Chinese Skating News, Pt. 3: A long & winding road to Beijing 2022

[Sylvia]

Are you asking for a translation of this one?

No need - thank you. I got a pretty good idea what it says via Google Translate.

 

[Jeschke]

Do we know, why Li (&partner) has (have) been crossed out of her(their) GP assignments?

 

[Sylvia]

Do we know, why Li (&partner) has (have) been crossed out of her her(their) GP assignments?

Xiangning LI's name also was crossed out today from NHK Trophy, her lone Grand Prix singles assignment.

 

[Wyliefan]

https://twitter.com/ifsmagazine/status/1049399928320069632?s=19

 

[Willin]

It's very strange... Maybe the injuries that can be caused by the intense training methods have finally caught up to their athletes, but it's also possible that this is related to the cancellation of Cup of China...

 

[SamuraiK]

They didn't show much progress or potential in the domestic comp a few weeks ago and knowing how CHN fed is all about saving face not surprising they were withdrawn. They shouldnt have been invited in the first place.

 

[binbinwinwin]

It's either injury or lack of preparedness, Li/Xie performed in an ice show exactly a week ago and honestly their condition looked worse than their competition in September, didn't attempt a throw at all (they've never done a triple) and the performance was uninspiring. Like I'm not even sure Xiangning Li has singles programs ready at all. It is better for the spots to be vacant or given to someone else.

 

[AxelAnnie]

If it matters, the English article only said that Beverly has enrolled in their National training program but the Chinese articles do confirm that she will compete on behalf of China.

If you are in the program then you do the program. It obviously works

 

[Doggygirl]

I've really been missing the Chinese presence during the Grand Prix so far. Loved seeing Peng/Jin at SC and Boyang Jin today at Helsinki (LOVE his SP!!). But that has been it so far, right? I've been reading back on this thread for a few pages anyway, and am still confused as to what is going on with figure skating in China right now. Sounds like we're not sure whether Zhang is retired or taking a break? Sounds like Wangs are still skating but not outside of China? Sounds like there are really no up and coming pairs ready for even Challenger level international competition? What the heck is going on with pairs???? I assume Sui/Han continue to recover and will hopefully skate at World's and maybe 4CC?? Things just seem SOOOOO quiet. Yao Bin retired, right? Have things taken a back slide since then? Hungry for news!!!

 

[meggonzo]

Also Wang & Liu in dance! They were at Skate Canada.

 

[Doggygirl]

Also Wang & Liu in dance! They were at Skate Canada.

Absolutely! I really like them too - can't believe I wasn't thinking of them when I wrote this post. Still a pretty lean showing.....

 

[binbinwinwin]

I've really been missing the Chinese presence during the Grand Prix so far. Loved seeing Peng/Jin at SC and Boyang Jin today at Helsinki (LOVE his SP!!). But that has been it so far, right? I've been reading back on this thread for a few pages anyway, and am still confused as to what is going on with figure skating in China right now. Sounds like we're not sure whether Zhang is retired or taking a break? Sounds like Wangs are still skating but not outside of China? Sounds like there are really no up and coming pairs ready for even Challenger level international competition? What the heck is going on with pairs???? I assume Sui/Han continue to recover and will hopefully skate at World's and maybe 4CC?? Things just seem SOOOOO quiet. Yao Bin retired, right? Have things taken a back slide since then? Hungry for news!!!

Wang's are still skating but we're off of the National team, they are on P/T's team now. Yu/Zhang are training again but took a break due to her injury, they have new programs from Benoit Richard. Sui/Han are training too, it's likely that the injured teams will be back by Nationals in December. we will see.

Yao Bin is pretty much retired, I heard his health is not that great so I don't think we will see him back.

 

[Doggygirl]

Wang's are still skating but we're off of the National team, they are on P/T's team now. Yu/Zhang are training again but took a break due to her injury, they have new programs from Benoit Richard. Sui/Han are training too, it's likely that the injured teams will be back by Nationals in December. we will see.

Yao Bin is pretty much retired, I heard his health is not that great so I don't think we will see him back.

Thank you so much for this update. I wasn't really able to follow the JGP - are there any promising young teams coming up?

I'm also curious about the "politics" of "Pang/Tong's team" v. the "National team" (I assume Hongbo Zhao is the head coach?). Is that as simple as people just choosing different coaching options, or is there a different meaning attached to being part of one or the other?

Thanks for any insights you can share!

 

[Marco]

Zhang still training with Yu? I thought he is like 50 now? He skated at the freaking SLC Olympics!

Nice to see Boyang at Finland GP. Short program was nice but the free was too much for him to handle, style and presence wise.

 

[Japanfan]

Zhang still training with Yu? I thought he is like 50 now? He skated at the freaking SLC Olympics!

