U.S. Ice Dance 2022-23 news & updates

[gkelly]

Would you say it'd improve their artistic merit? Or maybe touring with the American Ice Theatre would?

AIT is not a touring company.

Performance Company | American Ice Theatre

American Ice Theatre offers contemporary and artistic ensemble skating performances in our satellite locations.

americanicetheatre.org

Each AIT satellite location has a skating performance company — a group of figure skating artists who rehearse, perform at shows and events, and lead local seminars.

For competitive skaters in any discipline who live in or near one of the locations participating in a performance group would surely be helpful in developing artistry, especially at developmental levels. The time commitments might not mesh well with active training.

There are also opportunities for shorter seminars at other locations.

Working with other ice theatre companies such as Ice Theatre of New York or Next Ice Age could similarly be useful.

But the same caveats apply.

Some competitive ice dancers have worked with these companies after finishing their competitive careers (as have singles skaters) or when between partners, or as guest performers bringing their existing skills to performance.

Other performers were not high-level competitors but chose to focus on artistic skating earlier on because that's where their interests and/or talents were stronger.

I see that Oona and Gage Brown are listed as Young Apprentices on the ITNY site.

What might be more useful would be to establish cross-pollination between AIT-trained or other professional ice theatre company choreographers and coaches/choreographers working with competitive teams. There probably already is some.

 

[Dobre]

If he had not competed at Golden Spin, would USFS have any claim on him b/c of JW gold from three seasons ago???

Name an athlete that has medaled at Junior Worlds that has done so. My recollection is that Ponomarenko was told he could not do it. (Am I doing the wrong math there & it was a year less than that?) Min & Eaton sat out a year longer than people expected.

At any rate, Zingas & Kolesnik are competing here and they may be successful here. But whenever athletes change federations, it is also wise to look at the whole picture. (I figure Kolesnik wants to have a career in the sport. The U.S. can be a good place for that. USFS sends out a lot of teams if those teams can earn the required scores. I also figure he wants to skate at an Olympic Games. If I were him, it would be one of my goals. The U.S. is a tough place for that. None of us know, at this point in time, what will be doable in 7 years. We don't know what will be doable in 3, but the picture is less fuzzy).

People treat it like it was a game of trading cards.

In ice dance, I think it is treated like a serious asset in a job application.

Wouldn’t the easiest option in terms of room at the top have been Cyprus? Their K/K team didn’t do that well this year, Emilea had citizenship and it’s very easy for Russians and Ukrainians to get it, Cyprus is like their Cayman Islands for stashing bank accounts and real estate.

Would it? (I would think the answer is yes, but I don't actually know enough about the rules for acquiring citizenship there to be sure. I think I asked about the particulars on this before, but no one answered? My understanding is that it's easy to acquire citizenship there for people who can afford to purchase land there. Would it then be easy for someone skating with someone else who is now a citizen to get citizenship? Do both halves of Kudryatseva & Karankevich have citizenship? Or only her?)

 

[BlueRidge]

In ice dance, I think it is treated like a serious asset in a job application.

by "people" I meant fans, not skaters. sorry that wasn't clear.

Like partner swapping ideas fans are a bit cavalier about the ideas of switching countries. Its a lot more serious for the skaters.

I think its odd for people to be talking about Kolesnik and country-changing. He seems to me to have one of the brightest futures of US dancers. Why would he leave?

 

[Dobre]

Yes. But if you were a dance team considering a federation switch to another country with less competition, then it would be wise to look around & note who else could do the same. I do think teams--and dance coaches--do this.

 

[Debbie S]

I don't know if funding from USFS is an issue at this point for C/Y. I don't believe their int'l results this season qualify them for a team envelope (they could be put in the Reserve team but I don't think there's funding with that?) so they may not have that much to lose financially by switching to Ukraine, and they would likely get more int'l assignments which could lead to more prize money.

I’d like some market research on cities with enthusiasm for dance performances, from modern to ballet, and coming up with a new marketing campaign by buying those lists and targeting those audiences. There’s ways to promote dance specifically, outside the usual skating audience, but I’ve never seen USFS think out of the box about what has become our strongest discipline.

Interesting idea. But I don't know if ballet or modern dance fans would find much crossover with ice dance. While ice dancers take ballet lessons, there's not a lot of ballet in current programs. Modern might be closer but modern dance movement in ice dance choreo looks very different than what those audiences see on the floor. And there would need to be an effort to educate those audiences on how programs are judged so they can understand what they are watching.

