2019-20 Canadian Men news & updates

TygerLily

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2,229
I wonder what Roman's skate would have looked like if he had already been named to worlds - clearly the pressure got to him. He's by far my favourite of the 3 guys and I hope he at least has a good comeback skate in the long.
I was wondering that, too. :( Similarly, I wonder how Bausback would have skated had the minimums not been increased partway through the season. I know they should ideally both be able to skate their best under pressure, but both had extra pressure on them.
 

Marco

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14,906
I feel for Roman. Then again if he could not handle the pressure of 4CCs, how could he possibly handle the pressure of Worlds when the sole competitor would be fighting to regain that 2nd spot for Canada. NOw that he has nothing to lose, perhaps he can deliver a stunning FS tomorrow and hopefully fight for a higher SB / WS for GP invites next season.

I feel like Keegan didn't place higher because China only had pairs and men to politik for. Jin's GOEs were honestly quite unreasonable, especially given what the other top men got for what they did. I probably would have Keegan third if not a close second ahead of Jason.

I think Nam's scores were fair and I believe he will skate decently tomorrow - but he doesn't control his fate. It will all come down to how Keegan skates.

Gogolev was skating strong at Bavarian and I hope he can have the axel strong enough that he can go for 2 of them at Jr Worlds FS. I dare not think about the quad for him. For next season I hope he can consider music that can more readily highlight his style. I see him as one of the top skaters of the next generation. Him and Yuma and Artur.
 
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aftershocks

Banned Member
Messages
17,335
Gutted for Roman.

I guess it'll come down to Nam and Keegan. Nam tends to be a more consistent FP skater than Keegan, so it'll be interesting to see how the scores play out.

Whatever happens tomorrow, sorry, Roman, Worlds will have to wait for another year.

I wonder what Roman's skate would have looked like if he had already been named to worlds - clearly the pressure got to him.

Aarrgh... If only Roman could have popped into a triple on his first pass and then landed the 3-axel which is a good jump for him (as is usually the quad he attempted). Why does it tend to be a double or single when skaters pop jumps?

Maybe the desire to have skaters duke it out at one particular competition (4CCs/ Euros) before deciding on Worlds assignments is not always the way to go. It places inordinate pressure upon skaters, which clearly has not worked out for Luba/Charlie or for Roman.
 
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Colonel Green

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9,729
Maybe the desire to have skaters duke it out at one particular competition (4CCs/ Euros) before deciding on Worlds assignments is not always the way to go. It places inordinate pressure upon skaters, which clearly has not worked out for Luba/Charlie or for Roman.
If the goal is to see how they perform under pressure (there'll be a lot of it at Worlds), then knowing that it's a challenge is beneficial ultimately.
 

manhn

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13,683
I can see being sympathetic towards Roman, but Luba and Charlie? The only reason 4CC is being used to determine the Worlds pairs 2nd spot is because they couldn’t do it at Nationals.
 

aftershocks

Banned Member
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17,335
I can see being sympathetic towards Roman, but Luba and Charlie? The only reason 4CC is being used to determine the Worlds pairs 2nd spot is because they couldn’t do it at Nationals.

Ummm, I think Luba/Charlie have good potential and I hope they can get better. They are only in their first season together, so it is not surprising they still need more time to improve as a team. I simply mentioned that the opportunity to perform better at 4CCs didn't work out for them. Whether or not you feel any sympathy for Luba & Charlie, I stated a fact.

If the goal is to see how they perform under pressure (there'll be a lot of it at Worlds), then knowing that it's a challenge is beneficial ultimately.

Fair enough, albeit each competition and the particular circumstances are different from event-to-event. In this instance, those athletes with greater experience (in L&C's case they have little competition experience with each other compared to other teams) are the ones who came through. For eg., Walsh/Michaud have more experience together, and Nam's and Keegan's international experience and 4CCs experience far outweighs Roman's.

It looks like Keegan and Nam had a fire lit under them and seized this opportunity to improve upon their Canadian Nat'ls showings. Added to their previous 4CCs experience, the amount of pressure Nam & Keegan are under may be less than what Roman was feeling at his first 4CCs and coming in with his first Canadian National championship -- also it was a quick turnaround from Nationals competition.

So hopefully for Roman the pressure will be off in the fp and allow him to skate better and pull up a bit in the standings.

All-in-all the overall men's competition at 4CCs, especially the top groups, was great! :encore:
 

screech

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6,455
I wonder what Skate Canada will do if Keegan comes out only around 2 points higher than Nam. Nam had the better GP result and placed higher at nationals, but if 4CC is the decision maker, then Keegan would have it there, even if it was just eeked out.

Tomorrow will be interesting...
 

