From Russia with Love [#33]: Summer 2019

Moka-Ananas

Proud auntie of Nala the dog
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Also, Konstantin Milyukov and pairs team Victoria Yatsenko/Daniil Parkman (coached by Vasiliev and Moskvina)
This could be a real chance for Milyukov. I remember always making fun of him like 10+ years ago when he would show up at Russian Nats, a total peasant from Kazan or wherever and being so impressed by his performances at the last Russian Nationals. He's really improved a lot and certainly deserves to be at Euros and Worlds.
 

Tinami Amori

Well-Known Member
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17,578
Few videos/clips of Russian skaters participating in venues (music videos and adverts).

Adelina Sotnikova is staring in the music video by Turetsky Chorus "Under Snow".

Evgeny Pluschenko, Edwin Martin, Dima Bilan put together a video for a fundraiser to help kids
(part of video story. it's heart-breaking in the beginning but ends well).

Yulia Obertas is part of the music video by Katya Burzhinskaya "Ice".

Maria Butyskaya stars in Anna Semenovich's music video "Unintended Murder".

Usova/Platov star in Igor Kutoy's music video "When I close my eyes" (2008)

Alina Zagitova has a new Puma artistic video, running in major shopping malls in Russia.
Full advert with english subtitles "Be Yourself by Pumarussia".

Department store digital board ads.

Print/stands - https://pp.userapi.com/c855336/v855336804/ac7be/S3E0D0sGFvU.jpg
 

Mad for Skating

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Novoselov got released! Gooooo Stolbova!!!!
I literally burst into tears when I saw this on Twitter. Hallelujah.

OMG. I literally gasped out loud. Thank all the Gods above. #Susieforgold
Flash forward to you and I watching her win a medal at the 2022 Olympics and telling everyone “WE TOLD YOU SO!”

:bribe::bribe::bribe:
Awesome, can't wait to have Susie back.

So the GP RUS tba spot is gone :cheer2:
If they don’t get the spot, what even is the meaning of life?

I'm so happy about Stolbova, I'm taking the rest of the day off and going shopping. And, if Morozov can take them to an OGM, I will never, ever say anything negative about him again.
You have a much more forgiving heart than I do.

And they will show their programs at the test skates this September :cheer2:
September can’t come soon enough for me!

DG will go down as the most gracious in history :rofl:
I still hate him for how he treated Massot, but this time he did the right thing so I’ll shut up.

I honestly thought this day would never come! :cheer2:

(So how long until Stolbova goes public with the ransom demands?) :COP:
I’m just so relieved that I don’t have to pay for his release with my college fund like I promised!
 

taz'smum

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1,780
So, how much did they pay DG?
It should be noted that, technically DG was in the Russian Fed's debt, as the Russian Fed never made a fuss over the fact that DG sent Novoselov out to compete with Daria Popova to the The Hague 2015 International challenge cup, without having a release from Russia. More to the point, why was Novoselov allowed to compete when there was a TBC against the country he was representing? 🤔
 

hanca

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It should be noted that, technically DG was in the Russian Fed's debt, as the Russian Fed never made a fuss over the fact that DG sent Novoselov out to compete with Daria Popova to the The Hague 2015 International challenge cup, without having a release from Russia. More to the point, why was Novoselov allowed to compete when there was a TBC against the country he was representing? 🤔
I think they may consider the debt paid by releasing Tiffany though.
 

rfisher

Let the skating begin
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58,240
I literally burst into tears when I saw this on Twitter. Hallelujah.



Flash forward to you and I watching her win a medal at the 2022 Olympics and telling everyone “WE TOLD YOU SO!”



If they don’t get the spot, what even is the meaning of life?



You have a much more forgiving heart than I do.



September can’t come soon enough for me!



I still hate him for how he treated Massot, but this time he did the right thing so I’ll shut up.



I’m just so relieved that I don’t have to pay for his release with my college fund like I promised!
:lol: you do remember she has an OSM and team OGM. What she doesn't have is individual gold. That's the goal
 

kris2ffer

New Member
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I honestly think Novoselov/Stolbova's future will depend on that triple twist lift. The higher the brighter their future is.

Novoselov's track record on that element with his previous partners are meh at best.

Stolbova's was obviously affected by Klimov's shoulder injury but even then, that element was only decent to them.

I really think that this is the element that will dictate the future of this partnership. The other partner elements Im not really worried.
 
