She was indeed a nutcase. But I don't understand why she got so much negative press about the affair while both Zhulin and Navka remained unscathed.
Are Virtue & Moir now the ice dancing GOATs?
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She was indeed a nutcase. But I don't understand why she got so much negative press about the affair while both Zhulin and Navka remained unscathed.
VGThuy
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The thread that gk_891 provided is nothing but links to YouTube videos of people's favorite ice dance performances. It's like 5 pages long.
It always seems to be the other woman that gets blamed.
That's kind of ridiculous. Especially since Zhulin's affair with the teenage Tatiana Navka was (IMO) more instrumental to Usova & Zhulin's marriage falling apart than his affair with Grishuk. But let's be honest here. Zhulin was clearly a horndog and he was probably going to continue cheating on Usova whether or not Grishuk or Navka were in the picture.
I didn’t say it was fair just that in general women attack the other woman.
I don’t remember all the details about what happened. Her behaviour was bizarre long before that°
Oh yeah, I didn't say that you were saying that it was fair. I was just saying that it was ridiculous in general.
Oksana's behavior starting getting strange at around late 1997 or so. But I think it probably started earlier as Platov often said that Oksana was known for excessive behavior for almost her entire life. She was crazy obsessed with winning all the time and would train like a mad person, often until Evgeni couldn't stand anymore.
But I think the fallout from the affair with Zhulin and getting her name sullied in such a public way (while Zhulin and Navka remained unscathed), getting beaten up by Dubova's husband and getting kicked out of Dubova's camp, getting a ton of criticism for their gold medal win over the beloved Torvill & Dean, Tracy Wilson's super-unflattering commentary, and the fallout with Linichuk & Karponosov after the 1996 Worlds (there were rumours that Linichuk tried to get rid of them so she could lead Kyrlova & Ovsiannikov to gold) helped define her personality during those years. I'm sure she probably felt unappreciated to an extent.
Can you enlighten me on the background? I don’t remember anything about Dubova’s husband beating her? On the plus side she is a coach now and has a daughter so I would think things have long stabilized for her.
Twilight1
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There have been so many different variations/versions of what went down but from what I gather from interviews and what's been stated here and elsewhere, Zhulin and Grishuk had an affair in 1992. When Dubova found out about the affair, she kicked Grishuk out of her skating camp and allegedy Dubova's husband was (somewhat) violent with her in doing so or something along those lines (and earlier that year, I think there was also a confrontation between her and Usova at a bar somewhere). Zhulin asked Grishuk to wait for her but then Usova found out that he was also having an affair with Tatiana Navka. Grishuk dumped Zhulin and she went back to her first coaches Linichuk and Karponosov (although I'm not sure if she went back to L&K right after being kicked out or if she went back to them after she dumped Zhulin). Grishuk called Platov constantly to convince him to leave Dubova's camp and skate with her again under L&K. After Grishuk was kicked out earlier that year, Dubova paired Platov up with Navka. At first he obliged as he felt that he couldn't question her. But he realized that the arrangement wasn't going to work as Dubova was spending all of her time with U&Z so he finally left towards the end of that summer and reunited with Grishuk.
There's a lot more to this story both before and after but that's sort of the meat of it right there (I think anyways).
dramagrrl
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Tanith Belbin-White calls V&M GOAT in this article:
"Belbin White doesn't hesitate to call her old Canton training partners the G.O.A.T.s (greatest of all time).
'I use that term in reverence,' she said. 'The facts are in front of you. What else would you call them?' "
Smart girl.
"Belbin White doesn't hesitate to call her old Canton training partners the G.O.A.T.s (greatest of all time).
'I use that term in reverence,' she said. 'The facts are in front of you. What else would you call them?' "
Smart girl.
Viscaro
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Hello... Have you heard of personal taste ????
There are no facts to this kind of things. Art is subjective.
Seriously, this is the same stuff you see in dance. People that are like "Margot Fonteyn is the ultimate prima ballerina" or "Zakharova is better than anyone else ever", as if anyone else should just stop dancing because they have nothing to bring anymore. I actually laughed when I read some YT comments about Margot Fonteyn dancing, people were expecting her to be the GOAT dancer and used her as a reference without having seen her dance once and guess what ? they did'nt like what they saw because classical dance evolved in 50 years.
