U.S. Ladies [#22]: No More Carrots!

Status
Not open for further replies.

StitchMonkey

Well-Known Member
Messages
869
2016: https://web.archive.org/web/20160730073216/https://unseenskaters.wordpress.com/top-ten/
Mariah had the 3rd highest score, which she got at Broadmoor. Before her were Vivian Le and Tessa Hong. Vivian was doing JGP and Tessa was age-ineligible. Tim Dolensky had the highest score, which he got at Skate Detroit, and he got the SkAm TBD.

I think Angela got the spot first and then w/d for injury and Mariah got it. I think USFS weighs nationals placements heavily as well.
 

Willin

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,094
Hahaha I spent my early life on the Wilmette/Evanston boarder and will possibly be moving to the LA area near Arrowhead soon. It was interesting because I remember how ISI heavy a lot of those rinks were. DuPage Open was the huge USFS competition. My parents were shocked to hear about Jason, Bradie, and Gracie because they were so used to no one doing USFS up there! Is it still ISI heavy up there? Maybe that's why there in't a huge ladies field.

@StitchMonkey I wonder if they've been changing the whole Nationals placements thing. Certainly they still consider it, but I've been noticing that they've been taking risks with who they're sending at the lower levels. Not that they're sending bad skaters, just that they've been sending skaters based on summer competition performances and other monitoring sessions/training camps. It seems they're mainly using this approach of camps, competitions, and monitoring for lower levels. These changes seemed to coincide with changes to the high performance staff a few years back.

For Senior (and to some extent Junior) it's harder since there's rules about picking competitors, but USFS has been taking risks where they can with the host spots at SA and sending both lower and higher-ranked seniors to as many Senior B's as possible. It also seems like they're really upping the number of Novice (or intermediate age-eligible for Novice) skaters they send out to compete internationally.

So while I do think they'll look at Nationals placements I think they'll be taking the summer competitions seriously. It certainly paid off for Bradie, and Mariah got a GP medal out of her host pick at SA, so I see no reason for them not to consider summer. The biggest problem, as others have mentioned, is that the US Ladies eligible for that spot have been something of a mess this summer. TBH I couldn't say who would be best to give that spot to.
 

StitchMonkey

Well-Known Member
Messages
869
@Willin I think they largely do what they want but try to balance the two. I seem to recall Ross getting the SA TBA a few years when his Nats placement was the most logical reason.

I think they should both count to be honest. I think a strong summer should count more, but I am fine with Nats being a tie breaker or second reference point. Nationals should count for something after all.

They do seem to be taking more risks in general, (good) but the SA TBA does often seem still tied to nationals the year before.
 

Maximillian

TSDPFTBOTBOL! Those who know, know
Messages
4,500
Her jumps look mighty impressive for early August...I really do like Prokofiev's R&J, particularly the section she uses at the beginning. Rota's just makes me think (and wish for) Sasha...

OT, a bit: has there been any change in terms of scoring with regards to back-loading? I don't keep up with the ISU rule changes.
 

Cleo1782

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,302
Hahaha I spent my early life on the Wilmette/Evanston boarder and will possibly be moving to the LA area near Arrowhead soon. It was interesting because I remember how ISI heavy a lot of those rinks were. DuPage Open was the huge USFS competition. My parents were shocked to hear about Jason, Bradie, and Gracie because they were so used to no one doing USFS up there! Is it still ISI heavy up there? Maybe that's why there in't a huge ladies field.

@StitchMonkey I wonder if they've been changing the whole Nationals placements thing. Certainly they still consider it, but I've been noticing that they've been taking risks with who they're sending at the lower levels. Not that they're sending bad skaters, just that they've been sending skaters based on summer competition performances and other monitoring sessions/training camps. It seems they're mainly using this approach of camps, competitions, and monitoring for lower levels. These changes seemed to coincide with changes to the high performance staff a few years back.

