Men's discussion thread: "... in the Olympic season everyone fights for himself"

I know that I may be biased but still super happy with Kolyada's performances at CoC and the fact that he's almost guaranteed his spot in GPF :kickass:

He's the first Russian male skater since Yagudin whom I actually like a lot (the second one is Aliev but it's too early to talk about him :gallopin1), he has great jumping technique, his spins deserves high GOE. I know that a lot of users here think that he doesn't deserve high PCS but I believe that his basics aren't worse than most of the top skaters (as I said, I may be biased). He has great SS, skates with great speed and flow, shows great edges and if he is really ON he deserves to get high GOE on almost each element :respec:
His SP at CoC actually deserved that high score and I'm super glad that he finally landed all his jumps there. Hope he will do the same at Nationals and Olympics :kickass:


I was impressed with Han Yan performances in Beijing as well.
I enjoy his skating much more than Jin's, think that he deserved to be ahead of few other men at least in the free :shuffle:

Han Yan has absolutely no interpretation, imo. Or rather, it's that "I'm pretending" type of skating and it's definitely not as good as Machida's "pretending" (his skating was like that too).
 
Han Yan has absolutely no interpretation, imo. Or rather, it's that "I'm pretending" type of skating and it's definitely not as good as Machida's "pretending" (his skating was like that too).

I know what you mean. It doesn't look like Yan Han understands and is expressing the music. He just skates along it cluelessly like Zagitova, "this is what my coach told me to do". I still prefer that to the "I don't give a F" type of expression that Kolyada does.

I actually think Yan Han should have won China GP ahead of Aaron and Kolyada. The Chinese Fed is sadly only focusing on Jin Boyang.
 
Good grief, was something in the air in the rink during the men's competition in France?! :rolleyes: A lot of messy skating and OTT messy judging to boot! Yuk!

Misha Ge was the only one to skate two clean programs! Fortunately, the judges saw fit this time to allow Ge to make the podium third spot for a bronze medal over a poor performance by a Russian skater (this time not Kolyada). Samarin I suppose is Russian in name only. He seems to try hard, but he's not musical, nor does he have any presentation skills; he's very awkward looking the way he moves over the ice (somewhat similar to Maxim Kovtun of Russia). Get Samarin into a ballet studio fast. There must be some of those in Russia! :duh:

Denis Ten is clearly suffering from injuries. Despite a technically sloppy fp caused by trying hard for quads, Ten was actually quite good in the sp, with only one mistake on an attempted quad. But the judges didn't fully respect the absolute beauty of his skating and interpretation in the sp. They did give Morris K 39 on PCS in the sp; Samarin 40+; Bychenko 40+; Shoma 46; and Ten 42+. Once again confirming Jackie Wong's recent statistical proof of how the judges manipulate PCS and keep the marks within a tight range. If Shoma is going to receive 46, then Ten deserved at least 48 on PCS in the sp! Seriously! Samarin, Bychenko, and Morris K can crank out the quads here and there, but their overall skating is not very cohesive or interesting to watch. Vincent and Max were caught up in the splat-itis while going for quads. Max redeemed himself somewhat in the fp, but both were well out of podium contention. Kevin Aymoz of France (while not great technically here) is at least a very different looking skater stylistically, with an unusual approach to movement and interpretation. He is fun to watch for his unique movement style.

Javi was at 47+ on PCS in the sp and 13 points ahead, so he should have won this going away, but no, Javi messed up again in the fp and was gifted with 92+ on PCS by the judges! 92+ for that subpar performance? :rolleyes: Obviously, TPTB would really like to see Javi at the GPF, especially with Yuzu and Patrick out (although mathematically Javi may still be unlikely to make GPF, while Sergei Voronov does have the opportunity)! In any case, the winner in France turned out to be no contest with Javi and Shoma both skating like they weren't sure they wanted to be on top of the podium. Shoma made some small mistakes in the sp. And surprisingly, Shoma totally could not hold up and skate clean in the fp skating last after Javi's errors had left an opening. Unbelievable! It seemed as if there were booby traps all over the ice during the men's event. Ladies sp was a bit sloppy too, particularly with the judging.

The judges seem to have no idea what they are looking at, much less any idea of how to judge performance quality, period. Despite some bright spots here and there, so far, it has simply not been a great GP season overall in the lead-up to the Olympics (with Cup of China and the 'Grab bag in Grenoble' being the worst events for the men).
 
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Max got absolutely hosed in the FS. Only one of his errors could be considered program-marring, he stayed with the performance and the choreography, and he got smashed into pieces.
 
Max got absolutely hosed in the FS. Only one of his errors could be considered program-marring, he stayed with the performance and the choreography, and he got smashed into pieces.

When I finally saw the protocols, his 7th place finish belies the fact that he skated decently in the LP: His only mistakes were the popped sal and a UR on the 4T (He rarely gets a UR). No falls. He is still working hard to get levels on his spins and FW. His PCS also may have been better had he been in the last group.
 
