Let's Talk Movies #35 – Sparrows and Panthers and Dinosaurs…Oh My!

[MacMadame]

They already don't show all the awards during the show. Technical awards are done at a completely different ceremony!

I think the Variety article about how the Popular category is a dumb idea sums up why it's dumb the best. IMO it's lazy. Instead of opening their minds up to different kinds of films, they are going to create this faux category that can't even be defined clearly.

 

[VGThuy]

They already don't show all the awards during the show. Technical awards are done at a completely different ceremony!

I think the Variety article about how the Popular category is a dumb idea sums up why it's dumb the best. IMO it's lazy. Instead of opening their minds up to different kinds of films, they are going to create this faux category that can't even be defined clearly.

They have shown every competitive category on TV until this change. The Scientific and Technical Awards are a different entity and are honorary awards voted by the Board of Governors.

Anyway, I think these so-called popular movies already get enough attention, and IMO, dumbing down the awards are just alienating the core audience while appeasing people who won't even watch the awards anyway. I don't think the Academy are really snotty or anything because I think if they were they'd go even more high brow. I think an incredible portion of the mass membership really does not have time to watch all the movies that submitted themselves for consideration, so they tend to just go with the tide of award season which is shaped campaigning. Studios push certain kinds of films that they produced solely for awards and thus they get all the publicity before the nomination period, and campaign narratives overtakes and controls everything. The indie films outside the studio system start out on their own (from Sundance or whatever) and then get a much needed push from festival response and critics, but only a select few get distributors who know how to play the Oscar game and they join the studios in pushing the awards narrative. I think to "open" up the type of movies that get nominated and win there needs to be a restructuring of the voting process, have it be less susceptible to awards hype and publicity, sort of like the festival format. The problem is that with 6,000+ members, it's near impossible to do.

 

[Japanfan]

I fear I'm running out of movies to go see and our heat wave is going to outlast my movie-going options.

I digress in recommending a window AC unit (though they tend to sell out fast when a heat wave fits). We have one in our bedroom and one in the office - can't imagine being without them in the heat.

 

[watchthis!!]

...what I was surprised to read was that there was some objection to the male writer (Bo Burnham) writing for a female teen protagonist.

Certainly the way the movie ends, a sequel "Twelfth Grade" would be actually quite logical.

I think Burnham should be commended for writing and directing a movie in which a (young) woman gets to be front and center for the whole entirety of the movie. Those who should have the finger pointed at them are those who have the power to get movies made and don't use that power to involve women in the film world to the same extent that they involve men. Burnham is not a household name, is not a man in the entertainment world with a great deal of power. To be honest, I don't even know how he got a movie like this made. It's possible this actress might have a big future in front of her, and it will be in part due to Burnham creating something which enabled her to shine for everyone to see.

As for the sequel, that would be very cool!

And to shorten the show, they will give out awards during the COMMERCIAL BREAKS!

Does that mean we might not get to see who wins for best live action short or for best sound mixing?

 

[VGThuy]

Does that mean we might not get to see who wins for best live action short or for best sound mixing?

I think it's a shame. A lot of those films and crafts deserve attention and now will be pushed aside for things that already get more than their fair share of attention. And now they want to make a category where major blockbusters will get an award. Let's continue to shift focus away from awarding filmmaking.

For the past two years, my husband and I watch the live action shorts nominees at a theatre in Brooklyn, and some of those films are incredible.

 

[PeterG]

Trailers For Movies Released 2018-08-10th
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLuI4-fSHhipS-jWfZUgab03ysP70UrdGB


August 10th - The Meg (Wide) – Action horror sci-fi with Jason Statham, Rainn Wilson, Cliff Curtis

August 10th - Dog Days (Wide) – Comedy drama with Nina Dobrev, Vanessa Hudgens, Adam Pally, Eva Longoria and Tig Notaro

August 10th - Slender Man (Wide) – Horror with Joey King and Julia Goldani Telles [The Affair]

August 10th - BlacKkKlansman (Limited) – Crime comedy with Adam Driver, Alec Baldwin and John David Washington (Denzel’s son)

August 10th - Elizabeth Harvest (Limited – New York/L.A.) – Thriller with Ciarán Hinds, Carla Gugino and Dylan Baker

August 10th - The Guernsey Literary and Potato Peel Pie Society (Limited – Netflix) – Historical romantic drama with Lily James, Jessica Brown Findlay [Downton Abbey], Matthew Goode and Tom Courtenay

August 10th - Madeline’s Madeline (Limited) – Mystery thriller with a new cast & Molly Parker. From imdb.com: “A theater director's latest project takes on a life of its own when her young star takes her performance too seriously.”

