Russian women news & updates, 2021-22 season

hanca

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Well, in the small sample of Crone/Poirier, Samuelson/Bates, and Ilinykh/Katsalapov, all the men have since medalled at Worlds, and all the women are no longer skating competitively.

Further down the ranks, Michael Parsons didn't seem to have much trouble finding a new partner when his sister retired. Neither did Chris Reed a few years before him.

OTOH, both Hurtado and Diaz were able to find new partners after their split, though Adrian did so faster than Sara.

Anyway I don't think any of the Russian women will be taking up pairs or ice dance (really, none of them have the skating skills for the latter...)
The examples you gave - Parson was lucky that there was another ice dance couple at their rink who split up at the same time. Also, he was a relatively lower level skater, so he would have more choices. Ilynikh had bronze at Olympics, she was in top five or six in the world. That’s a different situation than a skater who looked promising but has never even qualify for worlds.

Hurtardo and Diaz - they were also lower level skaters (14-23 at worlds and 13 at the Olympics), and they were lucky that there were so many split ups around the world. For Hurtardo to have Khaliavin, the Russian federation had to release him. So she could easily be without a partner if Russian federation did their usual tricks. Luckily Hurtardo did not pose any threat to their ice dancers.

Zahorski was waiting for the right partner for a few years. Khokhlova retired when Novitski had to retire because of injuries. Actually, Khokhlova asked Katsalapov if he would skate with her. He didn’t want to break up his partnership with Ilynikh, so Khokhlova tried one season with Andreev who was singles skater, because she couldn’t find anyone better. It didn’t go anywhere and then she retired.

What do you mean that none of Russian women will be taking up pairs? Of course they will. Jasmina Kadyrova, who was competing at GP this weekend, switched from singles two years ago. In fact, every year quite a few pretty decent junior singles ladies switch to pairs. Kostiuk, Solovieva, Chistiakova, Vasilieva, Osokina… That’s why I am saying, it is much easier to find a partner for pairs than for ice dance. From elite skaters, Hotarek picked Marchei from singles, Vanessa James took Cipres from singles…
But Russian ladies are also switching to ice dance. In the past it was Davankova, who switched quite successfully thanks to Morozov, but unfortunately gave up too soon. More current for example Davis, Mitrofanova (now skating for Bosnia and Herzegovina), Kanysheva (still in juniors).
 
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MsZem

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Entire post
I gave multiple examples of men who did pretty well for themselves after their partnership ended, so I'm not sure why you think that giving more examples of women who have had a hard time finding new partners contradicts this.

To clarify: I don't think any of the more promising Russian women who are currently juniors or early in their senior careers will be taking up pairs, let alone ice dance - so this is a tangent and it's time to end it.
 

hanca

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I gave multiple examples of men who did pretty well for themselves after their partnership ended, so I'm not sure why you think that giving more examples of women who have had a hard time finding new partners contradicts this.

To clarify: I don't think any of the more promising Russian women who are currently juniors or early in their senior careers will be taking up pairs, let alone ice dance - so this is a tangent and it's time to end it.
If Medvedeva got feelings of ‘unfinished business’ and found a decent competitive partner, she probably could. Skaters are returning (Savchenko, James, Radford, Takahashi) and pairs would be easier, because without quads she has no chance in women any more. I am not saying that they would be immediately competitive, because Russian pairs are quite crowded and it is hard to get to the top, but not impossible. Medvedeva would need a tall and strong experienced pair skater and within a year or two she would be competitive at world level. That doesn’t means she would have a chance for OGM or medal from worlds, she still would have to claw her way to the top, which is hard but not impossible. Look at Mishina/Galliamov- for a few years Russian pair number four, and then suddenly they made progress, got opportunity and they took it.
 

rfisher

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We may think we know who could win the gold medal but that is not entirely predictable even with Valieva’s potential score. Let’s she how she does under Olympic pressure. In China.
Well, she certainly won't have any home grown competition in China. :lol: And, she'll have already competed against her main rivals at the GPF, Nationals and Europeans and possibly the RC final. I think she'll know where she is by February.
 

