Russian women news & updates, 2021-22 season

Scott512

Well-Known Member
Messages
615
I love Tuk but I don’t think it‘s close at all between her and Anna. Anna has quads and better presentation/skating skills plus is a rock. She’s already 3 time Russian Nats champ and world champ and does it all without hype. I wouldn’t be surprised if she wins gold at the games. Kamila is going to come in as the favorite and is going to feel the nerves. Anna had nerves of steel and she’s not far behind Kamila in terms of tech- only lack of a triple axel.

I would love to see Tuk on team event but realistically, Russia will go with Anna and Kamila. It would be a real slight not to have Anna skate in team event after all her success and consistency. All the girls will want a chance at team gold.
Anna is like Eteris 3rd daughter so she will be in the team event unless she's ill or injured or bombs Russian nationals or Europeans and this girl never bombs as a senior.

The ladies will dominate the team event in the Winter Olympics Russian pairs will be very good hopefully dance will be good although they're not off to a good start this season. The big worry is men and hopefully misha won't kill the team gold chances again. I keep waiting for someone else to step up. Didn't Ignatov land all 4 quads at NHK? The young guys are not really having the success this year we hoped they would.

As for eteri's real daughter Dians I do not want to see her in the team event unless her team is somehow one of the top 2 in Russia after nationals and that would be hard to cathom even though they are improving.
 

soogar

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,869
As for eteri's real daughter Dians I do not want to see her in the team event unless her team is somehow one of the top 2 in Russia after nationals and that would be hard to cathom even though they are improving.
I'm actually curious why everyone thinks Diana will be in the team event this year? My thought is that Eteri is trying to position her daughter as an Olympian. That already is more than what Eteri has achieved. Side note, I watched Diana's singles skating and she's a very good singles skater with a decent amount of triples. Not the same as the others, but she has talent.
 
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soogar

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,869
Nope don’t agree sorry. Her spins and step sequence levels should not correlate with this PCS rise .
As Marco said she is getting crazy GOE on some very average elements too, this is definitely a big behind the scenes push. At Skate America in the short she beat Valieva on Interpretation, some judges even had her ahead on SS. She also comfortably beat skaters like Kostornaia, Higuchi and Chen. I am sorry but no. She deserves all her medals and accolades but her PCS are a bit of a joke.
Her program is a lot more fun to watch than Kamila's. She doesn't have the speed across the ice but she engages the audience and judges are human too. The audience for both Grand Prixs were getting into her programs. I also wouldn't be surprised if the judges are impressed with the changes she made at this late stage in her career. She took all the feedback and made dramatic improvements in her spins and her programs. Plus she's landing consistent triple axels and 3-3s and she's not a little kid. Kamila looks like a superwoman racing across the ice, but Liza is spectacular as well. As for skating skills, maybe she is doing her turns correctly on good edges. She may not be as fast, but she may be more precise.
 

skatfan

Well-Known Member
Messages
6,122
No one is saying there shouldn’t be a spot for smaller countries if anything I would change how multiple spots are awarded I would rather see a fourth Russian than a third US lady
Sorry, not on board with that. One could have said the same about the US ladies back in the early 1990s. For a once in four years competition, having more representation is more important to me than adding a non-medal skater (because someone goes home without one) from a country dominating the event already.
 

Mayra

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,609
counting the eggs before hatching when GPF and Nationals are still to happen

Remember Tuk has a scoring ceiling and tiny mistakes her scores are beatable, I would not trust a skater with a 151-3 max celiling, Kromykh even score 154!
A 154 to go with that 64 in the sp? :shuffle:

I'd take a skater with an 80+ in the sp and 149+ in the lp to the bank. :lol:

For all you talk about her ceiling in the long, she is kept in the mix by that sp score alone. At this point Khromykh has not shown anywhere near the consistency of La Tukt and she is being outscored by her overall because Khromykh's sp score is 72 at best this season. La Tukt is outpacing her going into the long by a good 8 points and still beating her overall(even with mistakes).

Like it or not, Tuktamysheva is now a reputation skater and she is going to get those PCS marks no matter how many cigarette breaks she takes on the ice, or if she telegraphs those jumps all the way from Russia.

Who knows what will happen with juniors in the mix, but while everyone else is praying for healthy feet, legs and hips etc to make it to December, Tuktamysheva has made a very good case for an Olympic spot and that makes her bankable.
 

