The 2021 Athletics Thread

[allezfred]

Let’s put it this way:

Would you think it okay for let’s say a male pairs skater to be under the influence of marijuana during a skating event?

 

[canbelto]

Let’s put it this way:

Would you think it okay for let’s say a male pairs skater to be under the influence of marijuana during a skating event?

Stop legislating morality.
You sound like those old "Reefer Scare" educational films.

 

[Karen-W]

Let’s put it this way:

Would you think it okay for let’s say a male pairs skater to be under the influence of marijuana during a skating event?

Stop legislating morality.
You sound like those old "Reefer Scare" educational films.

Are you for real?! Or maybe you be just fine as the female pairs skater partnered with the male pairs skater who is under the influence of marijuana during a skating event...

 

[canbelto]

Are you for real?! Or maybe you be just fine as the female pairs skater partnered with the male pairs skater who is under the influence of marijuana during a skating event...

I'd rather someone be high rather than drunk. I can do most everything high. I can't do anything drunk.

 

[Karen-W]

I'd rather someone be high rather than drunk. I can do most everything high. I can't do anything drunk.

But can you be certain that your partner would be as functional high as you are?

 

[allezfred]

Stop legislating morality.
You sound like those old "Reefer Scare" educational films.

Would you feel safe being lifted by someone under the influence of marijuana given that we know it would impair their reaction time?

 

[Theatregirl1122]

Let’s put it this way:

Would you think it okay for let’s say a male pairs skater to be under the influence of marijuana during a skating event?

The test doesn’t detect if you’re under the influence during the event though. It tests if you’ve used it for weeks beforehand. Additionally, individual sports can ban things that aren’t banned by WADA as a whole.

Alcohol is most certainly also banned in-competition.

I think if she’d tested positive for marijuana on an out-of-competition test, it would have been fine. It’s that it showed up in a test taken at a competition that goes against WADA rules.

What source do you have for this? Alcohol is not listed as a banned substance on the WADA banned substance list.

Prohibited List Q&A

www.wada-ama.org

Individual sports may ban alcohol but it is not banned by WADA

 

[allezfred]

Now I am seeing an American media outlet claim she is the fastest woman alive.

Shelly-Ann Fraser-Pryce from Jamaica would like to have a word about that.

 

[canbelto]

Would you feel safe being lifted by someone under the influence of marijuana given that we know it would impair their reaction time?

Yes I would. Being high doesn't do shit other than make me hungry and relaxed. Being drunk knocks me out.
Let me guess: you've never smoked before. You have no idea beyond "Reefer Madness" movies what it's actually like.

 

[allezfred]

Yes I would. Being high doesn't do shit other than make me hungry and relaxed. Being drunk knocks me out.
Let me guess: you've never smoked before. You have no idea beyond "Reefer Madness" movies what it's actually like.

I have never seen a “Reefer Madness movie” and it might be worthwhile for you to consider that a global anti-doping body is not making decisions based solely on an American perspective.

Personally I would prefer not to be lifted by someone drunk or high on marijuana, but you clearly have impaired sense of risk which explains a lot.

But anyway, no one is coming to take your marijuana. It just means you cannot run in the Olympics.

 

[canbelto]

I have never seen a “Reefer Madness movie” and it might be worthwhile for you to consider that a global anti-doping body is not making decisions based solely on an American perspective.

Personally I would prefer not to be lifted by someone drunk or high on marijuana, but you clearly have impaired sense of risk which explains a lot.

But anyway, no one is coming to take your marijuana. It just means you cannot run in the Olympics.

Read this article. It documents how the WADA"s drug policy ARE based on the American, racist perspective of marijuana:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/olympics/2021/07/03/shacarri-richardson-marijuana-olympics-doping-ban/

And this:

Opinion | Weed shouldn't keep Sha'Carri Richardson from the Olympics

The Tokyo Olympics would be lessened without Richardson's presence on the track.

www.msnbc.com

Also, read up about the Rockefeller drug laws. They imprisoned and ruined the lives of so many low-level drug offenders.

Then you can whitesplain to me about how this isn't racist.