Ruby999

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If Medvedeva got feelings of ‘unfinished business’ and found a decent competitive partner, she probably could. Skaters are returning (Savchenko, James, Radford, Takahashi) and pairs would be easier, because without quads she has no chance in women any more. I am not saying that they would be immediately competitive, because Russian pairs are quite crowded and it is hard to get to the top, but not impossible. Medvedeva would need a tall and strong experienced pair skater and within a year or two she would be competitive at world level. That doesn’t means she would have a chance for OGM or medal from worlds, she still would have to claw her way to the top, which is hard but not impossible. Look at Mishina/Galliamov- for a few years Russian pair number four, and then suddenly they made progress, got opportunity and they took it.
I know that some people think she has mediocre skating skills, but I think Medvedeva would be good in ice dance. The throw jumps in pairs might be a liability for her back injury. And there are skaters in dance that people complain have mediocre skating skills too, so I think she should go for it if she still wants to compete. She is so emotive, she would be great!
 

hanca

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I know that some people think she has mediocre skating skills, but I think Medvedeva would be good in ice dance. The throw jumps in pairs might be a liability for her back injury. And there are skaters in dance that people complain have mediocre skating skills too, so I think she should go for it if she still wants to compete. She is so emotive, she would be great!
It is too late for her for ice dance. Maybe if she competed for a different country than Russia, she may have a chance to eventually get to worlds; if the are the only ice dance couple in that country, the only thing preventing her to compete would be getting the qualifying score. But she would have no chance getting to, let’s say, top ten at worlds.
 

Scott512

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I am glad that she is happy but as a FS fan it seemed like such a waste of talent! Her partner dumped her and she skated with whoever was available. She tried to make it work with two, but the partners were just not good enough. I don't think it is easy to find a really talented male partner in ice dance.

She has moved on with her life, and from what I read, she is happy about the success her former partner has had. That is good for her.
I think the dance discipline in figure skating can be very frustrating because your reliant on your partner 100% and if you don't have the right partner it ain't going to work.

I think Elena figured out she won the team gold medal at the Olympics and individual bronze in dance she gave it a couple more years then said the hell with it.
 

Scott512

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I know that some people think she has mediocre skating skills, but I think Medvedeva would be good in ice dance. The throw jumps in pairs might be a liability for her back injury. And there are skaters in dance that people complain have mediocre skating skills too, so I think she should go for it if she still wants to compete. She is so emotive, she would be great!
I would prefer dance for Evgenia because it's safer than the pair's discipline.
 

hanca

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I would prefer dance for Evgenia because it's safer than the pair's discipline.
One thing is what you may prefer, but other thing is whether she would realistically have a chance. I doubt that she would want to return, if she has no chance to be competitive at worlds level. That would not be worth all the effort because she has already achieved that. Do we know any singles skater who switched to ice dance after the age of 20 and got to top ten at worlds? Whereas there are examples who managed it in pairs (e.g. Marchei).
 

Scott512

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No Chance, a fracture Hip doesn't heal in a month, think about it even Trusova just got back on the ice from her foot fracture.
No news yet if Usacheva needs to undergo surgery.
She has a hip fracture? I thought Dasha pulled the muscle off her femur bone. Poor kid. She should not skate competitively until next season.

Amazing Sasha how can she do like a 4 quad program coming off a foot fracture? She really will be the Supernova if she can pull that off.
 

Scott512

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One thing is what you may prefer, but other thing is whether she would realistically have a chance. I doubt that she would want to return, if she has no chance to be competitive at worlds level. That would not be worth all the effort because she has already achieved that. Do we know any singles skater who switched to ice dance after the age of 20 and got to top ten at worlds? Whereas there are examples who managed it in pairs (e.g. Marchei).
No examples. It's fine if Zhenya is content with her singles career. She could do well in pairs but it's so risky and she's been so banged up for years with her back. She's actually doing very with her career without competitions.
 

