U.S. Ladies [#20]: In a Week, Maybe Two, They'll Make You a Star

[her grace]

But seeing as a selection committee went and sent Cain & Le Duc to 4CCs last season over Castelli & Tran, based on nothing but a higher score at a senior B, who the heck knows who could be propped up? When decisions are made politically, rather than in competition, a LOT depends on who is ahead of you.

Not to nitpick, but Cain/LeDuc did not have a higher Senior B score than Castelli/Tran last season. That selection shows that USFS can be perfectly happy to abandon the selection criteria to get its desired team.

 

[zoe111]

Not to nitpick, but Cain/LeDuc did not have a higher Senior B score than Castelli/Tran last season. That selection shows that USFS can be perfectly happy to abandon the selection criteria to get its desired team.

Either way it was a ridiculous decsion

 

[Carolla5501]

Either way it was a ridiculous decsion

Not sure what this has to do with Ladies, but.... I think USFSA was tired of giving C/T assignments only to see that so so skating and was hoping for more from another team. Personally I don't blame them

 

[kwanfan1818]

based on nothing but a higher score at a senior B,

Their Nationals SP.

 

[JJS5056]

I think that, with the way her season has gone, Ashley must now be connecting to the lyrics of LaLaLand in a way that had felt inauthentic earlier this season. I am unfamiliar with the movie and soundtrack, but would it be a choice that might work well during a breakup? She did end a long-term relationship around the time the program was chosen but we all know those feelings subside... perhaps being written off this fall has given her the same sense of need to prove herself, a trait she is know for digging deep to find and leverage.

I totally agree that Wagner is a near certainty for this team. On a crummy ankle and two URs, she managed a 64 SP which would be competitive enough at Nationals that her typical, 1 or 2 mistake (two-foots/URs) LP should easily get her onto the podium. PCS are part of FS judging and internationally, nobody from this group of Ladies is in the same ballpark as Ashley. Her SPs have never lit the world ablaze, but when she hits it, HHCC is a perfect vehicle to remind the judges that she does own the ice and that she can work face while others stalk their triples. And, you can bet she is oozing out every inch of facial drama possible for LLL; she has never had difficult CH, so she just needs to connect to the music, and be able to act her butt off. This was her only real chance at improving from 7th place, and I am so glad to see her make such a risky move before the event that has marred her career. She ain't dumb... I think she is going to bring it.

Lastly, 2 quick points:
1. Why so much concern on detail like her Lutz edge? No way would a skater announce that they are now hitting a better edge and remind the world they usually are on a flat/inside. Per the Brits and FSUers, the lutz looked like a flat at worst during SC, and if she can avoid an "e," this is a silly thing to hone in on.
2. People are comparing Ashley's trajectory to BUTYRSKAYA in the leadup to SLC? This has been her only "slump" of a season and it has only been 2 GP events! She won a GP event last year, skated a fantastic SP at Worlds en route to a top 10, and then was her standard self by WTT. Her career peak will have been around 18 months prior to the OG SP... yes, a stronger Worlds LP would have been great as would have a completed SA + GPF. But, who else has won GPs in 2/3 last years? Made GPF 2/4 times? Placed 4-5-7-5-2-7 in the World?

The program debacle is certainly puzzling, but this sort of change points to a good mindset and attitude which has been most important for AW as her record speaks for itself in terms of hit skates. Butyrskaya had no 3-3 and was struggling to land a single triple on one foot by 2002. From all I have read, AW will be throwing down her usual 3-3 + 3-3/3>3 set and she salvaged a shot at hitting the top group's PCS by generating buzz over LLL.

 

[VGThuy]

2. People are comparing Ashley's trajectory to BUTYRSKAYA in the leadup to SLC? This has been her only "slump" of a season and it has only been 2 GP events! She won a GP event last year, skated a fantastic SP at Worlds en route to a top 10, and then was her standard self by WTT. Her career peak will have been around 18 months prior to the OG SP... yes, a stronger Worlds LP would have been great as would have a completed SA + GPF. But, who else has won GPs in 2/3 last years? Made GPF 2/4 times? Placed 4-5-7-5-2-7 in the World?

It would have been pretty nice if Ashley had a Maria Butyrskaya like trajectory leading up to the Olympics. A World championship one year; an undefeated GP series, a bronze at the GPF, and a World bronze the next year; two first places and a silver on the GP series, a bronze medal at the GPF, 3rd place LP and 4th place overall at Worlds the year after that; and then during the Olympic season, an undefeated GP series, qualifying for the GPF; and winning a ISU championship (Euros) heading towards SLC.

That said, the level of skating has risen up considerably and it would be harder for Ashley to replicate those results given the field and scoring system she's competing with.

 

[Vagabond]

1. Why so much concern on detail like her Lutz edge?

As the poster who raised the topic, I have this to say:

1. Some people are not made for the brand of sarcasm and goofy wit that the INTP possesses. You are apparently one of them. ((((JJS5056))))

2. The way forward in Ladies' skating is to be able to do both a lutz and a flip from the correct edge. Many Top Ladies can do this, including Bradie Tennell. What's more, those who have true lutzes and flips can and do put two such jumps in their SP and three or four into their FS without having to rely on an extra loop or salchow instead.

