From Russia with Love [#33]: Summer 2019

[Japanfan]

I never heard of any coaches, in any country or club "prescribing a specific diet for a skater".
- Butyrskaya did say she takes her skaters to her home for a week, and they lose 5 kg, but it is a one-time measure if a skater is too heavy for the work load.

I'm sure that Bute must have a diet in mind and it would have to be a very strict one, if the skater is to lose 5 kg in just one week. That's a lot of weight for a tiny girl!

And I don't think coaches would need to prescribe a specific diet for a skater - skaters would share information about diets amongst themselves.

Tzareva (former Pogorylaia's coach) has posted a foto from her summer Training Camp for Juniors/Novices. Each such training camp centre has a cook and a dietitian. This is what the kids are eating. Seems like healthy food.

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.... and they look not bad at all.....

https://sun7-6.userapi.com/c851320/v851320798/17472f/FVcype2WNFU.jpg

Healthy enough, but I see no carbs on the table. Carbs are fuel for an athlete.

What is a coach supposed to do? Say "ok, i'll train you for the European championship which is 2 months away, but you can now do only single salto, since you're 10 lbs over weight"?.... or should the coach say "go home, and come back when you're ready and lost weight at your own speed and method"? or...... go ahead and jump 2ble salto and risk?

What is a coach supposed to do?

How about work with the athlete to help her through the weight loss process? Gracie Gold is/was back on the ice 10 pounds overweight. Liz Manley nearly quit the sport due to mental health issues and weight gain, and coaches took her on when was overweight.

 

[Polaris]

1,000 calories a day is a fairly extreme weight-loss diet. Most people, if they are patient, can lose weight on 1,500 calories a day. I can't imagine why Maria S. needs to be on such a restrictive diet. She must be trying to achieve a body-weight that is far below her normal weight. It is no wonder that eating disorders are so prevalent in the skating world, with the extreme emphasis on low weight, which has as much to do with aesthetics as it does with skating ability.

I don't get how why diets need to be so restrictive when athletes are burning so many calories from training alone. A normal person would lose weight just on 1,500 calories a day diet alone, without all the physical training.

 

[TAHbKA]

Kolyada married Beklemischeva. Mazl toff!

Михаил Коляда женился на Дарье Беклемищевой

Призер чемпионатов мира и Европы Михаил Коляда женился на фигуристке Дарье Беклемищевой. Торжественное бракосочетание состоялось в выходные. Ранее Дарья тренировалась в группах Валентины

www.fsrussia.ru

 

[Ka3sha]

Anastasia Gubanova is now a part of Rukavitsin’s group

Анастасия Губанова перешла в группу Евгения Рукавицына

Как стало известно "СЭ", российская фигуристка Анастасия Губанова после ухода из ЦСКА продолжит карьеру у тренера Евгения Рукавицына в Санкт-Петербурге.

m.sport-express.ru

 

[Tinami Amori]

Just for the record: The article in sport-express at the bottom of the text states that the info came from "the source", and that Rukavitsin has not yet confirmed.

" - Rukavitzin himself, to the question about Gubanova and Nugumanova, said "I will not comment at the moment".
"- Сам Рукавицын в ответ на вопрос о Губановой и Нугумановой заявил, что "сейчас не будет это комментировать".

Nugumanova's coach, Turenko (who is also a former Gubanova's coach), did make comment why she will no longer coach Nugumanova (who joined her in 2018, leaving Mishin's group):

Туренко объяснила, почему прекратила сотрудничество с Нугумановой

Тренер из Санкт-Петербурга Ангелина Туренко сообщила РИА Новости, что прекратила сотрудничество с фигуристкой Елизаветой Нугумановой по обоюдному согласию. РИА Новости Спорт, 22.07.2019

rsport.ria.ru

*Turenko used a term "Nugumanova has problems handling sparring" - in this context "sparring" can mean two things (either direct or figurative):

• not being able to handle the competitive environment between skaters inside the rink/club.
• or, not being able to handle normal confrontations "back and force arguing" with her coach and others.

