Royalty Thread #8.....A Pregnant Pause

[Vagabond]

So where did Harrison come from?

He is Harry's son. Harks back to Anglo-Saxon times, I guess.

 

[Jenny]

Oh total

 

[taf2002]

I can't imagine why anyone would say H&M went Hollywood. Archie or Archibald is an English name, is it not? But Archie is less archaic. I like it a lot. Remember when Kate had her 3rd child & we found out it was Louis pronounced Looie. It didn't sound all that regal either.

 

[Vagabond]

Remember when Kate had her 3rd child & we found out it was Louis pronounced Looie. It didn't sound all that regal either.

I dare you to tell that to the French!

 

[quartz]

@Vagabond ’s avatar.
I really hope this kid’s hair is red.

 

[skatesindreams]

Could HMQ award title(s); with Harry and Meghan choosing not to usr them, at this time?

 

[aftershocks]

I don't like any of the names that mean sun or breaking dawn, etc. Since they've known for a while it's a boy but didn't know he would be born at dawn his names probably were already chosen before the birth.

Ah, please share the link where it states they knew beforehand the baby would be a boy. AFAIK, Meghan had told people who asked during some of their walkabouts, that they were going to wait until the baby was born and be surprised. During the birth announcement on Monday, Harry said that because the baby was overdue, they'd had a chance to think about names. I would imagine they were thinking of both girl and boy names, and now they will of course be focusing on male names. According to custom, the Queen is consulted before a name is chosen.

Ah, catching up with the Sussex Instagram and this thread. That's cool. The name mystery is solved. They give a nod to Prince Harry, but choose a unique name for their son. And no 3 or 4 given names either. Just the usual American practice of two given names. Cool. Archie, Earl of Dumbarton. It looks like no 'Archibald' either, just 'Archie.'

 

[cocotaffy]

All this make me think of is this great character , "Oh Archie, Archie please can you speak Russian to me !"

 

[ilovepaydays]

This photo is too precious!

 

[aftershocks]

^^ What you linked is the same photo @Sylvia posted earlier, only it's in color from a different source than the Sussexes' Instagram.

The Queen and Prince Philip look so pleased and proud. That's a very lovely photo. I wonder who the photographer is?
https://www.instagram.com/p/BxNPb_9B0fn/

Meghan and Harry always surprise us. No traditional family names whatsoever. And they may not actually be giving their offspring any titles whatsoever. There's no indication in this latest announcement. So Archie may not in fact take on the Earl of Dumbarton courtesy title. If not then, Harry is going the route of Princess Anne with her progeny. Perhaps Harry envied his cousins, Zara and Peter Phillips, because they weren't burdened with titles of any kind. 'What you see is what you get!' Indeed.

 

[taf2002]

Ah, please share the link where it states they knew beforehand the baby would be a boy.

Right after the New York baby shower one of Meghan's friends let a male pronoun slip to some reporter then tried to backtrack. I can't believe with your talent of finding articles that that one slipped by you.

 

[aftershocks]

Apparently it has been confirmed by "sources" that young Archie will have no title for now, so he will be Master Archie Mountbatten-Windsor. Presumably in time (far, far in the future) he will inherit the title of Duke of Sussex. I will be interested to see what happens when the Queen dies and Charles ascends, then Harry's children will be entitled through the Letters Patent to an HRH and to be called Prince/Princess. Will they upgrade then? (There is precedence not to -- Edward and Sophie's children are entitled to the HRH, as grandchildren of the Queen, but don't use it, and presumably some day their son James will inherit his father's titles as well.)

I tend to think no titles whatsoever. They truly want their offspring apparently to experience normal, unpretentious lives, unfettered by title formalities. I recall in one of the documentaries of Harry spending time in Botswana in his 20s, he was so happy that practically no one knew who he was. They met him on his own terms and treated him naturally, without any awe or kowtowing. He loved that:
https://youtu.be/8KgzATFR0As?t=1476
https://youtu.be/Z3x-_XgpEvk?t=35
Harry: "It's so easy to become caught up in all the negativity that exists in this world. I would encourage everyone to do good, because then you can go to bed at night feeling good about yourself..."
https://youtu.be/Z3x-_XgpEvk?t=175
https://youtu.be/Z3x-_XgpEvk?t=256 sequence showing how young Harry bonded with little orphaned Mutsu (sp?)