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hanca

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Can Novoselov jump well? Aliona’s olympic dream nearly ended unsuccessfully by Massot messing up SP.
 

kris2ffer

New Member
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Can Novoselov jump well? Aliona’s olympic dream nearly ended unsuccessfully by Massot messing up SP.
He has a decent 3Sal and 3Loop. Im guessing he can also do 3T. He seems stable with the his jumps. Im guessing they will do 3T for SP and 3sal and 3T+2t(+2t maybe) for LP
 

Frau Muller

Everything is beautiful at the ballet!
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How are we so sure that Stolbova/Novoselov will be so good, to be top-3 Russian Pairs material? Are there any recent videos of the duo?
 

hanca

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It won’t be easy. Tarasova/Morozov, Zabijako/Enbert, Boikova/Kozlovski and Stolbova/Novoselov...one of them will miss out. A year ago I would think it would be Zabijako/Enbert or Boikova/Kozlovski, but Zabijako/Enbert managed to get their first worlds medal, and Boikova/Kozlovski medalled at their first Europeans and placed sixth at their first worlds, which is pretty decent. Both pairs are clearly on the rise.
 

3T3T

Active Member
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145
Delighted for Stolbova. It will be great to have her back. Another reason to look forward to the test skates. It will be tough in Russia though. Three very strong senior Pairs and plenty of promising juniors coming through the ranks. I find it very hard to rank the Russian Pairs, I love them all but T/M are my favourites.

I’m glad that Milyukov has got a release to Belarus. I like his skating. Europeans and Worlds are a guarantee but he has got a very good shot of making Beijing. Best of luck to him.
 

Jeschke

#teamtrainwreck
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29,722
With the recent releases do we have word if Lena Pavlova is released to skate for 🇩🇪 (w/ Blommaert) by now?
 

TAHbKA

Cats and garlic lover
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I was gushing about Novoselov while he was skating with Lola and hoping he'd find a better partner. He does have gorgeous lines and posture, he is a good jumper compared to Lola. Am not sure it will be good enough compared to Stolbova. On the other hand I had 0 faith in Massot, so... :)
 

Mad for Skating

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2,106
It should be noted that, technically DG was in the Russian Fed's debt, as the Russian Fed never made a fuss over the fact that DG sent Novoselov out to compete with Daria Popova to the The Hague 2015 International challenge cup, without having a release from Russia. More to the point, why was Novoselov allowed to compete when there was a TBC against the country he was representing? 🤔
Oh my, I had no idea this had happened! DG, what were you thinking?😱

:lol: you do remember she has an OSM and team OGM. What she doesn't have is individual gold. That's the goal
Of course I remember :D I want individual gold for her more than I want a car. May history repeat itself when it comes to pair queens and their partners from France.

I honestly think Novoselov/Stolbova's future will depend on that triple twist lift. The higher the brighter their future is.

Novoselov's track record on that element with his previous partners are meh at best.

Stolbova's was obviously affected by Klimov's shoulder injury but even then, that element was only decent to them.

I really think that this is the element that will dictate the future of this partnership. The other partner elements Im not really worried.
Agree. Tbh, I don’t know if the twist will ever be good, but I’ll hold my tongue for now.

Can Novoselov jump well? Aliona’s olympic dream nearly ended unsuccessfully by Massot messing up SP.
He’s actually a very consistent jumper, so that shouldn’t be a problem.

I was gushing about Novoselov while he was skating with Lola and hoping he'd find a better partner. He does have gorgeous lines and posture, he is a good jumper compared to Lola. Am not sure it will be good enough compared to Stolbova. On the other hand I had 0 faith in Massot, so... :)
I agree! I remember when I was watching Lola and Andrei at 2017 Internationaux de France, I made a mental note that he was a strong skater, but his partner struggled with jumps, and if he could find someone else, he could be very successful.
Ah, the universe must have read our minds :D
 

taz'smum

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I agree! I remember when I was watching Lola and Andrei at 2017 Internationaux de France, I made a mental note that he was a strong skater, but his partner struggled with jumps, and if he could find someone else, he could be very successful.
When I first saw him with Daria Popova, at French Masters I think it was, I too noticed he had a 'jolie glisse' as we say in France. (literally, he has a pretty glide)
I thought that he had natural flow and was a neat, classically trained skater.
I remember thinking Andrei was classy compared to Bruno who was pretty rough around the edges and in all honesty didn't look like he had the refinement needed for top level skating.

Though that same roughness was also Bruno's strength. His roughness came from his sheer physical size and strength. Aljona could see what everyone else couldn't see, that if that roughness could be refined his strength would make him unbeatable. So she put him into a killer intensive training program and the result is history, an OGM.

Andrei physically cannot have Bruno's winning strength, so we shall have to wait and see if his other qualities are enough to compensate. Also, lets not forget Aljona was an incredible skater, both mentally and physically, I'm not sure Stolbova will be able to come close. However Morozov can be a genius when he sets his mind to it, so I will reserve judgement until we see the programs in a few weeks time!
 
