U.S. Women [#2]: The Unbearable Lightness of Beijing

Status
Not open for further replies.
Alysa is still close to a medal, nobody went clean for the 3 axel here, why would she pause it when even skaters like Trusova wants to land them and keeps attempting it, she could still redeem in the freeskate, You is not very consistent either, the only spoiler would be Mana Kawabe, does she plan a triple axel in the FS ?
 
While I appreciate that Alysa is going for the 3A in the SP, she was getting much higher scores at her early Challengers when she only attempted it in her FS. I don't have a problem with her going for the 3A at Nationals where the field is much thinner and the caller is likely to be more generous, but I do think she and her team should reconsider taking it out for, at minimum, the Team Event in Beijing. Even if you discount her Lombardia scores as also generous, she still scored 73+ at Nebelhorn and the US needs every point it can find in the Team Event. If Alysa can go clean in the SP there, she is in far better position to beat whichever woman Japan uses for the SP. I'd probably, to be honest, take it out of the SP for the individual event and even Worlds also and aim for cleaning up her jump technique further the rest of the season. Absolutely, keep going for it in the FS but she hasn't come close to matching the best scores of Kamila, Anna, Sasha, Liza or even Maiia so the chances of her medaling are low (which we always knew going into this season). She can work on incorporating it into her SP next season, with the long-range focus on 2026.
 
Last edited:
Karen-W said:
While I appreciate that Alysa is going for the 3A in the SP, she was getting much higher scores at her early Challengers when she only attempted it in her FS. I don't have a problem with her going for the 3A at Nationals where the field is much thinner and the caller is likely to be more generous, but I do think she and her team should reconsider taking it out for, at minimum, the Team Event in Beijing. Even if you discount her Lombardia scores as also generous, she still scored 73+ at Nebelhorn and the US needs every point it can find in the Team Event. If Alysa can go clean in the SP there, she is in far better position to beat whichever woman Japan uses for the SP. I'd probably, to be honest, take it out of the SP for the individual event and even Worlds also and aim for cleaning up her jump technique further the rest of the season. Absolutely, keep going for it in the FS but she hasn't come close to matching the best scores of Kamila, Anna, Sasha, Liza or even Maiia so the chances of her medaling are low (which we always knew going into this season). She work on incorporating it into her SP next season, with the long-range focus on 2026.
Click to expand...
And that's the thing, I think Alysa and her team have to come to terms with the reality that her attaining an individual medal at Olympics or Worlds is out of her hands, 3A or not. It could happen, but it's not likely and is entirely contingent on the performance of the field.
 
Maximillian said:
And that's the thing, I think Alysa and her team have to come to terms with the reality that her attaining an individual medal at Olympics or Worlds is out of her hands, 3A or not. It could happen, but it's not likely and is entirely contingent on the performance of the field.
Click to expand...
I hope Team Liu recognizes that an Olympic Team medal is a success story for them. The only hope for Alysa now should be to winning the highest team medal. And that's an amazing achievement.
 
Maximillian said:
And that's the thing, I think Alysa and her team have to come to terms with the reality that her attaining an individual medal at Olympics or Worlds is out of her hands, 3A or not. It could happen, but it's not likely and is entirely contingent on the performance of the field.
Click to expand...
she will have competition soon with Isabeu Levito and Mia Kalin
 
Karen-W said:
Kalin is no competition at this point. She barely made an impression on the JGP this season. Levito... Maybe? But she has technique issues also.
Click to expand...
I agree. I was shocked to see how basic and sub-junior her skating skills are. Spins, movement, everything. She does have a beautiful 4toe though. She's going to need years of "AlysaLiu SkatingSkills Training" to get her up to snuff.

Maybe Lindsay Thorngren will be the "Next One"? I wasn't all that super-impressed with the state of our junior ladies beyond her and Isabeau.
 
I think Alysa going for the 3A in the FS makes sense. Not sure about the SP. Their team knows best, but they haven't landed it cleanly yet this season in competition.