 

[Sylvia]

I wonder who the photographer is?
https://www.instagram.com/p/BxNPb_9B0fn/

"Photo credit: Chris Allerton" is included in both of the royal IG posts.

 

[aftershocks]

@Vagabond ’s avatar.
I really hope this kid’s hair is red.

If you check the photo that's available of the baby's face in close-up, there are faint wisps of red hair around the edges of the white wool cap he's wearing:
https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv

Plus, I suspect that the name 'Archie' likely came to them after the baby was born. There's red hair on the Markle side of the family as well as the Spencer side. So yep, I believe little Archie of Sussex has red hair.

Meghan and Harry seem focused on raising their son as uniquely himself. I get that feeling.

 

[mag]

I am happy to see Harry and Meghan going the Princess Anne route rather than the Prince Andrew route. The reality is, even if something horrendous were to happen, it is unlikely the monarchy would remain if they had to go so far down the line to find a heir. Given Prince Charles’ wish for a much slimmed down monarchy, H&M’s children are unlikely to have any official roll, in fact, I suspect while M&H will continue to do lots of charity work and take up many good causes, I doubt we will rarely if ever see them at State Dinners or that sort of thing.

I suspect that will all fit well with the kind of lifestyle both M&H appear to prefer. Hopefully now they three of them can disappear into their home and cocoon for a few months. I believe both Kate and William have mentioned how much they appreciated their family time in Wales after George was born.

 

[DFJ]

Archie? Really?

 

[WillyElliot]

Archie isn’t very “Royal” is it? Cute name though.

You're British, correct? Is this name so off the wall in GB as it is America? Maybe they were fans of Cary Grant? Prince Archie sounds ridiculous to me. Harrison would have been more suitable IMO.

 

[aftershocks]

I am happy to see Harry and Meghan going the Princess Anne route rather than the Prince Andrew route. The reality is, even if something horrendous were to happen, it is unlikely the monarchy would remain if they had to go so far down the line to find a heir. Given Prince Charles’ wish for a much slimmed down monarchy, H&M’s children are unlikely to have any official roll, in fact, I suspect while M&H will continue to do lots of charity work and take up many good causes, I doubt we will rarely if ever see them at State Dinners or that sort of thing.

I suspect that will all fit well with the kind of lifestyle both M&H appear to prefer. Hopefully now they three of them can disappear into their home and cocoon for a few months. I believe both Kate and William have mentioned how much they appreciated their family time in Wales after George was born.

Kate & William spent their early months of marriage cocooned in Wales. Maybe they were still residing in Wales when Prince George was born two years later, but I don't recall if they were still there by then. Harry is leaving for the Netherlands tomorrow re the Invictus celebration countdown. And I'm sure we'll see a lot of Harry continuing on with his official royal duties while Meghan remains on maternity leave for at least 3 months. There have been reports that Meghan will attend Trooping the Colour in June. And we can probably expect to see Archie's christening in July. So no, the Sussexes will not be completely 'disappearing,' albeit they will surely be enjoying their cocoon and their delightful and magical 'bubble' at Frogmore Cottage on the Windsor estate.

The main point I was making: It looks as if Meghan and Harry are going to forego the Lord/Lady nobility titles and in this instance, the Earl of Dumbarton courtesy title for an eldest son. I find this slightly surprising, as being a Duke, Harry's offspring are automatically entitled to such titles at birth. It's only when Prince Charles becomes King that the Sussex offspring would be entitled to carry royal HRH Prince/Princess titles. That event is somewhat further into the future, and with this latest announcement, it seems clear at this moment and surely going forward, M&H have no interest in their children bearing any formal titles whatsoever, despite their entitlement. I'm not sure the couples' personal preferences in this instance have much to do with the 'streamlining of monarchy.' It just appears to be how Harry & Meghan wish to roll with it for their offspring.