The biggest obstacle to promoting ice dance, IMO, is that it's almost never on network TV. In the GP broadcasts, NBC maybe showed one FD in between the men and women. For the past few years, dance at Nats has only been on cable networks. Peacock requires a subscription and no longer makes coverage available on demand. I agree that there is much to promote about ice dance and USFS could certainly tap into new audiences, but they first need to get the sport watchable for the masses.

 

[ice coverage]

Name an athlete that has medaled at Junior Worlds that has done so. My recollection is that Ponomarenko was told he could not do it. (Am I doing the wrong math there & it was a year less than that?) Min & Eaton sat out a year longer than people expected. ...

Thanks for your reply.
Your mention of Min/Eaton is food for thought. I wonder whether it made any difference that after JW medals, Daniel also had represented the U.S. internationally as a senior?
As for Ponomarenko: Not saying that it did not happen, but my fallible brain does not recall that Anthony requested release from the U.S.

In any case, I think it's impossible to know definitively whether or not Vadym requested release from the U.S., and whether or not USFS told him it would not release him.

... I think its odd for people to be talking about Kolesnik and country-changing. He seems to me to have one of the brightest futures of US dancers. Why would he leave?

 

[VGThuy]

by "people" I meant fans, not skaters. sorry that wasn't clear.

Like partner swapping ideas fans are a bit cavalier about the ideas of switching countries. Its a lot more serious for the skaters.

I think its odd for people to be talking about Kolesnik and country-changing. He seems to me to have one of the brightest futures of US dancers. Why would he leave?

I agree. I get wondering about this when there are teams where this might be an option and, yes, there are some ice dancers who might have done this, but I don’t think this is such a casual choice as fans make it out to be.

One weird example was when some people suggested that the Shibs represent Japan when it looked like they might get passed over or not ever reach the no. 1 US position. As proud as they are of their family heritage, they were very American in every way and unlike other teams when this was suggested, they were not born in nor had lived in Japan. That suggestion for them actually weirded me out.

 

[PRlady]

I agree. I get wondering about this when there are teams where this might be an option and, yes, there are some ice dancers who might have done this, but I don’t think this is such a casual choice as fans make it out to be.

One weird example was when some people suggested that the Shibs represent Japan when it looked like they might get passed over or not ever reach the no. 1 US position. As proud as they are of their family heritage, they were very American in every way and unlike other teams when this was suggested, they were not born in nor had lived in Japan. That suggestion for them actually weirded me out.

Especially because Japan is an either/or country. Giving up US citizenship is no small thing.

 

[Dobre]

No one is suggesting that Zingas & Kolesnik should switch countries.

It was suggested that Cesanek & Yehorov might, and a couple of us simply pointed out that it would not be a straightforward scenario of earning berths at major international events. Though it could, quite plausibly, give them a real shot of doing so. (Still, the timing would seem strange).

Thanks for your reply.
Your mention of Min/Eaton is food for thought. I wonder whether it made any difference that after JW medals, Daniel also had represented the U.S. internationally as a senior?

Daniel had a 4CC medal as well. As best I can tell, both a Junior Worlds medal and a 4CC medal put athletes into a higher tier that makes earning a release from USFS a longer proposition. (But as far as I can tell, it's an either/or situation. Not a one or the other).

As for Ponomarenko: Not saying that it did not happen, but my fallible brain does not recall that Anthony requested release from the U.S.

I don't think he did; but my recollection is that they had clarification about the potential timeline after learning that she could not get expedited citizenship. Someone posted the actual year or season when he could acquire it & they would not have been able to compete for Canada until after the Olympics, obviously. If I thought that I could accurately search for that post, I would because it might give us a pretty good/up-to-date timeline.

In any case, I think it's impossible to know definitively whether or not Vadym requested release from the U.S., and whether or not USFS told him it would not release him.

It's impossible, but the discussion here said that he went to Russia & was going to skate with someone and then he didn't. As with C&P, I'd assume he looked into his options and potential timeline. Whether or not that is the reason the rumored partnership didn't materialize, of course, is impossible to know.

 

[ice coverage]

... It's impossible, but the discussion here said that he went to Russia & was going to skate with someone and then he didn't. As with C&P, I'd assume he looked into his options and potential timeline. Whether or not that is the reason the rumored partnership didn't materialize, of course, is impossible to know.

