U.S. Pairs 2018 - News & Updates, Part VIII

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AngieNikodinovLove

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^^^ Yup, Thats how my math is too.

I was watching this closely because there was a good chance L&P coulda made the Final. Instead it is F&N!

How exciting!

F&N have good jumps and they seem VERY FAST!!!
 

Spiralgraph

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Wow, there is hope for USA pairs waiting in the wings if our current senior pairs falter (which is very possible.)
I'll try not to get my hopes up too much, too soon though.
 

AngieNikodinovLove

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Uggg Im not sure what to make of the Knierims at this point anymore.

Thought this would be a very easy win for them here.

Well so far Im loving C&L and am curious to see K&O.

Im wondering if the jumps will not be fixed by The Knierims especially now that she too seems to have issues :(
 

happycamper2554

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Uggg Im not sure what to make of the Knierims at this point anymore.

Thought this would be a very easy win for them here.

Well so far Im loving C&L and am curious to see K&O.

Im wondering if the jumps will not be fixed by The Knierims especially now that she too seems to have issues :(

I actually think that this was a positive for them. The PCS was huge compared to everyone else. I bet that they are relearning the jumps which is why she is now having issues. They were close to C/L scores even with such big mistakes in both programs. Even if it's not this season, I think they will get the jumps and put themselves in good position as the quad continues. In her interview Alijona said it took her a while to relearn the jumps when she started skating with Bruno.
 

Cleo1782

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In Alexa and Chris's defense they really did change a lot. All the entrances to their jumps and twist are different and they added a throw 3 loop. I am not thrilled with the 3toe entrance, but maybe it will work?? Tbh, I thought I would like the program more, but I don't. It has some nice moments, but it's not fully developed. Maybe later in the season. It so hard to judge their first outing because they just made so many changes.
In the sp their pcs were high in comparison not so much in the free. Only a point or so higher.
 

AngieNikodinovLove

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All the entrances to their jumps and twist are different

I agree with all you said :)

Although the score for the twist, their signature element, is one of the lowest I have ever seen :(

I also wish they werent doing 2 Debbie Downers for their programs. One (or none) are enough.

Both music selections for me (including Halsey) are dreary and depressing.

I just watched the free again. The jumps just seem to be a mega issue now with now Alexa missing all of hers. Well, at least the falls were perfectly synchronized.

ANL is gonna end with a positive... All of the YouTube comments so far are very inspiring. Thats good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaJUd4_PUe0
 
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Sylvia

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Stellato/Bartholomay's FS from Nepela Trophy is blocked (in U.S. only?) on YT due to music copyright (music is Whitney Houston's "Run to You/I Have Nothing”). If they have a good FS performance at Nebelhorn tomorrow, maybe we can get an "alternative" video made.
Thank you to the nice & helpful person who uploaded an unblocked version of Stellato/Bartholomay's Nebelhorn FS at my request. :)
Even though scores really should not be compared across competitions ;), this is the highest FS score (116.72) recorded by a U.S. pair team so far this (early) season.

Pairs Scoretracker is updated: https://unseenskaters.wordpress.com/scoretracker/current-pairs-scores/
 

Cleo1782

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I agree with all you said :)

Although the score for the twist, their signature element, is one of the lowest I have ever seen :(

I also wish they werent doing 2 Debbie Downers for their programs. One (or none) are enough.

Both music selections for me (including Halsey) are dreary and depressing.

I just watched the free again. The jumps just seem to be a mega issue now with now Alexa missing all of hers. Well, at least the falls were perfectly synchronized.

ANL is gonna end with a positive... All of the YouTube comments so far are very inspiring. Thats good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaJUd4_PUe0


I mean, Alexa has proven she can land jumps. The 3t entrance is way different. She/They never did a 3twalley entrance before. I feel like her jump mistakes are almost because she is looking at/ worried about Chris in the air. It sometimes looks like she gets distracted.
I really, really love Wicked Game, but hate this version. Also, they seemed to be very disoriented for awhile after the 3t falls, so it looks like we/they missed some choreography.
With the twist it looks like they are trying a different approach. She isn't getting lateral in the air like she used to. The way they do it now is the more 'proper' twist technique so that's probably causing them some issues.
 

Foolhardy Ham Lint

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Uggg Im not sure what to make of the Knierims at this point anymore.

