Russian women news & updates, 2021-22 season

[Sylvia]

Sofia Muravieva thanked Sasha Trusova for giving her a Bing Dwen Dwen mascot: https://www.instagram.com/p/Cae2_6vIwiO/

 

[AxelAnnie]

But she’s arriving home to be treated like a hero. So it’s all got to be very confusing for her.

It is not confusing to her. It is all part of the nonsense in Russian Skating. In the real world, someone who is disgraced on the world stage would not be rewarded. What does that teach?

 

[AxelAnnie]

Of course she wasn’t doping on her own, she’s a literal child. But if she’s not suspended and her results are allowed to stand, the message is that it’s okay to drug kids as long as they’re so young that no policies are in place to protect them. This is not about punishing her - unfortunately she’s collateral damage. It’s about not incentivizing child abuse.

It’s well-established that RUSADA didn’t flag the test properly and that international events (particularly the Olympics) have very different domestic ones. This has nothing to do with anything.

Nobody is blaming the athletes for anything. If the rest of the world decides not to allow Russian teams or groups to participate in international cultural events, that’s a response to the government’s actions. If the Russian government doesn’t want their citizens to be excluded from those types of opportunities, they’re welcome to evaluate their foreign policy decisions and decide if they want to reconsider any of them.

I am not sure what a literal child is, but Kamala is not a child. She is a teenager. I do not think that doping kids is fine is the message. I think it is more along the lines of getting away with whatever you can.
I agree with you that she is collateral damage. I am particularly fond of "they did not flag the test correctly"....right, and I have a bridge I can sell you.

Was Kamilla a willing participant? We will never know until the book comes out. Most skaters watch what goes into their bodies vigilantly. They know what is at stake. Shoot, ask Ashley Wagner-----she wouldn't even eat a poppy seed muffin.

I think this gets laid at the feet of team Eteri. Somebody knew (or lots of somebodies). It is part of the coach's job to follow what goes into the skater's body.

One thing i am curious about, is why Kamilla? How did she get singled out and if she was the only one doping why? Eteri has a ton of great skaters. Luck? Training conditions? The secret of teaching jumps?

I agree with Scott Hamilton: Kamilla undoubtedly did not measure, experiment, and figure out how to mix a perfect compound for herself. Scott also said that the best thing for Kamilla (in his view) is to get away from Eteri. Come to the USA. Get a new start.

 

[Frau Muller]

…

One thing i am curious about, is why Kamilla? How did she get singled out and if she was the only one doping why? …

Best results from Jrs + perfect age of “15.5” at time of Olympics. More consistent than Khromykh, who was the same age.

They (Eteri & co.) also may have panicked a little last spring when, during the post-Worlds tour, Kamila was seeming to blossom very quickly (puberty came calling). It was obvious to me when watching her in the films of that tour. Hence, I was totally surprise when I saw K’s amazing performances and results in the fall. I had expected her to flake out and the others to pass her.

 

[Trillian]

I am not sure what a literal child is, but Kamala is not a child. She is a teenager.

Fifteen-year-olds are kids, and I don’t think you’d find a lot of people who’d argue that they can give informed consent to doping. That’s the point. I don’t care if she said, “Please give me performance-enhancing drugs!” to every adult she knows (which I doubt) - any adults involved in supplying the drugs still need to be held responsible.

 

[AxelAnnie]

Fifteen-year-olds are kids, and I don’t think you’d find a lot of people who’d argue that they can give informed consent to doping. That’s the point. I don’t care if she said, “Please give me performance-enhancing drugs!” to every adult she knows (which I doubt) - any adults involved in supplying the drugs still need to be held responsible.

I agree about the drugs. Every adult involved in that should be found and banned forever.....IMO.

However, a 15-year-old is no longer a kid. That is not to say she was complicit in the drugs...but the drugs did go into her body somehow. I guess they could have just told her it was carrot juice or something.

Worst: we will never know how she would have done had she skated clean.

From Web MD
"A 15-year-old is an adolescent -- no longer a child, but not yet an adult either. There are lots of physical changes, but it’s also a time of big intellectual, social, and emotional development. While it can vary from girl to girl, there are common milestones to look for."

Stanford defines teenagers as 13-18. So, there you go.

