U.S. Women [#2]: The Unbearable Lightness of Beijing

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None of the US senior ladies could do all clean triples so far this season. Could a healthy Tennell change that?
I don't know. We remember her calls in the 2018-19 season. Cost her a few GP medals. She also got three ">" at 2021 Worlds LP, more than what Karen Chen received (she got two qs and a > along with a !).
 
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I want to see her land at least four clean triples in her long before I make that prediction.
I agree, but I will say if she lands 4 clean triples, does a decent long, they should find her an International to try and get the minimums. They have given just about everyone who could possibly have a chance at the team an International and so far no one has stepped up to the plate. The only clear favorite for the team is Alyssa. When Gracie is on (which is a big ??? Even when she was in her prime) she’s right up there with these girls.
All that said, she isn’t known for her consistency and a competition is 2 programs, I give her lots of credit with this comeback though, she seems to be fighting for it! I hope she skates well in the free.
 
Don't suppose there are any more chances to get them? Golden Spin, perhaps? But can she even be entered at this point?
Looks like the only senior internationals aside from Golden Spin are Santa Claus Cup (entry deadline has passed) and Open Belarus Cup 12/16-19. There isn't even an announcement pdf on the ISU page for the Open Belarus Cup though, so who knows if it's happening or not. There is also the Open d'Andorra next weekend but I doubt she would be able to get the necessary travel docs even if the USFS could enter her after the deadline.
 
Looks like the only senior internationals aside from Golden Spin are Santa Claus Cup (entry deadline has passed) and Open Belarus Cup 12/16-19. There isn't even an announcement pdf on the ISU page for the Open Belarus Cup though, so who knows if it's happening or not. There is also the Open d'Andorra next weekend but I doubt she would be able to get the necessary travel docs even if the USFS could enter her after the deadline.
I know nothing about how the sign ups actually go, but I bet if a Fed as powerful as USFS wanted Gracie at Golden Spin they could make it happen. Also, she is still a big name and competitions love those!
 
I know nothing about how the sign ups actually go, but I bet if a Fed as powerful as USFS wanted Gracie at Golden Spin they could make it happen. Also, she is still a big name and competitions love those!
I agree. We'll have to see what happens today in Alpharetta. If Gracie strings together two decent programs then I could see a scenario where she becomes the replacement should Bradie withdraw.
 
I agree, but I will say if she lands 4 clean triples, does a decent long, they should find her an International to try and get the minimums. They have given just about everyone who could possibly have a chance at the team an International and so far no one has stepped up to the plate. The only clear favorite for the team is Alyssa. When Gracie is on (which is a big ??? Even when she was in her prime) she’s right up there with these girls.
All that said, she isn’t known for her consistency and a competition is 2 programs, I give her lots of credit with this comeback though, she seems to be fighting for it! I hope she skates well in the free.
That was five and a half years ago.

I hope Gracie goes out there and skates her very best. But I don't even hope for anything more from her than doing better than she did last time out.
 
That was five and a half years ago.

I hope Gracie goes out there and skates her very best. But I don't even hope for anything more from her than doing better than she did last time out.
I agree with you that she’s still no where near her prime. But watching the other US Ladies so far this season, they aren’t near their prime either. That’s all I was saying. I just hope she skated well and feels good about it.
 
I don't think so. You have to have the TES mins 3 weeks before the competition starts and the Olympics starts Feb 4th for the TE. She'll need to get it before Nats, I believe.
Worlds-ho? :unsure:

But let's see whether she even qualifies for Nationals first.

:watch:
 
I have nothing against her as an actress (she wuzrobbed the Oscar for "Dangerous Liaisons"), but as a chanteuse??? :scream:
An actress playing the role of a long-retired silent film star - not playing Alice Faye or Judy Garland or Doris Day in any of their primes (or retirements, in the cases of Faye and Day).
 
Wow. Just not feeling too confident about US ladies after watching the SP at IdF

It will come down to this - If Bradie Tennell can just stand up on her jumps at the next competition, and I honestly think she can water down her programs at this point because no other US lady can get a 3-3 around, she will accompany Liu to the Olympics. If not, the USFSA may want to be attentive to Lindsey Thorngren before considering Bell, Chen, etc
 
That was five and a half years ago.

I hope Gracie goes out there and skates her very best. But I don't even hope for anything more from her than doing better than she did last time out.
Exactly! This is seven kinds of crazy. She is being given opportunities that were certainly not available to the other skaters. And remember the hooplah when Ashley was appointed to the team putting her above the the person who was third. The rationalization was "Body of Work".
People went nuts.

Gracie's inclusion (in anything) is based on who she was years ago.
That is a pretty dumb idea, and IMO has little hope for success.