He was born July 6 1984, which makes him 34.

https://www.sports-reference.com/olympics/athletes/zh/zhang-hao-1.html

If he makes it to 2022, he'll be 38. Has their ever been a male in any discipline completing at 38?

 

[hanca]

He was born July 6 1984, which makes him 34.

https://www.sports-reference.com/olympics/athletes/zh/zhang-hao-1.html

If he makes it to 2022, he'll be 38. Has their ever been a male in any discipline completing at 38?

That is what his current passport say. And the Wikipedia says. I would love to know what his original birth certificate said. The one he got just after birth. If it still exist.

 

[Japanfan]

That is what his current passport say. And the Wikipedia says. I would love to know what his original birth certificate said. The one he got just after birth. If it still exist.

If you don't believe his current passport, how old do you think he is?

He looks about 34 to me, though of course he could be a bit older.

 

[Jeschke]

That is what his current passport say. And the Wikipedia says. I would love to know what his original birth certificate said. The one he got just after birth. If it still exist.

I just hope you look exactly the age you actually are giving such charming comments

 

[binbinwinwin]

Thank you so much for this update. I wasn't really able to follow the JGP - are there any promising young teams coming up?

I'm also curious about the "politics" of "Pang/Tong's team" v. the "National team" (I assume Hongbo Zhao is the head coach?). Is that as simple as people just choosing different coaching options, or is there a different meaning attached to being part of one or the other?

Thanks for any insights you can share!

There's some newly shuffled junior teams but they're not really ready to compete a la Li/Xie, it's hard to convince the bosses to let you compete internationally, back in the day Yao Bin would go knock on officials doors with gifts at 2AM just to beg them to let Shen/Zhao compete abroad. I'm guessing most non top teams are just being doing Chinese domestic competitions for this season.

And honestly we don't know yet, there's actually a 3rd National team now headed by Lu Chen to focus on ladies and ice dance (including Beverly Zhu) but I haven't followed it closely, each are supposedly for better focusing on different disciplines but I haven't heard much more.

 

[hanca]

If you don't believe his current passport, how old do you think he is?

He looks about 34 to me, though of course he could be a bit older.

I have no idea how old he really is, but a year or two difference would not be recogniseable on his appearance, so how he looks is irrelevant in this case. Wasn’t there the issue with the Chinese skaters age a few years back? Having different date of birth published at their skating federation’s website than they were using officially with ISU? Considering China’s history of making their gymnasts any age that was convenient, personally I am a bit sceptical about them claiming that the ‘wrong’ dates of birth on their webside were really just typos. But that’s me, you can believe whatever you want to.

 

[Sylvia]

I wasn't really able to follow the JGP - are there any promising young teams coming up?

China sent out 3 pairs on the JGP this fall - Feiyao TANG / Yongchao YANG (5th in CAN, 7th in CZE), Yuchen WANG / Yihang HUANG (8th in CAN, 13th in CZE) and Motong LIU / Tianze WANG (10th in AUT).

Tang/Yang have the most experience of the 3 since they were the 2nd Chinese pair (behind the now split Gao/Xie) at 2018 Junior Worlds, finishing 12th -- here's their SP at JGP CZE (52.24), choreographed by Shae Zukiwsky: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiswJq6bj1E

Re. Boyang Jin's subpar (for him) FS and 5th place finish in his international season debut, this was tweeted by Wei Xiong (Chinese journalist who was in Helsinki): https://twitter.com/pandaatlarge/status/1059088039283224579

Talked to Coach Fu, she said Boyang is okay physically, no need to worry. He may feel a bit too tight because it is his first competition. He does well in training. He has really trained a lot to improve his performance. The next GP is a tough field too, will try his best.

 

[barbarafan]

He was born July 6 1984, which makes him 34.

https://www.sports-reference.com/olympics/athletes/zh/zhang-hao-1.html

If he makes it to 2022, he'll be 38. Has their ever been a male in any discipline completing at 38?

He will most likely be 40 as he was born JUly 6 1982
https://www.webcitation.org/query?u...skating/news/story?id=6120559&date=2011-11-13

 

[Doggygirl]

Tang/Yang have the most experience of the 3 since they were the 2nd Chinese pair (behind the now split Gao/Xie) at 2018 Junior Worlds, finishing 12th -- here's their SP at JGP CZE (52.24), choreographed by Shae Zukiwsky: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiswJq6bj1E

Thank you @Sylvia for sharing this video. I enjoyed this team and look forward to seeing them on the senior circuit one day. I'm glad to know there are up and coming pairs.

I'm also glad to hear that Jin is OK. I absolutely love his short program and I know his free skate will be awesome too when he is able to perform it a little better. His effort on his presentation is so apparent.

