U.S. Women [#4]: How Dare You

[Karen-W]

I was just looking over it to see if it explicitly says so, but it doesn't. It just says teams qualified have the obligation to fulfill their duty and send skaters to compete.

Audrey Shin is second-best in the US rankings, so...

The doc reads very weird. It sort of implies that it should be the top-ranked skaters by WS rankings, but doesn't. I was looking at it yesterday because GhiAmbro are still ranked ahead of ConMac and it would seem crazy to leave the new World bronze medalists home in favor of another team. I guess we'll see who is chosen. At this rate, maybe the USFS should send Audrey or Lindsay (who is right behind Audrey in the standings), though I'm expecting it will be Bradie.

 

[Rukia]

I was just looking over it to see if it explicitly says so, but it doesn't. It just says teams qualified have the obligation to fulfill their duty and send skaters to compete.

Audrey Shin is second-best in the US rankings, so...

now that would be a twist (I don't see it happening but still sometimes I like a little chaos)

 

[tony]

By the way, Levito's quotes after the free skate mention that she probably won't do WTT because she wants to go on vacation/end the season.

It would make it easier to just send Tennell and Glenn that way, I guess.

 

[Frau Muller]

I hope that Levito considers a coaching switch.

 

[coppertop1]

This may sound harsh but I think it's time for Bradie and Amber to retire. Neither has made a significant impact on the international scene and the likelihood that either one of them will is slim to none. It's time to let the younger ladies get some experience before the next Olympics.

Let's just push veterans aside. Bradie is coming back to injuries and has improved throughout the season. How about giving these you skaters a chance to develop before pushing them into the spotlight?

I hope that Levito considers a coaching switch.

Same. I'm still troubled by what happens at 4CC.

 

[Karen-W]

By the way, Levito's quotes after the free skate mention that she probably won't do WTT because she wants to go on vacation/end the season.

It would make it easier to just send Tennell and Glenn that way, I guess.

I don't think Isabeau quite understands how this works, lol. She's not going to be given a choice by the USFS/NBC.

Additionally, she'd be rather foolish to skip it and the opportunity to build up her fan base in Japan.

 

[Coco]

I do wish there was a 2nd chance for countries to earn additional spots, even if those spots were only for the SP with a per country cap based on previous performances for the FS, but I can't get that worked up over it. IJS can lead to some interesting results when determining spots by placement. Thrilled for the podium skaters, these standings are crowded! Isabeau should feel good about her efforts. It's been a long season.

 

[ice coverage]

By the way, Levito's quotes after the free skate mention that she probably won't do WTT because she wants to go on vacation/end the season. ...

I hope that Isabeau will have the opportunity to make whatever decision (whether to not go to WTT or to go) that she feels would be best for her.

Money isn't everything, but I also hope that she is aware that per the WTT announcement, she would be entitled to an appearance fee of US$20,000 (on top of any prize money for Team USA) because she is second in the (post-Worlds) ISU Season's World Ranking.

 

[Barbara Manatee]

she'd be rather foolish to skip it

Not if she feels she needs to rest.

 

[Andrea82]

The doc reads very weird. It sort of implies that it should be the top-ranked skaters by WS rankings, but doesn't. I was looking at it yesterday because GhiAmbro are still ranked ahead of ConMac and it would seem crazy to leave the new World bronze medalists home in favor of another team. I guess we'll see who is chosen. At this rate, maybe the USFS should send Audrey or Lindsay (who is right behind Audrey in the standings), though I'm expecting it will be Bradie.

ISU docs are always weirdly written.
This one says that ISU have the right to exclude teams in which "one or more of the best ranked Skaters/Couples (in the ISU World Standings valid after the ISU World Figure Skating Championships 2023) elects not to participate". But in other sections they are much more vague in terms who must be entered.

So, basically, in practice, everything will be fine unless USFSA tries to send Alexa Gasparotto and Michelle Lee.