When I finally saw the protocols, his 7th place finish belies the fact that he skated decently in the LP: His only mistakes were the popped sal and a UR on the 4T (He rarely gets a UR). No falls. He is still working hard to get levels on his spins and FW. His PCS also may have been better had he been in the last group.
yes, skating orders play a lot in the PCS and GOE.
 
And surprisingly, Shoma totally could not hold up and skate clean in the fp skating last after Javi's errors had left an opening.
Not so surprising if you know that Shoma just got over the flu that's been wreaking havoc everywhere: http://www.sponichi.co.jp/sports/news/2017/11/17/kiji/20171117s00079000143000c.html

So am I just incredibly resilient or do athletes always get hit disproportionately hard by illness because they push themselves so much? I don't think I've ever been really sick for more than a day and a half. Once in my life I was in bed for four days because I didn't keep myself hydrated while I was sick. (I ended up getting an IV of water! Exciting times.)

(Also, anyone know why the auto-translation of that article gives me the phrase "four-turn monkey"? :rofl:)
 
When I finally saw the protocols, his 7th place finish belies the fact that he skated decently in the LP: His only mistakes were the popped sal and a UR on the 4T (He rarely gets a UR). No falls. He is still working hard to get levels on his spins and FW. His PCS also may have been better had he been in the last group.

It also belies how nice some of his jumps actually were. The triple loop and the second triple Axel particularly stood out to me as wonderfully beautiful jumps, and yet he raked in very little GOE for them.

So am I just incredibly resilient or do athletes always get hit disproportionately hard by illness because they push themselves so much?

And too soon. Done to myself on more than one occasion. You get sick in close proximity to a competition, you panic, think "I can't afford to be off the ice for this long this close to a competition!", rush yourself back on the ice while still unwell, and then either make it worse or set back your recovery (or get a lung infection, as I did). I can easily envisage that being what happened to Shoma.

(Doesn't mean he should have got 90+ PCS though.)
 
yes, skating orders play a lot in the PCS and GOE.

Not sure about this particular case, as the skater in the long program starting order before Max (Denis Ten) got almost 84 in components for a rather messy skate, compared to Max's ~76.
 
Not so surprising if you know that Shoma just got over the flu that's been wreaking havoc everywhere: http://www.sponichi.co.jp/sports/news/2017/11/17/kiji/20171117s00079000143000c.html

So am I just incredibly resilient or do athletes always get hit disproportionately hard by illness because they push themselves so much? I don't think I've ever been really sick for more than a day and a half. Once in my life I was in bed for four days because I didn't keep myself hydrated while I was sick. (I ended up getting an IV of water! Exciting times.)

(Also, anyone know why the auto-translation of that article gives me the phrase "four-turn monkey"? :rofl:)
IMO...stress, fatigue and air on planes all come together to attack!
 
*hauls thread out of the depths* *catches breath*

103 at CoC and now 99 for Kolyada! It looks like he has truly arrived! :cheer2:
So when does the Big Six club accept new members? I feel like he still has to prove himself a little bit but is well on his way.
 
I was actually searching for a Deniss thread but came across this one instead so...

*hauls thread out of the depths* *catches breath*

Just wanted to post this, the most +GOEworthy fall on a 3A I've ever seen (sorry not sorry if this has already been posted somewhere, you probably should rewatch it anyways)

I was kinda hoping Deniss would medal but I'm happy for Dima exceeding expectations and getting to the podium. I much rather watch him at Olys than Samarin. (Please don't implode. Please.)


But anyway, Euros are over -- it's time for 4CC!
Men's entries (as of Jan 17th, http://www.isuresults.com/events/cat03108500.htm)

No. Name Nation
1 Andrew DODDS AUS 1
2 Brendan KERRY AUS 1
3 Mark WEBSTER AUS 1
Jordan DODDS AUS 1 S
James MIN AUS 1 S
4 Elladj BALDE CAN 2
5 Nam NGUYEN CAN 2
6 Kevin REYNOLDS CAN 2
Liam FIRUS CAN 2 S
Nicolas NADEAU CAN 2 S
Roman SADOVSKY CAN 2 S
7 Boyang JIN CHN 3
8 Han YAN CHN 3
9 He ZHANG CHN 3
Tangxu LI CHN 3 S
10 Micah TANG TPE 4
11 Chih-I TSAO TPE 4
12 Leslie Man Cheuk IP HKG 5
13 Harry Hau Yin LEE HKG 5
14 Harrison Jon-Yen WONG HKG 5
15 Takahito MURA JPN 6
16 Keiji TANAKA JPN 6
17 Shoma UNO JPN 6
Ryuju HINO JPN 6 S
Daisuke MURAKAMI JPN 6 S
Kazuki TOMONO JPN 6 S
18 Abzal RAKIMGALIEV KAZ 7
19 Denis TEN KAZ 7
20 Kai Xiang CHEW MAS 8
21 Julian Zhi Jie YEE MAS 8
22 Donovan CARRILLO MEX 9
23 Geon Hyeong AN KOR 10
24 June Hyoung LEE KOR 10
25 Sihyeong LEE KOR 10
Jinseo KIM KOR 10 S
26 Micah Kai LYNETTE THA 11
27 Max AARON USA 12
28 Jason BROWN USA 12
29 Grant HOCHSTEIN USA 12
Timothy DOLENSKY USA 12 S
Alexander JOHNSON USA 12 S
30 Misha GE UZB 13
 
^I am really interested to see what shape Boyang is in. Also, interested to see if Uno is back in pre-season form and whether Tanaka is improving.