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Japanfan

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I didn't translate the whole interview, but in other excerpt he said more about financial side of their internship (that was supposed to be a full-time move at first) - that they paid around 10 000$ per month and after training in Russia it was quite a lot. Maybe he was expecting that for that amount of money they will work with Igor and not with Fabian, who did 80% of the work with them. IDK.
From what I’ve heard anecdotally $10k a month is about standard for the top training centres where most of the training is done by assistant coaches.
Are you saying that one skater or team pays $10k a month for training?

That doesn't make sense to me.

Skaters pay $50 to $100 and $5 to $15 for coaching according to this 2019 article https://www.liveabout.com/private-ice-skating-lessons-cost-1282351. The article is about the US SFAIK, but is probably also true for Canada.

I have no idea how many actual hours of coaching skaters pay for per week, but don't think it would be that much in the sense of a skater paying $10,000 per year.

I remember reading that Patrick Chan spent $200,000 per year for everything - it was not clear whether that included his rent/mortgage, but I presumed it did. It was when he was training with Krall, and Krall said it was expensive "to train a thoroughbred". And the everything include things like special compression pants. Patrick barred no expense.

That figure breaks down to about $16,000 per month. I would think it likely that most skaters don't even spend the half, excepting those at the very top.
 
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hanca

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Though that same roughness was also Bruno's strength. His roughness came from his sheer physical size and strength. Aljona could see what everyone else couldn't see, that if that roughness could be refined his strength would make him unbeatable. So she put him into a killer intensive training program and the result is history, an OGM.

Andrei physically cannot have Bruno's winning strength, so we shall have to wait and see if his other qualities are enough to compensate. Also, lets not forget Aljona was an incredible skater, both mentally and physically, I'm not sure Stolbova will be able to come close. However Morozov can be a genius when he sets his mind to it, so I will reserve judgement until we see the programs in a few weeks time!
But it is not size and strength that is the most important factor to a male partner. Aliona was successful even with Szolkowy, and the fact that they didn’t get the Olympic gold wasn’t because of lack of his physical strength. It is not the biggest and strongest guy that makes the difference, otherwise Sui/Han would have a problem. (Not implying that Han is not strong, he must be if he is lifting a girl who is nearly his size, but he definitely doesn’t have Massor’s figure.)

As you said, they have Morozov on their side and Morozov has shown she can achieve a lot for his girlfriends/wives. He is quite talented in hiding the weaknesses and showing the strengths in the programs he creates. Especially when the program is for someone he cares for.
 
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Michalle

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That article does not appear to be referring to skaters at the level we are generally talking about here, i.e. serious candidates for the Worlds/Olympics who are training with the top coaches in the world.
 

Yehudi

Has colluded with Russia
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4,235
Andrei physically cannot have Bruno's winning strength, so we shall have to wait and see if his other qualities are enough to compensate. Also, lets not forget Aljona was an incredible skater, both mentally and physically, I'm not sure Stolbova will be able to come close. However Morozov can be a genius when he sets his mind to it, so I will reserve judgement until we see the programs in a few weeks time!
I always felt that Aljona did a lot to adapt to Bruno. The style of programs they did were more the programs Bruno was used to doing than what Aljona typically did with Robin and Bruno seemed to have a lot of input into the training process. It will be interesting to see if Novoselov has input or if he’s just a long for the ride in the Stolbova show.
 

hanca

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I always felt that Aljona did a lot to adapt to Bruno. The style of programs they did were more the programs Bruno was used to doing than what Aljona typically did with Robin and Bruno seemed to have a lot of input into the training process. It will be interesting to see if Novoselov has input or if he’s just a long for the ride in the Stolbova show.
My guess is that it may be very different from both Novoselov’s style and from Stolbova’s style, because it will be Morozov who will be in charge of the program and the packaging.
 

starrynight

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Are you saying that one skater or team pays $10k a month for training?

That doesn't make sense to me.
Well, Ruslan said that it cost them $10k a month to train at Novi in the interview. I would expect that would be for both him and Elena (although I'm not sure, but dance teams do take ice together and share coach time so it would make sense). That was when Novi was very in demand and it was packed to the brim. And I've heard that dollar figure before in respect of other training centres.

I would expect that the top coaches who are so very in fashion charge a premium for their services. After all, skaters' reputations and scores can rise simply due to the names of their coaches. Federations and skaters would be prepared to pay. This is elite level world teams, though, at the most in demand rinks in the world. In each discipline, there's only a handful of elite world level training centres everyone wants to go to.
 
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Yehudi

Has colluded with Russia
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4,235
Well, Ruslan said that it cost them $10k a month to train at Novi in the interview. I would expect that would be for both him and Elena. And I've heard that dollar figure before in respect of other training centres.
I think the confusion comes from the outside specialists. The on ice coaches are just one piece of the pie. They are also paying for ballroom dancing/ballet classes/hip hop jazz, personal trainers, massage therapists, acrobats to help lifts, which all adds up.