Thought this would be a very easy win for them here.

Well so far Im loving C&L and am curious to see K&O.

Im wondering if the jumps will not be fixed by The Knierims especially now that she too seems to have issues :(

The Knierims' overall remind me of Savchenko - Massot Version 2.0, with all the drama, and sadly, none of the secure technique. Hopefully, they can clean everything up by nationals, or else Cain & LeDuc are going to give them a real run for the title.
 

Cleo1782

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The Knierims' overall remind me of Savchenko - Massot Version 2.0, with all the drama, and sadly, none of the secure technique. Hopefully, they can clean everything up by nationals, or else Cain & LeDuc are going to give them a real run for the title.
It was unfinished to me, so we will see how Alexa and Chris pan out, but Tarah/Danny, Ashley/Tim, and Deanna and Nate could all give them a run for the money for the US title.
 

olympic

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I've been thinking a lot about the Knierims, especially after reading their interview on 9/27. I think they are doing the only thing they could do at this point by moving to Savchenko. It is a huge risk, but staying w/ Sappenfield would have resulted in the same old same old: Good explosive elements, hit-and-miss SBS elements and second tier presentation, and they would never have moved up by staying the same.

One thing that struck me while watching their Nebelhorn SP was Chris's SS. His back, stroking, arm movements. I noticed his improvement in 2017, but w/ Savchenko, I think he's even much better. I daresay he is even w/ Alexa which would potentially make them a wow couple if they hit every element.

My hope is that all their mistakes or miscues were due to learning a brand new way of movement on the ice, complete with more choreography and transitions, replacing the basic stroking between elements. I am puzzled by Alexa's falls, though.

ETA - I will be interested to see what K/O produce on the ice. I think contrary to a scenario where Knierims had stayed, their move TO Sappenfield is a good thing. They have more flair overall in their movement, handle choreography and communicate emotion better. Their record on SBS elements is better than Knierims. Their issue is speed and power on individual elements, which would be addressed by Sappenfield.
 
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AngieNikodinovLove

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The Knierims' overall remind me of Savchenko - Massot Version 2.0, with all the drama, and sadly, none of the secure technique. Hopefully, they can clean everything up by nationals, or else Cain & LeDuc are going to give them a real run for the title.

Especially placing the throws at the end of the program. Very Savchenko. But I liked that part.
 

Sylvia

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Liu and Meyh have been added to the ISP. Will she be to old to compete on the JGP next year?
Yes, they were added to the ISP after the Golden West club competition. She will age out of ISU Junior after this season (will turn 19 on Dec. 31).
 

AxelAnnie

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Chris_E

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There are definitely some positive improvements in the Knierim's skating all around except for the jump consistency. However, I'm willing to give them some more time as I did notice less tentativeness going into their jumps even if they didn't land them. I also imagine they were nervous to show off what they've been working on and that comes with it's own pressure.

I could see them rising up the ranks if they are able to start putting all the elements together consistently. Similar to how James and Cipres have made themselves world medalists and World title contenders.
 

AngieNikodinovLove

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I was just watching Alexa and Chris knock it out of the park with their free skate from Four Continents in 2016. I hope they can get back to that point again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hn_u9RL4Mgk

Their best performance ever.. with just a slight bobble landing on the end of Chris's combo jump.

I think they also went for a quad twist in that performance as well.

Kudos!!!
 

olympic

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Ch
Tatjana Flade interviewed Alexa & Chris for IFS after they finished competing at Nebelhorn (16 mins.): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5hWoqBdjns

I caught a glimpse of the Knierims working with ice dance coach Martin Skotnicky at the Oberstdorf rink earlier today (via Aljona Savchenko's IG story).

Aljona had Chris skate w/ her and then w/ Alexa. I imagine this gave him a direct lesson in how to move.
 

lmarie086

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I just watched Alexa and Chris' skates from Nebelhorn...even with the technical issues, that's the most I've enjoyed watching them in a while. They have changed so much about their skating, but I'm actually really hopeful for them this season. I can't wait to see it all come together for them.

Their FS song is not my favorite - I prefer the version James/Cipres are using - but I like the different direction their programs are taking artistically this season. And I really like how both programs highlight their lines. That stood out to me.
 

Dobre

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Ooh, what a beautiful free program for Deanna & Nate. I have always loved the song, I Have Nothing.