 

[aka_gerbil]

The test doesn’t detect if you’re under the influence during the event though. It tests if you’ve used it for weeks beforehand. Additionally, individual sports can ban things that aren’t banned by WADA as a whole.



What source do you have for this? Alcohol is not listed as a banned substance on the WADA banned substance list.

Prohibited List Q&A

www.wada-ama.org

Individual sports may ban alcohol but it is not banned by WADA

I just looked it up and it was removed from the banned list by WADA in 2018, although the shooting sports and archery still don’t allow it.

I’d argue that it should not be allowed in competition nor should any drug that impairs judgement, awareness, and reaction time in field of play. One example: figure skating warm ups or practice groups with multiple teams/skaters on the ice in competition. Having someone who’s drunk/high or otherwise impaired from substance consumption is going to be a safety risk to everyone else out there.

 

[Theatregirl1122]

That seems reasonable, but it’s not what exists. What exists is no ban on alcohol even in competition and a ban on marijuana that effectively bans it for weeks in advance.

 

[aka_gerbil]

That seems reasonable, but it’s not what exists. What exists is no ban on alcohol even in competition and a ban on marijuana that effectively bans it for weeks in advance.

I do get what your saying—and my solution if I was in charge would be not to take marijuana off the list but put alcohol back on. Maybe, too, have a discussion about permissible levels and thresholds to distinguish between use a few weeks before and actually using at a competition.

That said, even if there needs to be a discussion about the rules and if they should be changed, the athlete in question knew she was bound to follow the current WADA rules as they are and as they apply to every elite level athlete across the globe. She didn’t, there were consequences, and she herself as said she knew she wasn’t supposed to do it, did it any way, and takes responsibility for her mistake.

 

[canbelto]

That seems reasonable, but it’s not what exists. What exists is no ban on alcohol even in competition and a ban on marijuana that effectively bans it for weeks in advance.

Also drug testing is actually an ineffective way to catch dopers.
Many famous dopers never had a positive drug test. Marion Jones, Lance Armstrong, the baseball players. It's more effective to catch doctors, trainers, and labs that produce the chemicals.

 

[ilovepaydays]

Right, but I guess my question is what does whether or not it's legal have to do with it if it's not performance enhancing? The legality/morality/etc of weed shouldn't really come into it when what is supposed to be controlled here is performance enhancing drugs. The reason that athletes are tested all the time is to see if they are using performance enhancing drugs, not because the public has the right to constant autocratic control over the bodies and lives of athletes.

I agree that people know what they are getting themselves into right now. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't push back that WADA should only have the right to control performance enhancing drugs. That is their only mandate as an organization. They are the World Anti-Doping Agency. Weed is not doping. It has no performance enhancing benefits.

I’ve done some reading on this since this story broke - It seems that one of the main reasons marijuana is banned in competition testing because it’s affects could be unfair as a “calming agent” - especially if you have an athlete who gets super anxious/hyped and it would affect them in something like concentration or the starting blocks.

Here’s a good and fairly concise article that I’ve found about this.

—————————-

My $.02:
1) She knew what the rules were for marijuana and she broke them.
2) She owned up to it and accepted the one month suspension - which has my respect. cough pork burrito cough
3) The timing of the one month suspension sucks for the Olympics. I REALLY REALLY wanted to see a SAFP/Sha’Carri showdown in the 100m - especially if they would have been put in lanes right next to each other.
4) It’s horrifying that Sha’Carri was notified of her birth mother’s death from a news reporter.

 

[tony]

Yes I would. Being high doesn't do shit other than make me hungry and relaxed. Being drunk knocks me out.
Let me guess: you've never smoked before. You have no idea beyond "Reefer Madness" movies what it's actually like.

A lot of assumptions have crept back in, I see! And it's your view or no view throughout this thread while constantly telling people what they must do and feel. But no, the minute I share any input I'm mansplaining in your mind, and you've claimed it more than once. Please note your own actions.