Silicon Valley SP - 3Aq fall
Silicon Valley FS - 3A<-2T
Cranberry FS - 3A<<
Lombardia FS - 3A<
Nebelhorn FS - 1A
SC SP - 3A<
SC FS - 3A<< fall
NHK SP - 3A< fall

She hasn't got a single one called fully rotated out of 8 attempts
 
RoseRed said:
I think Alysa going for the 3A in the FS makes sense. Not sure about the SP. Their team knows best, but they haven't landed it cleanly yet this season in competition.

Silicon Valley SP - 3Aq fall
Silicon Valley FS - 3A<-2T
Cranberry FS - 3A<<
Lombardia FS - 3A<
Nebelhorn FS - 1A
SC SP - 3A<
SC FS - 3A<< fall
NHK SP - 3A< fall

She hasn't got a single one called fully rotated out of 8 attempts
Click to expand...
I see some merit in Alysa having the 3A in both long and short.
I am not an expert, but I can read :) I was able to find Alysa's detailed scores at Silicon Valley skate.

She did a 3/A - 2/T - Base Value: 7.70, and she received 7.06.. A double Axel is worth 3.3 and the double toe is 1.3. that is a .64 difference. Seems worth it to me.

Double Axel is worth 3.3, and the triple to is 1.3. And, that is only 4.6. points compared to the 7,06 In value.

Seems kinda of like a no brainier to me.

And, I am fully aware that I may have done those scores all wrong. :)
 
Rukia said:
Alysa's problem is not going for the axel, it's that the rest of her jumps are super sketchy. Her rotations are almost always on the side of more questionable now. I love her, but that is an issue.
Click to expand...
I agree. Her base value was 10 pts above Kaori but Alyssa gets no GOE. Can you improve this within the season? Does her team know she will clean up the jumps without prodding? They're keeping all the difficulty in transitions expecting her to be be able to do both - deliver the jumps and the difficult in-between bits - by Olys. Well, it's a theory.
 
The rotations on the jumps here were really disappointing, she had three clean single triple jumps but her 3A and her combinations were all either q or under, and not just the second jump in the combination, the first one as well. Unless they'll manage to get the under-rotating under control I can't see Alysa's score improving.
 
Last edited:
kre56 said:
Am I the only one who thinks she needs to get some help back from Laura Lipetsky?
Click to expand...
No - there was a lot of valid criticism about her jump technique when she was with Lipetsky. It's sort of what's gotten her in this place right now.
sk9tingfan said:
If Mariah retires this year, i would get her to Rafael Arutunian.
Click to expand...
That was my thought as well. I'd love to see what Rafe can do with her.
 
kre56 said:
Am I the only one who thinks she needs to get some help back from Laura Lipetsky?
Click to expand...

sk9tingfan said:
If Mariah retires this year, i would get her to Rafael Arutunian.
Click to expand...

I completely disagree with both of these sentiments. It's astounding how much improvement Alysa has made in the past year with her current coaching team. Compare her form last fall as she was struggling through puberty to where she is now. For many skaters, it takes years to get back to form after going through a major growth spurt, and many even retire as a result. However, Alysa has come back as the strongest US lady. Yes, the rotation on her combinations is shakey, but it takes time to get everything back, and she's already landing triple axels again. Furthermore, her basic skating skills have improved astronomically in the past year with her current team. She's also been exceptionally packaged by them. I honestly can't think of much they've done wrong in the past year that Alysa's been training with them. It's impossible to expect everything to be perfect in a year when the pandemic has affected so much and Alysa has been growing.

Laura's technique was always unsustainable, and Alysa has grown beyond her, now that she's competing senior internationally.
 
dancelion21 said:
I completely disagree with both of these sentiments. It's astounding how much improvement Alysa has made in the past year with her current coaching team. Compare her form last fall as she was struggling through puberty to where she is now. For many skaters, it takes years to get back to form after going through a major growth spurt, and many even retire as a result. However, Alysa has come back as the strongest US lady. Yes, the rotation on her combinations is shakey, but it takes time to get everything back, and she's already landing triple axels again. Furthermore, her basic skating skills have improved astronomically in the past year with her current team. She's also been exceptionally packaged by them. I honestly can't think of much they've done wrong in the past year that Alysa's been training with them. It's impossible to expect everything to be perfect in a year when the ********* has affected so much and Alysa has been growing.