 

[nickp]

isabeau to win one of these medals these days

 

[Jammers]

2008 was the last time the US lost 3 spots and it also happened in a down time with US ladies. Michelle and Sasha weren't around anymore the defending US champion who was supposed to carry the torch for the next 4 years was in decline Emily Hughes was injured and there was no depth behind those 2 in 2008 so 3 girls too young to go to Worlds made the podium. Kimmie and Emily barely kept 3 spots in 2007 with a 4th and 9th place finish so there was no margin for error and the lack of depth in the end is why the 3rd spot was lost. So the team that got sent was one skater Kimmie who's best days were already behind her one skater Bebe Liang who like Amber was wildly talented but inconsistent and had never been to Worlds before and Ashley Wagner who was only 16 and had no experience at Worlds either and bombed. At least there was some hope back then with the Junior girls like Mirai, Rachael and Ashley but now there doesn't even seem to be that in the Junior ranks right now and with the raised age limit any future potential star is going to be to young to go the Olympics in 3 years.

 

[Mugs]

Let's just push veterans aside. Bradie is coming back to injuries and has improved throughout the season. How about giving these you skaters a chance to develop before pushing them into the spotlight?

Ack! I hit the wrong button. Apologies.

I didn't say push veterans aside. I said I think it's time they move on. Both Amber and Bradie sat in a heap on the middle of the ice after their performances. You could see anguish and regret on their faces. I understand that each person develops at their own pace but Bradie is 25 years old and her Worlds results show that as each year passes she's falling further behind.

Bradie's Senior Ladies World Championship results:
2018 - 6th place
2019 - 7th place
2020 - event canceled
2021 - 9th place
2022 - injured
2023 - 15th place

 

[Evgeniafan]

I was just looking over it to see if it explicitly says so, but it doesn't. It just says teams qualified have the obligation to fulfill their duty and send skaters to compete.

Audrey Shin is second-best in the US rankings, so...

I love Audrey. I hope she gets it.

 

[Carolla5501]

I don't think Isabeau quite understands how this works, lol. She's not going to be given a choice by the USFS/NBC.

Additionally, she'd be rather foolish to skip it and the opportunity to build up her fan base in Japan.

What did she just enter into indentured servitude?

 

[coppertop1]

I don't think Isabeau quite understands how this works, lol. She's not going to be given a choice by the USFS/NBC.

Additionally, she'd be rather foolish to skip it and the opportunity to build up her fan base in Japan.

Yes, burning out skaters is a great idea. Can't let her take a break. Have people series learned nothing about pushing skaters too hard?

 

[layman]

I hope that Levito considers a coaching switch.

Who would you recommend that she switch to?

I liked the work that Jeremy Abbott did with Alysa Liu. He really helped her improve her jumps (in the short amount of time that they worked together). I wonder if he might be a possibility and/or if Isabeau would consider relocating.

 

[Sarah]

I love Audrey. I hope she gets it.

I like Audrey, but I believe Audrey is coming back from an injury. Who knows how much she’s been training/full training.

Re: Isabeau: if she wants/needs a vacation, she should skip WTT. The last think the USFS needs is a skater there who doesn’t want to be there. Especially if she’s tired/burned out.

 

[airgelaal]

2008 was the last time the US lost 3 spots

And what about 2018

 

[layman]

Re: Isabeau: if she wants/needs a vacation, she should skip WTT. The last think the USFS needs is a skater there who doesn’t want to be there. Especially if she’s tired/burned out.

I agree. I think hype, pressure, unrealistic expectations and burnout contributed to Alysa Liu's premature retirement last year. I hate seeing young skaters debut (as seniors) and then retire (all in the same season). To me that's a huge red flag that the pressure on these young athletes is simply too much.

 

[VGThuy]

I mean if skaters can skip 4CC, they should be able to skip WTT too. At least 4CC is an actual ISU championship. WTT is just a money grab. It's important but you know, if a skater wants to skip it, why not?