Here's the thing, from my view: I would bet damn good money that the majority of this board 20 years ago were not in favor of a lot of things that have suddenly come into the light politically- and weed is 100% positively one of those things. I would further that many on this board probably had an absolutely negative view of anyone who smoked, and/or found them to be poorly educated or 'not raised right'. People have said as much on FSU that 20 years ago they wanted nothing to do with LGBTQ rights, but for one reason or another changed their minds over time (dare I open an entire feisty debate by saying it may be because it aligns with what they want politically?). It's also transparent that quite a few people here don't get the trans debate and still think it's a ridiculous claim (I bet there's a huge split mentality on the recent Miss Nevada winner, for example). I can also wager my remaining money on the fact that most of you would not want to work with certain professionals that were known to be high all the time.

I'm completely in favor of the regulations being reviewed and weed laws across the world being examined, but it's simply not going to happen at the same time in every country. We all know this from every other issue we face. WADA has concluded things in their findings that create the whole alcohol vs. weed debate, but there are a lot of things in life that we have to do or rules we have to follow that might not apply to every last person directly-- yet we do them. This is a rule that was completely known, this was a rule that was broken intentionally and she has owned up to it, and we sure can debate whether or not weed is bad. But the rule is still the rule as it is now.

 

[canbelto]

Also, tobacco should be banned over weed. Smoking tobacco is so gross and it's horrible for your health. And it's a stimulant.

 

[jenny12]

[QUOTE="ErikWilliam, post: 6017117, ]If you are just bitter, jaded, man-haters, then please leave your bizarre conclusions to yourself about people. It's better for any social internet group. Don't poison the good people with your bitterness here. Thanks.
[/QUOTE]

If you think any of the women on this site are bitter, twisted man-haters, then you’ve seen nothing. I’ll have to introduce you to some of my friends.

Anyway, while I am in total support of legalization, Sha’Carri should have known better. I do have sympathy for those who have an immediate urge to defend her because of this country’s history of double-standards towards black people who use drugs as opposed to white people but in this case it was poor decision making on her part (perhaps because of high emotions linked to losing her mom): see how that can be done without calling her stupid?

On another topic, it is very disappointing to hear about homophobia from her in the past. While I hope she has grown since then, she should apologize and take accountability for it.

 

[allezfred]

Also, tobacco should be banned over weed. Smoking tobacco is so gross and it's horrible for your health. And it's a stimulant.

FYI weed is also disgusting to those of us who don’t smoke it.

Listen, insulin is on the WADA list and any athlete that is a diabetic knows they have to get a TUE if they want to compete. You have failed to come up with a reason why Richardson shouldn’t be suspended other than “it’s only marijuana”.

 

[canbelto]

FYI weed is also disgusting to those of us who don’t smoke it.

Listen, insulin is on the WADA list and any athlete that is a diabetic knows they have to get a TUE if they want to compete. You have failed to come up with a reason why Richardson shouldn’t be suspended other than “it’s only marijuana”.

I'm not saying she shouldn't be suspended. I just think going forward some of the rules need to be examined.

ETA: so you think weed is "disgusting." I think tobacco is disgusting. See the issue with legislating morality? We can't use the "disgusting" test because everyone's view of disgusting is different.

 

[BittyBug]

Let’s put it this way: Would you think it okay for let’s say a male pairs skater to be under the influence of marijuana during a skating event?

I would think that everyone would answer no to your question. But do you believe that the only way to avert harm is to criminalize behavior? What's to prevent someone from drinking before a competition? What's to prevent someone from consuming mind altering substances before day-to-day training?

Weed is specifically banned only in competition, so safety of others does not seem to be the issue here.

FYI weed is also disgusting to those of us who don’t smoke it.

As an FYI, THC is widely available in edibles and oils - no smoking required.

Listen, insulin is on the WADA list and any athlete that is a diabetic knows they have to get a TUE if they want to compete. You have failed to come up with a reason why Richardson shouldn’t be suspended other than “it’s only marijuana”.

There's a difference between believing that the current marijuana laws are unjust and believing that Richardson should not be suspended. She violated the rules that are currently in place and therefore has no argument against her sanction, which she herself has admitted. However, that doesn't mean we can't debate whether the rules make sense.

