U.S. Men in 2017 - articles & latest news

[aftershocks]

Letting Katherine Hill take over the reins from Phillip Mills turned out to be a great decision for him IMO. Everything clicked here and there wasn't a moment of feeling - now that's some major progress.

Ah yes, Katherine Hill seems to be a bright light as a rising choreographer/ movement specialist who has skated competitively (she began skating at the age of two). I found this profile:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hISZrruEFU
"... What inspires me? ... I think skating has the potential ... to hold [audiences] captive and then watch them exhale as you [the skater] ... finish the energy. I think that ability to take someone's breath is inspiring."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rTLh2vXN_M Katherine Hill choreo in action

Here's an interview with Katherine Hill speaking to someone [Leanne (sp?) Mallory] involved in dance & movement training who founded Corporate Dance Maven (CDM): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rTLh2vXN_M
Katherine: "Do what interests you, do what inspires you, do what's exciting ... Stay true to what's most ... authentic [for you]... Don't try to make anything more than it is. Know what you enjoy, what you're interested in and what you care about, and people will see that."

 

[Karpenko]

Fair enough. As long as "Also, I do firmly believe that any man that shows up in black pants and a black shirt should be assigned a costume deduction (or lack there of)" is just a manner of speaking and not something you actually firmly believe.



Program Components criteria

Nothing at all about costumes. All about what the skater does on the ice during the program.

You are correct - but it does appear that Max (who didn't skate his best) has a very very long way to go to get anywhere near the high 8's-9's Jason has been getting for PCS with mistakes (by Nationals judges). Or even Nathan-Vincent.. I'd say that it wouldn't be a bad idea to get a new costume, considering the amount of ground he needs to make up on the 2nd score - some judges are snobs and probably share @AngieNikodinovLove opinion. They also probably consider Max a non-artistic skater and you want to leave no stones unturned and leave nothing to use against him.

Thank you Evan Lysacek for starting such a trend, people are turned off of all-black costumes solely because of him. The costume sets the mood for the program, a judge who wants to be a total snot can deduct for it on interpretation or P/E - but say it's for another reason (but it's really the lack of creativity in the costume.). I do think there are plenty of shady ISU/National-level judges in this sport..

I was a bit surprised to see his PCS were low 7's, I don't think his new programs are anything ground-breaking or masterful, but I expected a bit higher with US judges because he's definitely improved. To me he kind of got a wake up call, "you've improved, but you need to improve more if you want to make the Olympic team." I wasn't expecting him to be surpassed in PCS by Tim Dolensky (not by much, but still).. I figured he would have the highest PCS in this field of skaters.

It's not that big a deal, but a new costume wouldn't hurt him IMO. Just for the sake of giving people nothing to use against him later in the season.

 

[aftershocks]

How do we know whether or not what Max wore for his fp is what he'll be wearing all season? I'd put more energy into perfecting the details of executing the program and simply have faith in my costume designer.

 

[misskarne]

How do we know whether or not what Max wore for his fp is what he'll be wearing all season? I'd put more energy into perfecting the details of executing the program and simply have faith in my costume designer.

Well, it won't be, I'd put money on that, because he wore the same costume for both short and long in Philly and it was the Black Swan costume (with flappy waist). And while he often uses old costumes before the new ones are ready he doesn't recycle them for different programs otherwise.

PS: Max designs his own costumes - because he knows how much hate they get and he doesn't want any designer's feelings hurt just because they don't look good on him.

 

[Karpenko]

Um... I think Max would be a dream to work with for many costume designers. he's not un-artistic to look at! Max is kind of hot and could sell a great costume just wearing it.

 

[Tavi]

I was a bit surprised to see his PCS were low 7's, I don't think his new programs are anything ground-breaking or masterful, but I expected a bit higher with US judges because he's definitely improved. To me he kind of got a wake up call, "you've improved, but you need to improve more if you want to make the Olympic team." I wasn't expecting him to be surpassed in PCS by Tim Dolensky (not by much, but still).. I figured he would have the highest PCS in this field of skaters.