Skibean

Well-Known Member
Messages
181
I adore Liza, but agree her scores have been very high. Her skate in Russia was definitely not what I expected after hearing her scores beforehand. Maybe it was the skate order, but to me she lacked emotion, was slow, sloppy and almost…boring. I don’t thinks she’s a lock for the Olympic team. I think she’s amazing, and I give her credit for all she does, but I don’t think she’s a definite
 

love_skate2011

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,597
I adore Liza, but agree her scores have been very high. Her skate in Russia was definitely not what I expected after hearing her scores beforehand. Maybe it was the skate order, but to me she lacked emotion, was slow, sloppy and almost…boring. I don’t thinks she’s a lock for the Olympic team. I think she’s amazing, and I give her credit for all she does, but I don’t think she’s a definite
One mistake and shes off podium at the Olympics, a "mature" skater yet has a ceiling is the price, would I risk it if I was the Fed ?
I would gamble with a more high scoring skater, like they did in 2019 Worlds.

I hope they let her have a skate off again against Trusova
where she will lose again, like against Med, 2019 Flashbacks.
 

soogar

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,869
One mistake and shes off podium at the Olympics, a "mature" skater yet has a ceiling is the price, would I risk it if I was the Fed ?
I would gamble with a more high scoring skater, like they did in 2019 Worlds.

I hope they let her have a skate off again against Trusova
where she will lose again, like against Med, 2019 Flashbacks.
What risk are they taking? Liza finished second at worlds against Trusova with a few mistakes. This is a long season and she's a mature skater. Her performance at Rostelcom after illness was pretty good. She stayed on her feet in both programs. She has to manage her body a lot differently than the younger girls. The main thing is that she stays healthy and keeps skating consistently. That's really the only thing she can do. Russia can get a sweep with her or with Trusova. The worst that Russia can do is burn its skaters out before the main event.
 

~tapdancer~

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,637
I don't focus on women's singles, and I definitely don't know the stories of the Russian ladies...this is a legit question..can Kamila Valieva only do jumps with both her arms over her head? I watched her short and FS and every jump was that way. Even in her exhibition in Russia (from above). Is that her super power?
 

love_skate2011

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Messages
3,597
Zinina just went to JGPF with Isbeau's withdrawal.

Does this mean she is automatically qualified to Russian Senior Nationals? she is age 14 like Samodelkina

Tuktamsyehva must be sweating.
Thats 4 Juniors now that can beat her when she's off, Muravieva, Petrosyan, Samodelkina, Zinina.
 

Karen-W

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Messages
13,697
Zinina just went to JGPF with Isbeau's withdrawal.

Does this mean she is automatically qualified to Russian Senior Nationals? she is age 14 like Samodelkina

Tuktamsyehva must be sweating.
Thats 4 Juniors now that can beat her when she's off, Muravieva, Petrosyan, Samodelkina, Zinina.
Isabeau withdrew? Link? It's barely 6am on the East Coast.
 

Karen-W

Well-Known Member
Messages
13,697

anybody know what happened with levito ?
No idea. Like I said, it's only about 6:30am on the East Coast where she is from and it's 4:30am in Colorado Springs where the USFS headquarters are, so it'll be at least 3-4 hours before any sort of press release comes out. It does make me wonder whether or not she'll be at US Nats - she withdrew from the NQS event she was slated to compete in a few weeks ago.
 

love_skate2011

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Messages
3,597
No idea. Like I said, it's only about 6:30am on the East Coast where she is from and it's 4:30am in Colorado Springs where the USFS headquarters are, so it'll be at least 3-4 hours before any sort of press release comes out. It does make me wonder whether or not she'll be at US Nats - she withdrew from the NQS event she was slated to compete in a few weeks ago.
Hope shes alright, Levito I think has better chances of her quads developing than Liu, sure they're wild but so are most russian jumping technique in quads. we might get official update today ? that news came out fast. She has a high chance of placing a podium finish at US Nationals.
 

Karen-W

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Messages
13,697
Hope shes alright, we might get official update today ? that news came out fast. She has a high chance of placing a podium finish at US Nationals.
She certainly does. It's very strange that the entry list has been updated before the USFS made an announcement of its own.