And you're correct about the exemption available through a TUE, but it takes a while to obtain one. Richardson was in crisis due to shocking personal news. She clearly was not thinking rationally nor may she have felt that she could wait to consult with a doctor and try to obtain a TUE, if she even understood whether that such an option could be available to her. I don't find that difficult to imagine.

You seem to delight in playing the role of the scold here. Not sure why.

A lot of assumptions ...

Speaking of....

I would bet damn good money that the majority of this board 20 years ago were not in favor of a lot of things that have suddenly come into the light politically- and weed is 100% positively one of those things. I would further that many on this board probably had an absolutely negative view of anyone who smoked, and/or found them to be poorly educated or 'not raised right'.

Seriously? I've had this discussion on this board before (maybe in PI, not sure if you were in the convo). Weed is not some super taboo vile substance that only recently become legit by accident. It became legit because of the perseverance of many high achieving individuals who have sought to make more just laws and create a parity between THC and alcohol.

Maybe it's the company I keep, but I would say that most of the people I know have consumed THC in one way shape or form, and many still use it (I do myself on occasion.) I'm talking doctors, lawyers, professors, engineers, not "poorly educated" people or people who were "not raised right."

 

[canbelto]

@BittyBug , @allezfred never fails to delight in Americans suffering.

Oh I forgot. Sha'Carri doesn't like Lil Nas and therefore must be homophobic (even though she's out and proud). So let's make sure she's drawn and quartered before she ever steps on a track field again. Welcome to allezfred's mind.

 

[Theatregirl1122]

I do get what your saying—and my solution if I was in charge would be not to take marijuana off the list but put alcohol back on. Maybe, too, have a discussion about permissible levels and thresholds to distinguish between use a few weeks before and actually using at a competition.

That said, even if there needs to be a discussion about the rules and if they should be changed, the athlete in question knew she was bound to follow the current WADA rules as they are and as they apply to every elite level athlete across the globe. She didn’t, there were consequences, and she herself as said she knew she wasn’t supposed to do it, did it any way, and takes responsibility for her mistake.

Right, but the point I was making to begin with is that this situation is what it is, athletes have to follow the rules as they are, and athletes know what is on the banned substance list.

But it is reasonable to discuss what should be on there without that being equated to saying that someone shouldn’t know the rules.

 

[starrynight]

I can’t believe that dedicated sports fans on here are falling for ‘Olympic Time Click Bait Bandwagon’ media nonsense.

I hope there’s a more critical attitude when the same stuff starts up with skating next year.

And the USA obsession with marijuana really isn’t a global thing. I remember US exchange students at university being fixated on the stuff and thinking it was weird. I’m sure that it’s not a pressing issue for a lot of other nations in the world.

Given that elite athletes are so disciplined with strict sports diets and gruelling training, I’m pretty sure they can refrain from smoking drugs to pass doping control.

There’s also probably zero chance that any petition to WADA to approve in competition use of a recreational drug which is illegal in the vast majority of the world would succeed.

Marijuana is terrible stuff anyway. I had a friend who went through a phase of smoking it constantly and her intelligence and motivation deteriorated badly. However once she stopped, she got back to her normal self. It really isn’t the kind of thing athletes should be promoting as a good idea.

 

[tony]

I'm not saying she shouldn't be suspended. I just think going forward some of the rules need to be examined.

ETA: so you think weed is "disgusting." I think tobacco is disgusting. See the issue with legislating morality? We can't use the "disgusting" test because everyone's view of disgusting is different.

Which is why I don't understand why you keep saying what people must think or why they must be commenting on this case versus other cases (in which you clearly didn't research to see) as if this all falls back on something other than the rules as they stand. And the minute you disagree, it's some angry -splaining term thrown out because no one else can have an opinion.

Seriously? I've had this discussion on this board before (maybe in PI, not sure if you were in the convo). Weed is not some super taboo vile substance that only recently become legit by accident. It became legit because of the perseverance of many high achieving individuals who have sought to make more just laws and create a parity between THC and alcohol.