"Lisa has a hard time handling sparring, thus we decided to part by mutual agreement", - said Turenko on the telephone.
"Лиза тяжело работает в спарринге, потому мы решили расстаться по обоюдному согласию", — сказала Туренко по телефону.

 

[Tinami Amori]

How about work with the athlete to help her through the weight loss process?

Oh, what a beautiful phrase... which i hear so often from people who want a cheap and easy ticket to the realm of "humane, kind and compassionate" status (when in life they often act very selfishly).

"Working with" is subjective, risky, gives coach very little wiggling room, and usually results in coach being blamed, if results are not positive, no matter what the coach has done or have not done.

• Buianova stated in her earlier interviews that she does not fraternize with pupils outside the rink, all work takes place on ice (she sets their goals, they are to follow them, but can't come to her home or call at midnight). Her approach is "talk, explain, monitor, but let the pupil find his/her own rhythm). Results? Radionova, Sotnikova, Gubanova (that we know of) all have weight gain issues. Sotskova is on a 1000 per day diet, of her own chosing. Apparently all is "wrong and critiqued". Buianova is blamed.
• Butyrskaya's approach - take a girl into her home for a week, cook for her the food that is healthy in her opinion. Results? - Butryskaya is blamed.
• Tutberdize hires Lipnitskaya's mother (with salary and travel expenses paid) to take care of Julia's diet, mother makes choices that she makes. Results? - Tutberidze is blamed.
• Then Buianova in Kovtun's situation (who is an adult and old enough) - does not "take into her home", does not "hire mother", does not "ignore an issue", tries another approach - "set a goal" for an adult person over 20 to find a solution. And then we get Kovtun and his 15 kg weight loss in few weeks. Buianova is blamed.
• Then we get Daleman's and Gold's situation: they have different "weight related issues". North Am PC-whipped coaches, see it, feel bad about it, but do nothing about it.... because addressing "weight issues" is not politically correct and socially prohibited.... As Rafael A. said "you can't bring up a skater's weight issue even if a skater is too heavy, it's a taboo". Results? - handling by "silence" does not help either.

It's not about "working with an athlete". Every sport has physical condition requirements. A coach needs to set a goal for such in order for an athlete to be competitive. And it is up to an athlete and his/her family to find a solution. A coach is NOT A NANNY. Because when they try to be "various forms of nannies" - they get blamed.

 

[Eislauffan]

Just for the record: The article in sport-express at the bottom of the text states that the info came from "the source", and that Rukavitsin has not yet confirmed.

" - Rukavitzin himself, to the question about Gubanova and Nugumanova, said "I will not comment at the moment".
"- Сам Рукавицын в ответ на вопрос о Губановой и Нугумановой заявил, что "сейчас не будет это комментировать".

Nugumanova's coach, Turenko (who is also a former Gubanova's coach), did make comment why she will no longer coach Nugumanova (who joined her in 2018, leaving Mishin's group):

Туренко объяснила, почему прекратила сотрудничество с Нугумановой

Тренер из Санкт-Петербурга Ангелина Туренко сообщила РИА Новости, что прекратила сотрудничество с фигуристкой Елизаветой Нугумановой по обоюдному согласию. РИА Новости Спорт, 22.07.2019

rsport.ria.ru

*Turenko used a term "Nugumanova has problems handling sparring" - in this context "sparring" can mean two things (either direct or figurative):

• not being able to handle the competitive environment between skaters inside the rink/club.
• or, not being able to handle normal confrontations "back and force arguing" with her coach and others.

"Lisa has a hard time handling sparring, thus we decided to part by mutual agreement", - said Turenko on the telephone.
"Лиза тяжело работает в спарринге, потому мы решили расстаться по обоюдному согласию", — сказала Туренко по телефону.

When I was in St. Petersburg, Evgeni Rukavitsin told me that Anastasia asked to join his group (that was even before it became public that she had to leave CSKA Moscow). So I guess he has not made a decision yet whether she can stay or not. Lisa Nugumanova was already there. Angelina Turenko told me that it was a mutual decision to part ways.
Interesting comment about "sparring" though. Maybe Lisa didn't like to practice with her direct competitor Serafima Sakhanovich. Rukavitsin has many skaters, but mostly men. Sure, there are Alena Leonova and Maria Talalaikina, but they are less competition than Serafima Lisa might think. She could be the top girl in Rukavitsin's group. She then probably would not be happy if Nastia Gubanova joins the group, too...