 

[thvu]

I mean if skaters can skip 4CC, they should be able to skip WTT too. At least 4CC is an actual ISU championship. WTT is just a money grab. It's important but you know, if a skater wants to skip it, why not?

I can’t imagine being in the position to where I could just say “meh” to that amount of money. She should be able to skip it, and I’m envious that she feels she can.

 

[Private Citizen]

I hope that Levito considers a coaching switch.

She is better than the programs she had this year, and I think her tech content was a combination of being unnecessarily risky but also not risky enough. 3Lz+3Lo made no sense to me; quads or triple axels would have, especially in the early season.

Levito is still living at home and training locally, right? Suggesting a coaching change is easy, but there is a human cost of having Levito potentially move away from her single mother (who may not be able to move?) and her home. And, regardless of the screaming over her technique, she isn't getting underrotation or edge calls from a variety of panels, and she's one of if not the most consistent women in the world. In a perfect world, I'd love to see her with a different coach, but her current situation has a number of pluses that may be difficult for another situation to replicate.

I can’t imagine being in the position to where I could just say “meh” to that amount of money. She should be able to skip it, and I’m envious that she feels she can.

She's 16; she shouldn't have to be thinking about money like this, especially relative to her health. Her mother is a top doctor, so I doubt the prize money is more important than her health or future success.

 

[Karen-W]

If not a coaching change, then the minimum Isabeau needs is a better choreographer. I'm not suggesting anything drastic like Richaud or Bourne, because I don't think their sensibilities would suit her style, but someone like Marie-France might be a good choice seeing the wide range of styles we see in the Montreal teams.

 

[thvu]

She's 16; she shouldn't have to be thinking about money like this, especially relative to her health. Her mother is a top doctor, so I doubt the prize money is more important than her health or future success.

Teenagers have to think about money all the time. I’ve taught plenty who had to work, especially if they wanted a chance to afford going to a university. I’m not saying this is the desired state of things, but it’s clearly a sign of privilege that “no” is even a possibility. That’s a position many would be envious of.

Everyone makes sacrifices to their mental health to achieve other goals. Some have to make more than others.

 

[skatingguy]

I agree. I think hype, pressure, unrealistic expectations and burnout contributed to Alysa Liu's premature retirement last year. I hate seeing young skaters debut (as seniors) and then retire (all in the same season). To me that's a huge red flag that the pressure on these young athletes is simply too much.

I wouldn't discount the amount of work that Liu had to put into regaining her jumps after her technique failed. Because of the pandemic, and no junior events in 2020/21 we didn't see her a lot but that fall she didn't have any triples, and by US Nationals in January she had them back.

 

[VALuvsMKwan]

Teenagers have to think about money all the time. I’ve taught plenty who had to work, especially if they wanted a chance to afford going to a university. I’m not saying this is the desired state of things, but it’s clearly a sign of privilege that “no” is even a possibility. That’s a position many would be envious of.

Everyone makes sacrifices to their mental health to achieve other goals. Some have to make more than others.

Well, thanks, Eteri.

 

[sk8nlizard]

Not if she feels she needs to rest.

I dunno $20K plus is a lot of money for a competition that is pretty “fun.” If her finances are such that that amount of money doesn’t even give her pause, more power to her. I hope she can enjoy declining it. But for most that would be a serious motivator. Also, it’s in Japan, and skater’s continually say how great skating in Japan is. Either way, I hope she does what is best for her but understands the ramifications either way.

 

[layman]

I wouldn't discount the amount of work that Liu had to put into regaining her jumps after her technique failed. Because of the pandemic, and no junior events in 2020/21 we didn't see her a lot but that fall she didn't have any triples, and by US Nationals in January she had them back.

Alysa Liu was very wise to seek out help from a jump technician (when she did) and it paid off.

 

[thvu]

Well, thanks, Eteri.

Sure, my saying I’m envious of those that have the privilege to even consider forgoing $20k for mental health is the same as drugging children and forcing them to train while injured.

GTFO of here with that bs.