U.S. Ladies [#25]: Method in the Madness

[VGThuy]

Except UGG, Kwan's performance was identical. She was just missing the lavender candle worshippers or whatever they called themselves back then.

I think you really want to sell the idea that Kwan wasn't received well internationally. You also must have had some history fighting Kwan fans online (like on MKF or maybe during the Tara World with their Taratory days) by bringing up lavender candles and whatnot. 1998 was not 2004 and there was no reason for an American audience to prefer Kwan over Lipinski. If they did, it was due to the skating (and maybe personality as fans are like that). Kwan has had no issue connecting with an international audience, even in Nagano. Tara just had an amazing, inspired skate as well that was her best of the season after solidly losing to Kwan in front of an international panel at Skate America, losing to Hubert at Trophee Lalique, and then some people (not sure why) thinking Tanja Szewczenko should have beaten Tara at the GPF. Tara's Olympic skate was on fire and made Kwan's perfectly fine performance that could have arguably won the LP at any Olympics prior and maybe the two not accounting for IJS look cautious in retrospect.

That said, I do wonder if Lyra just wasn't the best Olympic vehicle as it wasn't "dramatic" or "Olympic" enough. Look at V/M's "Moulin Rouge" after they changed it to invite that sort of bombastic applause. Maybe her Rachmaninoff SP would have been a better LP.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

4 am in Los Angeles and pulled myself outta bed... Seems like Bell did very well! Great!!!

Taking a peak thus far at results I am a bit in shock at some of the ladies who didnt advance to the free.

One more group to go.

Back to sleep. I ll watch the final group on the broadcast.

 

[GullyGirl84]

Mariah got very lucky with the toe not being called, but pretty sure that is her personal best. Yea for making the final group!

 

[layman]

Mariah was aggressive! 3Lutz/3t in the short program! Into 6th in a tough field. Bradie was aggressive too. She tried the same combo but the 3toe was called. In 10th. Good job for both.

 

[natsulian]

Mariah at the beginning of the season said that her goal was to be in the final flight for Worlds because she knows she can do it, she just has to believe in herself. Fast forward months later and she’s in the final group at Worlds, scored a personal best, and skated her heart out for the audience. That’s what I call grit and determination (and a little smidge of luck).

 

[UGG]

Except UGG, Kwan's performance was identical. She was just missing the lavender candle worshippers or whatever they called themselves back then.

It wasn’t identical. For starters she had a mistake on her flip in Nagano...I think you need to rewatch...unless the audience reaction in Philly is going to give you PTSD or something like that.

 

[layman]

Maybe Mariah is being a little too aggressive. I am hearing that she may have intentionally collided with Eunsoo Lim in the warm-up and Lim's people are saying that Mariah has been bullying her. Has anyone else heard this?

https://www.france24.com/en/20190320-olympic-champ-zagitova-dazzles-world-short-skate

This is the relevant part of the article:

"Korean anger -
Two-time world champion Evgenia Medvedeva, runner-up to countrywoman Zagitova at last year's Pyeongchang Olympics, was fourth on 74.23 points with South Korean teenager Lim Eun-soo on 72.91 despite a sore ankle.
Lim had to dust herself down after being flattened by American Mariah Bell during the warm-up in a collision that angered Korean officials...."

 

[UGG]

Why would Mariah risk an injury to bully another skater?

 

[Wyliefan]

There's a thread here about the allegations. I honestly don't know what to think. It seems so unlike Mariah -- and unlike Raf to allow anything of the kind to go on among his students. On the other hand, we don't always know what's going on behind the scenes, and I don't want to just dismiss the story out of hand without knowing exactly what happened. I hope a proper investigation is done to get to the bottom of this. Especially since Mariah is now being harassed on Instagram over it.
https://twitter.com/lynnneposts/status/1108309832489066502?s=19

 

[wickedwitch]

Why would Mariah risk an injury to bully another skater?

That's what gave me pause. I can buy one skater bullying another, (I don't know Mariah so I can't say if this is something she personally would or wouldn't do) but why risk injury at Worlds?

Obviously, I hope none of it's true.

 

[Wyliefan]

That's what gets me too. We all know of stories of seemingly wonderful people who turned out to be abusers or bullies. But to run into another skater when you yourself might end up getting hurt? Why would someone do that? It makes no sense.