Colonel Green

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9,729
A topic I had forgotten to mention before (I think), but which was recently brought up again by a side comment in IFS' Junior Worlds preview, is what Gogo's plans are for next season as far as competition level. When he started as a junior it seemed like they wanted to move him into senior at the earliest possible opportunity, but between the growth- and injury-related problems this year and his coaching change (to a coach who is famous for his two-year plans for coaching changes), I wasn't sure if that was still true. IFS casually refers to this as his "final year in the junior ranks", so it may be that they've been informed that's still the strategy (they have interviewed him recently, after all).

I do think doing the senior Grand Prix, at least, is a solid idea. He's already won the JGP Final. If he wants to take another crack at Junior Worlds later in the year, he can still do that, though I imagine that will also depend on whether he makes the senior World team or not.
 

jlai

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I am not entirely sure if the results at 4cc is indicative of anything of how the men would perform at worlds. All three Canadian men have up and down results all season.
 

Colonel Green

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I am not entirely sure if the results at 4cc is indicative of anything of how the men would perform at worlds.
I don't think anybody has suggested it's guaranteed. Keegan had a fantastic 4CC last season (he should have been the bronze medalist), and then a not-so-fantastic Worlds. But these are the only data points the federation has to make decisions with.

And with Roman, in particular, his performance at 4CC basically reinforces the worst case scenario that the federation would be worried about based on his track record, namely, that he completely tanks the short program and misses the free skate cut. Roman hasn't done a clean short program all season, whereas Keegan and Nam have a couple of times apiece.
 

screech

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I missed Romans FP, but saw that he got -2 in deductions.
Nam just finished and he definitely is fighting for that Worlds spot. Popped his first 3A, but then threw it in later (I think instead of a 3F). Other than that, clean skate, and had the energy rivalling his Skate Canada performance. Keegan is going to have to skate well to beat him overall.
And then of course the hug with Keegan as he left the ice while Keegan waited to go on for warmup.
 

screech

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Not Keegan's best at all. Popped both axels into doubles, sat down on a lutz, and hands down on one quad. Ends up almost 8 points behind Nam overall.

So (I'm assuming) congrats to Nam on your ticket to Worlds.
 

dramagrrl

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1,967
Nam is my personal favourite, so I've been crossing my fingers all season that he ended up at Worlds. I just typed something about seeing him skate at Worlds in Montreal, but then I deleted it because I am only planning to go to the FD/men's LP and I don't want to put a BLACK MARK on him that ends up not qualifying to the FS. :p
 

screech

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Nam is my personal favourite, so I've been crossing my fingers all season that he ended up at Worlds. I just typed something about seeing him skate at Worlds in Montreal, but then I deleted it because I am only planning to go to the FD/men's LP and I don't want to put a BLACK MARK on him that ends up not qualifying to the FS. :p
Haha you never know with Nam. But I hope you get to see him!
I like his FP this year. I love his footwork sequence to Let It Be, and I hope he skates both programs to the best of his ability at Worlds.

And I hope being passed over doesn't turn Roman into this generation's Sandhu or Phaneuf...
 

dramagrrl

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1,967
And I hope being passed over doesn't turn Roman into this generation's Sandhu or Phaneuf...
Nam just posted an Instagram Live video where he was chilling at a restaurant with Roman and Zach Lagha, and Roman seemed to be in good spirits. They was even some talk about Nam going to Worlds with Nam saying nothing was decided yet and Roman basically telling him he was going, and they were laughing about it before Nam decided that maybe they shouldn't discuss Worlds selection on a live stream. ;)
 

shutterbug

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1,978
Aww, good for Nam. :cheer2: After seeing how well he skated at Skate Canada despite the Yuzurumania, he was my pick for the Worlds spot even before Nats. Fingers crossed he can make two spots for next year happen!

And for Team Roman, this was a valuable lesson in managing emotions/expectations/training after a big win and short turnaround. Also valuable to see Jason Brown finish with a medal to reinforce it's not all about the jumps. Overall, he's had a successful season, and I'm looking forward to more good things (and two new programs!) for him next season. :)

Has Keegan said anything about his plans beyond this year?
 

miffy

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10,215
It’s so nice how supportive the 3 Canadian men are of each other. I’m sad for Keegan and I have waited years for someone to skate to November Rain so I would have liked to see him do it at Worlds. But well done to Nam :) He isn’t my favourite but I hope he has a great Worlds, I’ll be rooting for him to get a 2nd spot for next year.
 