ETA: @binbinwinwin thank you for your update as well. I have also been curious about how travel works for the Chinese figure skaters. Obviously the top tier skaters travel more. I have always been under the impression that people are not necessarily free to just come and go as they please in and out of China. But one of my nieces married into a Chinese family a couple years ago. Her husband was in the states for his education (PhD in computer engineering ) and he has since become a US citizen. His parents reside in China and seem to be rather wealthy. I'm not sure what the occupations are, but they seem to travel very freely back and forth to the US and also other parts of the world. All of this just makes me realize how little I really know about Chinese culture, laws, etc. Anyway, this is just to say that I really appreicate the international nature of this forum and the fact that there are so many people here who DO understand many different cultures, etc. I look forward to any more updates as you become aware of new info!

 

[Sedge]

Wasn’t there the issue with the Chinese skaters age a few years back? Having different date of birth published at their skating federation’s website than they were using officially with ISU? Considering China’s history of making their gymnasts any age that was convenient, personally I am a bit sceptical about them claiming that the ‘wrong’ dates of birth on their webside were really just typos. But that’s me, you can believe whatever you want to.

I found the follow up article in which ISU and China's dates were said to agree.

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/700110903/ISU-No-discrepancies-for-Olympic-silver-medalists.html

Skeptical then, skeptical now

 

[binbinwinwin]

@Doggygirl for your niece's husband he probably has the same visa as me, if you have family in China then you can get a 10 year visa that allows you to travel to China pretty easily as long as the visit is 120 days or shorter. It's become easier to work in China over the last few years since they have a new visa for that but I'm not familiar with that stuff. For athletes who are Chinese citizens I'm sure the fed just takes care of it. It's just that there's a lot of domestic competitions in China so the bosses always say, what's the difference? It costs more money to go abroad, so just compete here. That's why Chinese skaters hardly compete outside the JGP/GP and major championships. It was only last season that they started sending the top skaters to Challengers.

 

[barbarafan]

I found the follow up article in which ISU and China's dates were said to agree.

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/700110903/ISU-No-discrepancies-for-Olympic-silver-medalists.html

Skeptical then, skeptical now

They only agreed because the list that was on the chinese skating website was taken down a day or 2 after the below article about ages was published. They now do not publish ages until skaters are entered in their first international competition, then whatever age works for them to be allowed to compete they are assigned and they are given ID and passports with that date of birth...They always kept the proper date only changing the year. So according to the official list that was on the website Sui and Han also won competitions that they were ineligible for.
https://www.webcitation.org/query?u...skating/news/story?id=6120559&date=2011-11-13

 

[Japanfan]

https://www.webcitation.org/query?u...skating/news/story?id=6120559&date=2011-11-13

China's top up-and-coming pairs team of Sui and Han are considered to be the heirs apparent to Olympic gold medalists Shen Xue and Zhao Hongbo, winning the junior world title last year and medaling at all of their senior Grand Prix events this year, including taking the bronze at the Grand Prix final. According to the list of birthdates on the federation website, however, Sui and Han should not have been competing at any of those events and also are ineligible for this year's junior world championships, which begin Feb. 28 in South Korea.

Sui was born on May 7, 1997, according to the federation website, making her just 13. That would mean she was too young for both last year's junior world championships, where she and Han were first, and this year's senior Grand Prix series. Han, meanwhile, has a March 1989 birthday on the federation's list, making him 21.

I assume the article is current?

Any possibility S/H will be stripped of their title?

 

[Willin]

@Japanfan It looks like it's just hearsay at this point. I trust the Associated Press as far as good journalism, so I do not doubt that they found lists like that (especially given China's previous problems with faking athlete ages). However, the ISU won't act on it because it sounds like they haven't ever seen that list.

The article is actually 7 years old, so it's not current, and if no action has been taken I don't think it will be taken in the future.

 

[barbarafan]

https://www.webcitation.org/query?u...skating/news/story?id=6120559&date=2011-11-13



I assume the article is current?

Any possibility S/H will be stripped of their title?

no...it is from 2011. Not all that time after the gymnastic girls's age scandal. As soon as the article was posted they removed the list from the website and nothing about ages gets posted anywhere until their near future is decided. The false ages were given to the ISU and traveling documents so the only place the real ages existed was on the website.
In general they add 2 yrs to the girls and take 2 yrs away from the men...With the girls gymnastics it was so weird...a little girl competed with no front teeth. It was said that they had been knocked out in a practice accident. The next year they had grown back in....Such magic they have in China.

 

[hanca]

With the girls gymnastics it was so weird...a little girl competed with no front teeth. It was said that they had been knocked out in a practice accident. The next year they had grown back in....Such magic they have in China.

To be fair, she could have had teeth implants done. Not all Chinese come from poor families.
Nevertheless, the age of Chinese gymnasts has been altered in the past and that’s the reason I struggle to believe that the published age of the skaters (those who had different age published on the website) was just a mistake.