U.S. Women [#2]: The Unbearable Lightness of Beijing

[BittyBug]

You mean Buttle with "Jeffrey"?

Karen’s brother, who is a senior-level ice dancer.

 

[sk9tingfan]

Alysa Liu posted an Instagram story with her on a pogo stick! she said she had forgotten she had brought it. Sometimes I think this kid wants out due to injury.

Instagram

www.instagram.com

 

[On My Own]

Karen’s brother, who is a senior-level ice dancer.

Oh, OK! Jeffrey Chen. But I guess I don't understand then as to why they would have the same coach, or learned skating skill basics together? Did Jeffrey want to be a single skater first, or did Karen want to be an Ice Dancer earlier? Like I don't think Karen's skating skills are as amazing as an Ice Dancer's, haha, even though her musicality I do genuinely love.

 

[BittyBug]

Most dancers start in singles and then move to dance.

 

[VGThuy]

Oh, OK! Jeffrey Chen. But I guess I don't understand then as to why they would have the same coach, or learned skating skill basics together? Did Jeffrey want to be a single skater first, or did Karen want to be an Ice Dancer earlier? Like I don't think Karen's skating skills are as amazing as an Ice Dancer's, haha, even though her musicality I do genuinely love.

Most ice dancers start out as single skaters and then they become ice dancers later on. Some are picked out by coaches at the rink who see certain skaters have a particular talent or could benefit from ice dancing lessons. Then they become really good at it and get partnered up, and life takes over. I kind of think it's safe to say that 99% or more of all skaters in every discipline start out as singles because you have to learn to skate by yourself first before you can skate with someone else.

The Shibs both were single skaters doing singles and doubles and competing that way until they decided to team up to do ice dancing. They also said they watched 2003 Worlds live and fell in love with ice dance there. Makes me sort of question their taste levels, but they said it was the speed and skating skills they observed from the teams that impressed them the most out of the entire competition. That, and Kwan, haha.

 

[On My Own]

Most dancers start in singles and then move to dance.

Most ice dancers start out as single skaters and then they become ice dancers later on. Some are picked out by coaches at the rink who see certain skaters have a particular talent or could benefit from ice dancing lessons. Then they become really good at it and get partnered up, and life takes over. I kind of think it's safe to say that 99% or more of all skaters in every discipline start out as singles because you have to learn to skate by yourself first before you can skate with someone else.

The Shibs both were single skaters doing singles and doubles and competing that way until they decided to team up to do ice dancing. They also said they watched 2003 Worlds live and fell in love with ice dance there. Makes me sort of question their taste levels, but they said it was the speed and skating skills they observed from the teams that impressed them the most out of the entire competition. That, and Kwan, haha.

Right, this makes sense in terms of how they develop, but I guess personally I wouldn't really pick out similarities between a senior single skater and a senior Ice Dancer. Like, I get that the very early development probably has all the skaters intending to compete doing jumps and of course you don't start out with a partner already (so "beginning as a single skater"), but a senior Ice Dancer similar to a senior single skater, not so much. I am probably nitpicking claircloutier's comment, but unless Jeffrey's switch happened much later than normal, surely his basics and movement quality across the ice are much more that of an ice dancer by now? (I mean, they are.)

IDK, just ignore me, I probably made no sense, and didn't read it properly.

 

[VGThuy]

I think Claire just meant Jeffrey's fundamentals before he moved on to ice dance to develop his skating skills further in that direction. Like with the Shibs, they trained with Slavka Kohout Button before moving on to Colorado Springs to develop their ice dancing. Ms. Kohout Button taught Janet Lynn, who inspired a generation of Japanese skaters, including Yuka Sato and Fumie Suguri who publicly acknowledged her as an inspiration. That can explain the Japanese's (generally speaking) emphasis on their notable knee bend and deep, and long edges. The Shibs certainly had that deep knee bend that not all ice dancers have.

 

[UGG]

During the 1996-97 season when Kwan was having some hardship, which turned out to be due to her boots more than anything as Frank even later acknowledged decades later where she was even falling on her outside edges on her spirals, the media and fans kept going on about Kwan's body changes and going through puberty. Kwan herself said that whole period was more embarrassing for her than anything as she was 16 and people kept harping and talking about her body. Like they were observing her body with a microscope. It's already a self-conscious time in any teen's life, but imagine adults in sports media and the rest of the skating community talking about it publicly.

That’s my whole point, I absolutely cannot imagine it. It’s gross. It’s like when all those male reporters were asking Britney Spears if she was a virgin when she was 17. It’s the exact same thing.

