I, Tonya

I am quite curious to see this movie. I hope we get a trailer soon, though I guess that just depends on whenever the movie will be released.
 
Scrufflet said:
I dismissed this movie until I read a review of it in The Toronto Star. And most shocking of all, the review was by Rosi DiManno!
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bardtoob said:
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...-hardings-rise-and-fall-and-fall-dimanno.html
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That is shocking - it was a surprisingly decent review. Even had a moment of self-criticism in there. Although, not to change the subject away from the movie or Tonya, but the one comment I found most surprising was that Nancy had battled an eating disorder. Apparently I missed that news (I actually wondered if it was right but googling shows it is)
 
^^ Re DiManno's review, I think it's stretching it a bit for DiManno to say that "judges rarely rewarded Tonya with the scores she deserved as a superb figure skater, one of only two women -- at that time -- to ever cleanly land a Triple axel jump in competition."

Despite the fact that favoritism and politics tend to always be involved in the scoring, Tonya was rewarded with a U.S. National championship win after she first landed that historic triple axel at the 1991 U.S. Nats. But Tonya did not wear the victor's crown very well.

Also, the summing up soundbites by DiManno do injustice to Tonya, Nancy and Oksana, but especially to Nancy (who btw was not exactly a pretty princess in a box, despite the sport's tendency to view her that way). Nancy is also not just an 'eliminated DWTS contestant.' She's in her 40s and she advanced fairly decently in that competition. After falling in love with and marrying her agent/manager post the 1994 Olympics, Nancy suffered through and overcame miscarriages to give birth to three healthy children. And she has hosted and appeared in a number of skating shows since retiring.
 
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@aftershocks I think part of DiManno's point is precisely that Tonya, Nancy, and Oksana were all painted into a corner by the media that forced them to play roles that did not match reality ... And they all sort of had hot mess lives as a result.
 
Read the Collider review and now I'm cautiously optimistic about this movie.

The review mentions The Price of Gold documentary from a few years back -- has somebody seen it? Is it worth hunting down?

Around Sochi, I remember hearing a podcast that discussed the media treatment Tonya got -- googled around a bit and found the episode here, in case somebody's interested -- but other than that, I haven't bumped into a lot of Tonya/Nancy stuff in the non-skating media over the last decade or so (I'm not in the US; it's probably different for the folks over there?)
 
Jot the Dot Dot said:
BINGO! If the fear is that such a subject for a movie would be too 'humdrum', what about some personal stories (Joannie Rochette competing two days after her mother died, Elizabeth Punsalan dealing with the news of her younger brother murdering their mother) that have that something extra? There were TV movies about the 'Orphan' Oksana Baiul, the Duchesnays, it's a sad state of affairs when scandal is the easiest road to big ratings.
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Why did you put orphan in quotes as if there was some doubt?? She was abandoned by her father as a small child and she lost her mother to ovarian cancer in 1991 when Oksana was just 13. Her father is dead too now so she is an orphan in every sense of the word.
 
nimi said:
I haven't bumped into a lot of Tonya/Nancy stuff in the non-skating media over the last decade or so (I'm not in the US; it's probably different for the folks over there?)
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Not necessarily. The event is part of our collective cultural psyche so you see the offhand reference to it here and there (usually as an analogy to some other point) and when a documentary or play or book comes out, it gets some publicity. But we haven't heard anything from Tonya in ages (she used to be in the news regularly around the time of US Nationals to the point where it became a joke) and Nancy is only in the news when she is promoting something, like when she was on Dancing with the Stars.

To get back to the article, I was annoyed at the ending. They made it seem like Tonya and Nancy's lives were shattered and they were failures. Nancy very clearly has moved on from this event. She has had numerous success gigs, is married and raising a family and seems happy. But her blurb was "battled an eating disorder and didn't win Dancing with the Stars. Talk about cherry picking to mislead!
 