Ka3sha

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Olympics did an interview with Evgenia Medvedeva (in English)

She is going to Beijing as ROC team ambassador and TV commentator
 
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Scott512

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It is not shocking. Most of top level ice dancers would not be able to find another partner. There are no unattached high level partners available whenever you need them. If Papadakis/Cizeron split up from whatever reason (e.g. one of them may be force to retirement by injury), there wouldn’t be that big choice for the remaining skater to find a new partner. There are not unattached high level partners waiting for the opportunity. Why do you think Abachkina retired for thee seasons? She was promising, but could not find a partner. Then there was an opportunity so she came back, but now they split up again, let’s see how long it will take to ind someone else. It is quite possible that she will retire again.
It's unbelievable. You would think that skaters who were good as juniors and then who could not survive in the men's and women's disciplines would move to dance and find a partner but but that is not happening because it's not easy to pull off.

I will say EGd daughter Diana gave up singles a couple years ago and found her partner right away and now they're a dance team on the rise and she's only 18. I still don't see that Diana Gleb dance team being in the top 3 in Russia but they are being pushed like they already are.
 

hanca

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It's unbelievable. You would think that skaters who were good as juniors and then who could not survive in the men's and women's disciplines would move to dance and find a partner but but that is not happening because it's not easy to pull off.

I will say EGd daughter Diana gave up singles a couple years ago and found her partner right away and now they're a dance team on the rise and she's only 18. I still don't see that Diana Gleb dance team being in the top 3 in Russia but they are being pushed like they already are.
I think you are mixing a few things together and ignoring some other important facts.
Firstly, Diana’s mother is a skating coach who ensured that Diana had decent basics. She also had high enough position at her rink by then that she could accommodate the switch at her rink. She also found her the first partner, who was a guy from the same rink. As a dance coach she could spend as much time as she wanted with Diana, to give her extra sessions. (Not every singles skater would have the finance to be able to afford unlimited coaching.) Tutberidze also had the contacts to ensure someone will take Diana (e.g. Zhulin refused, but she managed to get Diana into good coaching situation and when she moved from the complete ice dance beginner stage, she sent her to Spilband). Secondly Diana changed at quite young age, she was 13, so she had a chance to compete at junior level in ice dance first. That was very helpful, because through medals at JGP she built up her name as reasonably decent junior ice dancer, so her switch to seniors was easier than someone who switched to seniors from single skating.

Unlike her, Medvedeva is now 22 and her mother is not a coach. She didn’t have the opportunity to build up her name as a decent junior ice dancer; she was a decent single skater, but not an ice dancer. That’s a huge difference.

There were a few examples where skaters switched as teenagers to ice dance, with various levels of success.

Hurtardo and Diaz switched when she was 14 and he was 16. But they had the advantage that there was no ice dance competition in their country, so the only thing that they had to do was to get to such a level to get qualifying score for Europeans and worlds. They didn’t have to fight with other dance couples to be sent to top competitions.

Davankova switched from pairs to ice dance, and had the advantage of having unlimited coaching from her husband (Morozov) and within a year got to 7th at the Russian senior nationals, but I guess having a husband screaming at her every day was not very good for their marriage. She gave up after a year and now are divorced.

Stavitskaya tried to switch to ice dance, Zhulin took her into her group, but it was too late. (She was 19). As a Russian skater, there was too much competition among Russian ice dancers and after a few years she gave up). She didn’t have mother or husband to provide unlimited coaching, and she was in a country where every year more talented juniors with medals from JGPF and Junior worlds moved to seniors, that’s hard to fight that. If she switched countries, she may have a chance to be good enough to get to international competitions.
 

hanca

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Lewis Gibson
You are right, I didn’t notice that they placed that high at the last worlds. Saying that, they are again representing a country where they don’t have to fight with many decent ice dance couples just to be sent to Europeans and worlds. The situation in Russia would be much harder, because for Medvedeva to get to Europeans and worlds, she would need to get to top three at the nationals, which I don’t think is likely.
 