I am absolutely :rollin:for Sarah & TJ. Her positions are so stretched. I would love to see half the pair teams out there work on that. I think F&N could handle more choreo in this free skate; but they are coming along as a team and on the elements.
 

aftershocks

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaJUd4_PUe0 Knierims fs at Nebelhorn

I just viewed their fs, prior to reading other comments here. For me, I see the improvements in their style, movement quality, overall look and choreo. I think both programs are winners, and they obviously are putting in dedicated training with Aliona. They have a real opportunity with these new programs and the changes they've made. But they have got to ace the technical elements. They must in order to make an impact and significant strides. That goes for all U.S. pairs -- technical consistency and confidence is key!

Perhaps Alexa and Chris need more time to settle in and gain confidence with the promising changes they've made. In the sp, they seemed nervous with a tad over-adrenalin. In the fp, they just didn't show any comfort level with the jumps, but I suspect they have landed them in training practices. I wonder how they performed in practice and warm-ups at Nebelhorn? Maybe knowing that sbs jumps have been their bugaboo, they are putting more pressure on themselves? It's hard to figure out. The rest was very good and steady improvements seem possible across-the-board. I hope they can relax and just do it re the jumps.
 

aftershocks

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It was unfinished to me, so we will see how Alexa and Chris pan out, but Tarah/Danny, Ashley/Tim, and Deanna and Nate could all give them a run for the money for the US title.

Yeah, and I think this was simply bound to be the case no matter what, especially heading into the new quad. That certainty is surely why the Knierims wished to take a leap of faith and make changes, take a different approach. In fact, K/O were already challenging Alexa & Chris out-the-wazoo, but both teams' momentum had been slowed by illness/ injury (not to mention Denney/Frazier's injury setbacks).

S/B and C/L as newer teams with prior individual pairs and/or singles experience, have always been very promising and ambitious over-achievers from the get-go. It's not surprising that both teams are loaded for bear heading into their third season partnerships!
 

aftershocks

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Thank you to the nice & helpful person who uploaded an unblocked version of Stellato/Bartholomay's Nebelhorn FS at my request. :)

Thanks! That's a very pretty program by Deanna & Nate. It really suits them too. I can see it getting stronger. They are certainly risk-takers. Deanna's second throw landing was more solid than the first but good job for staying up on her feet on both. Their sbs jumps were a bit shaky and not without error, but a bit better than Alexa/Chris. I like S/B's fp more than their sp.

In regard to lifts, they are all trying to increase difficulty. I think D/F and Knierims have the best lifts of top U.S. teams, with K/O a close third. S/B and C/L are fairly solid on lifts and kudos for them adding difficulty but lifts are not either team's strongest suit. I think S/B are a bit more solid in execution on the lifts, but not necessarily in difficulty than C/L.
 

insideedgeua

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I am absolutely :rollin:for Sarah & TJ. Her positions are so stretched. I would love to see half the pair teams out there work on that. I think F&N could handle more choreo in this free skate; but they are coming along as a team and on the elements.

While I’m not sure of the details, I believe that Sarah had some time off over summer due to an injury. Hopefully they will just get stronger and stronger from here on.
 

aftershocks

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...I will be interested to see what K/O produce on the ice. I think contrary to a scenario where Knierims had stayed, their move TO Sappenfield is a good thing. They have more flair overall in their movement, handle choreography and communicate emotion better. Their record on SBS elements is better than Knierims. Their issue is speed and power on individual elements, which would be addressed by Sappenfield.

Indeed. And keep in mind that K/O were always an on-the-rise ever improving team, even against all the injury odds they have faced. After Tarah recovered from a surgery about four years ago or so, they looked better than ever and came back serving notice they were a team to watch. They have steadily been making strides ever since, even despite Tarah's most recent serious injury and rehab coupled with some off-ice problems Danny has faced.

ITA re K/O's sbs jumps consistency and the speed/power weaknesses they should be able to address under Sappenfield, especially with having already improved their 3-twist under her guidance over the summer.

The Knierims are looking much improved movement-wise, but they clearly have things to work out. They have to build more confidence and consistency on their tech elements. A number of U.S. pairs rivalries are possible. But that's the goal. Each team pushing the other to be better and better. It's the crucial way forward to success for U.S. pairs discipline.
 
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