For me, there is another way of looking at Vadym's trip to Russia.
I'm speculating, but you're speculating too.
A possible scenario would be that before his trip to Russia, he had checked with USFS about his potential timeline ... and that he did not proceed with his trip until after getting word from USFS that it would be willing to release him without undue delay ... and then something completely unrelated to release was the reason that the rumored partnership did not materialize.

And with that thought, I think I'm ready to move on from this topic.

 

[clairecloutier]

I believe that USFS pays travel, accommodations, and entrance fees for U.S. skaters assigned to any international competitions, right? (Although I know that the senior GP hosting federations do cover travel for those events.)

Do we know if smaller federations such as Ukraine or Cyprus typically cover these costs? Because that could potentially factor into the decision to switch countries.

 

[Trillian]

It's not that the U.S. lacks domestic competitions outside of Nats.
It's that U.S. dance couples with multiple GP/Challenger assignments choose not to include domestic competitions other than Nats on their individual calendars. Which is understandable, I think.

True. What I really should have said is: I believe that with the right kind of promotion to a mainstream audience, and with incentive for the top teams to participate, there would be a market for more high level domestic dance events. And that could potentially provide opportunities for teams who aren’t quite at the Worlds level to grow a fan base, etc.

The biggest obstacle to promoting ice dance, IMO, is that it's almost never on network TV. In the GP broadcasts, NBC maybe showed one FD in between the men and women. For the past few years, dance at Nats has only been on cable networks. Peacock requires a subscription and no longer makes coverage available on demand. I agree that there is much to promote about ice dance and USFS could certainly tap into new audiences, but they first need to get the sport watchable for the masses.

To be perfectly honest, when it comes to trying to reach new audiences or increase mainstream visibility for U.S. dance, I think network TV is pretty irrelevant. Set up all 15(?) senior dance teams who qualified for nationals with official Tik Tok channels and have them compete virtually or something. I don’t know, it’s not my area of expertise. All I know is that the “let’s get some footage of Chock and Bates walking their dogs and use that to fill eight of the seventeen (17) minutes a dying TV network has allotted us for ice dance coverage this season on the off chance there are any potential new fans in the 65+ demographic who won’t be immediately turned off by the Billie Eilish program that follows” strategy is more and more baffling with each passing season.

 

[Sylvia]

I believe that USFS pays travel, accommodations, and entrance fees for U.S. skaters assigned to any international competitions, right? (Although I know that the senior GP hosting federations do cover travel for those events.)

Yes and for the assigned skaters' respective coaches.

 

[kwanfan1818]

One weird example was when some people suggested that the Shibs represent Japan when it looked like they might get passed over or not ever reach the no. 1 US position. As proud as they are of their family heritage, they were very American in every way and unlike other teams when this was suggested, they were not born in nor had lived in Japan. That suggestion for them actually weirded me out.

The same was true of Cathy and Chris Reed: born in Michigan, never lived in Japan, and grew up in NJ; they were contemporaries of the Shibutanis, if they competed at different levels. They started to compete for Japan in 2006-7, when she was 19, and she chose Japanese citizenship, although I'm not sure if she and/or her brother waited until she was 22.

I don't think it was unreasonable for people to wonder whether the Shibutanis would make the same choice.

 

[Debbie S]

To be perfectly honest, when it comes to trying to reach new audiences or increase mainstream visibility for U.S. dance, I think network TV is pretty irrelevant.

That's a valid point, but in order to get people to watch, it needs to be somewhere they can find it. Maybe put the comp on YouTube afterward (or simulcast). NBC currently won't allow that, but they've seen when they've posted specific programs, they have the potential to catch on and rack up the views (D/W's Bollywood OD, Jason's Riverdance). If the only way to watch is by paying for a streaming service and needing to be at the computer/TV at the exact broadcast time, no one is going to tune in (well, except us diehards).

There is a lot more USFS should be doing to reach new audiences via social (although not sure TikTok is the right channel ) but their strategy seems to be geared to those already watching/current fans. They could have done a lot more with Ilia's 4A, for example. They could use social to show off the skater's personalities (no fluff pieces during comps!) but instead we get the silly games they film at Champs Camp to play on the Jumbotron at SA and Nats.

