U.S. Ladies [#27]: A Time to Reboot

Status
Not open for further replies.
I think it's a GOOD sign that Ting is taking a break and putting recovery as her first priority. We've seen so many great US ladies put their recovery to the wayside and get back into competitive skating only to falter and worsen their injuries. We can practically count them off one by one. Ting has about three months to fully recover before Nationals. Since she has a bye due to her placement, Ting will not have to worry about qualifying. Additionally, superb placements at the I.S.U. Championships following Nationals will serve her MUCH better than weak to sub-par showings at her Grand Prix events. Wishing Ting a full, healthy, and sustained recovery as she makes her strides towards 2022 Beijing.
 
Frida80 said:
What happened was after injuring her ankle, it probably weakened the muscles around her ankle. With no support, sprains happen. It happens to the best of us. A few months of PT and she’ll be as good as new.
Click to expand...
Where were her co for
Debbie S said:
I think the writer spends a bit too much time listening to TSL. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
I thought the writer was observant, realistic and has Gracie's best interests at heart.
 
My problem with this article is the assumption that Gracie a) as a twenty-something woman, has no will of her own and is not aware of what it takes to make it to the top of the sport and b) that she is 'ruining' her reputation and should be concerned about appearances and that this comeback is all about being back where she was, and as far as I can tell, the only thing Gracie has said is that she would like to make the Olympic team in 2022 and that's still a couple of years off, so...
 
crzesk8dad said:
Article re: Gracie Gold and her attempt at coming back. Granted it's just a college piece, it made the internet. Frankly, I think it's a bit harsh.

www.uscannenbergmedia.com

The Inside Edge: Gracie Gold isn’t ready for a comeback

“She is hard on herself. She is broken and won't ask for help. She is messy, but she's kind. She is lonely most of the time.”
www.uscannenbergmedia.com www.uscannenbergmedia.com
Click to expand...

I think the writer either posts on here or lifted posters' words for this article. This looks just like some of the stuff posted here. How unimaginative.
 
The author in question lifted their argument from the most recent TSL video, which is embarrassing because you'd think a college student at USC Annenberg—of all places—would know better than the plagiarize. (Can't believe I'm defending TSL, but here we are...)
 
Last edited:
crzesk8dad said:
Article re: Gracie Gold and her attempt at coming back. Granted it's just a college piece, it made the internet. Frankly, I think it's a bit harsh.

www.uscannenbergmedia.com

The Inside Edge: Gracie Gold isn’t ready for a comeback

“She is hard on herself. She is broken and won't ask for help. She is messy, but she's kind. She is lonely most of the time.”
www.uscannenbergmedia.com www.uscannenbergmedia.com
Click to expand...

This showed up in my news feed over more well-established sports journalists (many of whom I follow regularly). I had never heard of the author before.

In full disclosure, I have ties to Annenberg (I have several close friends who teach there) and speak there once or twice a semester. That may explain why this particular story (which I would classify as commentary) topped my feed.

After reading this I immediately thought it sounded reminiscent of TSL's recently shared opinions on Gracie, and in particular, her coach Vincent.

The analysis of her skating can be made with one's own eyes and looking at protocols. The club stuff is definitely a bit more inside baseball (apologies for mixing sports metaphors) and did sound like it may have been lifted. And while the author hinted that she is a skater herself and may be familiar with specific clubs, as a student in So-Cal, one would assume she's somewhat removed from an east coast skating club.

I had a very similar situation recently with a college student. My colleague had written an original piece that I had edited, full of interviews and research he sourced himself. Many outlets picked it up, appropriately citing and linking back. And then a similar article showed up in my Facebook feed a few days later so I clicked on it. The writer -- a female college student -- had COMPLETELY plagiarized my colleague's piece. The only thing she did was rearrange a few sentences around and change a few words. It was so egregious that I immediately reached out to the website it was published on.

The article was taken down and the author rewrote it with proper citation. She sent me and my colleague a lengthy apology and was very remorseful. I appreciated her apology but warned her that her journalism career could've ended before it ever started with this one piece. And even though she took down her original piece, the way the web works, it may have been syndicated elsewhere.