It is possible to fix a flutz; Joannie Rochette is a well-known example. If Wagner had made the effort years ago, she would most likely have had better results.

 

[Eeyora1]

According to Ashley’s latest Instagram story, it looks like she might be moving. Can’t say I blame her but her little kitty Dexter will be missing his friend next store.

 

[Willin]

Well, with the whole person stalking her social media, it's probably a good choice to move. It's probably a less good choice to announce she's moving on social media when she knows the person likely follows her on it...

 

[berthesghost]

As the poster who raised the topic, I have this to say:

1. Some people are not made for the brand of sarcasm and goofy wit that the INTP possesses. You are apparently one of them. ((((JJS5056))))

2. The way forward in Ladies' skating is to be able to do both a lutz and a flip from the correct edge. Many Top Ladies can do this, including Bradie Tennell. What's more, those who have true lutzes and flips can and do put two such jumps in their SP and three or four into their FS without having to rely on an extra loop or salchow instead.

It is possible to fix a flutz; Joannie Rochette is a well-known example. If Wagner had made the effort years ago, she would most likely have had better results.

Well, if Osmond is attending the Rochette school of flute fixing, she’s been skipping class and it doesn’t seem to be hurting her chances at all.
As for Wagner, if one were to list all of the issues that have been holding her back over the years, I suspect flutzing, like Ashley, would struggle to do better than the 4th to 7th range.

 

[Sylvia]

"Making of Part 2: Returning to Ashley Wagner's La La Land free skate" (3 mins.) via Jackie Wong: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIC5ezOlbh8
Ashley Wagner will debut her La La Land free skate at the 2018 U.S. Championships. My extended interview with her on why she switched and switched back, and changes since the summer. Plus, new footage from the summer!

 

[Sylvia]

Golden Spin of Zagreb results:
5 Emmy MA USA 166.71 9 2 - her 2nd place FS (117.08 ISU PB): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-N8djPWSUss
6 Starr ANDREWS USA 163.49 4 7 - no video of her 4th place SP (60.80)
8 Hannah MILLER USA 149.46 8 8 - 1st int'l in 2 years; she got the 4CC minimums

Emmy now has the Worlds FS minimum & the 4CC SP minimum (Starr already had both Worlds minimums).

 

[Frida80]

Golden Spin of Zagreb results:
5 Emmy MA USA 166.71 9 2 - her 2nd place FS (117.08 ISU PB): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-N8djPWSUss
6 Starr ANDREWS USA 163.49 4 7 - no video of her 4th place SP (60.80)
8 Hannah MILLER USA 149.46 8 8 - 1st int'l in 2 years; she got the 4CC minimums

Emmy now has the Worlds FS minimum & the 4CC SP minimum (Starr already had both Worlds minimums).

I took the plunge and paid for streaming. Unfortunately, I didn’t get a chance to see Emmy’s short, but I did see Starr’s and Hannah’s.

I’m very pleased with Emmy’s long. She emotes so well and she connects with the program. Starr put in both her Flip and her Lutz, which both had problems. It was to be expected. It’s good that she used this competition as way to practice doing them again before nationals.

As for Hannah, I believe that it takes some time to get used to competing internationally again. It’s a first step.

 

[Coco]

So the most Emmy can hope for is Junior Worlds?

Too bad there isn't a North American Senior B in mid to late December where skaters training in the US and Canada could go without too much travel.

 

[wickedwitch]

So the most Emmy can hope for is Junior Worlds?

I don't think it's inconceivable that Emmy gets 4CC.

 

[Coco]

Oh, I misunderstood...so she does have both minimums for 4cc...d'oh! Good!

 

[Frida80]

Well we all know who's in the debate for the Olympic team. Let's talk about the potential team for 4CC.
This includes:

Courtney
Angela
Amber
Caroline
Starr
Tessa
Hannah Miller
Emmy

Now many of these girls have the potential to be a spoiler for the Olympic team, so I'm not counting them out for that. I'm just looking at some ladies that could go to 4CC. I'll have to look up their scores and add them.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

^^^ New blood

Any of 5 -8

Added later: I think I may have read this wrong... My picks 5-8 are for 4 CC....

 

[DimaToe]

it’s a 4 way battle , I think the Olympic team is between Wagner, Tennell, Nagasu and Chen. I think skaters like Hong, Hicks, and Wang could surprise, but based on scoring potential alone I can’t see the Olympic team going beyond the 4 skaters I mentioned. Bell’s LP especially is way beneath her level, that combined with her nconsistency, I think a pewter finish is the highest she can accomplish.