 

[tony]

That's a valid point, but in order to get people to watch, it needs to be somewhere they can find it. Maybe put the comp on YouTube afterward (or simulcast). NBC currently won't allow that, but they've seen when they've posted specific programs, they have the potential to catch on and rack up the views (D/W's Bollywood OD, Jason's Riverdance). If the only way to watch is by paying for a streaming service and needing to be at the computer/TV at the exact broadcast time, no one is going to tune in (well, except us diehards).

There is a lot more USFS should be doing to reach new audiences via social (although not sure TikTok is the right channel ) but their strategy seems to be geared to those already watching/current fans. They could have done a lot more with Ilia's 4A, for example. They could use social to show off the skater's personalities (no fluff pieces during comps!) but instead we get the silly games they film at Champs Camp to play on the Jumbotron at SA and Nats.

If the USFS wants to reach teens and young adults, TikTok is 100% the way to go, and then Instagram to a little lesser extent. But a lot of the material that both the USFS and ISU put out, in my opinion, is borderline cringe or not interesting at all. The skaters themselves do an infinitely better job of making the sport seem interesting. The ISU is living in a previous decade in many ways, but the website and the social media content/team really need to be stepped up.

Network TV isn't going to be beneficial for most of the target/new audience, and I don't even think full programs need to be plastered on social media to grab the attention of new fans. Highlight clips have sent skaters like Elladj Balde and Amber Glenn into social media stardom, and those who truly want to get into the sport can seek out the ways to do so. But more often than not, they probably want the exhibition-type skating to top 20 music and not the stuffy rules that even most people on FSU don't bother with learning.

Having said all of that, skating around the world is much bigger now than it was in the US golden years, so the people who do want to follow hardcore will likely find the means to do so. I did it when I was 6 or 7-- eagerly looked in the Sunday newspaper TV listings each week to figure out how much skating was on the next weekend, started setting my VCR for each and every event a few years later, etc. It was a lot harder than doing a Google search and getting an entire season schedule instantly A lot of the target audience has Netflix and probably Hulu or HBOMax, too, and they live with just streaming the content and no cable. The hardcores will either invest in Peacock or read really closely into their fandom and see the VPN is the way to go.

 

[Trillian]

That's a valid point, but in order to get people to watch, it needs to be somewhere they can find it. Maybe put the comp on YouTube afterward (or simulcast).

I don’t think there’s a lot they can do about existing competitions, especially now that Peacock isn’t archiving the streams. Creating some kind of new or additional content seems like a better strategy to me. I agree with you that one way or another, the current options for watching skating are a huge issue.

There is a lot more USFS should be doing to reach new audiences via social (although not sure TikTok is the right channel ) but their strategy seems to be geared to those already watching/current fans.

This is really the crux of the problem. I’m not a TikTok fan personally, but it seems to be the best vehicle right now to build an audience for pop culture personalities, which is really what USFS needs to do more if they want to expand their audience. A few skaters have managed to do pretty well on social media, so there are templates. Social media as a vehicle for conveying the teams’ styles, personalities, backstories, relationships, etc, could pull in new fans who might be willing to watch skating events in other contexts, like live shows/competitions or … on the 27th most popular streaming service at three in the morning.

 

[VGThuy]

The same was true of Cathy and Chris Reed: born in Michigan, never lived in Japan, and grew up in NJ; they were contemporaries of the Shibutanis, if they competed at different levels. They started to compete for Japan in 2006-7, when she was 19, and she chose Japanese citizenship, although I'm not sure if she and/or her brother waited until she was 22.

I don't think it was unreasonable for people to wonder whether the Shibutanis would make the same choice.

Like I said, I know other teams did it and I thought about the Reeds. However, I think it was weird that some fans were pushing for it so vocally like it was normal and were kind of as Blueridge put it “cavalier” about it. It’s not as if the Reeds were the norm and it’s not as if the Shibs themselves indicated they were going to represent any other country. And it was weird that despite their dry spell after medaling in all their GPs, Nationals, 4CC, and Worlds in their first season as seniors, they were still medaling at Nationals, vying for medals on the GP circuit, and making it to Worlds every season placing in the mid top ten. They weren’t a team that split up and had a partner born someplace else as an option, nor were they a team who has no chance of getting international assignments and making the world team when that talk was happening. So what was the point of it all? That if they sat one year out and became Japan no. 1, their international results would get better?