 

[Vagabond]

I tend to think no titles whatsoever. They truly want their offspring apparently to experience normal, unpretentious lives, unfettered by title formalities.

How fortunate, then, that his surname is Mountbatten-Windsor! What could be more normal and unpretentious than that?

 

[WillyElliot]

Remember when Kate had her 3rd child & we found out it was Louis pronounced Looie. It didn't sound all that regal either.

Huh? Ever heard of King Louis XV on down?

 

[aftershocks]

You're British, correct? Is this name so off the wall in GB as it is America? Maybe they were fans of Cary Grant? Prince Archie sounds ridiculous to me. Harrison would have been more suitable IMO.

Don't you guys get it though? Harry especially does NOT want his son to be called a prince, because Harry didn't care much for being called a prince when he was growing up. At this point, they don't even want Archie to use the courtesy Earl of Dumbarton title either. It's possible they may wait until Archie grows up and ask for his input on his personal desires, but I'm not entirely sure that's the direction they are going to go in either.

Archie is a cute name. No 'Archibald' for Master Sussex apparently. It reminds me of how the name 'Eddie' is used as a given name, sans the more formal 'Edward.'

 

[taf2002]

I didn't know Dukes could decide not to let his 1st son have the Earl courtesy title. I thought that was automatic upon birth.

ETA the one photo of his little face has the cap pulled down covering his forehead so I didn't see any hair at all.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ Well, it is, so I actually do not understand the logistics. I'll read up on some royalty sites and see if there's anymore skinny available regarding what those surprising Sussexes are up to.

How fortunate, then, that his surname is Mountbatten-Windsor! What could be more normal and unpretentious than that?

Sure, but that's all the more reason I would imagine for the first name informality. With the distinguished surname moniker, Archie really doesn't need any nobility or royalty prefixes. Again, M&H are always surprising us with their unique way of doing things the way they prefer.

Plus, I am quite sure, much like 'Harry' is fairly well known around the world by only his first name (the nickname his mother Diana preferred, and which he was always called from the beginning), so will his son always be known worldwide as 'Archie!' Albeit, Archie shares that name with a well known cartoon character who has red hair. Perhaps Meghan loved that character and enjoyed reading the Archie comics growing up. Inquiring minds want to know the background deets on this name selection.

I did see someone suggest 'Harrison' on one of the royalty forums, and possibly 'Arhibald' might have been broached, but not commonly. More commonly, the traditional names: Philip, Albert, Francis, Charles, James, etc were discussed.

I totally agree that Solomon was a fantasy long shot for Sussex baby, as was Ivan, Gabriel, Zain, and Daniel.

 

[mag]

Maybe they were still residing in Wales when Prince George was born two years later, but I don't recall if they were still there by then.

Okay, you caught me. I just made that bit up. Do you re read your posts and think about their tone before posting?

So Kate and William showed up at some kind of cross country race shortly before they moved from Wales. Kate was on maternity leave at the time, but reports say that she decided to go as a thank you to the community. So yes, when George was born they spent the first few weeks with Kate’s parents, then they went back to Wales. At some point when George was still a baby they moved to Kensington Palace and Anmer Hall. I believe they were living full time at Anmer Hall when Charlotte was born. George’s first preschool was a local Montessori school.

 

[Lorac]

How fortunate, then, that his surname is Mountbatten-Windsor! What could be more normal and unpretentious than that?

Agreed - Mountbatten-Windsor is a very pretentious surname - and Archie Harrison Mountbatten Windsor is so very British public school boy (i.e. upper class toff)!!

As to the name - I love Harrison - but Archie?!?! Come on - I honestly though someone was taking the piss when I first saw the name as I automatically though of Archie from Archie comics - love your avatar @Vagabond - but no that's the name!! Why on earth would you lump your kid with that name - especially when you add the hyphenated last name!?