Ironically, it's something I talk about at USC: repurposing instead of reporting. It's fine if you use others as a jumping-off point, just attribute them properly. If she got the club stuff from TSL, she should advance her story by reaching out to Vincent, Iceworks, etc. That's how you advance a story.

Journalists don't work in a vacuum. You are often monitoring the competition via social media and sometimes simply reading/listening to someone else influences you -- consciously or not.

Sure, I listen to TSL. But I make it a practice to watch a program first and post my own reactions BEFORE I listen to Dave and Jonathan. I often find myself in agreement with what they say. But when I'm covering skating professionally, I definitely reply upon my own expertise (and often have to, as it's live coverage) and wait until after to see what everyone else has said.
 
Last edited:
all_empty said:
This showed up in my news feed over more well-established sports journalists (many of whom I follow regularly). I had never heard of the author before.

In full disclosure, I have ties to Annenberg (I have several close friends who teach there) and speak there once or twice a semester. That may explain why this particular story (which I would classify as commentary) topped my feed.

After reading this I immediately thought it sounded reminiscent of TSL's recently shared opinions on Gracie, and in particular, her coach Vincent.

The analysis of her skating can be made with one's own eyes and looking at protocols. The club stuff is definitely a bit more inside baseball (apologies for mixing sports metaphors) and did sound like it may have been lifted. And while the author hinted that she is a skater herself and may be familiar with specific clubs, as a student in So-Cal, one would assume she's removed from an east coast skating club.

I had a very similar situation recently with a college student. My colleague had written an original piece that I had edited, full of interviews and research he sourced himself. Many outlets picked it up, appropriately citing and linking back. And then a similar article showed up in my Facebook feed a few days later so I clicked on it. The writer -- a female college student -- had COMPLETELY plagiarized my colleague's piece. The only thing she did was rearrange a few sentences around and change a few words. It was really egregious that I immediately reached out to the website it was published on.

The article was taken down and the author rewrote it with proper citation. She sent me and my colleague a lengthy apology and was very remorseful. I appreciated her apology but warned her that her journalism career could've ended before it ever started with this one piece. And even though she took down her original piece, the way the web works, it may have been syndicated elsewhere.

Ironically, it's something I talk about at USC: repurposing instead of reporting. It's fine if you use others as a jumping-off point, just attribute them properly. If she got the club stuff from TSL, she should advance her story by reaching out to Vincent, Iceworks, etc. That's how you advance a story.

Journalists don't work in a vacuum. You are often monitoring the competition via social media and sometimes simply reading/listening to someone else influences you -- consciously or not.

Sure, I listen to TSL. But I make it a practice to watch a program first and post my own reactions BEFORE I listen to Dave and Jonathan. I often find myself in agreement with what they say. But when I'm covering skating professionally, I definitely reply upon my own expertise (and often have to, as it's live coverage) and wait until after to see what everyone else has said.
Click to expand...

Fascinating post. Thank you for sharing.

Skating is a niche sport, which often limits respected event coverage. However, one would have to question the author's mindset who wrote the article on Gracie, and appropriated content from TSL, that they actually see Dave Lease as a legitimate news agency.
 
Last edited:
I have been very curious as to why her coach keeps posting these videos... Gracie isn't posting them. What is the point?

Apparently what it did was convince the "true believers" that "She's back" when in fact 4th place in the free at sectionals hardly screams "she's back".

Since I refuse to listen to or look at any content produced by Dave Liar and his friends I have no idea if she appropriated it. As for Dave Liar as a "legitimate news agency", he's right up there with the National Enquirer in my estimation LOL!
 
Carolla5501 said:
I have been very curious as to why her coach keeps posting these videos... Gracie isn't posting them. What is the point?
Click to expand...
If you look on his IG, Vincent posts vids of lots of his skaters, most of whom have nowhere near the recognition Gracie does. Actually, lots of coaches post jumps or spins of their skaters from practice. Lots of skaters post practice vids. I'm not a big fan of Vincent, but I don't think what he's doing is out of the ordinary or eyebrow-raising.