As an Asian-American, it kind of triggered some messages about what and who Americans were and looked like and kind of seemed like “American beats Kwan” again. Oh, Maia and Alex are of Japanese descent, they can just just skate for Japan and give up their American citizenship because they aren’t that American anyway…unlike other teams they could make room for at Nationals.

Anyway, they later revealed they received funding from American sports foundations while training, would later do videos for the USOC, are on the LA Olympic committee, become diplomatic envoys for the US State Department in two administrations, and are publishing a book about Asian-American role models. Yeah that’s in hindsight, but fans who watched them knew that was their attitude all along so the Japan talk relating to them seemed out-of-the-blue to me.

 

[kwanfan1818]

Oh, Maia and Alex are of Japanese descent, they can just just skate for Japan and give up their American citizenship because they aren’t that American anyway…unlike other teams they could make room for at Nationals.

Just like any other skaters who have the choice of what country to represent and have chosen to represent the country of their non-major Federation citizenships they were born with in order to have more opportunities to compete, which would have been their right. It's not like they were shopping for other citizenships. It's not really that hard.

I was glad they chose to compete for the US, because they were that good, and, after the Reeds switched, I thought they might, too. If the Japanese Fed was funding dancers, they might very well have competed for Japan, but Mama Reed complained bitterly and publicly that after her kids switched, the Japanese Fed wasn't interested in funding them at all. (I might have checked beforehand, but, hey.) I don't know what their funding model was for singles at the time, so they might not have been funding anyone.

 

[dancefan17]

Is it possible C/Y are just sitting out the rest of this season to further recover from her surgery? It’s been a hard season for them.

 

[VGThuy]

Just like any other skaters who have the choice of what country to represent and have chosen to represent the country of their non-major Federation citizenships they were born with in order to have more opportunities to compete, which would have been their right. It's not like they were shopping for other citizenships. It's not really that hard.

I was glad they chose to compete for the US, because they were that good, and, after the Reeds switched, I thought they might, too. If the Japanese Fed was funding dancers, they might very well have competed for Japan, but Mama Reed complained bitterly and publicly that after her kids switched, the Japanese Fed wasn't interested in funding them at all. (I might have checked beforehand, but, hey.) I don't know what their funding model was for singles at the time, so they might not have been funding anyone.

And part of my point, what opportunities were the Shibs missing out on when some posters were making their recommendations that the Shibs compete for Japan? You say it was a reasonable or at least not unreasonable thought, but looking at the facts and details surrounding the Shibs' competitive career, I'd have to disagree with the notion that the suggestion was a "reasonable" one.

 

[kwanfan1818]

And part of my point, what opportunities were the Shibs missing out on when some posters were making their recommendations that the Shibs compete for Japan? You say it was a reasonable or at least not unreasonable thought, but looking at the facts and details surrounding the Shibs' competitive career, I'd have to disagree with the notion that the suggestion was a "reasonable" one.

It would have been a guaranteed spot at all of the championships, and, presumably, permission to attend any internationals they were willing to fund themselves.

Early in their career, US first and second were a lock with Belbin/Agosto and Davis/White, they were always behind Davis/White and Virtue/Moir at their rink when all three teams were there, and just as they should have been taking their place, after their 2011 Worlds bronze, they were dumped the following year, then surpassed by Chock/Bates for a couple of years before earning Worlds bronze in 2017, and weren't that far ahead of Hubbell and Donohue at the 2018 Olympics.

While they won a well-deserved bronze at those Olympics, it didn't look like USFS was that enthusiastic, and Zoueva's politik was dropping after Sochi, and that bronze was not a given, even if a happy ending.

I think they ultimately made the right choice, but they had to have nerves of steel not to second-guess their choice.

 

[tony]

It would have been a guaranteed spot at all of the championships, and, presumably, permission to attend any internationals they were willing to fund themselves.

Early in their career, US first and second were a lock with Belbin/Agosto and Davis/White, they were always behind Davis/White and Virtue/Moir at their rink when all three teams were there, and just as they should have been taking their place, after their 2011 Worlds bronze, they were dumped the following year, then surpassed by Chock/Bates for a couple of years before earning Worlds bronze in 2017, and weren't that far ahead of Hubbell and Donohue at the 2018 Olympics.

While they won a well-deserved bronze at those Olympics, it didn't look like USFS was that enthusiastic, and Zoueva's politik was dropping after Sochi, and that bronze was not a given, even if a happy ending.

I think they ultimately made the right choice, but they had to have nerves of steel not to second-guess their choice.