For Senior (and to some extent Junior) it's harder since there's rules about picking competitors, but USFS has been taking risks where they can with the host spots at SA and sending both lower and higher-ranked seniors to as many Senior B's as possible. It also seems like they're really upping the number of Novice (or intermediate age-eligible for Novice) skaters they send out to compete internationally.

So while I do think they'll look at Nationals placements I think they'll be taking the summer competitions seriously. It certainly paid off for Bradie, and Mariah got a GP medal out of her host pick at SA, so I see no reason for them not to consider summer. The biggest problem, as others have mentioned, is that the US Ladies eligible for that spot have been something of a mess this summer. TBH I couldn't say who would be best to give that spot to.

Well back in the day when it was ISIA there were a lot of comps. There were just a lot of skaters and still are in the Chicago area. Like Juvenile ladies had 10 qualifying rounds. I don't remember competing ISI past like Freestyle 5 or 6. Once you had an axel and a few doubles there was a pretty clear point at least where I skated to start on the USFSA path...Although I do remember having to still take a once a week group ISI class (FS7 and above) to be able to participate in my clubs annual show even with a 2a.. I think I got all the way to FS 9 but to pass FS10 you had to have a judge come out and you had to do an axel in the opposite direction, which was pretty pointless. Not sure if the requirements are still the same.
 

AngieNikodinovLove

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,006
Hahaha I spent my early life on the Wilmette/Evanston boarder and will possibly be moving to the LA area near Arrowhead soon. It was interesting because I remember how ISI heavy a lot of those rinks were. DuPage Open was the huge USFS competition. My parents were shocked to hear about Jason, Bradie, and Gracie because they were so used to no one doing USFS up there! Is it still ISI heavy up there? Maybe that's why there in't a huge ladies field.
PM us when you arrive. Welcome to the family.
 

AngieNikodinovLove

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,006
Starr dropped to 5th with 97 points for the free. Not even sure how that would hold on JGP.

I think Bradie will be the one to watch this season.... Need to see Hicks.... but I dont have high hopes for Mariah or Angela atm.

Weird summer thus far.

More curious for Gracie now than ever. I would totally be fine if by Oct her SP was a 3/2, a 3 and a 2 axel for now. And a free with a mix of 2 and 3. Good execution and good choreography is enough for me atm.
 
Last edited:

StitchMonkey

Well-Known Member
Messages
869
Starr's 5th place was in part due to a fall on a 3A attempt. It was UR but not downgraded... so i mean that is something. She entered it without hesitation, but it may have thrown off some of her rhythm on other jumps, but that is part of why you have to try these things.
 

WillyElliot

Tanning one day, then wearing a winter coat today.
Messages
662
Maybe Starr will get the SA spot? The highest scorers among Senior Ladies so far are Alysa and Ting...Alysa is age-ineligible and Ting is probably better-suited to the JGP right now...as much as I'd love to see her receive such an honor, I think she prob needs another year in Junior internationally.
I hope that it goes to Starr, to be honest. She is the future. Rewarding Hicks with a Skate America slot is just throwing good money after bad in my opinion. If not Starr, then Angela.
 

AngieNikodinovLove

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,006
^^^^Starr already has SkAm.

Im hoping for GG, Amber or Katie of the eligible gals.

ATM I cant see any reason for a second for Hicks or Angela.
 

Frida80

Well-Known Member
Messages
815
Starr's 5th place was in part due to a fall on a 3A attempt. It was UR but not downgraded... so i mean that is something. She entered it without hesitation, but it may have thrown off some of her rhythm on other jumps, but that is part of why you have to try these things.
Pretty much. Lots of skaters struggle when they introduce a new jump in their programs. I think she fought for it, but she was too rattled by that 3A fall. Mirai said during Champs Camp after she landed her 3A everything else went bad. I think it’s just a matter of gaining more muscle memory.

I think this is only the second time she’s competed with this her FS, after about two or three more comps the jumps will be much better.
 

StitchMonkey

Well-Known Member
Messages
869
Pretty much. Lots of skaters struggle when they introduce a new jump in their programs. I think she fought for it, but she was too rattled by that 3A fall. Mirai said during Champs Camp after she landed her 3A everything else went bad. I think it’s just a matter of gaining more muscle memory.