Dave has made no secret of his dislike for Vincent. (My (random, uneducated) guess is Dave tried to get some access to IceWorks to watch/interview Gracie and/or other skaters and Vincent refused.) As for the IceWorks club, I don't skate there so have no idea how things are, but I'm going to guess that they did not have to twist Gracie's arm for her to perform in the spring show. I don't believe she did a competitive program (or maybe 1 program was her SP) but IIRC, in the vids I saw, Gracie was smiling and looked happy, and really, it's a spring club show, there's nothing painful or stressful about it. It's a chance for the club to cheer her on.
 
Debbie S said:
If you look on his IG, Vincent posts vids of lots of his skaters, most of whom have nowhere near the recognition Gracie does. Actually, lots of coaches post jumps or spins of their skaters from practice. Lots of skaters post practice vids. I'm not a big fan of Vincent, but I don't think what he's doing is out of the ordinary or eyebrow-raising.

Dave has made no secret of his dislike for Vincent. (My (random, uneducated) guess is Dave tried to get some access to IceWorks to watch/interview Gracie and/or other skaters and Vincent refused.) As for the IceWorks club, I don't skate there so have no idea how things are, but I'm going to guess that they did not have to twist Gracie's arm for her to perform in the spring show. I don't believe she did a competitive program (or maybe 1 program was her SP) but IIRC, in the vids I saw, Gracie was smiling and looked happy, and really, it's a spring club show, there's nothing painful or stressful about it. It's a chance for the club to cheer her on.
Click to expand...

You’re right - he does post lots of clips of lots of skaters. When he was in Monument he used to post clips of Jason, Jordan and other skaters there.

Re Gracie, it was her current SP, but with easier content.

Not 100% sure, but I think Dave’s opinion of Vincent predates the time when Gracie started working with him.
 
all_empty said:
Ironically, it's something I talk about at USC: repurposing instead of reporting. It's fine if you use others as a jumping-off point, just attribute them properly. If she got the club stuff from TSL, she should advance her story by reaching out to Vincent, Iceworks, etc. That's how you advance a story.

Journalists don't work in a vacuum. You are often monitoring the competition via social media and sometimes simply reading/listening to someone else influences you -- consciously or not.

Sure, I listen to TSL. But I make it a practice to watch a program first and post my own reactions BEFORE I listen to Dave and Jonathan. I often find myself in agreement with what they say. But when I'm covering skating professionally, I definitely reply upon my own expertise (and often have to, as it's live coverage) and wait until after to see what everyone else has said.
Click to expand...

Full disclosure: I've taught in a journalism program at a large East Coast university. I completely agree with everything you've said here.

As I've mentioned to students endlessly, we are constantly absorbing information, which makes the need for citing and attribution more essential. Some students think they're being overly detailed with this, but I assure them this is an important step in establishing trust with an audience. A reporter who can "show 'em the receipts" (even if said receipt is a hyperlink) is still worth more than one flapping their gums with nothing to back it up.

And getting statements from other parties referenced—IceWorks, Vincent, etc—is the bare minimum to cushion a writer or outlet from any potential legal snafus.

I know this is just a student paper and a "teachable moment," but OY, the headache.
 
Debbie S said:
As for the IceWorks club, I don't skate there so have no idea how things are, but I'm going to guess that they did not have to twist Gracie's arm for her to perform in the spring show. I don't believe she did a competitive program (or maybe 1 program was her SP) but IIRC, in the vids I saw, Gracie was smiling and looked happy, and really, it's a spring club show, there's nothing painful or stressful about it. It's a chance for the club to cheer her on.
Click to expand...

FWIW it's also worth keeping in mind that a lot of rinks also require their coaching staff to perform "service hours" (not unlike in academia) and doing the show was perhaps one way of checking off that task.

Anyway, this is to say that she does seem very happy to be there—it looks like she hosted an adult skating class on Monday.

Maybe what Dave dislikes is a grown adult woman trying to take charge of her skating career, and in a manner that is, aside from Restencourt's videos, very much offline in a deeply online world.
 
natsulian said:
Our high school intends to host a festival celebrating Asian American success... and the board decided to pick important Asian American figures to showcase and Alysa Liu was picked alongside people like Sandra Oh. Imagine my shock at the amount of people who recognized her.
Click to expand...