I don't disagree with a lot of this, but they were 2nd at 2016 Worlds and that season is where they really reshaped their career trajectory.

 

[ice coverage]

Molly Cesanek and Yegor Yegorov's message on Instagram a few minutes ago:

Thank you to those who have reached out to us, it means so much. As some of you have noticed, we do not appear on the US Figure Skating Championship groupings. Together, we made a decision and withdrew from the upcoming US Championships due to personal reasons. Much that has happened this year especially for Yegor and his family has impacted and affected us both. We will miss performing this year at Nationals very much. Thank you again for all your support, and we look forward to continuing sharing our journey with you all! ​

Love, Molly and Yehor​

​

Molly Cesanek on Instagram: "Thank you to those who have reached out to us, it means so much. As some of you have noticed, we do not appear on the US Figure Skating Championship groupings. Together, we made a decision and withdrew from the upcoming U

506 likes, 30 comments - mollycesanek on December 19, 2022: "Thank you to those who have reached out to us, it means so much. As some of you have noticed, we do not appear on the US Figure Skating Championship groupings. Together, we made a decision and withdrew from the upcoming US...

www.instagram.com

 

[jlai]

Re Shibs it reminds me of my own “do I stick it out or do I switch employers?” In Shib’s case their early success made switching difficult.

 

[VGThuy]

It would have been a guaranteed spot at all of the championships, and, presumably, permission to attend any internationals they were willing to fund themselves.

Early in their career, US first and second were a lock with Belbin/Agosto and Davis/White, they were always behind Davis/White and Virtue/Moir at their rink when all three teams were there, and just as they should have been taking their place, after their 2011 Worlds bronze, they were dumped the following year, then surpassed by Chock/Bates for a couple of years before earning Worlds bronze in 2017, and weren't that far ahead of Hubbell and Donohue at the 2018 Olympics.

While they won a well-deserved bronze at those Olympics, it didn't look like USFS was that enthusiastic, and Zoueva's politik was dropping after Sochi, and that bronze was not a given, even if a happy ending.

I think they ultimately made the right choice, but they had to have nerves of steel not to second-guess their choice.

I promise I'm not being argumentative nor do I have any interest in turning this into a never-ending discussion. I just want to say one last time that I am actually genuinely confused with this particular situation and don't get how any of the above would have gotten better had they represented Japan...if not got worse by going to a Fed with no strong ice dance history and as you said, with the Reeds not having the most fed support with them.

First, the Shibs won Nationals at almost every level with the exception being the first, Juvenile level back in 2005. They competed at juniors, won the junior title in 2010, and made two World Junior teams and won a silver in 2009 and placed 4th in 2010. Then the Shibs made their senior debut in the 2010-2011 season after Belbin/Agosto retired and medaled at every competition they entered with the exception of the early Challenger event, Nebelhorn (where they placed 2nd in the FD) including 4CC and Worlds, so there was no issue with them not receiving assignments or USFS support, which is a strong fed to have on your side.

Ok, so to be fair, most of that talk of them switching was happening in the 2012-2015 period, but even then they were getting all the international assignments including qualifying for two GPFs, all the 4CC and Worlds, and the Olympics, and I believe as a top 2-3 ice dance during this period they weren't lacking in USFS support.

Even if you think the Shibs lost some ground (after gaining some ground) moving towards Pyeongchang, and had to compete more domestically than they would have if they skated for Japan, they were still actual medal contenders and shared every international podium with V/M and P/C from 2016-17 GPF to the 2018 Olympics. Internationally, no matter what country they skated for, Hubbell/Donohue and Chock/Bates as well as Weaver/Poje, Bobrova/Soloviev, Weaver/Poje, Cappellini Lanotte, Gilles/Poirier, Coomes/Buckland, Ilinyk/Katsalapov and then Ilinyk/Zhignanshin and Sinitsina/Katsalapov, Paul/Islam and Monko/Khaliavin (earlier on and were rivals during their junior days), etc. were always going to be there competing and being contenders/spoilers for medals during this period.

As for Zoueva...the Reeds and Muramoto/Reed still trained with her so it's not like that was going to change had they represented Japan. The Shibs could have left Zoueva anytime they wanted but decided to stay with her.

With all the above, I just don't get why some vocal fans were thinking they should have competed for Japan because they had every opportunity top World competitors were getting throughout their entire senior career.

