U.S. Ice Dance 2022-23 news & updates

layman

Well-Known Member
Messages
497
I think you've gotta give the Browns time. Take a look at Lajoie/Lagha, they were among the very best junior teams, but still had to pay their dues at the senior level. I also think senior judges appreciate more mature themes and as they get older, these will be easier to convincingly skate. Fixing the levels and continuing to work on polish and expression are what the Browns can do now as they build up their body of work.
One of the things that I really like about the Browns is the way they think outside the box with their music choices. I find their choices fresh and interesting. I would hate for them to have to lose their contemporary/innovative approach to music in order to win approval from the (conservative) judges.

I think I will implode if I have to watch yet another (dance) team forced to skate to Rachmaninov's Piano Concerto No. 2 (plus, it's not even dance music).
 

dancefan17

Active Member
Messages
246
The Browns have a lot of talent. The precision of the Shibs and the attack of D/W takes many, many years of competition and experience. I am excited about their future, but taking this year to really work on the precision of levels is probably a good strategy. Would expect to see a lot of improvement by Nationals.
 

layman

Well-Known Member
Messages
497
Congratulations to Pate and Bye for their Silver Medal at the Nepela Memorial Trophy 2022. I really enjoyed both their dances.

I loved the speed they showed in their Short Dance and I loved the way they interpreted the samba rhythm. I liked the way they used the authentic samba rolls in the choreography. They seemed to really understand the music and used it very effectively in the choreography. I loved the perfection of their line and extension.

I must admit that I was not excited when I heard that they had chosen Riverdance for their free. It's such a skating chestnut. Yet, Pate and Bye won me over with the way they used the music, with the freshness and innovation in their choreography. I was really impressed that they could take such familiar music and make it their own. They skated the free with an enthusiasm that was genuine and infectious. I loved the dance!
 

jlai

Question everything
Messages
13,351
I think you've gotta give the Browns time. Take a look at Lajoie/Lagha, they were among the very best junior teams, but still had to pay their dues at the senior level. I also think senior judges appreciate more mature themes and as they get older, these will be easier to convincingly skate. Fixing the levels and continuing to work on polish and expression are what the Browns can do now as they build up their body of work.
L/L debuted with much higher scores though, as did other first year seniors in the past.

That said let’s see if they can get their levels up
 

~tapdancer~

Knees won't let me tap dance anymore
Messages
6,061
Congratulations to Pate and Bye for their Silver Medal at the Nepela Memorial Trophy 2022. I really enjoyed both their dances.

I loved the speed they showed in their Short Dance and I loved the way they interpreted the samba rhythm. I liked the way they used the authentic samba rolls in the choreography. They seemed to really understand the music and used it very effectively in the choreography. I loved the perfection of their line and extension.

I must admit that I was not excited when I heard that they had chosen Riverdance for their free. It's such a skating chestnut. Yet, Pate and Bye won me over with the way they used the music, with the freshness and innovation in their choreography. I was really impressed that they could take such familiar music and make it their own. They skated the free with an enthusiasm that was genuine and infectious. I loved the dance!
Totally agree! They have something special and I believe their star is rising. Love both their programs, lots of nice content in both. And yes, they have made Riverdance their own. I was all in for them with Hunger Games and they just keep getting better. And they are proving it with the medal count rising. Love them!
 

azcalder

Well-Known Member
Messages
217
The Browns also have a great ability to listen to and dance to the beat of their music that's difficult to teach.

Some teams can fake it but with the Browns, it just looks completely natural.
In their own words from an article I wrote for ice-dance.com back in March 2021. "
The Brown siblings have another positive going for them as they aim to accomplish more feats on the ice.

They come from a very musical family. Gage has played the electric bass for about nine years. He sings and plays in a band he started with his two older brothers. He also plays the bagpipes and has participated in several Irish marching bands with Oona, who is a snare drummer.

“Music has definitely helped us with our rhythm-perception and timing” Oona said. “We have found these abilities are crucial, especially in our discipline. These skills are hard to teach so the fact we were always surrounded by music has definitely given us a boost that we are grateful for.”
 