Aug. 10th NOT April 27th – Animal Crackers (Limited) – Animated with Emily Blunt, Danny DeVito, John Krasinski, Ian McKellen, Raven-Symoné, Sylvester Stallone, Gilbert Gottfried and Harvey Fierstein

August 10th - What Still Remains (Limited) – Thriller with Colin O'Donoghue [Once Upon A Time] and Mimi Rogers

August 8th - Fox Trap (Limited) – U.K. Horror, new cast. From imdb.com: “After a terrible accident leaves a young girl disabled, five years later, the group responsible are invited to a remote manor house in the countryside for a class reunion. Little do they know, they are being targeted by a masked maniac hell bent on revenge.”

August 10th - A Prayer Before Dawn (Limited) – Action with a new cast. From imdb.com: “The true story of an English boxer incarcerated in one of Thailand's most notorious prisons as he fights in Muay Thai tournaments to earn his freedom.”

August 10th - Summer of 84 (Limited – New York/L.A.) – Horror mystery with a cast. From imdb.com: “After suspecting that their police officer neighbor is a serial killer, a group of teenage friends spend their summer spying on him and gathering evidence, but as they get closer to discovering the truth, things get dangerous.”

August 10th - Hope Springs Eternal (Limited) – Comedy drama, new cast. From imdb.com: “When 18 year old Hope Gracin suddenly finds herself in remission from end-stage cancer, she must learn to live without an expiration date.”

August 10th - Along Came the Devil, aka Tell Me Your Name (Limited) – Horror thriller with a new cast & Bruce Davison. From imdb.com: “After a troubled childhood, Ashley searches for a connection, and unknowingly invites in a demonic force, which leaves her loved ones fighting for her soul.”

August 10th - The Package (Limited - Netflix) – Comedy with a new cast. From imdb.com: “When a group of teenage friends go on a spring break camping trip, an unfortunate accident sets off a race against time to save their friend's most prized possession.”

August 10th - Skate Kitchen (Limited) – Drama, new cast. From imdb.com: “A teenaged skateboarder makes friends with a bunch of other skateboarding girls in New York City.”

August 10th - The Island (Limited) – Comedy drama from China. From imdb.com: “A cataclysmic event causes a man, who dreams of winning the lottery, to become stranded on an island with his co-workers.”

August 10th - BUYBUST (Limited) – Action thriller from the Philippines. From imdb.com: “An anti-drug enforcement agency stages a massive drug bust in the slums of Manila.”

 

[VGThuy]

I think it's a shame. A lot of those films and crafts deserve attention and now will be pushed aside for things that already get more than their fair share of attention. And now they want to make a category where major blockbusters will get an award. Let's continue to shift focus away from awarding filmmaking.

For the past two years, my husband and I watch the live action shorts nominees at a theatre in Brooklyn, and some of those films are incredible.

The craft people are angry:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/b...ges-spark-fear-outrage-crafts-members-1133357

I think the biggest issue is that the Oscars are focusing so much on bloated skits and numbers and such that they lost sight of this ceremony is for. Further, they don't explain or show case these categories so people who are watching don't even know what these people are nominated and winning awards for. I bet most people don't know the difference between Best Sound Mixing and Best Sound Editing. They give an award for Best Cinematography but don't show off said cinematography of the films nominated. They don't show how editing can really change the quality and tone of a film. They don't really showcase the nominated films at all. It's all trying too hard to go viral with hashtags and crap with meeting tourists, and doing weird variety show segments. They don't even do that well. Everyone every year are always commenting on how lame the production numbers are and wonder how the people behind the show to celebrate film entertainment can be so bad at entertaining its audiences.

 

[Buzz]

I do not ever watch the Oscars but I do check the final results. It is highly unusual for me to have watched any more than maybe one of the movies nominated for Best Picture. Some years I have watched non of them.

 

[MacMadame]

I do not ever watch the Oscars but I do check the final results. It is highly unusual for me to have watched any more than maybe one of the movies nominated for Best Picture. Some years I have watched non of them.