Adults talking about a child’s body snd wondering if she will be able to have the same skills as when she was pre puberty is gross. It has to stop. I’m not a fan of 13 year olds at nationals if all these adults are going to continuously clutch their pearls in horror when the skaters show up at 16 with a different body and can’t do the same skills

 

[becca]

That’s my whole point, I absolutely cannot imagine it. It’s gross. It’s like when all those male reporters were asking Britney Spears if she was a virgin when she was 17. It’s the exact same thing.

Adults talking about a child’s body snd wondering if she will be able to have the same skills as when she was pre puberty is gross. It has to stop. I’m not a fan of 13 year olds at nationals if all these adults are going to continuously clutch their pearls in horror when the skaters show up at 16 with a different body and can’t do the same skills

I think it depends on how the discussion is made said.

I don’t think it is irrelevant at all to factor in puberty and the real fact that body’s change. It’s a relevant in managing expectations hype on skaters and It’s also relevant in the age limit discussions

 

[Wyliefan]

Alysa Liu posted an Instagram story with her on a pogo stick! she said she had forgotten she had brought it. Sometimes I think this kid wants out due to injury.

Instagram

www.instagram.com

If Nathan and Ilia manage to skateboard all over the place and survive, I think Alysa can handle a pogo stick.

 

[kwanfan1818]

In one of Brennan's books, therewas a comment by one of Tonya Harding's rivals' coaches - Scotvold? -- who said they knew what chance they had at a competition by looking at the size of Harding's ass.

 

[AYS]

If Nathan and Ilia manage to skateboard all over the place and survive, I think Alysa can handle a pogo stick.

Yeah, I think what they're all doing on the ice is the most hazardous (says she who is recovering from surgical repair of a demolished elbow incurred ice dancing).

 

[Frau Muller]

Alysa Liu posted an Instagram story with her on a pogo stick! she said she had forgotten she had brought it. Sometimes I think this kid wants out due to injury.

Instagram

www.instagram.com

Oh Lordie, I love her freshness & honesty! If she tried doing this in USFS’ “country club years” (pre-1990) she would’ve been packed away to some sort of charm school to be prim & proper in front of the media.

I really want to see Alysa in Beijing. May it come to pass.

 

[Wyliefan]

Yeah, I think what they're all doing on the ice is the most hazardous (says she who is recovering from surgical repair of a demolished elbow incurred ice dancing).

Ow! Hope you feel better soon!

 

[BittyBug]

I hope you're on the mend @AYS.

 

[skatingguy]

In one of Brennan's books, therewas a comment by one of Tonya Harding's rivals' coaches - Scotvold? -- who said they knew what chance they had at a competition by looking at the size of Harding's ass.

That would be an Evy Scotvold comment, yes.

 

[VGThuy]

That's why in one of the many Tonya/Nancy parodies, one parody film had a running gag of people (judges, coaches, other skaters) going on and on about Tonya's behind.

 

[olympic]

That's why in one of the many Tonya/Nancy parodies, one parody film had a running gag of people (judges, coaches, other skaters) going on and on about Tonya's behind.

I think that was The Attack of the 5'2" Woman in the 90s w/ comedienne Julie Brown. She skewered Tonya (and Nancy) and Lorena Bobbit (early 90s bad woman icons). She also did an excellent job skewering Madonna w/ a harsh parody of Truth or Dare

ETA - Oksana also got skewered. The character’s reaction to everything was to cry

 

[AxelAnnie]

Oh Lordie, I love her freshness & honesty! If she tried doing this in USFS’ “country club years” (pre-1990) she would’ve been packed away to some sort of charm school to be prim & proper in front of the media.

I really want to see Alysa in Beijing. May it come to pass. ysa

Ditto. I want to see her on the podium. Boy that would shake things up.
Loved the pictures of Alysa on the pogo stick. Someone is raising her right!
I noticed her hair. At Nationals I thought is was fake...like my horse's tail piece lol.

 

[tylersf]

Not to sound harsh....but that is the way it is....and the way it will remain. Money pays for stuff...and
then more stuff.

Some skaters who come from low income families are helped. Are there ant

Karen was utterly gorgeous. I am not sure what the points are, but beautiful artistry should be given more weight. The beauty IMO makes up for a lot of UR's

Did anyone really "attack" them? They may have criticized, but I don't think they were attacked.
I think that the US made an error, years ago when they decided beautiful skating would rule the day, when, in fact, jumps are king (or queen). The US ladies need those 3/3 to be competitive on the world stage.


What about Isabeau's jump technique needs an intervention? All I could think while watching her is that Uncle Dick is out there kvelling about the pointed toes, gorgeous posture, and elegance of movement.