Technically Sandra Oh should be considered Asian-Canadian(-American), should she not?

en.wikipedia.org

Sandra Oh - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
To me there’s a big difference between posting random videos and posting one of someone like Gracie. If I post a video of skater X doing a triple jump it’s not gonna get a lot of attention. If I post a video of someone like Gracie, kwan etc doing a jump I know it’s going to get more attention



IMHO unrelated to this article and David Lease’s trash I have been wondering all along why she’s been allowing these videos. (And if her coach is posting without her approval he’s a jerk)

If She had shown up last week with her full arsenal then I think I probably would feel differently but right now I really question the decision making behind those posts. I’ve been uncomfortable all along with them but assumed they reflected her current status and were approved by Gracie. After last weekend I questioned that. The videos seemed to have people expecting “national championship” Gracie. Not “hoping to qualify for the next round” Gracie. Why put that additional pressure on yourself?

I like Gracie and want her to do well. But more importantly I want her to be able to have a full life when the skating stops. She’s a beautiful smart young woman. Skating is not the “only option”
 
Not sure about Oh. I read an interview with her maybe a decade or so ago when she was LA-based. She voiced reservations about getting US citizenship, but she may have changed her mind.

ETA: If I had looked first, I would have seen that she became a US citizen in 2018 and calls herself "Asian-Canadian-American."

Sandra Oh celebrates U.S. citizenship anniversary on ‘Saturday Night Live’ | Project Citizenship

By Variety, NBC News April 1st, 2019 LOS ANGELES — "Killing Eve" star Sandra Oh marked her one-year anniversary of becoming an American citizen by hosting the March 30th episode of "Saturday Night Live." The Canadian-born actress announced the special occasion during the monologue of the NBC...
projectcitizenship.org
 
Last edited:
AxelAnnie said:
Where were her co for
I thought the writer was observant, realistic and has Gracie's best interests at heart.
Click to expand...
Mostly a re-hash of last year. Obviously, Gold is not where she was. Should she go to regionals? Well, maybe she's trying out how it feels to compete. Much less risky than Rostelecom. I don't get her coach choice either. But, how does the writer know the coache's motivations? Anyway who cares what a college newspaper says.
 
Theoreticalgirl said:
Full disclosure: I've taught in a journalism program at a large East Coast university. I completely agree with everything you've said here.

As I've mentioned to students endlessly, we are constantly absorbing information, which makes the need for citing and attribution more essential. Some students think they're being overly detailed with this, but I assure them this is an important step in establishing trust with an audience. A reporter who can "show 'em the receipts" (even if said receipt is a hyperlink) is still worth more than one flapping their gums with nothing to back it up.

And getting statements from other parties referenced—IceWorks, Vincent, etc—is the bare minimum to cushion a writer or outlet from any potential legal snafus.

I know this is just a student paper and a "teachable moment," but OY, the headache.
Click to expand...
Everyone want to be an op/ed columnist or features writer. It's a lot of work to put together a news story with sources. But most good columnists have that background. They've done work to gain trust with readership before letting their "voice" do all the talking. You can't just tweak the tone of your blog posts and elevate the writing to journalism. That's how this comes across to me.
 
If Gracie has a coach that “doesn’t really need her” that’s probably a well known coach and more would be expected and be more expensive!!! Like of course artunian wouldn’t need Gracie or orser wouldn’t need Gracie but seriously!! More expectation and pressure from all!! Being with a no name is not bad for her now but good!!!!!!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 4 (members: 0, guests: 4)

Similar threads

Vagabond
  • Locked
U.S. Ladies [#29]: Skating with Adjusted Vision
32 33 34
Replies
1K
Views
154K
Vagabond
Vagabond
Vagabond
  • Locked
U.S. Ladies [#30]: Cover Girls
18 19 20
Replies
578
Views
85K
Jammers
J
Vagabond
  • Locked
U.S. Ladies [#28]: Achieving 2020 Vision
33 34 35
Replies
1K
Views
179K
Sylvia
Sylvia
Vagabond
  • Locked
U.S. Ladies [#23]: Triple Axels? What a Novice Idea!
32 33 34
Replies
1K
Views
165K
Yazmeen
Yazmeen
Vagabond
  • Locked
U.S. Ladies [#24]: Starr-Ting Order/Detailed Classification
41 42 43
Replies
1K
Views
176K
Sylvia
Sylvia
Back
Top
Do Not Sell My Personal Information