I think this is a big problem and it didn't used to be true. The answer isn't to have a 'popular film' category. The answer is to be more open to nominating those films for Best Picture. I think the Academy has gotten stodgier over time.

 

[allezfred]

So I read more...not only are they considering that popular category (let's just call it the Marvel category since I bet they'll be running away with this and I bet ABC demanded something like this...and Disney owns both ABC and Marvel...) but now they are shortening it to three hours and cutting presentations of less popular categories (having them be presented during commercials). I guess desperate times call for desperate measures. I just don't think any of this will actually bump up ratings.

I think the biggest problem with the Oscars is because with all the award shows running up to it now makes the whole night so utterly predictable.

I think this is a big problem and it didn't used to be true. The answer isn't to have a 'popular film' category. The answer is to be more open to nominating those films for Best Picture. I think the Academy has gotten stodgier over time.

Most of the films that do well at the box office are shite though. Most of the Marvel films look like they have been made for people with limited attention spans. Give me a "Moonlight" any day.

 

[manhn]

I do not think the Academy is getting pickier. Just last year, they nominated big moneymakers like Dunkirk and Get Out. The Shape of Water may be an art film, but it is a fantastical, sci-fi one. Not the sort of genre the Academy tends to favour. They nominated very recently Mad Max: Fury Road. I think if the GP had liked the Blade Runner sequel more, the Academy would have given more love.

The studios are abandoning the mid budget movies. They only make comic movies with gigantic budgets. Even things like romcoms are rare.

 

[MacMadame]

I think the biggest problem with the Oscars is because with all the award shows running up to it now makes the whole night so utterly predictable.

Good point. And there are SO MANY.

Most of the films that do well at the box office are shite though. Most of the Marvel films look like they have been made for people with limited attention spans. Give me a "Moonlight" any day.

Black Panther wasn't shite. I think it deserves a Best Picture nom. I'd say the same for Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban.

My list of 5 best movies includes Citizen Kane, It's a Wonderful Life and Blade Runner. Today's Academy would only consider Citizen Kane for best picture the vast majority of the time.

I do not think the Academy is getting pickier.

I don't think it's a pickiness factor. I think it's a limited perspective factor.

 

[snoopy]

Meh to the televised/non-televised awards. What other industry gets a nationally televised award show? Sound editing deserves TV time but nursing doesn't? Show business is ridiculously masterbatory already. I'm okay with them shortening the TV time.

 

[VGThuy]

If we’re talking nominations, the process has a lot to do with it. It’s a ranking system so it’s better for a movie to be ranked 1 or 2 on enough ballots than it is to be a movie that may appear on many more ballots but are only ranked like 4 or 5. A lot of these arthouse pictures that people want to get rid of in favor of the latest blockbuster will be supported by auteur filmmakers and those with more discerning taste and they will rank them high because they are passionate about certain films. Maybe the marvel films aren’t receiving the same amount of passion and are just liked enough for consideration for but not to be ranked 1 or 2 on someone’s personal ballot.

And the reason why Oscars and such are on tv is people nationwide watch movies and movies have had enormous impact on people in a positive way. Otherwise it wouldn’t be the industry that it is. I don’t get anybody complaining about it existing. You’re not paying for it.

Most of the films that do well at the box office are shite though. Most of the Marvel films look like they have been made for people with limited attention spans. Give me a "Moonlight" any day.

I don't think people understand how rare it was for a movie like Moonlight to have won Best Picture. Some people say it was going to win because it's a "serious" movie about inner-city gay men who are black. However, that sort of movie usually does NOT get awards attention especially one that is not structured like an American film but is more like a Wong Kar-Wai or Hou Hsiao-Hsien film. Many movies like that make it to Sundance or various other film festivals but then don't see the time of day or get relegated to Amazon Instant Prime or Netflix after nobody bites. I thought this was one of the few times the Academy went above middle-brow taste and actually went for something that was high art. Now people think it's the norm and want the Academy to move away from rewarding or recognizing more films like Moonlight to make room for broad-based fare.

It seems movies like Forrest Gump, Dances with Wolves, The English Patient, and Titanic don't get the same box office receipts anymore. Movies like that tend to do only ok these days and all the money is going towards superhero films and other blockbusters and summer fare and anything that moves strongly away from those films are seen as small films that are awards bait or whatever. So I think the film scene is even more fractured and I think people's attitudes and perceptions of films encourage this sort of extreme stratification. Maybe it's the Internet making film fans adopt a certain kind of tribal attitude about the type of films they like.