Anyway the pictures and video of the family are adorable - both Meghan and Harry can't stop grinning like Cheshire cats - but we got very little of the baby's face and how anyone can determine the colour of the hair from those tiny glimpses is beyond me. Hopefully we will get a better picture of the little one in the next few weeks as he develops his personality.

As to if the Portland Hospital was a choice or a late decision I am beyond impressed that Harry and Meghan got there and back with a new baby without anyone outside those they trusted with the info getting any inkling Meghan was anywhere but Frogmore Cottage over the bank holiday weekend!! Well done them

 

[aftershocks]

... how anyone can determine the colour of the hair from those tiny glimpses is beyond me.

^^ Yep, I will bet it's some shade of red hair. But a baby's hair color and texture can change over time.

Okay, you caught me. I just made that bit up. Do you re read your posts and think about their tone before posting? ...

Why the over-sensitivity though? I could only recall that the Cambridges expressly lived in Wales in the first months of their marriage. I didn't recall them spending two years there until baby George was born. Does anyone re-read their posts and religiously worry about tone being misconstrued?

 

[AxelAnnie]

I can't imagine why anyone would say H&M went Hollywood. Archie or Archibald is an English name, is it not? But Archie is less archaic. I like it a lot. Remember when Kate had her 3rd child & we found out it was Louis pronounced Looie. It didn't sound all that regal either.

With the video inside their home. Let me think.........oh yes, I can see where that is private. Geesh. I wouldn't want a camera crew in my house with a new baby.....think germs.

And Archie? Really? Archibald I could get. And, no, he will not receive a title.

Prince Harry and Meghan Markle’s first royal child, Archie Harrison Mountbatten-Windsor, will not have a royal title until Prince Charles himself becomes king.

According to CNN’s Max Foster, the new parents have elected to forego the courtesy title of His Royal Highness (HRH) or prince, meaning that the newest member of the royal family will simply be known as , Archie Harrison Mountbatten-Windsor.

The absence of an HRH or prince title was a given leading up to the birth, as the small royal’s great-great-great-grandfather, King George V, limited titles within the royal family in 1917, meaning that as a great-grandchild of the Queen, little Archie is too far down the line of succession to be an HRH.

 

[AxelAnnie]

Shouldn't that be Lord Archie Mountbatten-Windsor ?


It does sound more like a diminutive than a formal name. But more leeway the farther you are from the throne

No, it Archie is actually the name. Poor kid.

 

[aftershocks]

Hopefully we will get a better picture of the little one in the next few weeks as he develops his personality.

Unless they both decide to post update pics on their Instagram, which is a bit doubtful (but not impossible), we won't get a glimpse of Archie again until the christening (most likely sometime in July).

I think little Archie is exceedingly lucky, and I certainly would never reference him as 'poor kid.' Some observers were speculating that if he took on the Earl of Dumbarton title, he might be called Dummy or Dumbo at school. I then thought his parents could read him the story of Dumbo, the Elephant, so he might feel proud to share a nickname intended to be derogatory.

I think everyone is a bit mixed up. Lord/Lady and Earl are not royal titles. HRH Prince/Princess are royal titles. Also the CNN report is slightly inaccurate in suggesting that 'Prince' is a courtesy title. It is not. The Earl of Dumbarton is a courtesy title, which normally would be extended to Harry's first born son. I'm going to see if there is any better official accounting regarding possible future titles being given. If they aren't planning to use Earl, I have a feeling they may not use 'Prince' either when Charles becomes King.

Kudos to the Sussexes. May they enjoy little Archie in these very special coming days and months! I wonder when Doria will depart for California. It will surely be hard for her to leave her grandson, but I'm sure she will be visiting often, and seeing him via Skype or Facetime.

 

[kittyjake5]

The first thing that came to my mind was "Archie Bunker" not Archie the cartoon character.