Im not sure who was on this panel of judges, but I thought this was supposed to be the international portion of the competition. So maybe some judges were from outside the US.

In any case, the PCS for many of these guys seemed surprisingly low. Alex Johnson's was only about 70 - quite a bit lower than the PCS the top 6 guys received at Junior Worlds.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ Ah, that's so wrong to score Alex Johnson that low. I think most of these judges do not know how to judge performance ability, interpretive skills, and musicality.

Well, it won't be, I'd put money on that

Exactly. That's what I was referencing. Most skaters do not have their new season costumes ready at this point. Thanks for pointing out Max's preference to design his own costumes. He must then have someone help him realize the concept, i.e., do the construction and sewing.

 

[gkelly]

They can judge costumes, actually. Just only if they're so egregiously bad/dangerous/rule breaking, and even then it's only 1 point.

Yes, that's true. Judges can vote to deduct for clothing they consider not to be "modest, dignified and appropriate for athletic competition" particularly violating rules about how much of the body is covered or attached pieces falling off.

The clothing should be "not garish or theatrical in design. Clothing may, however, reflect the character of the music chosen."

So as far as the rules go, simple black clothing or other simple practice clothing, as long as it covers what it needs to cover, would be more in keeping with the clothing rules than theatrical costumes.

In practice, many judges may appreciate costumes that are beautiful, that look like the skater is taking the competition seriously and dressing up for it, and/or that enhance the mood or theme of the program.

But in terms of pleasing judges, it's wiser to err on the side of simplicity, even if a more theatrical costume might be more fun for audiences.

 

[jiejie]

Solid black clothing + guy with good body = What's Not to Like?

 

[el henry]

Im not sure who was on this panel of judges, but I thought this was supposed to be the international portion of the competition. So maybe some judges were from outside the US.

In any case, the PCS for many of these guys seemed surprisingly low. Alex Johnson's was only about 70 - quite a bit lower than the PCS the top 6 guys received at Junior Worlds.

Only because they were introduced theee times do I remember: I think one, or at most two, of the International panel was from the US. Others from Belarus, Japan, Korea, Mexico, Denmark, Canada (I hope I'm not mixing it up with the ladies' panel, but some were on both).

Fun fact: for both the Ladies' SP and the men's LP, someone let the first group of skaters on the ice before the judges were introduced. The announcer had to tell them to clear the ice so we could get the all-important judging panel introductions without distractions

It's August, of course no permanent conclusions can be made, but IMHO Tim and Andrew T. were the class of the field for PCS. Graded on the curve, the judging was good.

 

[Bellanca]

Solid black clothing + guy with good body = What's Not to Like?

I completely agree with this.

I think Max looks great and whenever one of these men choose to wear a simple costume of pants, shirt or t-shirt, etc., I feel that it makes them look extra i.e. Max, Javier, Patrick, etc.

Jeremy Abbott would wear clean-cut, uncluttered costumes or an outfit on many occasions and he always looked really good when he would do that.

If the music selection a skater is skating to demand a particular look, that is one thing, but I still prefer and would choose a ‘less is more’ look to present at any competition instead of 20lbs. of assorted ornamental bric-à-brac glued to or hanging off a costume any day. Ever heard of a "Sharp Dressed Man?"

JMHO...

 

[Dobre]

Taste in fashion is extremely cultural.

 

[BittyBug]

Indeed. Remember the North American uproar over Alexei Urmanov's ruffled shirt outfit? Which was perfect.

 

[SmallFairy]

Um... I think Max would be a dream to work with for many costume designers. he's not un-artistic to look at! Max is kind of hot and could sell a great costume just wearing it.

Kind of indeed Max looks great in his black outfit, that sweater I'd love to see on many men. No one complained about Cipres' outfit last year. (If anyone did, they should go for a check up). It early August. Of course, Max could dress up like this or this. Or maybe this. This? (and just to make that clear, I loved all of these guys and their outfits!!)