 

[PeterG]

Very interesting posts! I had a thought about Marvel movies (and similar big box office type of fare). If you were to pick Robert Downey Jr.'s best performance as Tony Stark and compared that to his Oscar-nominated work in Chaplin, would you say the latter performance was dramatically better than his best Tony Stark (Iron Man) role?

If you say yes, then how about Mark Wahlberg having two Oscar nominations, but Jake Gyllenhaal only one?

One last point I expect most of you will disagree with, but I think it's a cool discussion topic:

Chris Pratt in the Guardians of the Galaxy movies. Now this takes us back to Marvel, but more interestingly, to comedic performances. A lot of dramatic actors with multiple Oscar nominations or wins, have not even TRIED to do one comedic film performance. How about we take Daniel Day Lewis as an example. Now it's possible that somewhere on his resume he was once in a comedy film. But I'd have to do some research to find it, nothing comes to mind, that's for sure. So how about a Chris Pratt vs. Daniel Day Lewis battle. Which do you think is most likely...

1. Daniel Day Lewis could successfully carry off any one of Chris Pratt's comedic roles.

2. Chris Pratt could successfully carry off any one of Daniel Day Lewis' roles.

I do not think Daniel Day Lewis has the talent to carry off a comedic role. I do think that Chris Pratt can do drama. And when/if Pratt has a creative and patient director, I will not be surprised to see him up for a best actor Oscar in a drama.

Okay, that's enough. Would love to hear your thoughts!

 

[VGThuy]

I don’t think Chris Pratt could do Abraham Lincoln in the way Lewis did. I mean I think a lot of actors are versatile enough to do a lot of roles other actors do (we see it in theatre) but it doesn’t take away from the incredible work that original actor did in that role.

 

[PeterG]

Ouch. Some harsh words!

'The film business passed away today': Hollywood slams Oscars' 'popular film' addition

 

[MacMadame]

It seems movies like Forrest Gump, Dances with Wolves, The English Patient, and Titanic don't get the same box office receipts anymore.

I've seen 3 of those 4 movies and I thought they were all mediocre to horrible. Therefore, I am perfectly okay with them not getting the same box office receipts anymore.

 

[VGThuy]

I've seen 3 of those 4 movies and I thought they were all mediocre to horrible. Therefore, I am perfectly okay with them not getting the same box office receipts anymore.

Please tell me one of the ones you hated was The English Patient. I want to imagine you like Elaine in that one episode of Seinfeld.

 

[MacMadame]

I didn't see that one. But I did like Elaine when she made fun of it and it made me think that I would probably hate it if I saw it.

I think hatred of Titanic is pretty well-understood. The movie was too long and had too much going on and only the middle part really worked. And that part (the love story) was problematic.

Forrest Gump I found to be pretty one-note and also problematic in areas. I was bored watching it. So meh to that one.

Dances with Wolves has been critiqued pretty thoroughly so not going to go into details. But I found it boring, problematic and not very well-acted.

 

[manhn]

I hate Seinfeld.

 

[watchthis!!]

The other day I watched a movie called Winnebago Man. A filmmaker came across some outtakes on youtube of an RV salesman making a promotional video. And the outtakes were all about that salesman losing it, and doing so with very colourful language! So the filmmaker tries to find out more about this story and the man at the centre of it. I thought it was pretty good, but there was a little too much of the filmmaker having decided what he wanted the storyline of the movie to be and then being bothered when the subject wasn't doing things that fit in line with what he wanted. Luckily the guy making the movie adapted to what was happening and ended up with something interesting.

Trailer for Winnebago Man: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NO05RfHO_4s

 

[Japanfan]

The craft people are angry:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/b...ges-spark-fear-outrage-crafts-members-1133357

Relegating the presentation of any of the 'below the line' Academy Awards to the commercial breaks is a disservice to the exceptional artists and innovators who make enormous contributions to filmed entertainment," said Mike Chambers, chair of the Visual Effects Society and member of the Academy's visual effects branch. "They deserve the proper respect and recognition for attaining this high achievement -- as voted on by their peers -- and the opportunity to receive these honors and deliver their full remarks to the worldwide audience of filmgoers."