That on top of other things that showed just how devoted the Shibs were in identifying that they were proud Asian-Americans (being athlete ambassadors for the U.S. State Department in 2012 and then diplomatic envoys after 2016) make it to me all the more strange why there were as many posters as they were saying they should skate for Japan. I know this part tends to be ignored as is the storied history of children of immigrants having experiences of their "Americaness" is questioned, which is actually a big deal to many in the Asian-American community as is my personal experience and one I learned many of us shared when I discuss these things in AAPI circles, I personally found it all strange and more complicated than just seeing this as a situation where a team who may not have gotten assignments or opportunities just to compete internationally having an opportunity to do so by taking advantage of the citizenship of one partner or both. Especially when the Shibs had such a career representing Team USA from as early and as continually as they did.

I know we skating fans can sometimes get conditioned to seeing this as normal (even though the vast majority of skaters don't do this) but I do think this is not something to be taken lightly in all cases, especially when Japan, unlike other countries that allow dual citizenship, requires renouncement of your initial citizenship and this will affect the skaters for the rest of their lives.

 

[kwanfan1818]

I saw much more wondering if the Shibs would compete for Japan for the exact same reason that we wonder if anyone with multiple citizenships will switch, going back to before you were born -- one example is de Leeuw from the '70's, a formidable opponent to to Hamill -- ie, the built-in opportunity to compete automatically in everything. And that's with the added recognition that they would be forced to give up one of their citizenships, a huge decision that impacts them in the long term. And if you think Americaness being questioned is unique to the Shibutanis, deLeeuw's was, because she was competitive with US skaters, yet she took the "easy" way out, but when less than competitive, the "That fourth/fifth/sixth US skater/team in this competition" narrative is persistent, no matter what passport the skater holds, even if the skater is fluent in the language, spent summers in the country they represent until training made that impossible, and has strong family and cultural ties there.

 

[Sylvia]

Fan Zone article Wolfkostin/Chen by @clairecloutier (Dec. 26):

Wolfkostin and Chen Finding Their Niche in the Senior Ranks - U.S. Figure Skating Fan Zone

For Katarina Wolfkostin and Jeffrey Chen, this season is all about trying new approaches as they move into the senior ice dance ranks.

usfigureskatingfanzone.com

Excerpt:

Combining skating and college is another learning curve this season. Wolfkostin is a freshman at University of Michigan's School of Kinesiology, majoring in applied exercise science. Chen is a sophomore, pursuing a degree in computer science. Both currently attend part-time.
"It's a huge challenge, if I'm being completely honest. It's hard," Chen said candidly. "But we make it work. It helps when we have accommodating professors. And it's not only balancing skating and school. That can't just be our whole lives – skating and school. We're human; we need other things, like taking care of our physical and emotional sides."

 

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IDC's Matteo Morelli "met with [Christina & Anthony] after Grand Prix of Espoo in Finland, and talked about how they found each other, their career as junior and senior competitors, and their recent change of coaches and team" (Dec. 27):

Carreira & Ponomarenko reflect on their journey so far – Ice-dance.com

www.ice-dance.com

AP: I had a pretty big surgery in February, it was a unique off-season for us. It was difficult for us to stop right away. I worked a lot on the mental side of things, with a psychologist and a performance specialist. I came back very slowly, improved the muscles and worked on what I needed to work on. They say that when one partner has a surgery, the team is recovering. I am really proud to have Christina as a partner, she worked very hard when I was gone and drove all the way to London, Ontario, every day to put the work in.

 

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Article by Lois Elfman on Kristina Bland & Matthew Sperry who placed 10th in their JGP debut in Gdansk POL (Solidarity Cup) and 6th in the Ice Dance Final in November (Dec. 22):

Bland and Sperry aim for strong skating performances

Like many students at the University of Michigan, Kristina Bland and Matthew Sperry are exhaling after finishing their exams for the fall semester.

amsterdamnews.com

Like many students at the University of Michigan, Kristina Bland and Matthew Sperry are exhaling after finishing their exams for the fall semester. Unlike other college students, they’re not heading off on vacation. Bland, 18, and Sperry, 20, are an ice dance team and will compete at the 2023 U.S. Figure Skating Championships that will take place in San Jose, California, in January.

“We’re focusing on polishing our programs and doing nitty gritty work, focusing on the details,” said Sperry. “Making sure the synchronicity is on point.”