 

[Trillian]

I agree about the drugs. I think I was clear about that.
However, a 15-year-old is no longer considered a kid.

I don’t disagree with you about developmental stages being different, but in terms of their legal responsibility in most situations, teens are either children or adults. And while that age can vary, it sounds like we both agree that Kamila should not be considered an adult in this situation.

 

[annie_mg]

Best results from Jrs + perfect age of “15.5” at time of Olympics. More consistent than Khromykh, who was the same age.

They (Eteri & co.) also may have panicked a little last spring when, during the post-Worlds tour, Kamila was seeming to blossom very quickly (puberty came calling). It was obvious to me when watching her in the films of that tour. Hence, I was totally surprise when I saw K’s amazing performances and results in the fall. I had expected her to flake out and the others to pass her.

And here was I thinking Kamila was the exception to the rule because she could still be technically brilliant without being stick thin...

 

[Frau Muller]

And here was I thinking Kamila was the exception to the rule because she could still be technically brilliant without being stick thin...

It seemed too good to be true, right?

 

[Bigbird]

And here was I thinking Kamila was the exception to the rule because she could still be technically brilliant without being stick thin...

Not with the Eteri technique. With Mishin things could be different. But would she miss the Eteri boost? Who will ever know at this point.

 

[aka_gerbil]

I don’t disagree with you about developmental stages being different, but in terms of their legal responsibility in most situations, teens are either children or adults. And while that age can vary, it sounds like we both agree that Kamila should not be considered an adult in this situation.

Teen’s brains are not yet fully developed with adult thinking, reasoning, and comprehension skill. Their bodies may be changing, but those brains aren’t done yet. She’s not a little kid, but she’s not an adult yet.

 

[AxelAnnie]

I don’t disagree with you about developmental stages being different, but in terms of their legal responsibility in most situations, teens are either children or adults. And while that age can vary, it sounds like we both agree that Kamila should not be considered an adult in this situation.

Yep.

 

[AxelAnnie]

It seemed too good to be true, right?

And it was.

 

[dewey]

And it was.

Have you watched Polina Edmonds’ guest spot on TSL? I now think that all of Eteri’s top skaters are being doped. Probably without their knowledge or consent. See also the East German swimmers, who were told they were getting “vitamin” shots.

 

[AxelAnnie]

Have you watched Polina Edmonds’ guest spot on TSL? I now think that all of Eteri’s top skaters are being doped. Probably without their knowledge or consent. See also the East German swimmers, who were told they were getting “vitamin” shots.

I have not seen it, but I will look it up. Thanks. I agree with you about doping. I am sorry for the skaters. I don't know what they knew or did not know. But somebody should have had a clue here. One person does not have that many record-setting skaters.

I hope Eteri is banned for life. How can people be happy/proud when they cheat?

 

[Frau Muller]

Suddenly the Botox jokes aren’t funny.

 

[screech]

I'm wondering if the reason the TMZ was still in Kamila's system at testing time is due to puberty. I am definitely no expert on this, but maybe they thought her development was at a different point than it actually was, so it burned out of her system slower than they expected.

 

[overedge]

I'm wondering if the reason the TMZ was still in Kamila's system at testing time is due to puberty. I am definitely no expert on this, but maybe they thought her development was at a different point than it actually was, so it burned out of her system slower than they expected.

Or maybe they miscalculated the dose.

 

[Maximillian]

Have you watched Polina Edmonds’ guest spot on TSL? I now think that all of Eteri’s top skaters are being doped. Probably without their knowledge or consent. See also the East German swimmers, who were told they were getting “vitamin” shots.

Sadly...so do I. I adore KV and her skating...but man from a fan perspective the past month has been a huge punch in the gut and I say this as a diehard Nagasu and Sasha Cohen fan, so I'm no stranger to heartbreak, but this one was rough.

 

[Tobbe]

Have you watched Polina Edmonds’ guest spot on TSL? I now think that all of Eteri’s top skaters are being doped. Probably without their knowledge or consent. See also the East German swimmers, who were told they were getting “vitamin” shots.

I wouldn't take Polina E's words for the truth though. She was only speculating and that is always dangerous to do in these circumstances. Clearly, the Russians have different training methods, and who knows, maybe they have some "vitamins" others don't have. But we shouldn't make conclusions before we know more.