 

[SmallFairy]

Indeed. Remember the North American uproar over Alexei Urmanov's ruffled shirt outfit? Which was perfect.

It was!

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Thank you Evan Lysacek for starting such a trend, people are turned off of all-black costumes solely because of him.

LOL, I met Evan drying off his Range Rover in front of my house a few years ago. And yes the black outfits I think started to steamroll since him.

I only have a few pet peeves and any skater (Jason, Evan, John Coughlin, etc) who only wear black pants and a basic black top I feel should get a low score for the IN mark. Its just my opinion and I feel rather strong about it. Unless the music is Paint It Black like the Scimerim's will be doing I just don't get it.

I also would feel the same if a ladies skater was doing Les Mis or Evita or Send In The Clowns and then just showed up anywhere to any competition in a black onesie or unitard.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

LOL

Solid black clothing + guy with good body = What's Not to Like?

..nothing is hotter than a man in a UPS uniform but probably not for an ice skating competition where you are skating to Les Mis.

 

[SmallFairy]

LOL, I met Evan drying off his Range Rover in front of my house a few years ago. And yes the black outfits I think started to steamroll since him.

I only have a few pet peeves and any skater (Jason, Evan, John Coughlin, etc) who only wear black pants and a basic black top I feel should get a low score for the IN mark. Its just my opinion and I feel rather strong about it. Unless the music is Paint It Black like the Scimerim's will be doing I just don't get it.

I also would feel the same if a ladies skater was doing Les Mis or Evita or Send In The Clowns and then just showed up anywhere to any competition in a black onesie or unitard.

I guess it is not the case with Max, but lots of skaters from smaller federations who don't get a lot of funding can't afford more expensive skating outfits. The standard black is the best they can do. Majorov for instance, spoke about this in interviews. No way they should automatically get a love score for IN.

And BTW, I wouldn't want to see anyone in an UPS-uniform either. It's sort of brown greenish, right?

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

And BTW, I wouldn't want to see anyone in an UPS-uniform either. It's sort of brown greenish, right?

LOL, well that what gets me going! More UPS men for me then!!!! lol

Greenish???? not in LA. LOL.

(But if you can get a black outfit with no funding you could also get a red one, or white one, or shorty shorts and spaghetti strap tank top, anything. That is just the point Im trying to make. Didnt matter the funding, if you got a hold of black pants you can get ahold of blue pants too.)

Ok, i put this topic to rest now. Its Monday...gotta get focused for O.C. Housewives tonight.

 

[Dobre]

Indeed. Remember the North American uproar over Alexei Urmanov's ruffled shirt outfit? Which was perfect.

It was ghastly. But that's my North American fashion sense talking. I do remember, and I almost mentioned Urmanov in my post. If the judges were swayed by simple & plain, then a great many close competitions would have swayed the other way. I think it is the audience response that is tempered by costuming, and I don't think there is a whole lot you can do about it. (A number of the Japanese fan posts I've read dislike how "plain" and "boring" most of the North American men's costumes are). Most athletes dress according to the fashion norms of their culture because those are the complaints they will hear/see discussed within their own language. At the elite level, you are going to compete for audiences that appreciate your costuming & for audiences that don't. If everyone hates it, please change. If everyone loves it, enjoy it while it lasts because you have indeed hit upon a rare find & the same will probably not occur with your next costume. In 10-20 years, it will all look dated no matter what you wore.

 

[Sylvia]

Philadelphia Summer International Competition recap article: http://web.icenetwork.com/news/2017/08/07/246985602

Dolensky credits his training partners with helping him push through his intricate free skate, choreographed by Ryan Jahnke to Novo Amor and Ed Tullett's graceful and yearning "Faux." After falling on an opening quadruple salchow -- a jump he landed in warm-ups -- he hit a glorious triple axel-triple toe loop combination, followed by six jumping passes in the program's second half. His spins and steps gained Level 4's, and his only major mistake was doubling an intended triple loop. His 153.84 points, added to his second-place short program score, gave him the win with 229.22 points, more than 12 points over the field.