I remember Dylan Moscovitch had a gofundme me that broke down his expenses (all the on-ice and office stuff necessary). It all came out to over 100k a year, so 10k sounds right.
 

starrynight

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1,230
I think the confusion comes from the outside specialists. The on ice coaches are just one piece of the pie. They are also paying for ballroom dancing/ballet classes/hip hop jazz, personal trainers, massage therapists, acrobats to help lifts, which all adds up.

I remember Dylan Moscovitch had a gofundme me that broke down his expenses (all the on-ice and office stuff necessary). It all came out to over 100k a year, so 10k sounds right.
Was Dylan's expenses just for him or was that the team's collective expenses?
 

Mad for Skating

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2,106
When I first saw him with Daria Popova, at French Masters I think it was, I too noticed he had a 'jolie glisse' as we say in France. (literally, he has a pretty glide)
I thought that he had natural flow and was a neat, classically trained skater.
I remember thinking Andrei was classy compared to Bruno who was pretty rough around the edges and in all honesty didn't look like he had the refinement needed for top level skating.

Though that same roughness was also Bruno's strength. His roughness came from his sheer physical size and strength. Aljona could see what everyone else couldn't see, that if that roughness could be refined his strength would make him unbeatable. So she put him into a killer intensive training program and the result is history, an OGM.

Andrei physically cannot have Bruno's winning strength, so we shall have to wait and see if his other qualities are enough to compensate. Also, lets not forget Aljona was an incredible skater, both mentally and physically, I'm not sure Stolbova will be able to come close. However Morozov can be a genius when he sets his mind to it, so I will reserve judgement until we see the programs in a few weeks time!
I agree, there’s a very different feel to Andrei’s skating than Bruno’s. I personally think Andrei’s style might work best with Ksenia’s, because Fedor was a very graceful skater who was not particularly massive.
I’m not saying anyone can match the mighty Aljona, but Ksenia is talented, and all she needs is two great performances at the Olympics. She was an underdog leading up to the Sochi Olympics, so I am hoping history will repeat itself.

My guess is that it may be very different from both Novoselov’s style and from Stolbova’s style, because it will be Morozov who will be in charge of the program and the packaging.
Morozov has done choreography for Stolbova before, so we have an idea of what he has done for her already. He worked on her programs in the 2014-15, 2015-16, and 2016-17 seasons.
 

Lara111

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392
If you want a kid to succeed you probably want to go the Russian way, but the chance of burnout is high. The American way, burnout rate is lower, cost is much higher, and you might never know whether you are good enough to make it all the way there. In the long run I think the younger generation of Russian coaches aren't as stubborn as it used to be, and with their goal instead of fee oriented system they will have the edge going forward.
I do not think it is all just about Russian way or American way. Igor, Marina, WISA are all Russians after all. I think it is more about coaches really investing their souls into their students or not. Igor, WISA are just making money. It is a business for them for the most parts except when it is big money or their own kids. They may pick one team to care more about for a short period of time but typically lose interest soon after.
 

feraina

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2,137
I do not think it is all just about Russian way or American way. Igor, Marina, WISA are all Russians after all. I think it is more about coaches really investing their souls into their students or not. Igor, WISA are just making money. It is a business for them for the most parts except when it is big money or their own kids. They may pick one team to care more about for a short period of time but typically lose interest soon after.
Or you can think about it the other way around. Russian coaches can kick out any student (except those few elite ones in the national team who bring in funding) for any reason any time - if they lose interest in a student, if they think the student is going to grow too tall, or whose parents are not cooperative enough, or the student doesn’t work hard enough, or is too chubby... American coaches have to keep working with as many students as it takes to fill their coaching slots because that’s what their living depends on. Not every student they coach is (in their eyes) future star material.
 

Lara111

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392
Or you can think about it the other way around. Russian coaches can kick out any student (except those few elite ones in the national team who bring in funding) for any reason any time - if they lose interest in a student, if they think the student is going to grow too tall, or whose parents are not cooperative enough, or the student doesn’t work hard enough, or is too chubby... American coaches have to keep working with as many students as it takes to fill their coaching slots because that’s what their living depends on. Not every student they coach is (in their eyes) future star material.
Trust me these ''American'' coaches kick out students all the time but just do it by bulling, ignoring them into quitting or creating a situation where there is no choice just to quit. You cannot keep paying USD40K+ without seen any results. There will be no results if coaches are not interested in their students.
 

Bigbird

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847
Trust me these ''American'' coaches kick out students all the time but just do it by bulling, ignoring them into quitting or creating a situation where there is no choice just to quit. You cannot keep paying USD40K+ without seen any results. There will be no results if coaches are not interested in their students.
Word. Ice dancers just have to have thick skin, just like the rest of us mere mortals.
 

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