 

[Karen-W]

I wouldn't take Polina E's words for the truth though. She was only speculating and that is always dangerous to do in these circumstances. Clearly, the Russians have different training methods, and who knows, maybe they have some "vitamins" others don't have. But we shouldn't make conclusions before we know more.

Right... Because a skater of Russian descent whose mother was raised in that system doesn't have any awareness of what might be in those "vitamins" and shouldn't call out instances where she witnessed questionable behavior that might fit a pattern of which her coach/mother knew meant certain things. What would she know? She's just a bitter American, right?

 

[Tobbe]

Right... Because a skater of Russian descent whose mother was raised in that system doesn't have any awareness of what might be in those "vitamins" and shouldn't call out instances where she witnessed questionable behavior that might fit a pattern of which her coach/mother knew meant certain things. What would she know? She's just a bitter American, right?

That's not what I meant. Of course there are fishy circumstances all around this, but can we just please wait for the investigation results before we make any decisions? These things travel like truths around social media before the trial has even begun. I just don't think that's fair.

 

[mackiecat]

The skaters could have been told they were vitamin. However it is not uncommon in many countries around the word for adolescents to consume all kinds of illegal drugs. If you don’t think this is happening, open you eyes. There were students in my kids grade 7 class taking marijuana and fentanyl.

 

[Arch-]

Why hold Anna and company responsible for Putin? That would be like holding me responsible for the inhuman treatment for 10 years of putting hundreds of thousands of kids in cages or in the last 20 years all those errant Anerican bombs to Muslim countries that killed hundreds of thousands of innocent muslims. I am no more responsible for that than any Russian athlete is for Putin's actions. In fact I'm sure Anna and every Russian athlete is against this invasion of Ukraine. I have only heard Russian athletes speak out against this invasion.

It's also the same with Ukraine if you know it's recent history you know they and their growing neo nazi base have been brutal to ethnic Russians and killed many of them in the most inhumane ways possible. But I think everyone here would agree that Ukrainian athletes should not be held responsible for that.

Oh no that's it Scott. I can't keep it in. It's been knawing at me. 5% of the time you say something with merit, which is why I skim thru what you say, but HOW DARE YOU COMPARE WHAT RUS IS DOING to what the USA & NATO did against Iraq. I dont know what screwed up history they teach in history but if you have access to FSU you have access to Google USE IT AND EDUCATE YOURSELVES...The most import part here is that the retaliation was NOT AGAINST MUSLIMS but very specific people hidden in mountins. For most US troops it was a rescue mission to SAVE Afghans and IRQ from their Putin named Sadam Hussain.

Also, you clearly are recieveing some 1st class autocratic RUS propaganda BS if you think 100's of thousands of kids were put in cages by ICE. Fact check yourself or wreck check yoself bro. The highest total who were in detention camps, not cages, were 10,890 at one time. That was the max of the 3 facilities.

Know, it's people like you that have escalated this war. Making excuses and excusing the Russian way out of blaming everyone else but THEMSELVES for their terrorist actions is pitiful. YOU are just as responsible for murdering hundreds of your own Russian people and Ukrainians for sitting around and looking away and blindly following an autocratic self involved war criminal. SHAME ON YOU.

Kamila competed in an a senior level OLYMPIC competition while RUS hid her SUSPENTION. Any and every other federation A) Wouldn't have to send drug samples outside their labs because their labs were caught cheating...over and over again. B) Wouldnt have sent them to one of the busiest labs in the world in Sweden with Covid-19. Why would they do that? Georgia or Germany or Belarus are MUCH closer and MUCH more staffed. I don't care if she was 13. And for you to defend a country that WOULD ALLOW her closest family & associates to dope this child while still in puberty treating her heath as a crap shoot, tells us all we need to know about Rus sporting culture. You're own family and govt will sell your soul & your child's life for a meaningless 1/2 pound of precious 'made in china' Jewelry.