Gracie is given these opportunities, not because she earned them, but because she is GRACIE GOLD - ice princess.
 
Wow. Just not feeling too confident about US ladies after watching the SP at IdF

It will come down to this - If Bradie Tennell can just stand up on her jumps at the next competition, and I honestly think she can water down her programs at this point because no other US lady can get a 3-3 around, she will accompany Liu to the Olympics. If not, the USFSA may want to be attentive to Lindsey Thorngren before considering Bell, Chen, etc
Just gonna point out that Chen's SP score at IdF is about 4 points higher than Thorngren's at Warsaw Cup, and that was with Thorngren going clean vs Chen's jump issues. And Bell's SP score at IdF is just a smidge higher than Thorngren's at Warsaw Cup, again despite Bell falling on one jumping pass.
 
SP Base value (Thorngren - CS Warsaw and Bell, Chen from IdF)
Thorngren: 30.79
Bell: 28.59
Chen: 28.09

SP GOE
Thorngren 1.84
Bell 2.41
Chen 3.29

SP PCS
Thorngren 28.12
Bell 30.81
Chen 33.29

Big picture stuff
Thorngren - 3f!, 3zq-3t<
Bell - fall on <<
Chen - two "q" (both triples)

So Thorngren was about as clean as Chen, more or less.
 
Wow. Just not feeling too confident about US ladies after watching the SP at IdF

It will come down to this - If Bradie Tennell can just stand up on her jumps at the next competition, and I honestly think she can water down her programs at this point because no other US lady can get a 3-3 around, she will accompany Liu to the Olympics. If not, the USFSA may want to be attentive to Lindsey Thorngren before considering Bell, Chen, etc
What makes you think Tennell will have cleaner calls than Chen? Check out her calls at 2021 Worlds. And we just saw Thorngren's calls at Warsaw.

The U.S. ladies will do as well as the other at this point. It's kind of a crap shoot on whether they'll have a hot performance and get their jumps just around enough to score well. Liu can be medal spoiler if lots of things go wrong to other ladies, but is showing to have real rotation and technique issues on her jumps even without the 3A attempt. Chen can be anywhere from 4th to 14th. Tennell is a question mark after injury and even beforehand she was susceptible to actual > calls despite working hard to alleviate them. Bell can best hope to replicate with Nagasu, Chen, and Tennell did in 2018. Thorngren was hyped up but seems just as good as the others without their GOE and PCS boost. Same with Glenn with all her 3A talk. The fact that some are now flocking to Gracie Gold just shows where U.S. ladies fans are at now - desperate.
 
Just gonna point out that Chen's SP score at IdF is about 4 points higher than Thorngren's at Warsaw Cup, and that was with Thorngren going clean vs Chen's jump issues. And Bell's SP score at IdF is just a smidge higher than Thorngren's at Warsaw Cup, again despite Bell falling on one jumping pass.
Lindsay was skating in her very first Senior international event. As a newbie, she would hardly be getting PCS scores equivalent to what Chen and Bell get in the GP. However, her TES was a point higher than both Chen and Bell.
 
I don't know. We remember her calls in the 2018-19 season. Cost her a few GP medals. She also got three ">" at 2021 Worlds LP, more than what Karen Chen received (she got two qs and a > along with a !).
At Worlds 2021, Bradie was skating in disintegrating boots, so it's a wonder she was even able to land those jumps.
 
Don’t know if this is being discussed now or what but if Bradie does no international events before nationals does she not need to obtain minimum’s before Olympics or worlds?’s having done no competitions this season? Or is it based off of last year for her?

After today’s short programs all over the world for US ladies I don’t know who is a shue-in for the Olympic team especially since Alysa scores have been lower than what they were in August and September

We have not seen Bradie at all, we’ve just seen Mariah....

Karen is doing triple/ doubles in the short program still

Lindsey’s short program score is the lowest it’s been all season by a lot

And now Gracie gold has surprised all of us in her short program. Lol

I have no idea who will make up the three woman team anymore
 
Of all the US ladies right now who has the higher odds of having cleaner jumps? I guess I would say Amber. Specially since in her free program at skate America she had no symbols at all.

She also seems like she has the most power in her jumps for sure than everyone else
 
Don’t know if this is being discussed now or what but if Bradie does no international events before nationals does she not need to obtain minimum’s before Olympics or worlds?’s having done no competitions this season? Or is it based off of last year for her?

After today’s short programs all over the world for US ladies I don’t know who is a shue-in for the Olympic team especially since Alysa scores have been lower than what they were in August and September

We have not seen Bradie at all, we’ve just seen Mariah....