(And it really annoys me because when I watch a dance video of a ballerina you always have stupid people who are like "Meh, *insert super famous dancer name here* did it better")
Doesn't makes more sense in music. Or in literature. Or in movies : do you think that the director who won the most oscars is the greatest direct eeeeveeeer and that anyone NOT thinking the same thing is a hater ?
We don't like the same things. We're allowed to.
(No offence to Tanith she's always respectful and positive, love her comments)
Edit : Oups, sorry to have feed the drama troll. Lesson learned ! (Until the next troll, sadly, I'm only human after all)
There are no facts to this kind of things. Art is subjective.
Seriously, this is the same stuff you see in dance. People that are like "Margot Fonteyn is the ultimate prima ballerina" or "Zakharova is better than anyone else ever", as if anyone else should just stop dancing because they have nothing to bring anymore. I actually laughed when I read some YT comments about Margot Fonteyn dancing, people were expecting her to be the GOAT dancer and used her as a reference without having seen her dance once and guess what ? they did'nt like what they saw because classical dance evolved in 50 years.
(And it really annoys me because when I watch a dance video of a ballerina you always have stupid people who are like "Meh, *insert super famous dancer name here* did it better")
Doesn't makes more sense in music. Or in literature. Or in movies : do you think that the director who won the most oscars is the greatest direct eeeeveeeer and that anyone NOT thinking the same thing is a hater ?
We don't like the same things. We're allowed to.
(No offence to Tanith she's always respectful and positive, love her comments)
Edit : Oups, sorry to have feed the drama troll. Lesson learned ! (Until the next troll, sadly, I'm only human after all)
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dramagrrl
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dramagrrl
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1) There is no such word as "oups".
2) I love all the PC ubers who try to call me a troll!
I've been "trolling" on FSU longer than most of y'all put together as a group of blinded ubers. 
Sylvia
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dramagrrl
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Hahahaha! Point taken! I was being Anglocentric, and should have said there is no English word such as "oups".
Viscaro
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I'm not French, if this is was this post is implying... https://lecoinducervanties.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/francophonie_-_carte_80x60.jpg
Guess, if you have nothing better to do
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1) There is no such word as "oups".
2) I love all the PC ubers who try to call me a troll!
That’s true I remember you - and all of us - back then.
cocotaffy
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I didn't know that, it sounded so unbelievable I had to go check their records to be sure it wasn't a mistake. The most surprising one was their acclaimed 2010 FD not being 1st at Worlds.
Anyway, GOATs don't exist in a discipline like ice dance, the artistic side plays such a fundamental role that medals don't always account for the brilliance or the far reaching influence of a team. For me the only possible description of an exceptional team could be one of the GOAT, even for the most iconic couples like Torvill and Dean. So indeed, V/M are one of the GOAT among other greats who will undoubtedly all be joined by more teams in the future.
forthewin
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By P/C ubers' logic, I could also say P/C don't really win their world titles because they often lost the SD. What a bunch of nonsense. And since when WC matters that much in the discussion of GOAT? Wake up, baby, it's all about Olympics!
MsZem
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Kurt Browning says hi.
Twilight1
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I now think they are GOAT's just because it seems to peeve off so many to say they are 
Peepsquick
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Or ... by the number of people peeved off when people think they are not ... perspective, perspective
dramagrrl
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Or ... by the number of people peeved off when people think they are not ... perspective, perspective
If you read the thread, I think the saltiness of the anti-GOAT contingent far outweighs the “people peeved off when people think they are not”.
If that's your logic, you should also mention that they won the freedance handily at 2010 Olys. And most clearly won the FD at the 2018 Olys in the eyes of every human in that arena...except a few judges, by the slightest of margins.
But anyway, there's a lot more that goes into GOAT than statistics. It's a whole picture of a lot of things, including significant results, impact, programs, versatility, icon-status, the list goes on...
VGThuy
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I think V/M are GOATS at least in the post-6.0/IJS era.
Anyone that is in medal position for 3 Olympics ... that is a huge commitment. If it were me I wouldn’t have done it.
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