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U.S. Ladies [#20]: In a Week, Maybe Two, They'll Make You a Star

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Vagabond, Nov 27, 2017.

  1. her grace

    her grace Team Polina

    Not to nitpick, but Cain/LeDuc did not have a higher Senior B score than Castelli/Tran last season. That selection shows that USFS can be perfectly happy to abandon the selection criteria to get its desired team. :angryfire
    LilJen likes this.
  2. zoe111

    zoe111 Well-Known Member

    Either way it was a ridiculous decsion
    centerpt1 likes this.
  3. Carolla5501

    Carolla5501 Well-Known Member

    Not sure what this has to do with Ladies, but.... I think USFSA was tired of giving C/T assignments only to see that so so skating and was hoping for more from another team. Personally I don't blame them
    aftershocks, Jammers and haribobo like this.
  4. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I <3 Kozuka

    Their Nationals SP.
    haribobo and skatingguy like this.
  5. JJS5056

    JJS5056 Well-Known Member

    I think that, with the way her season has gone, Ashley must now be connecting to the lyrics of LaLaLand in a way that had felt inauthentic earlier this season. I am unfamiliar with the movie and soundtrack, but would it be a choice that might work well during a breakup? She did end a long-term relationship around the time the program was chosen but we all know those feelings subside... perhaps being written off this fall has given her the same sense of need to prove herself, a trait she is know for digging deep to find and leverage.

    I totally agree that Wagner is a near certainty for this team. On a crummy ankle and two URs, she managed a 64 SP which would be competitive enough at Nationals that her typical, 1 or 2 mistake (two-foots/URs) LP should easily get her onto the podium. PCS are part of FS judging and internationally, nobody from this group of Ladies is in the same ballpark as Ashley. Her SPs have never lit the world ablaze, but when she hits it, HHCC is a perfect vehicle to remind the judges that she does own the ice and that she can work face while others stalk their triples. And, you can bet she is oozing out every inch of facial drama possible for LLL; she has never had difficult CH, so she just needs to connect to the music, and be able to act her butt off. This was her only real chance at improving from 7th place, and I am so glad to see her make such a risky move before the event that has marred her career. She ain't dumb... I think she is going to bring it.

    Lastly, 2 quick points:
    1. Why so much concern on detail like her Lutz edge? No way would a skater announce that they are now hitting a better edge and remind the world they usually are on a flat/inside. Per the Brits and FSUers, the lutz looked like a flat at worst during SC, and if she can avoid an "e," this is a silly thing to hone in on.
    2. People are comparing Ashley's trajectory to BUTYRSKAYA in the leadup to SLC? This has been her only "slump" of a season and it has only been 2 GP events! She won a GP event last year, skated a fantastic SP at Worlds en route to a top 10, and then was her standard self by WTT. Her career peak will have been around 18 months prior to the OG SP... yes, a stronger Worlds LP would have been great as would have a completed SA + GPF. But, who else has won GPs in 2/3 last years? Made GPF 2/4 times? Placed 4-5-7-5-2-7 in the World?

    The program debacle is certainly puzzling, but this sort of change points to a good mindset and attitude which has been most important for AW as her record speaks for itself in terms of hit skates. Butyrskaya had no 3-3 and was struggling to land a single triple on one foot by 2002. From all I have read, AW will be throwing down her usual 3-3 + 3-3/3>3 set and she salvaged a shot at hitting the top group's PCS by generating buzz over LLL.
    falling_dance likes this.
  6. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    It would have been pretty nice if Ashley had a Maria Butyrskaya like trajectory leading up to the Olympics. A World championship one year; an undefeated GP series, a bronze at the GPF, and a World bronze the next year; two first places and a silver on the GP series, a bronze medal at the GPF, 3rd place LP and 4th place overall at Worlds the year after that; and then during the Olympic season, an undefeated GP series, qualifying for the GPF; and winning a ISU championship (Euros) heading towards SLC.

    That said, the level of skating has risen up considerably and it would be harder for Ashley to replicate those results given the field and scoring system she's competing with.
    danafan and FSfan107 like this.
  7. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

    As the poster who raised the topic, I have this to say:

    1. Some people are not made for the brand of sarcasm and goofy wit that the INTP possesses. You are apparently one of them. ((((JJS5056))))

    2. The way forward in Ladies' skating is to be able to do both a lutz and a flip from the correct edge. Many Top Ladies can do this, including Bradie Tennell. What's more, those who have true lutzes and flips can and do put two such jumps in their SP and three or four into their FS without having to rely on an extra loop or salchow instead.