U.S. men's results in Philadelphia:
1 Timothy Dolensky 229.22 2 1 (153.84 FS)
3 Max Aaron 209.37 3 4 (135.37 FS)
4 Alex Krasnozhon 206.25 1 7 (129.88 FS)
5 Alexander Johnson 203.39 4 6 (130.25 FS)
6 Andrew Torgashev 202.95 10 3 (141.46 FS)
8 Sean Rabbitt 197.65 8 5 (134.99 FS)
10 Jordan Moeller 178.11 9 10 (116.48 FS)
11 Camden Pulkinen 169.59 11 11 (113.02 FS)

Re-posting @marysy's Philadelphia International U.S. Men's SP fan cam videos in placement order:
Krasnozhon (76.37, 1st): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0d6dX6AFboM
Dolensky (75.38, 2nd): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yaiZ6Q7Ojog
Aaron (74.00, 3rd): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmry1KtFnCw
Johnson (73.14, 4th): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYuzMX3pbMM
Rabbitt (62.66): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgeON0s-aWo
Moeller (61.63): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-Bbx4ZLRBo
Torgashev (61.49): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4z0xECzXDk

ETA link to Sean Rabbitt's photo with Max Aaron & Alex Johnson at the Philly comp.: https://www.instagram.com/p/BXb9q5-nNxO/?taken-by=seanrabbitt

 

[cheremary]

US Men FS from Philadelphia:
Andrew Torgashev: https://youtu.be/uhhKh5n9TLg
Sean Rabbitt: https://youtu.be/U5Hia-rRcvM
Timothy Dolensky: https://youtu.be/mGnWdIdkzjU
Max Aaron: https://youtu.be/lHo1mG0qOP8
Alexei Krasnozhon: https://youtu.be/2XMZz-mhMq8
Alex Johnson: https://youtu.be/3vV2tdf-9Xk

non-US men:
Daisuke Murakami: https://youtu.be/_C6NFZpY_YA
June Hyoung Lee: https://youtu.be/XWAwG45cMjY

 

[dr.frog]

Aha! The Bobrin jump IS in Dolensky's FS. It's at about the 3:50 mark in the video linked above. Dolensky doesn't get the near-horizontal air position that Bobrin did, but he's clearly got the "backwards" rotation.

 

[Japanfan]

Indeed. Remember the North American uproar over Alexei Urmanov's ruffled shirt outfit? Which was perfect.

I loved that shirt, including the ruffles!

And on Urmanov, in 1994

I have always said that if the handsome prince on the white horse who rescues the damsel in distress really existed, he would look exactly like Urmanov in that costume.

 

[Lanie]

I just love watching Tim Dolensky skate, and Alex Johnson too... They have such a lovely quality about their skating that's rare.

 

[Kecasyl]

I just love watching Tim Dolensky skate, and Alex Johnson too... They have such a lovely quality about their skating that's rare.

Artistry! A lost art!

 

[skatfan]

Max's new programs are looking wonderful. You can really see all the hard work he's done coming to life. His spins are better, his turns are better, his steps are better, his overall movement is better, his programs have an energy about them. God, if they don't recognise it this year at US Nats...

And the jumps are there. He was credited with two rotated quads in the short and three in the long and the intended fourth was popped to 3S. And that's in August. He's looking better now than he did in October last year. Come on, Max. Blitz this season and show everyone you're not done yet.

I loved the SP on Max. This time it seems as though it is all coming together. I see a mature skater who looks comfortable in his choreography!

 

[SkateFanBerlin]

Artistry! A lost art!

Everyone knows this Tim D. skate from 2015? No quad but so musical and beautiful to watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TcHH8eiZrpw

 

[dinakt]

Though I question "Roxanne" for a 16 year old (in theory), Torgashev takes no prisoners with that LP. Fabulous drama and skating skills.

 

[acraven]

Torgashev is a precocious interpreter of music. Was it "Parisian Walkways" he skated to when he was 12 or 13? Perhaps it comes from having a mother/coach who was a Russian ice dancer.