MacMadame said:
To get back to the article, I was annoyed at the ending. (...) Talk about cherry picking to mislead!
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I've read some DiManno articles in the past where she displays a pretty advanced combination of cherry picking and concern trolling so originally I wasn't even going to read the article... but your post made me curious so I clicked the article link and...
And the aftermath?

Oskana sank into alcoholism, drunkenly crashing her car into a tree three years later.

Kerrigan battled an eating disorder. Just this past season, she was an (eliminated) contestant on Dancing With the Stars.
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Really. ELIMINATED CONTESTANT! Oh, the tragedy! :violin:
As we all know, not winning DWTS is totally comparable to battling eating disorders or alcoholism. Great framing.

So yeah... DiManno being DiManno. :blah:
 
MacMadame said:
To get back to the article, I was annoyed at the ending. They made it seem like Tonya and Nancy's lives were shattered and they were failures. Nancy very clearly has moved on from this event. She has had numerous success gigs, is married and raising a family and seems happy. But her blurb was "battled an eating disorder and didn't win Dancing with the Stars. Talk about cherry picking to mislead!
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Yeah I didn't care for that part at all -
I got distracted by verifying if the eating disorder was true and forgot to mention that I didn't care for that framing. My opinion that the review was decent was more focused on the rest of the article and was also probably judging against the low bar I've set for DiManno.
 
G*d, you guys are bitching about DiManno's review as if it is the main event.

And, yes, Nancy is fine despite being wacked for figure skating, Tonya is fine despite being wacked for everything else, and Oksana is a hot mess.
 
Erin said:
was also probably judging against the low bar I've set for DiManno.
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:lol: yes, there is that

I was also a bit annoyed about the whole "Nancy was the elegant ice princess" stuff. This is such a shallow interpretation of what happened. Yes, she was packaged that way but the package never quite fit and that lack of authenticity came out at times and IME explains some of the backlash she received over things like "Why?" and "This is so corny."
 
Sasha'sSpins said:
Why did you put orphan in quotes as if there was some doubt?? She was abandoned by her father as a small child and she lost her mother to ovarian cancer in 1991 when Oksana was just 13. Her father is dead too now so she is an orphan in every sense of the word.
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Sorry, you are right. I should have italicized it instead.
 
nimi said:
Really. ELIMINATED CONTESTANT! Oh, the tragedy! :violin:
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LOL. All but one of them is eliminated. What a silly thing to point out. Nancy is a true survivor when you consider the impact (no pun intended) of something like that on the life of a young person. I'm proud of Nancy :)

I am looking forward to seeing this film. It's a relevant part of my personal figure skating world. Plus, I like Margot Robbie.
 
bardtoob said:
G*d, you guys are bitching about DiManno's review as if it is the main event.

And, yes, Nancy is fine despite being wacked for figure skating, Tonya is fine despite being wacked for everything else, and Oksana is a hot mess.
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:rofl: There's always 'bitching' though on FSU. And right you are it's the OGM winner who's the 'hot mess' naturally. It figures, and it's an example that demonstrates how the OGM is a worthy goal, but not a necessity, nor a magic remedy for a wonderful life. Be careful what you wish for. :lol: :drama:

Anyway, it's not a huge 'bitch' to point out that the summary soundbite at the tail end of DiManno's review is misleading. No biggie. :D It doesn't mean it's a bad review or that no one should go see the movie. Probably most of us are looking forward to seeing I Tonya.

ETA:
Dave discusses I Tonya movie around 14 to 15 minutes into TSL's latest video podcast. I didn't realize the documentary on Tonya way before the whack happened was a project produced by a student filmmaker.
 
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nimi said:
The review mentions The Price of Gold documentary from a few years back -- has somebody seen it? Is it worth hunting down?)
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Yes yes yes and YES!! If you get the "ESPN Classic" channel (coded ESPNC), the 30 for 30 episode of The Price of Gold is going to be on 9/23 at 1:30-3p EST. I've seen it a couple times, but its already programmed on my DVR to watch again.