 

[Sylvia]

Mirai is closing out the Team USA Winter Olympics Athlete Reddit AMA [Ask Me Anything] series, starting at 1 pm Eastern today: https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/7jkud3/i_am_figure_skater_mirai_nagasu_i_won_the_us/

ETA that I've started a new GSD thread for this: https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/threads/mirai-nagasus-reddit-ama.102639/

Elliott Almond, the Olympics reporter for the San Jose Mercury News/Bay Area News Group, spoke to Mirai when she was in town on Tuesday: http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/12/13/ice-skating-star-mirai-nagasu-i-can-eat-18-dumplings/
Excerpt from the end:

She said Gold’s struggles underscore how difficult it is to remain at the top, how the sport always has someone younger and hungrier coming up quickly.
“People misunderstand that sometimes,” Nagasu said. “Even our commentators have had rough performances. You have to understand this is a very difficult sport.”
Nagasu can reflect more now as she nears the end of her career, She has been taking business classes at the University of Colorado-Colorado Springs. The skater signed up for the spring semester but she hopes to “definitely drop them” after nationals.
Nagasu wants to perform at the Olympics in February, not study for an exam in Colorado.
“I’m prepared to go for everything,” she said.

 

[RD]

The most noteworthy thing I saw in there is confirmation that she (currently, anyway) plans to continue competing beyond this season

 

[VALuvsMKwan]

Mirai is closing out the Team USA Winter Olympics Athlete Reddit AMA [Ask Me Anything] series, starting at 1 pm Eastern today: https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/7jkud3/i_am_figure_skater_mirai_nagasu_i_won_the_us/

ETA that I've started a new GSD thread for this: https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/threads/mirai-nagasus-reddit-ama.102639/ (eta: full transcript is posted in there now)

Elliott Almond, the Olympics reporter for the San Jose Mercury News/Bay Area News Group, spoke to Mirai when she was in town on Tuesday: http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/12/13/ice-skating-star-mirai-nagasu-i-can-eat-18-dumplings/
Excerpt from the end:

"She said Gold’s struggles underscore how difficult it is to remain at the top, how the sport always has someone younger and hungrier coming up quickly.
“People misunderstand that sometimes,” Nagasu said. “Even our commentators have had rough performances. You have to understand this is a very difficult sport.”
Nagasu can reflect more now as she nears the end of her career, She has been taking business classes at the University of Colorado-Colorado Springs. The skater signed up for the spring semester but she hopes to “definitely drop them” after nationals.
Nagasu wants to perform at the Olympics in February, not study for an exam in Colorado.
“I’m prepared to go for everything,” she said."

A little shade at Weir and Lipinski, I think? Go on, Miss Thing (or is "henny" the latest term?)!

 

[missing]

ESPN columnist Paul Lukas wrote a column suggesting skating costumes were inappropriate and Ashley Wagner, via Twitter, let him have it.

Big LOL at this article. Live for ignorant male writers who take something beautiful and question if it could possibly be a sport! Put @JannyMedvedeva in a paper bag and she'll still be a kickass ATHLETE who dominates..SMH @espn at such a ridiculous article.

Oh one last thing! Since when do journalists reference Hollywood movies and act like those are the facts? Get back to me when you can actually learn how to spell OLYMPIC CHAMPION Meryl Davis's name right. Google, try it out it's fun! Again @espn SMH at all of this.

Ok, just kidding this is the last thing. Fine, you aren't so sure that skating is much of a sport bc we have costumes etc. I guess my question is at this point, just bc you have access to a keyboard are you really a journalist? Hmmm

 

[RD]

It's one thing to criticize the article for its content - totally fair game - but, I don't think throwing personal insults around does anybody any good.

 

[Sylvia]

I've started a thread in the Trash Can for Paul Lukas' column: https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/th...an-international-sport-need-a-costume.102666/

 

[RoseRed]

It's one thing to criticize the article for its content - totally fair game - but, I don't think throwing personal insults around does anybody any good.

Well I'm sure for lots of athletes, it feels personal when someone dismisses their sport. And it was kind of condescending/mainsplainy.

And he not only did he use I, Tonya as fact to support his argument, he also misspelled Meryl Davis's name, so not great journalism there. Seriously I know typos happen, but it's pretty unprofessional when it's someone's name.

 

[Vagabond]

Ashley Wagner just managed to make Gracie Gold look just a teensy weensy bit better than she does.

 

[RD]

And he not only did he use I, Tonya as fact to support his argument, he also misspelled Meryl Davis's name, so not great journalism there. Seriously I know typos happen, but it's pretty unprofessional when it's someone's name.

I'll give you that one though, that didn't help his credibility any. Only gave more fodder to his detractors...gotta check your work man...

 

[Sylvia]

Courtney Hicks' 3F+3Lo in practice on her 22nd birthday (eta: filmed by Jonathan Cassar): https://twitter.com/courtneynhicks/status/941814481381859328

 

[AxelAnnie]

I wish skaters...Ashley in this case would stop trying to defend Figure Skating as a sport. It is not an argument that can be won and I find it demeans Ashley or whomever enters into it. Figure Skating is athletic....no doubt about that. But it is a judged sport which makes it different. It is like trying to convince people that a table is a chair......It isn't. That does not make it less than anything else...just different.