martipellow2

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21
I think Roman is a beautiful skater, easily the most talented and the best skating skills of the three, but I'm increasingly thinking he will turn out to be yet another beautiful Canadian skater who can't cut it under pressure on the international stage. I have never ever once seen him skate a clean short or long program. Or if he has, it was many years ago when the content was easier. In his vlog just before Canadians, he said he had never felt so prepared: he said he even skated a clean long program in practice. It sounded like he was surprised to skate a clean long in training. Which makes me question his training? Shouldn't it be routine to skate a clean long? Any time I've seen him practise, he marks many of his jumps, which makes me think he doesn't do routine runthroughs. I also think he has low expectations for himself. He says his best short program was at Finlandia this year, but he missed the lutz there: he seems to think he's doing well when he only misses one or two jumps. So either he has to change his training, or see a sports psychologist to help him overcome his consistent crumbling in competition. It's a recurring pattern. I know it's easy for me to criticize. He's the one out there and it's a tough sport. Just frustrated to see a very talented skater year after year not living up to his potential. He should have been competing at Worlds years ago!
 

Colonel Green

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Has Keegan said anything about his plans beyond this year?
He said at the start of the quad that he was committed to doing two years and then would assess whether he wanted to push on toward Beijing. There hasn't been any word since as to where that stands; probably that's something he'll start thinking about now.

It's quite understandable if he feels it's time to hang up the skates (for several reasons, including age, marriage, and his recent travails), but I hope he doesn't, just because this would be a bit of a down note to end things on.

Unrelatedly, as far as assessing Nam's chances at a top ten finish at Worlds, his best international scores this year (262.77, from SCI; and 251.60, from 4CC) would have ranked him 5th and 10th at last year's Worlds, respectively. Different judging panels and blah blah blah, but we're talking ballpark.
 

clairecloutier

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I do hope Keegan continues on. I enjoy his skating. At this point it seems he's quite reliable in the SP, but struggles in the long, for reasons that are unclear. Would love to see him get more consistent. Even at 28, he still has room to grow, it seems.
 

Seerek

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Good to see Nam (and Robert) having a plan B (and likely plan C) mid program just in case things didn't go as initially planned. That probably secured his Worlds berth.

It would have been unfortunate if Keegan lost a Worlds berth based on a "+REP" mental error (but he already had 2 2 toes to that point, so not sure what he would have done).
 

screech

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With Stephen age eligible next year, the mens event is going to be interesting. His artistry has improved, and when healthy, he can do things that none of the other Canadian men can do (except for Keegan's one successful quad lutz, at last year's GPF).

I hope Keegan sticks around, but I won't be surprised if he announces this season as his last. If it is, I hope that he's recruited as a spin and power coach (preferably by Nam)
 

Vase

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I am a big Keegan fan, I hope he continues. But Stephan is gonna make men’s exciting along with Nam he’s always exciting to watch
 

Dobre

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Congratulations to Nam:).

As for Roman, he has had a very successful season, won a national title, and just had the chance to compete at his first major international.

Keegan had a lovely SP here, and I suppose if the kid I was rooting for must finish ninth, it might as well be behind Keegan;).
 

Marco

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Has the team been named? Nam looks to be the fairest choice since he beat the other 2 by a large margin here.

Absolutely bummed for Roman but also in a way relieved that it happened here instead of at Worlds. Imagine how horrible he would be crucified if he skated at Worlds like this.

Keegan absolutely is the better skater but he can't control his jumps. Nam on the other hand is obviously very hungry and did his job and more.

Now, if Nam gets the spot and regains the 2nd spot for next season - and if Stephen predictably starts to dominate domestically next season and grabs the title Nathan-style, we will all be back where we are with Roman, Nam and Keegan fighting for that spot for Worlds...
 

victorskid

Happily ignoring many pontificators & know-it-alls
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The various teams have not yet been named - this includes both junior and senior Worlds. They were awaiting results of several competitions including 4CC and the Bavarian Open. There was apparently a social media hint from Nam that the announcement might be made on Thursday. That would allow time for everyone to get home from the weekend competition, I guess.

Meanwhile we just have to wait :)
 

Foolhardy Ham Lint

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Messing and Sadovsky are far superior skaters. Nguyen, on this occasion, was the better competitor.

If he does his best, hopefully a home-court advantage will secure Nam a top ten spot, and Canada, two men for 2021.

However, it's going to be a tough call up against athletes from the USA, Japan, Russia, Italy, Korea, Georgia, Latvia, the Czech Republic, and France.

My guess is he will place in the top sixteen again.

Interestingly, his point total at Four Continents would have earned him the silver medal at Europeans.
 

mocha-ice

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The various teams have not yet been named - this includes both junior and senior Worlds. They were awaiting results of several competitions including 4CC and the Bavarian Open.

Stephen and Joseph were named for junior worlds. There are still TBA in the other categories, but men’s was announced right away.
 

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