Laura's technique was always unsustainable, and Alysa has grown beyond her, now that she's competing senior internationally.
Click to expand...
Exactly right i doubt if Alysa had stayed with Lipetsky we would have seen the huge improvements in Alysa's overall basic skating since she was woefully slow when she was with Laura. It almost seemed like she had never took stroking lessons when she was with her.
 
Another argument for staying with her current coaching team is that she's off to college after the olympic season (she mentioned in interviews that she's applying) and I don't think a new coach would know her well enough to coach her over FaceTime or Skype. I think one of the reasons why Nathan and Raf made it work was that they've been working together for so many years. But I guess it depends on which college she gets into etc. We'll see.

ETA: I assume she continues skating as she hasn't mentioned anything about taking a break.
 
Sorry, I disagree with that. Laura brought in Massimo to help her with skating skills and components. If she had stayed with Laura with and the jump technique and Massimo with her components, I think that would’ve been a more winning package. Just my two cents.
 
dancelion21 said:
I completely disagree with both of these sentiments. It's astounding how much improvement Alysa has made in the past year with her current coaching team. Compare her form last fall as she was struggling through puberty to where she is now. For many skaters, it takes years to get back to form after going through a major growth spurt, and many even retire as a result. However, Alysa has come back as the strongest US lady. Yes, the rotation on her combinations is shakey, but it takes time to get everything back, and she's already landing triple axels again. Furthermore, her basic skating skills have improved astronomically in the past year with her current team. She's also been exceptionally packaged by them. I honestly can't think of much they've done wrong in the past year that Alysa's been training with them. It's impossible to expect everything to be perfect in a year when the ********* has affected so much and Alysa has been growing.
Click to expand...
I agree, look how far Alysa has come, it's magical!
And she will continue to get better each day, week, month, year!
 
Lacey said:
I agree, look how far Alysa has come, it's magical!
And she will continue to get better each day, week, month, year!
Click to expand...
Fortunately she skates in the US and not Russia. So she has the time to grow and improve, and be the #1 American lady for a long while. I wonder how she’s going to juggle college. Although if she goes somewhere like Berkeley she could probably juggle 3 courses at a time with skating. Might take her 6 years but so what? She’s so young for college anyway. Even if she took 8 years for college it wouldn’t be a big deal.
 
kre56 said:
Sorry, I disagree with that. Laura brought in Massimo to help her with skating skills and components. If she had stayed with Laura with and the jump technique and Massimo with her components, I think that would’ve been a more winning package. Just my two cents.
Click to expand...
Many people have commented on Alysa's unsustainable jump technique with Laura which relied on her incredibly fast rotation. However, that's difficult to keep with puberty. For Laura to have succeeded with Alysa after Alysa went through puberty, she would have had to teach Alysa a whole new jump technique. I don't think Laura would have been able to do that considering she didn't teach Alysa sustainable jump technique in the first place. Jeremy and Massimo have reworked Alysa's jump technique so that she can still do triples and she's attempting the triple axel again. Laura also has no experience with working with skaters competing at the international level, and it showed with Alysa appearing more 'juniorish' than the other ladies she was competing against who were the same age as her in the 2019-20 season.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 51 (members: 0, guests: 51)

Similar threads

haribobo
2025 US Nationals Senior Men and Women Projected Entries
Replies
8
Views
3K
Sylvia
Sylvia
Vagabond
  • Locked
U.S. Women [#6]: The More the Merrier!
32 33 34
Replies
1K
Views
134K
Sylvia
Sylvia
Sylvia
Entries & Skater info - 2025 US Nationals
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)
AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)
Vagabond
  • Locked
U.S. Women [#5]: Remain on the Dance Floor
32 33 34
Replies
999
Views
163K
Coco
Coco
Sylvia
Detailed Colored Schedule & Practice Groups
Replies
2
Views
805
Sylvia
Sylvia
Back
Top
Do Not Sell My Personal Information