“I’m afraid this will end up being a little demeaning,” warned one member of the film editing branch. “It's a big thing for those of us ‘below the line’ to get such an award. It makes a big difference in your life and career." [/QUOTE]

ITA. Having studied film-making and films (was a film studies maker), I know that these so-called 'below the line' positions are an equal part of the collaborative effort that is both fundamentally necessary for a film to be made and an essential part of a film being outstanding. We may not be aware of sound mixing when we watch a film, but it significantly impacts our experience of a film. When I was a film student I loved editing - and that was in the days when film was cut and pasted manually. I had a bit of experience some years later with an editing suite, and loved it. Editing is poetry in motion. If I could do it all over again, film editing would be a profession I consider.

I think the biggest issue is that the Oscars are focusing so much on bloated skits and numbers and such that they lost sight of this ceremony is for.

ITA. I always record award events and usually just skip over the skits.

Further, they don't explain or show case these categories so people who are watching don't even know what these people are nominated and winning awards for. I bet most people don't know the difference between Best Sound Mixing and Best Sound Editing.

Seems obvious to me, but you may be right.

They give an award for Best Cinematography but don't show off said cinematography of the films nominated. They don't show how editing can really change the quality and tone of a film.

Again, seems obvious to me but you may be right.

And IMO the editing of most Hollywood films is competent, but I rarely see an American film for which I consider the cinematography and editing brilliant. With some exceptions, film-making is an art in Europe and an industry in America. A blend of both in the UK.

Please tell me one of the ones you hated was The English Patient. I want to imagine you like Elaine in that one episode of Seinfeld.

I loved The English Patient. And it was strong in terms of cinematography. I'll never forget the scene involving the air crash.

 

[VGThuy]

I actually have no feeling towards The English Patient one way or the other, I just liked Elaine yelling at the movie.

I do think there are real artists in American filmmaking, but they are not the ones spotlighted the most and they don't come from the Hollywood system.

 

[MacMadame]

I actually have no feeling towards The English Patient one way or the other, I just liked Elaine yelling at the movie.

Me too. I've only seen maybe 10 Seinfeld episode and that was one that cracked me up.

 

[VGThuy]

Me too. I've only seen maybe 10 Seinfeld episode and that was one that cracked me up.

Me too! I can literally count the number of Seinfeld episodes I REALLY watched on one hand...maybe both hands.

 

[PeterG]

I saw The Spy Who Dumped Me today. It was what I expected. More of an action-drama with a lot of funny moments rather than a straight-out comedy. Everybody in the cast was very strong, lots of great supporting performances, I always like movies where the leads are not afraid to surround themselves by a lot of talented people. So we get Jane Curtin, Paul Reiser, Hasan Minaj (The Daily Show), Gillian Anderson, Sam Heughan (Outlander) and Justin Theroux added to the mix to make a good movie even better. A decent amount of twists and turns, the story keeps you guessing. And if anybody says Americans can't make fun of themselves, this movie is proof that that is not true. There are two moments that almost shocked me...but in a great way. If you are interested in a movie with equal amounts of action, twisty-turny plot twists and laughs, I recommend this one.

 

[allezfred]

Black Panther wasn't shite. I think it deserves a Best Picture nom. I'd say the same for Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban.

Can’t comment on Harry Potter, but Black Panther was entertaining. Formulaic though. I mean, is the super hero ever not going to come through at the end?

 

[allezfred]

Oh and Chris Pratt v Daniel Day Lewis - LOL

Dances with Wolves was shite though. Titanic was entertaining, but for all the wrong reasons. The script is on par with camp classics like Showgirls. The English Patient was beautifully made, but utterly depressing. So I’m left with Forrest Gump.

 

[VGThuy]

Can’t comment on Harry Potter, but Black Panther was entertaining. Formulaic though. I mean, is the super hero ever not going to come through at the end?

I always find I enjoy these superhero movies or sci-fi/fantasy movies before they decide to go on with the plot and it becomes all the same. The same in itself isn't bad, and almost all movies follow a certain formula. I just find with Marvel films and the like, it's something I don't particular enjoy too much but I know many other people do. I think I enjoy the idea of them and the concepts of them and possibly the world building before they decide they have to go reach various points in the action movie playbook. Some movies are better at it than others, but I don't know if I really see art but rather visuals for the sake of visuals and action for the sake of action rather than shooting the scenes with a real POV.