Going into 4CCs, the SB totals are -

Uno 319.84
Fernandez 295.55
Chen 293.79
Hanyu 290.77
Kolyada 282.00
Aliev 274.06
Voronov 271.12
Rippon 266.45
Boyang 264.48
Aaron 261.56
Brown 261.14

Ge 258.34
Zhou 256.66
Yan 254.61
Samarin 253.13
Hendrickx 253.06
Bychenko 252.07
Kvitelashvili 250.26
Messing 248.30
Tanaka 247.17
Chan 245.70
Nguyen 245.21
Vasiljevs 243.52
Brezina 237.04
Krasnozhon 236.35



I struck through the men that will NOT be at the Olympics, but these numbers are volatile: We won't know what shape Hanyu will be in until he steps on Olympic ice, and at 4CCs, will we find out if Boyang's ankles are healed and he is back in form. Also, I really don't know what to expect from Patrick Chan at this point: His skates at Nationals weren't that convincing and his comments about helping the team tell me that is his focus, not an individual medal. However, any big effort by Patrick will certainly lift him far higher than 245 points where he is currently mired.
 
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I noticed that 2 men who will be in Pyeongchang didn't make the free skate cut at Europeans. Could all 6 that don't make the Olympic free skate cut be from Europe?
 
Looking forward to 4CC. Desperately hoping that Max has a great skate.

For the Australians, aside from seeing how high Brendan could finish (I think a low to mid top 10 is possible in this field), I'll be keeping an eye on how Andrew holds up. At Australian Nationals he seemed to get stronger as the week went on, but Nationals dance and the men was scheduled specifically so that he and Charlton wouldn't be pulling double duty on the same day, whereas 4CC is not scheduled so nicely - he will be doing his SP and FD on the same day, only a few hours apart.
 
I noticed that 2 men who will be in Pyeongchang didn't make the free skate cut at Europeans. Could all 6 that don't make the Olympic free skate cut be from Europe?
Well, some of the non-European skaters are not safe bets, either. E.g. Cha (the Korean teenager who got the lone men's spot) could skate really well or he could bomb the SP.

Oh, and now that the Swedish OC has decided Majorov doesn't get to go to Olys -- shame on you, SOC! what a crappy thing to do to an athlete who fought hard to get that spot for Sweden :wall: -- MC Martinez gets his chance. He finished 24th in Helsinki last year, both in SP and in FS.

Btw, does anybody know why MCM isn't entered in 4CC?
 
Btw, does anybody know why MCM isn't entered in 4CC?

Wouldn't it be sad if he saw that he wasn't going to go to the Olympics and just stopped training and retired?! :scream:

Which country is next in line after the Philippines?
 
Stephane Walker is next in line, and the Swiss Federation's secondary criteria is far less strict (he only needed 180 total score to be eligible had he qualified a berth).
 
MCM is indeed going to Pyeongchang & he is very happy about it:

https://twitter.com/ABSCBNNews/status/956296493345816576

ETA: His interview is written up here
"I saw the message from the federation, they were like Michael you’re in. They sent me screencaps of the email saying ISU emailed us that you’re in and I’m like no way so like I rushed in the rink and told me coach, were in we were all super happy about it," Martinez told ABS-CBN News' Steve Angeles in an interview.
 
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^I am really interested to see what shape Boyang is in. Also, interested to see if Uno is back in pre-season form and whether Tanaka is improving.

Going into 4CCs, the SB totals are -

Uno 319.84
Fernandez 295.55
Chen 293.79
Hanyu 290.77
Kolyada 282.00
Aliev 274.06
Voronov 271.12
Rippon 266.45
Boyang 264.48
Aaron 261.56
Brown 261.14

Ge 258.34
Zhou 256.66
Yan 254.61
Samarin 253.13
Hendrickx 253.06
Bychenko 252.07
Kvitelashvili 250.26
Messing 248.30
Tanaka 247.17
Chan 245.70
Nguyen 245.21
Vasiljevs 243.52
Brezina 237.04
Krasnozhon 236.35
Oh, Patrick Chan and Deniss Vasiljevs are very low. I hope they will skate well enough at the Olympics ! Patrick is already such a legend, and Deniss is so beautiful to watch !
 

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