I worry that we are sending two women who are at the end of their skating careers. There is wisdom and experience to be gained at the Olys. If they had asked me (and, again, they did not ask me) I would have sent Karen or Mariah, and two younger picks----Alysa and an up and comer who is expected to represent the next Quad. And, no, that would not be Starr.

Agree with Annie. I think you live in the Bay Area, like I used to, and you know you need money. When you have a $100k+ income and qualify for low-income discounted housing as a single person, you know that your life is expensive.
Most of our top skaters come from households with good income. I find it sad when a poor talented skater isn't able to move a career forward becauae their economic status.

 

[tylersf]

Following up on this. The Micheal Weiss foundation assisted many up and coming skaters. I know of at least 2 youngsters that later became Olympians.

Thank god for Michael Weiss!

 

[becca]

Agree with Annie. I think you live in the Bay Area, like I used to, and you know you need money. When you have a $100k+ income and qualify for low-income discounted housing as a single person, you know that your life is expensive.
Most of our top skaters come from households with good income. I find it sad when a poor talented skater isn't able to move a career forward becauae their economic status.

I have to wonder if some US and Canadian coaches look at the talent pool Eteri gets and ….

 

[AxelAnnie]

I have to wonder if some US and Canadian coaches look at the talent < pool Eteri gets and ….

Agree with Annie. I think you live in the Bay Area, like I used to, and you know you need money. When you have a $100k+ income and qualify for low-income discounted housing as a single person, you know that your life is expensive.
Most of our top skaters come from households with good income. I find it sad when a poor talented skater isn't able to move a career forward becauae their economic status.

Well, it is sad, but also the way it is. Skating is expensive. So is a Rolls Royce. If you make $100,000.00 per year chances are you are not driving a Rolls.

I am amused to watch a family use food stamps at Cosco for their food while buying a new flat screen tv.

And, it is sad. Just like almost anything else, supporting your talented athlete is going to require budgeting both time and money. Skating is also a luxury not everyone can afford. In general, I would have to say that people in the Bay Area are living much of the time are living in an altered reality.
A house you can't really afford, a private school. so your kid has the requisites to get into an Ivy League college, a car, and cell phone for their kid, so you can find out where they are (Shouldn't you know where are?) they for all of the above and the babysitter who is raising their kids.

IMO - (and that is just me) priorities are a bit screwed up.

 

[mtnskater]

In the for what it’s worth category, I was sitting near two figure skating coaches at Nationals. One from Oregon and the other from Chicago. I asked both of them if they thought something was wrong with Isabeau’s jump technique and both looked at me like I was crazy. I told them she had received criticism for it on the skating boards and they were dumbfounded. I felt the same way seeing her live for the first time. She impressed me even more than Ilia in some respects because she has the style and choreography too. Can’t wait to see her skate again. Are they rescheduling the JGPF?

 

[VGThuy]

In the for what it’s worth category, I was sitting near two figure skating coaches at Nationals. One from Oregon and the other from Chicago. I asked both of them if they thought something was wrong with Isabeau’s jump technique and both looked at me like I was crazy. I told them she had received criticism for it on the skating boards and they were dumbfounded. I felt the same way seeing her live for the first time. She impressed me even more than Ilia in some respects because she has the style and choreography too. Can’t wait to see her skate again. Are they rescheduling the JGPF?

This explains why U.S. ladies skating is where it is internationally at the moment.

 

[Sonata]

This was the first time I've watched Isabeau Levito and at first, I was delighted by her skating. Then she started jumping and the jumps made me cringe. Her jump technique is similar to what the top Russians are doing, but even more exaggerated. The pre-rotation and strange pre-jump position stand out a lot. I wonder if her jumps will last with this technique for another Olympic cycle. I know Bell and Chen do not have the technical arsenal of the current top women in the world, but I found their old school skating ironically refreshing.

 

[toddlj]

I noticed today that USFS is listing "Smith (adv. novice)" for Bavarian Open.

2021-22 International Assignments and Results

2021-22 International Assignments and Results

usfigureskatingfanzone.com

 

[wickedwitch]

Isabeau's jump technique is clearly wonky. I hope she fixes it, so she can have a long, successful career.

That said, even if she doesn't fix it, I will continue to enjoy the wonderful qualities she does bring to the ice every time I watch her.

 

[Wyliefan]

I don't care what her jumps look like; I just don't want her to hurt herself or get derailed by faulty technique.

 

[livetoskate]

Thank god for Michael Weiss!

I'm pretty sure Nathan received one of the Michael Weiss skating scholarships. Too bad it's no longer being offered and they stopped having the fundraiser shows around DC. Wouldn't it be nice if some of the most successful skaters had a scholarship program for young skaters who could really use the money.