Maybe it's the company I keep, but I would say that most of the people I know have consumed THC in one way shape or form, and many still use it (I do myself on occasion.) I'm talking doctors, lawyers, professors, engineers, not "poorly educated" people or people who were "not raised right."

Yes, seriously, and I don't think I've ever had the weed discussion on FSU. I know there are plenty of people with serious jobs who are doing a hell of a lot more than weed on the regular, and I'm sure you might have friends that do the same. In gay circles, it's often the people with the most established jobs who are traveling all over the world for big parties, doing every letter of the alphabet all day and night-- but that's a different topic.

Your experience is obviously different, but having transitioned from high school to college ~20 years ago, there was a much, much different attitude about weed as a whole (as someone who was constantly around people getting in trouble for it). Now, that's not to say there were periods in history where it was accepted by just about everyone. I wasn't alive in the 60s for example, though

1996 to 2016 were the years apparently when all of the laws shifted. You honestly think everyone was on board prior to that? I don't, and I still think a lot of change in opinion is brought on by what one's favored political views favor rather than people making their own choices.

I already brought up the shift in attitudes about LGBTQ, which posters here have stated that they were no supporters of within the last 20 years. We haven't exactly changed during that time. A big liberal (and before someone freaks out about me using 'liberal', consider me as one) agenda is sex work being decriminalized. I guarantee if the President hits this hard as something that should be allowed, all of a sudden people who sneered at the business for their entire lives will suddenly change tunes as if their previous rants just disappeared and they've thought this the entire time.

Given that elite athletes are so disciplined with strict sports diets and gruelling training, I’m pretty sure they can refrain from smoking drugs.

No, no correlation between the two.

 

[tony]

@BittyBug , @allezfred never fails to delight in Americans suffering.

Oh I forgot. Sha'Carri doesn't like Lil Nas and therefore must be homophobic (even though she's out and proud). So let's make sure she's drawn and quartered before she ever steps on a track field again. Welcome to allezfred's mind.

I would really love if you didn't keep on with this. Lesbians can be homophobic towards gay men, gay men can be homophobic towards lesbians, gays and lesbians can be disgusted by transsexuals, straight men can think lesbians are the hottest thing ever but bully and gay men, gays can be self-loathing and not want to be around anyone else who is feminine, and so on. There's a disgusting 'no fats, no fems, no Asians' culture within this world and you know nothing about any of it. I gave you examples before and you said even then that it makes it less likely. You're wrong.

BTW- some of the biggest closet-cases are the ones who go above and beyond to make sure they denounce the LGBTQ community. That might give a little bit of an out for her actions as a teen, but why pick and choose who has 'changed' when she gave evidence that she really hasn't just a few months ago?

Marijuana is terrible stuff anyway. I had a friend who went through a phase of smoking it constantly and her intelligence and motivation deteriorated badly. However once she stopped, she got back to her normal self. It really isn’t the kind of thing athletes should be promoting as a good idea.

Welp, there we have it. Proof that not everyone thinks the same about it at this point

 

[canbelto]

Marijuana is terrible stuff anyway. I had a friend who went through a phase of smoking it constantly and her intelligence and motivation deteriorated badly. However once she stopped, she got back to her normal self. It really isn’t the kind of thing athletes should be promoting as a good idea.

I hate to say this but if your friend lost her intelligence and motivation she was NOT on just weed but probably mixed with some other drugs (candy-flipping).

 

[starrynight]

Whatever the case may be, I have a fair bit of respect for athletes like Ronaldo and Paul Pogba who removed Coca Cola bottles and Heineken bottles that had been product placed next them at press conferences. For sure they are more disciplined than many of us will ever be, but it’s great that such high profile athletes set an example for healthy living.

 

[canbelto]

Whatever the case may be, I have a fair bit of respect for athletes like Ronaldo and Paul Pogba who removed Coca Cola bottles and Heineken bottles that had been product placed next them at press conferences. For sure they are more disciplined than many of us will ever be, but it’s great that such high profile athletes set an example for healthy living.

Really? You're going to police athletes' diets?

The requirement is to pass a drug test, not to be a role model for some wellness influencer.