I think this is only the second time she’s competed with this her FS, after about two or three more comps the jumps will be much better.
It's a work in progress. But you have to do that work to get any where. I guess i kinda feel like this competition was not a waste for her. She got a new SP PB, and she got a feel for the 3A in competition with this program. You have to start somewhere with big elements, so let her try. She tends to improve over the season so I am looking forward to SA.
 

layman

Well-Known Member
Messages
213
It's a work in progress. But you have to do that work to get any where. I guess i kinda feel like this competition was not a waste for her. She got a new SP PB, and she got a feel for the 3A in competition with this program. You have to start somewhere with big elements, so let her try. She tends to improve over the season so I am looking forward to SA.
Is it just me or has Starr grown a lot from last season to this season? She was a tiny waif last season. She seems to have grown almost a foot. If so, this could be throwing off the timing of her jumps (until she adjusts). Anyway, she looks much stronger. She looks like a senior lady now. The stroking and edging looks stronger. The jump entrance technique looks stronger. She seems to skate with more speed and security. With a tiny bit more spring, she will get that 3-axel clean.

I absolutely loved the music choice for her. Very sophisticated. It reminded me of the Duchesnays. It is hard to skate to rhythms but she pulls it off brilliantly.
 

Frida80

Well-Known Member
Messages
815
Is it just me or has Starr grown a lot from last season to this season? She was a tiny waif last season. She seems to have grown almost a foot. If so, this could be throwing off the timing of her jumps (until she adjusts). Anyway, she looks much stronger. She looks like a senior lady now. The stroking and edging looks stronger. The jump entrance technique looks stronger. She seems to skate with more speed and security. With a tiny bit more spring, she will get that 3-axel clean.

I absolutely loved the music choice for her. Very sophisticated. It reminded me of the Duchesnays. It is hard to skate to rhythms but she pulls it off brilliantly.
No she’s still really tiny. I just saw a picture of her next to Karen and Mirai a few weeks ago. Here it is.

https://instagram.com/p/BlMntC7lxGI/
Maybe she been working with a choreography to help her use her extensions more. Like that new spiral she included. Or maybe it was the body suit. :confused:
 

layman

Well-Known Member
Messages
213
No she’s still really tiny. I just saw a picture of her next to Karen and Mirai a few weeks ago. Here it is.

https://instagram.com/p/BlMntC7lxGI/
Maybe she been working with a choreography to help her use her extensions more. Like that new spiral she included. Or maybe it was the body suit. :confused:
That spiral was really beautiful...one of the highlights of the program. It's rare to see a lady hold a spiral long enough for you to see it (these days) the way that Starr does. I do see a lot of improvement with her extensions and lines...maybe that's why she is looking taller to me.
 

Tavi

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,941
I am really looking forward to seeing Courtney, who’s been training with Kori Ade for several months. Her FS is apparently to the Nutcracker pas de deux. GS poster Arriba627 saw her last night at the DuPage Open and was favorably impressed with her speed and the “lovely smoothness” of her skating. As is typical for Kori’s students with new programs, some jumps were doubled.
 

Frau Muller

Everything is beautiful at the ballet!
Messages
11,714
Some of Bradie’s new FS, which she debuted at DuPage Open - thanks to GS poster marinhondas for finding it! It is incomplete and posted in several sections - scroll right for next clip. Apparently, this is not her actual costume:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BmFQe2OlbxO/
Wow! Bradie’s sleek figure (past puberty monster, folks), the way she uses torso and arms are TO DIE FOR! Love the music. Love the dress. Best US Lady by a mile.
 

jlai

Title-less
Messages
12,455
For skaters with no international exp, the best place to send them is the senior B at Salt Lake City, see how they do, and then if they do reasonably well, give them a shot at SA or something else later.
 