 

[Rukia]

This whole story is so bizarre. What, so Mariah just skated up and bladed Eunsoo in the calf? Because otherwise she risks injuring herself too.

 

[chameleonster]

I struggle to believe that she would intentionally collide with someone-- that's not about character, that's putting her own safety at risk, and at worlds no less. But if she has taken a dislike to Eunsoo and has been bullying her, I could see her not bothering to apologize and finally pushing the KSU to take action.

While I would hope none of it is true, it seems unlikely that there isn't some basis for this if a formal complaint has been filed. Very disappointing.

 

[Wyliefan]

At any rate, whatever the reasons and whatever has actually been going on, we do know there was a collision and injury of some kind here, so I hope Eunsoo is okay.

 

[meer]

Here are pics of it happening

https://twitter.com/thelittlepicks/status/1108404408356724736
https://twitter.com/thelittlepicks/status/1108404541265866752

I mean... I don't think she did it on purpose. In front of all those people. It's just not realistic. I can see how it could happen without her noticing it.

Now the bullying issue and them being separated completely is something that can be easily confirmed by the rink though. Mariah defenders are saying there is no issue and they train together no problem and Eunsoo's agency is saying Mariah has been warned, and measures were taken to stop her behavior by keeping them apart. So someone is not telling the truth here. Regardless I hope Eunsoo is all right.

 

[Eeyora1]

I think you really want to sell the idea that Kwan wasn't received well internationally. You also must have had some history fighting Kwan fans online (like on MKF or maybe during the Tara World with their Taratory days) by bringing up lavender candles and whatnot. 1998 was not 2004 and there was no reason for an American audience to prefer Kwan over Lipinski. If they did, it was due to the skating (and maybe personality as fans are like that). Kwan has had no issue connecting with an international audience, even in Nagano. Tara just had an amazing, inspired skate as well that was her best of the season after solidly losing to Kwan in front of an international panel at Skate America, losing to Hubert at Trophee Lalique, and then some people (not sure why) thinking Tanja Szewczenko should have beaten Tara at the GPF. Tara's Olympic skate was on fire and made Kwan's perfectly fine performance that could have arguably won the LP at any Olympics prior and maybe the two not accounting for IJS look cautious in retrospect.

That said, I do wonder if Lyra just wasn't the best Olympic vehicle as it wasn't "dramatic" or "Olympic" enough. Look at V/M's "Moulin Rouge" after they changed it to invite that sort of bombastic applause. Maybe her Rachmaninoff SP would have been a better LP.

I remember reading somewhere that Michelle wanted Aranjuez for that season. I honestly think it was the eight weeks of training time lost due to the foot injury that did Michelle in. Can’t believe I’m watching Worlds 2019 and still talking about Tara vs Michelle but yes I was a lavender wearing chicken sacrificing Kwan fan.

Great Job Mariah Bell!

 

[oleada]

Here are pics of it happening

https://twitter.com/thelittlepicks/status/1108404408356724736
https://twitter.com/thelittlepicks/status/1108404541265866752

I mean... I don't think she did it on purpose. In front of all those people. It's just not realistic. I can see how it could happen without her noticing it.

These pics don't show anything, though. They just show Mariah skating by as Lim clutches her leg. There's no contact at all.

 

[Eeyora1]

I doubt Raf would put up with any bullshit from his skaters.

 

[Carolla5501]

Here are pics of it happening

https://twitter.com/thelittlepicks/status/1108404408356724736
https://twitter.com/thelittlepicks/status/1108404541265866752

I mean... I don't think she did it on purpose. In front of all those people. It's just not realistic. I can see how it could happen without her noticing it.

Now the bullying issue and them being separated completely is something that can be easily confirmed by the rink though. Mariah defenders are saying there is no issue and they train together no problem and Eunsoo's agency is saying Mariah has been warned, and measures were taken to stop her behavior by keeping them apart. So someone is not telling the truth here. Regardless I hope Eunsoo is all right.

Ummm……. Am I the only skeptic going the skater's "AGENCY" is talking about this.... And we are now discussing a skater that doesn't get much attention?? Hmm..... Wonder if there might be guilt on both sides???

Having seen this before sadly sometimes it's the person "raising the stink" that actually turns out to be the problem. (I just dealt with this in a youth group recently)

 

[Wyliefan]

But then that can work both ways. Sometimes people would rather believe the skater that does get more attention.