ETA: I'm sorry Nimi, I just noticed you said you are not in the US so you probably don't have this channel. :( But it really is worth watching if you can find it online!
 
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Sasha'sSpins said:
Why did you put orphan (Orphan' Oksana Baiul) in quotes as if there was some doubt?? She was abandoned by her father as a small child and she lost her mother to ovarian cancer in 1991 when Oksana was just 13. Her father is dead too now so she is an orphan in every sense of the word.
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Ok, i did not start Baiul conversation, but for the record:

...technically Oxana is not an “orphan” even today, and her father did not “abandon” the family when she was 2. She still has a living step-father who “fathered her” when he married her mother. Her biological father did not pack up and leave, the Mother kicked him out for drinking.

Her parents married very young. He was a mechanic at a factory in Dnepropetrovsk. Like many in his circle, he drank, a lot. Came home late, very drunk, and brought his drinking buddies with him. Oxana’s mother, like most women in that situation in Russia/USSR, started locking him out of the apartment. He slept on a landing on the staircase, or went to his buddies’ homes, and DRANK more. Eventually Mother gave the standard ultimatum “chose: Vodka or Family”. He kept drinking, she filed for divorce. He became desperate, drank more, got fired from his job, and left town to live in a small town or village with his parents.

Mother knew where he was, but wanted nothing to do with him, rightfully so. She told Oxana “he abandoned/betrayed us” meaning “chose drinking over family”. Father’s mother and father (Oxana’s paternal grandparents) were still visiting Oxana on regular basis, brining candy and toys, visiting Oxana in parks and kindergarten.

Shortly after the divorce Oxana’s mother remarried, Oxana has a step-father, who she likes very much, Anatoly Direktorenko, and as far as I know still keeps contact with (info as of few years ago).

When Oxana’s mother died, Oxana’s biological father and grand-parents came to the funeral. At that time Oxana remembered mother’s view “that he valued booze more than family” and was not friendly to him. After the funeral she lost all contact with this side of the family. In later years she reconsidered and decided to find him. She could not locate him at first, made many phone calls, and finally asked her step-father Anatoly for help. Anatoly somehow kept contact with Oxana’s father, and found him immediately.

Oxana met her bio-father with a new attitude, very happy to have found him. Two years later he died, and Oxana buried him in a grave NEXT to her mother, saying “at least in death they will be together”.

Oxana did not mind the orphan-image, she said “American Press liked to give me Cinderella image, I guess it was good for PR”.
 
MacMadame said:
To get back to the article, I was annoyed at the ending. They made it seem like Tonya and Nancy's lives were shattered and they were failures. Nancy very clearly has moved on from this event. She has had numerous success gigs, is married and raising a family and seems happy.
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And Tonya too moved on and found happiness. I recall either a news clip or a documentary (think it was the latter) showing Tonya working as a landscaper, and she said she loved it because it was a very physical job, like figure skating. IIRC she was married, but I don't recall whether she had had any children.
 
Japanfan said:
IIRC she was married, but I don't recall whether she had had any children.
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Tonya married her current husband in 2010 and they had a child in 2011. When asked, Tonya said she married her current husband because he is a nice hard working guy that treats her well. There are a number of articles that quote someone saying, "real nice, blue-collar-type guy".
 
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Tinami Amori said:
Ok, i did not start Baiul conversation, but for the record:

...technically Oxana is not an “orphan” even today, and her father did not “abandon” the family when she was 2. She still has a living step-father who “fathered her” when he married her mother. Her biological father did not pack up and leave, the Mother kicked him out for drinking.

Her parents married very young. He was a mechanic at a factory in Dnepropetrovsk. Like many in his circle, he drank, a lot. Came home late, very drunk, and brought his drinking buddies with him. Oxana’s mother, like most women in that situation in Russia/USSR, started locking him out of the apartment. He slept on a landing on the staircase, or went to his buddies’ homes, and DRANK more. Eventually Mother gave the standard ultimatum “chose: Vodka or Family”. He kept drinking, she filed for divorce. He became desperate, drank more, got fired from his job, and left town to live in a small town or village with his parents.