SkateFanBerlin

Well-Known Member
Messages
801
Wow! Bradie’s sleek figure (past puberty monster, folks), the way she uses torso and arms are TO DIE FOR! Love the music. Love the dress. Best US Lady by a mile.
Interesting - using Prokofiev again. Last year middle section was from Cinderella. This year from Romeo and Juliet (part of music Ashley hated and dropped after nationals and before Sochi)
 

Frau Muller

Everything is beautiful at the ballet!
Messages
11,714
Interesting - using Prokofiev again. Last year middle section was from Cinderella. This year from Romeo and Juliet (part of music Ashley hated and dropped after nationals and before Sochi)
Maybe she’ll use Stone Flower next year?
 

Tinami Amori

Well-Known Member
Messages
18,627
Maybe she’ll use Stone Flower next year?
I thought of "Mistress of the Cooper Mountain" (the name of "Stone Flower" ballet) many times, because it is a beautiful story, with many possibilities for costumes and choreography..... But! the music is not good for skating, it has no memorable and/or melodic pieces at all (imo). But it is a wonderful theme.. too bad about the music.
https://pp.userapi.com/c306504/v306504577/95e1/vMud3C5BN3w.jpg
https://mariinsky-theatre.com/pic_perfomance_big/1502116466_kamen2.jpg
 

mag

Well-Known Member
Messages
11,545
I am not sure if Starr's Asian Open FS has been posted but here it is: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LKfZshnMR5E
I still don’t get how Starr managed to get assigned to SA in the first round. She still looks very junior with pre novice skating skills and choreography to me. I got as far as the spiral and man were there a lot of cross overs and not particularly good ones. There is no deep under push on the backward ones and the forward ones appear to skate across the surface of the ice. Maybe it would be different live, but for now I am just not seeing it.
 

Dobre

Well-Known Member
Messages
6,491
I still don’t get how Starr managed to get assigned to SA in the first round.
I assume by defeating all the U.S. ladies that didn't earn 2 GP spots at U.S. Nationals. As well as defeating Wang at 4CCs. And by outscoring the top junior ladies at Nationals as well.
 

WillyElliot

Tanning one day, then wearing a winter coat today.
Messages
662
I still don’t get how Starr managed to get assigned to SA in the first round. She still looks very junior with pre novice skating skills and choreography to me. I got as far as the spiral and man were there a lot of cross overs and not particularly good ones. There is no deep under push on the backward ones and the forward ones appear to skate across the surface of the ice. Maybe it would be different live, but for now I am just not seeing it.
I agree. I want to like her, but this program is underwhelming to say the least. Her technique is not strong and this music does nothing for her. Not like she is skating to the music anyway. I would scrap this, because it is worse than her program last year. What a disappointment.
 

Willin

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,094
Well, there's also that Ashley may or may not be retired, Mirai isn't doing the GP (and also may or may not be retired), and Bradie/Karen/Mariah all have two assignments (presumably they didn't want two of these three at the same GP). Those were the only people that beat her at nationals. As noted she beat out others that could've had the spot including Wang, Hicks, Glenn, and all the other Junior Ladies competing Senior at Nationals. With no one above Starr at Nationals who could have that second spot and few (if any) of the other options having competed for the summer when spots were chosen, it was probably easiest to pick by Nationals results.

Also, if they're trying to promote the future, Starr may very well be it. She needs work on her skating quite a bit to be competitive at the Senior ranks, but she does have the potential to be one of the faces of US Figure Skating. Girl is very marketable. She went viral in the past, she has (or almost has) a 3A like Mirai, she's got a fun personality, she chooses unique music and costumes, she performs on the ice, she's pretty, etc. They were already using all those as marketing for Nationals this year, but when she is legitimately in the conversation for the Olympic team I expect USFS to play those talking points up to the media even more.
 

Frida80

Well-Known Member
Messages
815
If you thin Starr is tiny, then look to the far right in the photo. That is Alyssa Liu who is super tiny.
Alysa is 12. Starr is 17. Alysa will probably grow quite a bit in the next few years, but Start is definitely done growing. She may grow an inch, but that’s it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Top
Do Not Sell My Personal Information