 

[Tinami Amori]

Maybe Lisa didn't like to practice with her direct competitor Serafima Sakhanovich. Rukavitsin has many skaters, but mostly men.

that is exactly what the "insiders" on the Russian chats were saying, but it was "just a chat". It sounds like that's what it is.

 

[Wyliefan]

Your world is an interesting place, Tinami. All the pure, innocent, delicate coaches living in terror of the big bad teenage skaters.

 

[Tinami Amori]

Your world is an interesting place, Tinami. All the pure, innocent, delicate coaches living in terror of the big bad teenage skaters.

What i see lately in most "coach-skater conflict" regardless of club/country location - is "teenager gets out of line, misbehaves, disregards his/her coach and instructions - coach tries to fix it or dismisses the pupil - pupil goes public and tells a sob-story - many take skater's side - coach tells his/her side - result: coach is blamed".

Like Judge Judy used to say "when do you hear a lie? when a teenager opens his/her mouth"...

-------
so..... Rukavytsin, Leonova's coach, several hours ago says "No comment" about Gubanova's (and Nugumanova's) transfer. It's been in sports news for several hours.... But Leonova is obviously thinking she can go over her coach's head and when asked several hours later tells the media "yes, these girls are skating in our group"....

Анастасия Губанова и Елизавета Нугуманова перешли в группу к Евгению Рукавицыну

sport.business-gazeta.ru

 

[Tinami Amori]

Sasha Trusova adopts one of the 3 kittens which Alina Zagitova was trying to adopt out.
The kittens' name is "Khloya".
https://www.instagram.com/p/B0NUbuZo_wS/ (4 fotos. last one Khloya playing with Tina's "ice-cream" toy).

Alena Kostornaya posted her none-GP events participation (with disclaimer that all is subject to change).
Lombardia Trophy
Minsk Trophy

https://i3.imageban.ru/out/2019/07/22/c3a275c657189af2fe4dec513a1e5920.png

 

[Jeschke]

Anastasia Gubanova is now a part of Rukavitsin’s group

 

[Tinami Amori]

Two pretty young ladies in the group will certainly not be a minus in almost "all boys" Rukavitsin's group...

---

Eteri Tutberidze with Diana in Detroit (just for few days).

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Diana and Gleb at practice.

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[DobrinFan]

Liza says she is now with Rukavicin and doesn't understand Turenko's explanation on why they parted

Нугуманова о работе с Рукавицыным: это большая честь для меня

Российская фигуристка Елизавета Нугуманова призналась, что работа с тренером Евгением Рукавицыным является для нее большой честью. РИА Новости Спорт, 22.07.2019

rsport.ria.ru

 

[rfisher]

 

[AxelAnnie]

Both of you presented extremes from coaches, and those do happen, but not all coachs' demands, which cause conflicts with pupils, are extremes, just saying. I don't think it is right to look at each and every situation between coach and athlete with automatic bias "student is a victim and coach is an offender".

Just an FYI. Elena Vaytsekhovskaya, a sports writer, now with R-sport, formerly with SE, whose articles often get translated and posted here on FSU, is defending Buyanova, and questioning Gubanova's approach to training. It is true that EV is on very good terms and supportive of Buianova (while old-time enemy with Tutberidze) and what Vaytsekhovskaya has to say may be influenced by personal bias, but this is what she has to say (from the stand point of a former olympic platform diving winner in 1976):

СОЛДАТ ДЖЕЙН. Обсуждение на LiveInternet - Российский Сервис Онлайн-Дневников

Если вы не интересуетесь спортом от слова совсем, а прыжки в воду раздражают вас самим фактом существования, все равно прочитайте. История о том, как простая африканская тетка сделала двух русских девочек олимпийскими чемпионками, а британца Тома Дей...

www.liveinternet.ru

English translation from discussion in the blog (original comments in Russian will be below):

EV: After i won my first Russian championship with a most difficult jump content, i spent summer with grandmother, gained 5 kg (10 lbs), and my coach said to my parents - if she does not lose them by the end of the month, we are finished.