Mother knew where he was, but wanted nothing to do with him, rightfully so. She told Oxana “he abandoned/betrayed us” meaning “chose drinking over family”. Father’s mother and father (Oxana’s paternal grandparents) were still visiting Oxana on regular basis, brining candy and toys, visiting Oxana in parks and kindergarten.

Shortly after the divorce Oxana’s mother remarried, Oxana has a step-father, who she likes very much, Anatoly Direktorenko, and as far as I know still keeps contact with (info as of few years ago).

When Oxana’s mother died, Oxana’s biological father and grand-parents came to the funeral. At that time Oxana remembered mother’s view “that he valued booze more than family” and was not friendly to him. After the funeral she lost all contact with this side of the family. In later years she reconsidered and decided to find him. She could not locate him at first, made many phone calls, and finally asked her step-father Anatoly for help. Anatoly somehow kept contact with Oxana’s father, and found him immediately.

Oxana met her bio-father with a new attitude, very happy to have found him. Two years later he died, and Oxana buried him in a grave NEXT to her mother, saying “at least in death they will be together”.

Oxana did not mind the orphan-image, she said “American Press liked to give me Cinderella image, I guess it was good for PR”.
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I know Oksana got together with her dad again before he died. But now both of her parents are dead. She's an orphan.

Thanks anyway for the very long post. I read the first few lines but had to stop.

Btw, in the Latin (or Roman alphabet if you prefer) Baiul spells her given name as Oksana with a K not Oxana with an X. She's spelled it that way since she was a kid.
 
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bardtoob said:
I might just go see I, Tonya because it is good for skating to get buzz despite telling myself I would never want to see another Tonya-Kerrigan TV expose.

It is also rare that skating movies gets such good reviews.

ETA: This clip from the movie is something else. Oy, if Tonya actually talked to the judges that way, then I get the perspective of some the real skating officials that are actually on this board from time to time who have commented on their personal interactions with Tonya.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLaajUKAxQg
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Darn. The clip was removed due to copyright claim.
 
Sasha'sSpins said:
Btw, in the Latin (or Roman alphabet if you prefer) Baiul spells her given name as Oksana with a K not Oxana with an X. She's spelled it that way since she was a kid.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but I think Oksana is Russian while Oxana is Ukrainian. Since Baiul is a Russian speaker who grew up in Odessa (a Russian-speaking part of Ukraine), it's understandable that she would use Oksana.
 
Russian and Ukrainian are both in the Cyrillic Alphabet, so "ks" vs "x" in the Latin Alphabet seems a bit moot.

... :shuffle: Oksana was also born and spent her formative years in Soviet Ukraine, which is not exactly post-Soviet Ukraine. I think the national identity of Soviet Ukraine was the Soviet Union and Russian was the prestigious defacto national language expected at school and work (actually "the language of inter-ethnic communication" as there was no state language) while Ukrainian was a local language that a Soviet child maybe understood because that is what they spoke at grandma's house.

Oksana may very will still think of herself as a former citizen of the Soviet Union, rather than a Ukrainian citizen, and probably recognizes her own name fluidly in either Russian or Ukrainian.
 
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Japanfan said:
And Tonya too moved on and found happiness. I recall either a news clip or a documentary (think it was the latter) showing Tonya working as a landscaper, and she said she loved it because it was a very physical job, like figure skating. IIRC she was married, but I don't recall whether she had had any children.
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As was mentioned, she has a son. I would say that for a long time after The Whack, she was getting into trouble constantly and making poor decisions. So a "where is she now" that was sweetness and light wouldn't be accurate either. But she seems to have eventually moved on at some point and that would be worth mentioning.

VIETgrlTerifa said:
Would Tonya really have said that in practice ice with other people around?
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At least part of the dialog was something she was known to have said at some event. Not the sucking my d*ck part but one of the earlier phrases. (I can't go back and quote it because the clip is gone.)
 
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