Frau Muller

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If Medvedeva got feelings of ‘unfinished business’ and found a decent competitive partner, she probably could. Skaters are returning (Savchenko, James, Radford, Takahashi) and pairs would be easier, because without quads she has no chance in women any more. I am not saying that they would be immediately competitive, because Russian pairs are quite crowded and it is hard to get to the top, but not impossible. Medvedeva would need a tall and strong experienced pair skater and within a year or two she would be competitive at world level. That doesn’t means she would have a chance for OGM or medal from worlds, she still would have to claw her way to the top, which is hard but not impossible. Look at Mishina/Galliamov- for a few years Russian pair number four, and then suddenly they made progress, got opportunity and they took it.
Why on earth would Russia need Medvedeva for Pairs? If this were 2008, I could see it but the Russia Fed is not currently desperate for pairs AND doesn’t bow to marketing interests (like Japan with Takahashi)…just let natural champions develop within each discipline.
 

hanca

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Why on earth would Russia need Medvedeva for Pairs? If this were 2008, I could see it but the Russia Fed is not currently desperate for pairs AND doesn’t bow to marketing interests (like Japan with Takahashi)…just let natural champions develop within each discipline.
I never said that Russia needs her. I said ‘if she had feelings of unfinished business’.
I don’t think Russia would be bending backwards for her, but they would let her try it and if she seemed promising, they would support her as much as they do anyone else that may seem promising.
Russia did not need Stolbova/Novoselov either, and yet they let Stolbova to try it and were happy to support her, if it looked like a promising partnership.
 

Frau Muller

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I never said that Russia needs her. I said ‘if she had feelings of unfinished business’.
I don’t think Russia would be bending backwards for her, but they would let her try it and if she seemed promising, they would support her as much as they do anyone else that may seem promising.
Russia did not need Stolbova/Novoselov either, and yet they let Stolbova to try it and were happy to support her, if it looked like a promising partnership.
It’s just the question that popped into my mind while reading your post. I didn’t mean to imply that you were advocating it.
 

Scott512

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I think you are mixing a few things together and ignoring some other important facts.
Firstly, Diana’s mother is a skating coach who ensured that Diana had decent basics. She also had high enough position at her rink by then that she could accommodate the switch at her rink. She also found her the first partner, who was a guy from the same rink. As a dance coach she could spend as much time as she wanted with Diana, to give her extra sessions. (Not every singles skater would have the finance to be able to afford unlimited coaching.) Tutberidze also had the contacts to ensure someone will take Diana (e.g. Zhulin refused, but she managed to get Diana into good coaching situation and when she moved from the complete ice dance beginner stage, she sent her to Spilband). Secondly Diana changed at quite young age, she was 13, so she had a chance to compete at junior level in ice dance first. That was very helpful, because through medals at JGP she built up her name as reasonably decent junior ice dancer, so her switch to seniors was easier than someone who switched to seniors from single skating.

Unlike her, Medvedeva is now 22 and her mother is not a coach. She didn’t have the opportunity to build up her name as a decent junior ice dancer; she was a decent single skater, but not an ice dancer. That’s a huge difference.

There were a few examples where skaters switched as teenagers to ice dance, with various levels of success.

Hurtardo and Diaz switched when she was 14 and he was 16. But they had the advantage that there was no ice dance competition in their country, so the only thing that they had to do was to get to such a level to get qualifying score for Europeans and worlds. They didn’t have to fight with other dance couples to be sent to top competitions.

Davankova switched from pairs to ice dance, and had the advantage of having unlimited coaching from her husband (Morozov) and within a year got to 7th at the Russian senior nationals, but I guess having a husband screaming at her every day was not very good for their marriage. She gave up after a year and now are divorced.