As far as the Russian women go, most of the international juniors have been inconsistent in competitions. Akateva is the only one that has been really dominant in both of her events and she isn't allowed to compete at Sr RusNats. I don't see any of Muravieva, Petrosian, Samodelkina, or Zinina beating Kostornaia or Khromykh much less approaching the 232+ that a slightly undertrained Tuk put out last week at RC. Not with typical Nationals score inflation that should be expected for top tier skaters like Valieva, Shcherbakova, Tuktamsyehva, Trusova & even Kostornaia & Khromykh.
 

rfisher

Let the skating begin
Messages
70,022
I don't focus on women's singles, and I definitely don't know the stories of the Russian ladies...this is a legit question..can Kamila Valieva only do jumps with both her arms over her head? I watched her short and FS and every jump was that way. Even in her exhibition in Russia (from above). Is that her super power?
Because that's how she learned to jump when she was younger. That was when the position gave a bonus so all the Russians her age group learned to jump that way to maximize points. Many of them have discussed this. Some of the next generation (the 10-13 year olds) are not doing the variation since it's no longer a big bonus.
 

Tobbe

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Messages
174
So only rich countries/rich skaters who can train in rich countries should be able to participate in the Olympics. As problematic as the Olympics are, part of the Olympic Ideal is that every country can participate.
It's not about only rich countries. It's about some countries are more suited for winter sports. The argument that everyone should participate is absurd. If you live in like Kenya, of course there would be a shortage of ice rinks. The country is simply not a winter country.
We have all seen those skaters from India in the Junior Grand Prix. While they are very endearing to watch, we mustn't forget that they take a spot from someone else. Sure, it is a nice idea that everyone is welcome to figure skating. But I don't expect India to be a major figure skating nation anytime soon.
Then we have some winter sport countries, like my country Sweden, where figure skating isn't a big thing. But that is mostly because all the ice rinks are busy with ice hockey players so it's difficult to get ice time. That means that there are just a few figure skating clubs around, and very few skaters that are good. Sweden has qualified for two spots for the Olympics now that they probably won't use. That's because the Swedish Olympic committee don't think that they are good enough. And though I am Swedish I totally agree. I would rather see perhaps another Russian woman and another Japanese man instead of Taljegård and Majorov, because I know they are better.
 

Tobbe

Well-Known Member
Messages
174
Zinina just went to JGPF with Isbeau's withdrawal.

Does this mean she is automatically qualified to Russian Senior Nationals? she is age 14 like Samodelkina

Tuktamsyehva must be sweating.
Thats 4 Juniors now that can beat her when she's off, Muravieva, Petrosyan, Samodelkina, Zinina.
That was unexpected.

I just hope Zinina is ok as she didn't enter the last senior Cup stage as expected.
 

RoseRed

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Messages
1,974
It's not about only rich countries. It's about some countries are more suited for winter sports. The argument that everyone should participate is absurd. If you live in like Kenya, of course there would be a shortage of ice rinks. The country is simply not a winter country.
We have all seen those skaters from India in the Junior Grand Prix. While they are very endearing to watch, we mustn't forget that they take a spot from someone else. Sure, it is a nice idea that everyone is welcome to figure skating. But I don't expect India to be a major figure skating nation anytime soon.
Then we have some winter sport countries, like my country Sweden, where figure skating isn't a big thing. But that is mostly because all the ice rinks are busy with ice hockey players so it's difficult to get ice time. That means that there are just a few figure skating clubs around, and very few skaters that are good. Sweden has qualified for two spots for the Olympics now that they probably won't use. That's because the Swedish Olympic committee don't think that they are good enough. And though I am Swedish I totally agree. I would rather see perhaps another Russian woman and another Japanese man instead of Taljegård and Majorov, because I know they are better.
No, they don't. Other countries available JGP spots are exactly the same, whether or not India sends anyone.
 

emason

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Messages
4,439
If India is sending skaters to an ISU competition that means India has a skating federation that is an ISU member and pays dues like every other member and India is entitled to the same benefits as every other dues-paying member. It doesn't matter if the skaters are good or bad and how else do you expect them to get better if they can't get competition experience? it's not about what we want, it's about what's good for the skater and the federation.
 

hanca

Values her privacy
Messages
12,101
If India is sending skaters to an ISU competition that means India has a skating federation that is an ISU member and pays dues like every other member and India is entitled to the same benefits as every other dues-paying member. It doesn't matter if the skaters are good or bad and how else do you expect them to get better if they can't get competition experience? it's not about what we want, it's about what's good for the skater and the federation.
For JGP, I agree. But for senior events, there should be a certain level of skating. I recall the pair a few years who was struggling even with the most basic things. Was it failed Canadians who were skating for a different country?
 