Karen is doing triple/ doubles in the short program still

Lindsey’s short program score is the lowest it’s been all season by a lot

And now Gracie gold has surprised all of us in her short program. Lol

I have no idea who will make up the three woman team anymore
Bradie has her TES minimums and is fine. All she needs to do is finish top 3 and she'll move from Group 4 to Group 3. Given that Alysa is the only skater in Group 2 at the moment and none of the other women seem to be anywhere close to achieving Group 2 status, I'd say that top 3 at Nats would secure Bradie a second Olympic trip.

Gracie didn't skate as well in the FS today - her score would place her somewhere between 6-10 at Nats. In addition, as discussed earlier today in this thread, she does not have the SP TES min for the Olympics, so she is not going to be named to the team.
 
Of all the US ladies right now who has the higher odds of having cleaner jumps? I guess I would say Amber. Specially since in her free program at skate America she had no symbols at all.

She also seems like she has the most power in her jumps for sure than everyone else
Amber's jumps were clean at SA, but that was not the case at NHK:

SP 3a<<, 3f+3tq, 3lo
FS 3f+3t<, 2a, 3f, 2z, 3lo+2t, 3lo, 2a

Just like any of the other US women, she is just as likely to get dinged by a really tough caller.

Power is all in the eyes of the beholder. An uninjured Bradie is just as powerful, if not more powerful, than Amber. And Amber has never been anywhere near as consistent a performer as Bradie.

 
Amber's jumps were clean at SA, but that was not the case at NHK:

SP 3a<<, 3f+3tq, 3lo
FS 3f+3t<, 2a, 3f, 2z, 3lo+2t, 3lo, 2a

Just like any of the other US women, she is just as likely to get dinged by a really tough caller.

Power is all in the eyes of the beholder. An uninjured Bradie is just as powerful, if not more powerful, than Amber. And Amber has never been anywhere near as consistent a performer as Bradie.


Well let’s not count the triple axle… I mean that was basically a double axle turned into a spin. But at least she’s trying that, if you don’t try it it’s never going to be happening

But aside from that after four programs in the Grand Prix only one of them had symbols if you don’t count the triple axel

Just seems like of all the US ladies she has the most speed and power going into her jumps.

And I only asked about jumps. Of course she’s not a consistent skater. I’m talking about clean jumps.

I also disagree I don’t think power is in the eyes of the beholder, I mean I can see Kaetlyn Osmond, Kaori Sakamoto, Tonya Harding and Midori Ito have powerful jumps whereas others don’t .... that’s something that can be quantified and observed.
 
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Gracie didn't skate as well in the FS today - her score would place her somewhere between 6-10 at Nats. In addition, as discussed earlier today in this thread, she does not have the SP TES min for the Olympics, so she is not going to be named to the team.
She was so close though. Looking at the protocols Gracie landed 3 clean triples in her long...if she had landed one more clean triple, I would say that she is a contender. Still, if I were the USFSA I would start looking for a Senior International for her right now. One more clean triple is doable (by Nationals). She could actually surprise us all and win Nationals. What happens then, if she does not have the ISU minimums?
 
She was so close though. Looking at the protocols Gracie landed 3 clean triples in her long...if she had landed one more clean triple, I would say that she is a contender. Still, if I were the USFSA I would start looking for a Senior International for her right now. One more clean triple is doable (by Nationals). She could actually surprise us all and win Nationals. What happens then, if she does not have the ISU minimums?
She's not going to win Nationals. Disabuse yourself of that notion right now.

And, frankly, if she wanted consideration for international assignments, then she had a chance to make her case at Cranberry as well as her first NQS. She didn't and now, well, I suppose if she does well enough at Nats, the USFS could send her to one of the Jan or Feb Senior Bs to try and earn the Worlds mins.
 
She was so close though. Looking at the protocols Gracie landed 3 clean triples in her long...if she had landed one more clean triple, I would say that she is a contender. Still, if I were the USFSA I would start looking for a Senior International for her right now. One more clean triple is doable (by Nationals). She could actually surprise us all and win Nationals. What happens then, if she does not have the ISU minimums?
This weekend alone, three US woman put up better scores in internationals than Gracie put up in a national event. The margin was bigger than one more triple, despite the stricter international judging.

I wouldn't be opposed to Gracie getting another international, but remember: she had a shot at her minimums. But Gracie didn't skate well enough. And then she didn't skate well enough at her earlier championship series event to merit another assignment.

Gracie herself, however, seemed very pleased with her score yesterday. She has her own goals that she seems to be hitting, regardless of whether they'll lead her to the Olys. From an outsider's point of view, she's seems happy with where she's at overall (even if she wasn't super thrilled with yesterday's skate). And that's what I want for her.
 
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