Lara111

Well-Known Member
Messages
500
The Browns looked disappointed in their scores at the Nepela Memorial Trophy (their senior debut). They came in 5th. I was disappointed for them. To me they seem to combine the precision of the Shibutanis with the speed and attack of Davis and White. What do they need to do to get higher scores?

I hate to be pessimistic but dance is so political. Do they need a bigger name coach? The top two teams at the Nepela Memorial had big name coaches (Haguenauer, Dubreil & Lauzon for the winners and Igor Schilband for the silver medalists).
Oh, they have no lines or extensions.
 

angi

Well-Known Member
Messages
620
The Browns looked disappointed in their scores at the Nepela Memorial Trophy (their senior debut). They came in 5th. I was disappointed for them. To me they seem to combine the precision of the Shibutanis with the speed and attack of Davis and White. What do they need to do to get higher scores?

I hate to be pessimistic but dance is so political. Do they need a bigger name coach? The top two teams at the Nepela Memorial had big name coaches (Haguenauer, Dubreil & Lauzon for the winners and Igor Schilband for the silver medalists).
I don't think it's fair to blame politics for how the Browns scored at Nepela. First, teams from much smaller federations outscored them. Second, they had noticeable bobbles with a big one during the twizzles and their levels were really bad (mostly level 1 with the occasional level 2). And third, they themselves admitted they are still adjusting to the length and requirements of senior programs and have stamina issues.
I love them and I think they are good with a lot of room for growth. That being said, I personally feel like they would have benefited a lot from dominating the junior field for an additional season, I don't think their move to seniors this year is really needed (or smart).
 

Frau Muller

From Puerto Rico…With Love!
Messages
18,489
Congratulations to Pate and Bye for their Silver Medal at the Nepela Memorial Trophy 2022. I really enjoyed both their dances.

I loved the speed they showed in their Short Dance and I loved the way they interpreted the samba rhythm. I liked the way they used the authentic samba rolls in the choreography. They seemed to really understand the music and used it very effectively in the choreography. I loved the perfection of their line and extension.

I must admit that I was not excited when I heard that they had chosen Riverdance for their free. It's such a skating chestnut. Yet, Pate and Bye won me over with the way they used the music, with the freshness and innovation in their choreography. I was really impressed that they could take such familiar music and make it their own. They skated the free with an enthusiasm that was genuine and infectious. I loved the dance!
Having just rewatched all of the RDs from the past three weekend’s events, I’ve enjoyed Pate/Bye’s Baianas program the best of all RDs. Their Riverdance free has yet to win me over, although the last minute is great fun. Sorry that I can’t get Bourne/Kraatz out of mind…neater and sharper to me but maybe it’s not fair to compare.
 

Wyliefan

Slow, dull, and G-rated
Messages
37,487
I love the Browns, but it's not a given that they would have kept dominating. Mrazkova/Mrazek and Bashynska/Beaumont have already surpassed the Browns' personal best (their Junior Worlds score) this season. I expect it was better to make the jump and start getting adjusted to seniors.
 

litenkyckling

Well-Known Member
Messages
543
I do really like the Browns but they do have a tendency to miss footwork levels - they scraped a win on the JGP to make the final last year. I don't know what the solution was - but having US junior champs under their belt would've been good (and would have happened had they not had to miss nationals due to covid).

I wonder if they need a new coach - I don't even mean a more "political" one, it's just that I'm not sure if their coach has ever had a senior team at this level. It is such a massive step up from juniors, and part of the way to success is having a coach who knows the system. Easier said than done, I know.

In saying all of this though, if we compare La/La with C/P (a good comparison as they are contemporaries) - most would probably say that LaLa have had the most success as seniors as they've made it to Olympics, Worlds and non-Olympic year 4CC. However, this weekend was their first senior international medal. Alternatively, C/P have only made it to olympic year 4CC but have 10 senior international medals. So maybe the Browns will have a more steady move up like LaLa.

Oh and they need to get a new RD. I know they were trying to be different but this just didn't work, at all. One of my biggest takeaways of the RD at Nepela was that the Browns would be great at La/La's RD.
 