soogar

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Messages
2,869
It's not about only rich countries. It's about some countries are more suited for winter sports. The argument that everyone should participate is absurd. If you live in like Kenya, of course there would be a shortage of ice rinks. The country is simply not a winter country.
We have all seen those skaters from India in the Junior Grand Prix. While they are very endearing to watch, we mustn't forget that they take a spot from someone else. Sure, it is a nice idea that everyone is welcome to figure skating. But I don't expect India to be a major figure skating nation anytime soon.
Then we have some winter sport countries, like my country Sweden, where figure skating isn't a big thing. But that is mostly because all the ice rinks are busy with ice hockey players so it's difficult to get ice time. That means that there are just a few figure skating clubs around, and very few skaters that are good. Sweden has qualified for two spots for the Olympics now that they probably won't use. That's because the Swedish Olympic committee don't think that they are good enough. And though I am Swedish I totally agree. I would rather see perhaps another Russian woman and another Japanese man instead of Taljegård and Majorov, because I know they are better.
I'm really over people complaining about the Indian skaters. First of all, skating is a sport that most kids do as a hobby. The junior grand prix tech minimums do not include triple jumps. That's because it gives its member countries the opportunity to send skaters and permit them to get experience. Look at where Chinese pairs came from. That coach wasn't the best participant but he learned enough from observing skaters from top programs that enabled him to create a top pairs program in China.

As for India, India is a huge country with tons of people. In fact, Meryl and Charlie's Indian dance received over a million views from India. It's also a song and dance country. I think there is built in opportunity for viewership in India and to build a program that would be popular.

While the Russians take the JGP seriously, many participants don't have the funds or even ice time to replicate what the Russians do- that include many from European countries as well. That Indian girl was doing an axel and double jumps and Ted said that she only could practice a few hours a week and she lived far from the rink. I thought she was a lovely presence on the ice and it was refreshing to see kids who were normal and it helps you appreciate what the Russians put in to have a program like that. Every country has to start somewhere.
 

MsZem

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Messages
17,011
It's not about only rich countries. It's about some countries are more suited for winter sports. The argument that everyone should participate is absurd. If you live in like Kenya, of course there would be a shortage of ice rinks. The country is simply not a winter country.
We have all seen those skaters from India in the Junior Grand Prix. While they are very endearing to watch, we mustn't forget that they take a spot from someone else. Sure, it is a nice idea that everyone is welcome to figure skating. But I don't expect India to be a major figure skating nation anytime soon.
Javier Fernandez finished 23rd at his first JGP*, with a total score of 88.84. He was 28th at his first Euros, and 35th at his first Worlds. Being able to compete at that level was important for his growth as a skater, and his success will hopefully pave the way for others from his country.

I'll note, yet again, that most sports have limitations on the number of entries from each country at various events, and this is certainly the case for the Olympics.

(Fernandez was 14th at his first Olympics)

* Interestingly, the bottom three all became Olympians :)

ETA: I couldn't resist - JGP Lake Placid 2009, ice dance results.
 
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RoseRed

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Messages
1,974
For JGP, I agree. But for senior events, there should be a certain level of skating. I recall the pair a few years who was struggling even with the most basic things. Was it failed Canadians who were skating for a different country?
And the ISU agrees, because they have tech minimums for all their major senior international events (GP series/Euros/4CCs/Worlds).
 

~tapdancer~

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,637
Because that's how she learned to jump when she was younger. That was when the position gave a bonus so all the Russians her age group learned to jump that way to maximize points. Many of them have discussed this. Some of the next generation (the 10-13 year olds) are not doing the variation since it's no longer a big bonus.
Thanks for the info. I was honestly curious about that. Very interesting. I prefer it as a highlight.
 

Evilynn

((Swedish skating dudes))
Messages
2,679
Then we have some winter sport countries, like my country Sweden, where figure skating isn't a big thing. But that is mostly because all the ice rinks are busy with ice hockey players so it's difficult to get ice time. That means that there are just a few figure skating clubs around, and very few skaters that are good. Sweden has qualified for two spots for the Olympics now that they probably won't use. That's because the Swedish Olympic committee don't think that they are good enough. And though I am Swedish I totally agree. I would rather see perhaps another Russian woman and another Japanese man instead of Taljegård and Majorov, because I know they are better.

Whereas I think the SOK are too harsh with the criteria. Taljegård and Majorov might not go on to place more than top 15 in the world, but to have skaters at the Olympics means a lot for the growth of the sport. I think Taljegård in particular would be a great draw for kids to try out skating, if they got to see her at the Olys.
 

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