Such approach (from the coach about extra weight) is not a punishment. It's to avoid further pointless work. (such work with an overweight athlete would be) Absolutely pointless. Waist of time. It is too bad that this talented girl does not understand it.

EV: I remember clearly and exactly, about my condition - 1-2kg extra weight - is prohibitive. For real. Feeling uncomfortable - is one thing, increased risk of injury is another.

EV: (about Buyanova and Gubanova's relationship). It's not about (Buyanova's) high rank as coach (who can pick and chose), it's about a fact that any coach is not there to be a skater's nanny. Especially when a skater is old than 10...

EV: Perhaps a person (a coach) just does not feel right spending time on what/who does not give her satisfaction - she is the one to say so.

EV: I personally don't care about "wants and don't wants" - i base my logic on how each factor affects "results" or "lack of results".

EV: (what's important) is for an athlete to work her/his butt off during training. When a person works that hard, the trainer always wants to find ways to give such athlete maximum help with any problems. I have no idea if Gubanova worked her butt off or not. But i am less inclined to believe that a coach (Buianova) is acting like an idiot, in this situation.
--

Thank goodness someone has a brain! I am totally impressed with Buianova's approach. The coach has a huge investment in a skater. Not money but time, expertise, etc. The skater is not "entitled" to be coached by someone. So if the Coach does not think the skater is doing her part, why in the world should the coach spend her time and energy?

 

[Tinami Amori]

Liza says she is now with Rukavicin and doesn't understand Turenko's explanation on why they parted

Нугуманова о работе с Рукавицыным: это большая честь для меня

Российская фигуристка Елизавета Нугуманова призналась, что работа с тренером Евгением Рукавицыным является для нее большой честью. РИА Новости Спорт, 22.07.2019

rsport.ria.ru

Nugumanova said exactly the opposite of what Turenko said:
"I don't have a problem with sparring (competing with another female skater of my level in the same rink). For 8 years i was in such situation, it worked well for me, i like learning from the strong - it inspires me. I don't understand Turenko's statement".

«Я 8 лет тренировалась в спарринге, и у меня это очень хорошо получалось, мне нравится чему-то учиться и тянуться за сильными спортсменами – это всегда подстегивает. А ответ Ангелины Николаевны мне непонятен»

... my 5 kopeeks... (reading what's out there on russian chats): it was not about sparring with Sakhanovich, it was something personal with Sakhanovich, but Turenko saw it as "rivalry on the ice" issue.

 

[Zazy]

What i see lately in most "coach-skater conflict" regardless of club/country location - is "teenager gets out of line, misbehaves, disregards his/her coach and instructions - coach tries to fix it or dismisses the pupil - pupil goes public and tells a sob-story - many take skater's side - coach tells his/her side - result: coach is blamed".

Like Judge Judy used to say "when do you hear a lie? when a teenager opens his/her mouth"...

We don't know what actually happened in any of these situations, we weren't there. As your quote shows, you automatically assume the student is at fault because of your biases. An adult isn't morally superior by virtue of having lived longer or being in a position of authority - that's not how this works. And it's this kind of thinking that encourages abusive environments.

 

[Tinami Amori]

We don't know what actually happened in any of these situations, we weren't there. As your quote shows, you automatically assume the student is at fault because of your biases. An adult isn't morally superior by virtue of having lived longer or being in a position of authority - that's not how this works. And it's this kind of thinking that encourages abusive environments.

Two things happened from my side:

• I gave an alternative view of the Buianova/Gubanova situation, as it was presented by a sport journalist who is widely translated and read on this forum. This journalist is an former athlete herself, and the specific issue was "being overweight for required technical requirements of a given sport".
• I object to an automatic assumption that no matter what "the coach is at fault".

In case of Buianova/Gubanova, my view is (which i have not yet stated):

• Gubanova's condition after her vacation, her attitude towards the critique, and some actions, is one issue. Probably most coaches would have noted it, and objected. She is not an angel.
• Buianova's expectations and reaction is not atypical and has reasoning. The journalist covered her side.
• Buianova's public announcement of exclusion from CSKA, 2 weeks after the partnership ended - is another story. It looks and sounds vindictive, and out of spite.
• then there are stories about Gubanova's actions during these 2 weeks, and "things she said to others" including giving an interview. it is possible that Buianova, in anticipation of "information with unjust negativity against her", took a preemptive step and made the announcement.