 

[sk9tingfan]

Maybe Mariah is being a little too aggressive. I am hearing that she may have intentionally collided with Eunsoo Lim in the warm-up and Lim's people are saying that Mariah has been bullying her. Has anyone else heard this?

https://www.france24.com/en/20190320-olympic-champ-zagitova-dazzles-world-short-skate

This is the relevant part of the article:

"Korean anger -
Two-time world champion Evgenia Medvedeva, runner-up to countrywoman Zagitova at last year's Pyeongchang Olympics, was fourth on 74.23 points with South Korean teenager Lim Eun-soo on 72.91 despite a sore ankle.
Lim had to dust herself down after being flattened by American Mariah Bell during the warm-up in a collision that angered Korean officials...."

Adam Rippon replied to the tweeter who evidently translated a few articles.

Replying to @[B]lynnneposts[/B]
This article is click bait. I’ve been to the rink multiple times and NO ONE has been bullying anyone. Stop creating shit and spreading rumors. What happened in the warm up was an accident. Don’t distract both Eunsoo and Mariah from the competition.

This also isn’t a comment directed towards you @lynnneposts - towards to people writing the article. Mariah and Eunsoo are competitive and train all the time together at home. Bullying is something Rafael would never tolerate.

And Adam would know given his past training with Arutunian as well as having choregraphed Bell's SP. I know that Adam is particularly sensitive to this issue and Rosie Di Manno falsely accused of him of deliberately colliding with Patrick Chan at the 2009 or 2010 SC.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Maybe Mariah is being a little too aggressive. I am hearing that she may have intentionally collided with Eunsoo Lim in the warm-up and Lim's people are saying that Mariah has been bullying her. Has anyone else heard this?

https://www.france24.com/en/20190320-olympic-champ-zagitova-dazzles-world-short-skate

This is the relevant part of the article:

"Korean anger -
Two-time world champion Evgenia Medvedeva, runner-up to countrywoman Zagitova at last year's Pyeongchang Olympics, was fourth on 74.23 points with South Korean teenager Lim Eun-soo on 72.91 despite a sore ankle.
Lim had to dust herself down after being flattened by American Mariah Bell during the warm-up in a collision that angered Korean officials...."

huh? Arent they training mates and all???

 

[UGG]

how are those pics of it happening when there is no contact shown in the pictures ?

 

[Spun Silver]

It's just hard to believe Raf would allow this. They're both his skaters. Plus where's the video evidence?

 

[Coco]

Yeah 2019 worlds!!!!


...and the difference between Philly and Nagano was the larger rink. Tara covered more ice, so the larger rink amplified the impact of that.

 

[sk9tingfan]

It's just hard to believe Raf would allow this. They're both his skaters. Plus where's the video evidence?

Please see my post with Adam Rippon's tweets concurring with your position,

 

[meer]

Well, it's not of it happening but that's as close as we got. There's no video yet. Though it's a public practice with an arena full of people and you can see how close they are. There was no talk about this before (as in saying Mariah went out of her way to hurt Eunsoo) and plenty of fans doing practice rundowns. So I imagine it wasn't much more dramatic than those pictures.

Second on the I can't imagine Raf putting up with this nonsense in his rink.

 

[AxelAnnie]

UMMMMM I think if Mariah tried to bully someone, she would scare herself to death!

 

[nylynnr]

And Adam would know given his past training with Arutunian as well as having choregraphed Bell's SP. I know that Adam is particularly sensitive to this issue and Rosie Di Manno falsely accused of him of deliberately colliding with Patrick Chan at the 2009 or 2010 SC.

Rosie has written some inflammatory things but I don't remember her ever writing Adam deliberately collided with Patrick. She did write the collision was Adam's fault. In any event, that collision is a perfect example of why it's exceedingly farfetched any skater would deliberately try to hit another in practice: both Adam and Patrick were shaken up, Adam more so; and Adam sustained facial bruises. If you try to hit another skater in practice you can just as easily injure yourself. It just makes no sense.

 

[Wyliefan]

I've always liked Mariah, and of course we never want to think someone we like could bully someone else. But if the past few years have taught us all anything, it's that sometimes bad behavior comes from the last person you'd expect. So I think there should be an investigation into the allegations, and the USFSA or whoever should do their best to get at the facts. Hopefully it will all turn out to be some kind of misunderstanding.