Stavitskaya tried to switch to ice dance, Zhulin took her into her group, but it was too late. (She was 19). As a Russian skater, there was too much competition among Russian ice dancers and after a few years she gave up). She didn’t have mother or husband to provide unlimited coaching, and she was in a country where every year more talented juniors with medals from JGPF and Junior worlds moved to seniors, that’s hard to fight that. If she switched countries, she may have a chance to be good enough to get to international competitions.
It's true about Diana having skating skills of a single skater and then finding her partner right away because they train in the same rink.

Certainly having her mother as a famous coach has helped with connections.

And Diana's mother has a background in dance so that that is helping. I did not know Diana did dance at 13. But most of me the transaction back to dance a little easier.

Does Zhulin regret not taking Diana and Gleb?
Maybe he just did not want to deal with EG.
 

Aceon6

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All this “try dance” or “try pairs” has me thinking of the NASCAR drivers who were SURE they would win everything if they raced open wheel. Nope.
 

Skibean

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If sasha wasn't injured Russia certainly would have gotten all 6GPF spots instead of 5 of the 6. Whether they have 9 of the top 10 ladies in the world or 8 of the top 10 is debatable. I would venture to say 12 of the top 16. But it's a moot point because nothing's going to change. It's like hoping politicians change that never happens.
That’s not necessarily true. Sasha has been known to bomb.

I think giving more spots would make other countries lose interest in the sport fast. The US wasn’t given more slots when they were dominating years ago. Why should the rules change now?
 

becca

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Zhenya may feel there is unfinished business but I don’t think she is likely to do better in pairs and dance than she did in singles.

Multiple world titles and Olympic silver is nothing to sniff at. If you told her she would achieve all that as an eight year old she would likely be thrilled.

Russia is not desperate for pairs skaters. They are better there than dance.

As for Diana got to say why are people always going after the female children of stars Diana and Annabelle and not so much the male children?

I do think all the female interest in skating has helped Russian pairs but likely when they are younger
 

Belsornia

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You are right, I didn’t notice that they placed that high at the last worlds. Saying that, they are again representing a country where they don’t have to fight with many decent ice dance couples just to be sent to Europeans and worlds.
Yes, Lewis rather hit a sweet spot in terms of skating for a smaller but not totally obscure federation and making the switch at a time when domestic competition was particularly lacking. Plus not having the resource constraints or issues around finding and maintaining an international partnership that stymie many small fed and/or late switching skaters. But I do wonder how good he could have been if he had switched early enough to build strong dance fundamentals.

Anyway, Russian women…. Probably none of them are going to be skating with Lewis. :lol:
 

love_skate2011

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I never said that Russia needs her. I said ‘if she had feelings of unfinished business’.
I don’t think Russia would be bending backwards for her, but they would let her try it and if she seemed promising, they would support her as much as they do anyone else that may seem promising.
Russia did not need Stolbova/Novoselov either, and yet they let Stolbova to try it and were happy to support her, if it looked like a promising partnership.
Medvedeva and Enbert/potential partner would need all high pairs elements not just jumps

They will at least comepete with
Mishina / Galliamov, Boikova / Kozlovski, Pavlychenk / Khodykin, Artemeva / Nazrychev, Kahbibullina / Kynazhuk

Can Enbert land triple Lutz like Med ?
 

Scott512

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That’s not necessarily true. Sasha has been known to bomb.

I think giving more spots would make other countries lose interest in the sport fast. The US wasn’t given more slots when they were dominating years ago. Why should the rules change now?
Didnt sasha win skate America? Meaning all she would have to do is be top 4 in her 2nd grand prix event and she's in the final. 5 Russian girls are going to GPF sasha would have been one of the 6.

We don't need massive changes in the rules but they need to be modified it's overdue. You're more concerned with small countries I'm more concerned with athletes they give their lives to these sports that don't get to go to the big events because because it's a numbers game. Someone came up with the idea about countries in a certain discipline that dominate the Grand Prix season get another spot for Olympics worlds or Europeans and I agree with that. That wouldn't damage the sport in any way and would actually reward the elite skaters better than the current setup.
 