It is not a black and white situation. I just don't like when coaches are automatically blamed. (and a secret: i can't stand Buianova, for many reasons, mostly skating related).

One thing is certain to me: coach/pupil need to finish their business, and make a decent and dignified joint announcement, or send a press release about ending their partnership...... and this mess would not happen.

Take a clue from Japanese... never a scandal, never any dirt.

 

[Tinami Amori]

Elena Ilinykh joins Sergey Polunin in Italy, where he is to perform R&J at Verona Arena.
@ 5:40 He and Elena are giving an interview on Italian Radio, in english, where they talk about dancing and their relationship.

Sergei Polunin a RTL 102.5

Puoi seguire RTL 102.5 in RADIOVISIONE sul canale 36 del digitale terrestre, 750 di Sky, in FM, Digital Radio, dal sito internet ufficiale, dall’App e dai no...

www.youtube.com

 

[AxelAnnie]

Like Judge Judy used to say "when do you hear a lie? when a teenager opens his/her mouth"...

-------

No $hit. And never trust anyone with a 1 in front of their age!

 

[Tinami Amori]

Challenger assignments for Russian Senior Ladies posted on private twitter account...

https://twitter.com/kovko2011Linux/status/1153028983111467009?s=20

Alena Kostornaia
Lombardia Trophy 2019
Minsk Arena Ice Star 2019

Anna Shcherbakova
Finlandia Trophy 2019

Alexandra Trusova
Nepela Memorial 2019
Japan Open 2019

Alina Zagitova
Lombardia Trophy 2019?
Japan Open 2019

Evgenia Medvedeva
Nebelhorn Trophy 2019
Shanghai Trophy 2019

Elizaveta Tuktamysheva also at Lombardia.

 

[pointbleu]

Injuries, such as concussions, can be result of improper shape too. That's why coaches can measure weight of their students: to avoid injuries. At least, Stanislava's coach do that as I have just read...

That is a cheap shot. You don’t even know the reasons for the concussions yet you state the opposite. I just told you the real story.

That is said, enough of this and let’s go back to Russian news.

 

[zebraswan]

I wouldn't believe anything coming from that "private" (lol) Twitter account. They've posted wrong info many times before, like when they said the GP assignments were going to be delayed. Just because someone claims to be an "insider" doesn't mean they know what they are talking about or that they are giving you information you can trust. They could be a troll or just another gullible fool like...oh, never mind.

 

[_Lola_]

That is a cheap shot. You don’t even know the reasons for the concussions yet you state the opposite. I just told you the real story.

That is said, enough of this and let’s go back to Russian news.

I prefer to rely on what I read in Julianne's interview and stick to my own opinion: injuries are consequences of her shape and therefore Bilodeau preferred to move on with someone else. Please, feel free to move on too.

 

[Finsta]

Saw that posted on Golden Skate and they said it’s just guessing. Has that schedule been confirmation?

 

[Jeschke]

Challenger assignments for Russian Senior Ladies posted on private twitter account...

Hopefully russian fed will use all its possible spots for challengers this season.
It was kinda bizarre seeing a country with such depth sending sometimes no lady at all to one event.
#nugu

 

[Stephanie]

Finlandia is the week before Skate America. I can't see Shcherbakova doing both back to back like that

 

[rfisher]

Finlandia is the week before Skate America. I can't see Shcherbakova doing both back to back like that

Me either. I suspect there will be a lot of shifting around depending on GP events and even JGP events. The Russian ladies are now pretty concentrated with coaching and I don't doubt coaches will try to minimize travel as well as maximize SB points. And, there will be all the Russian cup events for those skaters who don't get an automatic entry to Russian Nationals via the GP/JGPF. It's going to be another crazy season.

 

[babayaga]

Part of Alina's short program: https://www.instagram.com/p/B0QmXbtnJno/