    It is possible to fix a flutz; Joannie Rochette is a well-known example. If Wagner had made the effort years ago, she would most likely have had better results.
  8. Eeyora1

    Eeyora1 Active Member

    According to Ashley’s latest Instagram story, it looks like she might be moving. Can’t say I blame her but her little kitty Dexter will be missing his friend next store.
  9. Willin

    Willin Well-Known Member

    Well, with the whole person stalking her social media, it's probably a good choice to move. It's probably a less good choice to announce she's moving on social media when she knows the person likely follows her on it...
  10. berthesghost

    berthesghost Well-Known Member

    Well, if Osmond is attending the Rochette school of flute fixing, she’s been skipping class and it doesn’t seem to be hurting her chances at all.
    As for Wagner, if one were to list all of the issues that have been holding her back over the years, I suspect flutzing, like Ashley, would struggle to do better than the 4th to 7th range.
    Coco likes this.
  11. Sylvia

    Sylvia Counting down to U.S. Nationals!

    "Making of Part 2: Returning to Ashley Wagner's La La Land free skate" (3 mins.) via Jackie Wong: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIC5ezOlbh8
    Ashley Wagner will debut her La La Land free skate at the 2018 U.S. Championships. My extended interview with her on why she switched and switched back, and changes since the summer. Plus, new footage from the summer!
  12. Sylvia

    Sylvia Counting down to U.S. Nationals!

    Golden Spin of Zagreb results:
    5 Emmy MA USA 166.71 9 2 - her 2nd place FS (117.08 ISU PB): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-N8djPWSUss
    6 Starr ANDREWS USA 163.49 4 7 - no video of her 4th place SP (60.80)
    8 Hannah MILLER USA 149.46 8 8 - 1st int'l in 2 years; she got the 4CC minimums

    Emmy now has the Worlds FS minimum & the 4CC SP minimum (Starr already had both Worlds minimums).
  13. Frida80

    Frida80 Well-Known Member

    I took the plunge and paid for streaming. Unfortunately, I didn’t get a chance to see Emmy’s short, but I did see Starr’s and Hannah’s.

    I’m very pleased with Emmy’s long. She emotes so well and she connects with the program. Starr put in both her Flip and her Lutz, which both had problems. It was to be expected. It’s good that she used this competition as way to practice doing them again before nationals.

    As for Hannah, I believe that it takes some time to get used to competing internationally again. It’s a first step.
  14. Coco

    Coco Rotating while Russian!

    So the most Emmy can hope for is Junior Worlds?

    Too bad there isn't a North American Senior B in mid to late December where skaters training in the US and Canada could go without too much travel.
  15. wickedwitch

    wickedwitch Well-Known Member

    I don't think it's inconceivable that Emmy gets 4CC.
    pinky166 likes this.
  16. Coco

    Coco Rotating while Russian!

    Oh, I misunderstood...so she does have both minimums for 4cc...d'oh! Good!
  17. Frida80

    Frida80 Well-Known Member

    Well we all know who's in the debate for the Olympic team. Let's talk about the potential team for 4CC.
    This includes:

    Hannah Miller

    Now many of these girls have the potential to be a spoiler for the Olympic team, so I'm not counting them out for that. I'm just looking at some ladies that could go to 4CC. I'll have to look up their scores and add them.
  18. AngieNikodinovLove

    AngieNikodinovLove Well-Known Member

    ^^^ New blood

    Any of 5 -8

    Added later: I think I may have read this wrong... My picks 5-8 are for 4 CC....
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2017 at 2:53 AM
  19. DimaToe

    DimaToe Olympic Rhodium Medalist

    it’s a 4 way battle , I think the Olympic team is between Wagner, Tennell, Nagasu and Chen. I think skaters like Hong, Hicks, and Wang could surprise, but based on scoring potential alone I can’t see the Olympic team going beyond the 4 skaters I mentioned. Bell’s LP especially is way beneath her level, that combined with her nconsistency, I think a pewter finish is the highest she can accomplish.
    Firedancer and AxelAnnie like this.