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skatfan

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,189
I don't think it's fair to blame politics for how the Browns scored at Nepela. First, teams from much smaller federations outscored them. Second, they had noticeable bobbles with a big one during the twizzles and their levels were really bad (mostly level 1 with the occasional level 2). And third, they themselves admitted they are still adjusting to the length and requirements of senior programs and have stamina issues.
I love them and I think they are good with a lot of room for growth. That being said, I personally feel like they would have benefited a lot from dominating the junior field for an additional season, I don't think their move to seniors this year is really needed (or smart).
They looked undercooked to me. Her costumes don’t do her any favors and they seem a bit overwhelmed. Hopefully they can sort it out during the season and end strong.
 

layman

Well-Known Member
Messages
497
I LOVE Hawayek and Baker but their new Rhythm Dance (seen at Finlandia 22) really missed the mark for me. Latin rhythms, to me, are the ISU's invitation to the dancers to be sexy but it seems like Hawayek and Baker did not get this memo. I did not find their RD sexy at all. It was goofy, campy, corny...an attempt at humor that fell (completely) flat for me.

Their RD was G-rated, slow and dull which are just not qualities you would expect in a (supposedly) hot and sultry latin-themed rhythm dance. The joke that was Hawayek and Baker's whole RD felt stale, the skating looked slow and laboured, the music was dated (it sounded like it was recorded in mono in the 1930s) and the (crucial) "attitude" in this rhythm dance just came across (to me) as self-conscious and uncomfortable.

So, I give Hayawek and Baker's new RD a grade of F. They failed the assignment. They need to drop this dance completely and come up with something new.

I think Green and Parsons nailed the rhythm dance (although their marks were suspiciously low). They brought a sultry and passionate "attitude" to their RD and combined that with really innovative, never seen before movements and pictures (just like they did in last season's FD). I give Green and Parsons an A+ on their RD.
 

litenkyckling

Well-Known Member
Messages
543
It's funny - I think Hawayek and Baker's is fun and different, which they need to do in a crowded US field. Not totally in the realm of ISU latin but then again, if the ISU keep giivng people the same themes to work with what do they expect? They didn't get very rewarded for doing a more sexy RD last year so I can see why they tried to think outside the box.

On the other hand - Green and Parsons' fell totally flat for me. I don't think it was all that innovative and they had pretty bad levels here too (for them). I don't know they didn't bring the chemistry and excitement that I think they're capable of. I'd give MIDA choreography so far a C+ - needs improvement and some fresh ideas.
 

Rukia

A Southern, hot-blooded temperamental individual
Messages
15,580
Latin doesn't have to be sexy that's not all we're about

I thought both RDs had some interesting parts, but they did look very early season. Green/Parsons music is pretty atrocious though. It sounds like my son making noises while playing video games put to the generic Casio keyboard samba backbeat (I'd recognize it anywhere).
 

layman

Well-Known Member
Messages
497
It's funny - I think Hawayek and Baker's is fun and different, which they need to do in a crowded US field. Not totally in the realm of ISU latin but then again, if the ISU keep giivng people the same themes to work with what do they expect? They didn't get very rewarded for doing a more sexy RD last year so I can see why they tried to think outside the box.

On the other hand - Green and Parsons' fell totally flat for me. I don't think it was all that innovative and they had pretty bad levels here too (for them). I don't know they didn't bring the chemistry and excitement that I think they're capable of. I'd give MIDA choreography so far a C+ - needs improvement and some fresh ideas.
The biggest failure (for me) in Hawayek and Baker's RD is the lack of speed. A latin number (where ever it is performed) should NEVER be slow, dull and G-rated.
 

Karen-W

Neither sexy nor sultry, but loving life!
Messages
23,075
The biggest failure (for me) in Hawayek and Baker's RD is the lack of speed. A latin number (where ever it is performed) should NEVER be slow, dull and G-rated.
Oh, please. Why are you fixated on a Latin number not being G-rated? You want something more than that from the Browns or the Taschlers? And what about Lajoie/Lagha's Rio FD? That was entirely G-rated. It wasn't, for me personally, that great, but plenty of people loved it around here.