Russia and their loyalists have been cheating in sport for decades, at times blatantly. Thier delusional 'small penis syndrome' of I'll drive a Ferrari though ill never be able to pay it off, has ruined every single competition, sporting or not, event they participate in. Bc the 1st thought in EVERYONES mind is if they ever medal (funny enough even with cheating they still can't win enough gold medals to justify it) is... why bother giving out medals, Russia or Bulgaria or Little Russia is just going to have to give them back eventually after being caight doping as science catches up. So now Russia has ruined sport because of tiny microscopic penises and now started a war because Putin's testicles started to invert inside his body. Every Russian gets what they deserve and it FINALLY catching up with them.

 

[skatingguy]

The skaters could have been told they were vitamin. However it is not uncommon in many countries around the word for adolescents to consume all kinds of illegal drugs. If you don’t think this is happening, open you eyes. There were students in my kids grade 7 class taking marijuana and fentanyl.

I think it's important to remember that these are not ordinary adolescents. They don't have the kind of freedom that would allow drug experimentation. Also, TMZ is not a recreational drug, and neither are the puberty blockers that have been rumoured for years. There's no high associated with any of those drugs.

 

[mackiecat]

I think it's important to remember that these are not ordinary adolescents. They don't have the kind of freedom that would allow drug experimentation. Also, TMZ is not a recreational drug, and neither are the puberty blockers that have been rumoured for years. There's no high associated with any of those drugs.

Oh I understand that TMZ is not a drug of choice to get high off of. Many posters have been claiming she is a child thus she couldn’t be taking this drug herself, that she was being tricked, and would have no idea what she is putting in her body.
I’m just debating that there are lots of kids her age and even under that obtain and take illegal drugs ( as well as underage smoking, vaping and drinking.-even athletes) There are also many kids that age who are extremely aware of what they are eating and even using as facial products. Kids can read labels and kids can do their own research.

 

[overedge]

Yes, some 15 year old will take drugs they shouldn't, just because. But this isn't a drug that a 15 year old would get from their naughty friends, or get over the counter at their neighbourhood pharmacy. If she did decide to take it herself (which personally I don't think is what happened), how did she get the drug in the first place?
(and no, isn't how )

 

[Arch-]

That's not what I meant. Of course there are fishy circumstances all around this, but can we just please wait for the investigation results before we make any decisions? These things travel like truths around social media before the trial has even begun. I just don't think that's fair.

What don't you people understand the investigation is over. KV cheated. She's a cheater. A doper for life. Period. There is no rumor...facts...fact...fact. I know they might sell you on 'contamination' theory but THAT'S how rumors start/sold, but outside of Rus, that happens less then .001%. Even if it was invested by crumbles of her GP meds by 'accident' LOL. Still a doping strike. Still guilty. She cheated whether she knew it or not. And trust me when I say this: 14, 15, 16yo inject steroids in every sport from wrestling to swimming. Its not a new thing. I personally am not totally convinced that all Sambo 70 students are dopers. The fact the other 6 or 7 contenders who are tested through a long season after grand prix/euros/rus Nats have never come back with a pos test tells me something. My guess KV's family friend doctor outside of sport came up with her cycles.

She competes as a Senior. In theory the 'slap on the wrist' is intended for Juniors. If RUFED had done their job like everyother federation would have done, this wouldnt be a mess. Shed be suspended. Her 'A' sample came back positive so she requested the B sample analysis, not to prove whether or not TMZ is present bc it always is, but confirm the levels. RUFED will do whatever it takes, like they always do. WADA & ISU will ban her for 2yrs. It will go to a full CAS hearing in October 2022 probably and then the real details of how deep things run will come out.

 

[MacMadame]

so she requested the B sample analysis, not to prove whether or not TMZ is present bc it always is, but confirm the levels

I don't think she did. All the quotes said "of course we will ..." not "we do".

 

[carriecmu0503]

Teen’s brains are not yet fully developed with adult thinking, reasoning, and comprehension skill. Their bodies may be changing, but those brains aren’t done yet. She’s not a little kid, but she’s not an adult yet.

Latest neuroscientific research suggests that brain development isn’t done until possibly the 30s. If we’re going to use when the brain is done developing to determine when someone is an adult, that’s going to be a real problem. Someone who is 15 absolutely is old enough to take responsibility for what they’re putting into their bodies as elite athletes. If they’re not, and we need to coddle them as children, then they have no business competing in adult competition.