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Karen-W

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Didnt sasha win skate America? Meaning all she would have to do is be top 4 in her 2nd grand prix event and she's in the final. 5 Russian girls are going to GPF sasha would have been one of the 6.
Theoretically, had Sasha been able to compete at her 2nd GP then, in all likelihood, yes, she would have only needed a Top 4 finish to make it to the GPF assuming the rest of the results in the other comps as well as the top 3 at NHK remained the same. In that scenario:

1) Valieva 30 pts
2) Shcherbakova 30 pts
3) Tuktamysheva 26 pts
4) Trusova 24 pts (1st & 4th)
5) Sakamoto 24 pts (4th & 1st)
6) Khromykh 24 pts (2nd & 3rd) 446.04

7/Alt 1) Kostornaia 24 pts (3rd & 2nd) 436.39
8/Alt 2) You 22 pts
9/Alt 3) Hendrickx 18 pts (3rd & 5th)

10) Mihara 18 pts (4th & 4th)
 

Scott512

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Theoretically, had Sasha been able to compete at her 2nd GP then, in all likelihood, yes, she would have only needed a Top 4 finish to make it to the GPF assuming the rest of the results in the other comps as well as the top 3 at NHK remained the same. In that scenario:

1) Valieva 30 pts
2) Shcherbakova 30 pts
3) Tuktamysheva 26 pts
4) Trusova 24 pts (1st & 4th)
5) Sakamoto 24 pts (4th & 1st)
6) Khromykh 24 pts (2nd & 3rd) 446.04

7/Alt 1) Kostornaia 24 pts (3rd & 2nd) 436.39
8/Alt 2) You 22 pts
9/Alt 3) Hendrickx 18 pts (3rd & 5th)

10) Mihara 18 pts (4th & 4th)
Theoretically, had Sasha been able to compete at her 2nd GP then, in all likelihood, yes, she would have only needed a Top 4 finish to make it to the GPF assuming the rest of the results in the other comps as well as the top 3 at NHK remained the same. In that scenario:

1) Valieva 30 pts
2) Shcherbakova 30 pts
3) Tuktamysheva 26 pts
4) Trusova 24 pts (1st & 4th)
5) Sakamoto 24 pts (4th & 1st)
6) Khromykh 24 pts (2nd & 3rd) 446.04

7/Alt 1) Kostornaia 24 pts (3rd & 2nd) 436.39
8/Alt 2) You 22 pts
9/Alt 3) Hendrickx 18 pts (3rd & 5th)

10) Mihara 18 pts (4th & 4th)
All 6 spots would have been Russias. Only 5 because the quad Queen got injured. Is still very impressive and the Russian girls dominate junior girls every single year.

It should be interesting to see what happens at Russian nationals. Do we expect meltdowns?
The pressure to be in the top 3 in oil for disciplines will be massive.
 

Karen-W

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All 6 spots would have been Russias. Only 5 because the quad Queen got injured. Is still very impressive and the Russian girls dominate junior girls every single year.

It should be interesting to see what happens at Russian nationals. Do we expect meltdowns?
The pressure to be in the top 3 in oil for disciplines will be massive.
No, all 6 spots would NOT have been Russia's, had the results remained exactly the same at NHK with Trusova finishing 4th. Not to mention, when Usacheva injured herself and withdrew from NHK as well, it changed the dynamic and "must deliver" stress levels for both Kostornaia at IdF and Khromykh at RC. We can't say that they would have placed where they did under different circumstances.
 

Vash01

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All 6 spots would have been Russias. Only 5 because the quad Queen got injured. Is still very impressive and the Russian girls dominate junior girls every single year.

It should be interesting to see what happens at Russian nationals. Do we expect meltdowns?
The pressure to be in the top 3 in oil for disciplines will be massive.
The pressure at the RN could be greater than the Olympic pressure, IMO. Whoever (women's field) survives it, will handle the Olympic pressure.
 

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