Hawayek/Baker were definitely slow in the last third of the program and it left a rather flat impression, but as others have pointed out, they usually gain speed and stamina as the season progresses, so I'm not ready to give up on it yet.
 

layman

Well-Known Member
Messages
497
Oh, please. Why are you fixated on a Latin number not being G-rated? You want something more than that from the Browns or the Taschlers? And what about Lajoie/Lagha's Rio FD? That was entirely G-rated. It wasn't, for me personally, that great, but plenty of people loved it around here.

Hawayek/Baker were definitely slow in the last third of the program and it left a rather flat impression, but as others have pointed out, they usually gain speed and stamina as the season progresses, so I'm not ready to give up on it yet.
Get your mind out of the gutter. Obviously siblings can't do sexy but they can do fun and fast. I would have been happy if Hawayek and Baker at least showed that (but they don't). Furthermore, Hawayek and Baker are not siblings (so their options are not limited).
 

Karen-W

Neither sexy nor sultry, but loving life!
Messages
23,075
Get your mind out of the gutter. Obviously siblings can't do sexy but they can do fun and fast. I would have been happy if Hawayek and Baker at least showed that (but they don't). Furthermore, Hawayek and Baker are not siblings.
You're the one with your mind in the gutter, since you're the one claiming that a Latin program shouldn't be G-rated. Anything beyond G-rated would require some level of Parental Guidance (PG) and, therefore, be questionable for a sibling team to perform (which I realize Hawayek/Baker are not, but I was speaking in generalities and, specifically, referenced two sibling teams on the GP), wouldn't it? G-rated does not mean it can't be fast or fun, but you seem to not understand that distinction.
 

topaz

Well-Known Member
Messages
15,040
I may be alone in this opinion, but I like McNamara/Spiridonov 's RD more than any other US team I've seen so far this season.
 

PRlady

Well-Known Member
Messages
41,318
So i watched the two US teams and Danadians.

I think the H/B take is funny and could be hilarious, it’s very 1940s Carmen Miranda. They don’t do well with vanilla programs and this will suit them fine with more mileage.

The Danadians OTOH can play to their sexy sultry strengths and do. Laurence in that dress would be enough to make me change teams if Nik wasn’t also so gorgeous. Also will be great in a few outings.

Green/Parsons seem…generic. There’s nothing specific to them in that dance.
 

AJ Skatefan

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,823
So i watched the two US teams and Danadians.

I think the H/B take is funny and could be hilarious, it’s very 1940s Carmen Miranda. They don’t do well with vanilla programs and this will suit them fine with more mileage.

The Danadians OTOH can play to their sexy sultry strengths and do. Laurence in that dress would be enough to make me change teams if Nik wasn’t also so gorgeous. Also will be great in a few outings.

Green/Parsons seem…generic. There’s nothing specific to them in that dance.
I just watched them too. Agree with all your points. And that they all need more mileage
 

Wyliefan

Slow, dull, and G-rated
Messages
37,487
Just for fun, for those who've never seen it, here's the Cuban Pete number from "I Love Lucy." And now I really want Jean-Luc to ditch the black and get a shirt with sleeves like the drummer has here!

 

Karen-W

Neither sexy nor sultry, but loving life!
Messages
23,075
Just for fun, for those who've never seen it, here's the Cuban Pete number from "I Love Lucy." And now I really want Jean-Luc to ditch the black and get a shirt with sleeves like the drummer has here!

His black shirt does have ruffles on the sleeves, but they're so hard to see. I wouldn't get a shirt with sleeves like the drummer has, but I'd probably do the ruffles in a few contrasting colors - maybe the fuchsia and orange that make up the majority of her costume, or perhaps the green that's in her skirt.

BTW - I'm a bit shocked that Lucille Ball was able to show that much leg on a TV sitcom in the 1950s! The censors wouldn't even let the writers use the word "pregnant" when she was expecting Little Ricky (Desi Jr in real life).
 

AJ Skatefan

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,823
Just for fun, for those who've never seen it, here's the Cuban Pete number from "I Love Lucy." And now I really want Jean-Luc to ditch the black and get a shirt with sleeves like the drummer has here!

Funny, I thought of Ricky Ricardo and the Copacabana watching it!
 

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