Figure skating in the United States is on thin ice

skylark

Well-Known Member
Messages
339
I think it must be this show - Skating's Next Star

I never saw it or even recall it, but that's unfortunate that the judges were awful to them. I know some of the skaters were national level competitors!
Goodness. I followed the link, and then looked up the winner. Her name was Kristen Treni, and after she won the show, she was so exhausted that she almost quit her professional skating career (she was 26 at the time). She turned down multiple professional skating opportunities in the weeks after the show, but finally recovered some energy and earned and accepted a leading role in High School Musical on Ice. That show, Skating's Next Star, must have been brutal ... if I'm reading it correctly, the whole six-week show, with competitions in a different category each show, was filmed in the period of several days. It sounds rather horrifying ... and then the emotional cost of being criticized in such a mean way. Whew.

 

Lemonade20

If I agreed with you, we’d both be wrong.
Messages
2,379
Another thing that I personally hate but recognize as a factor is that rivalries really help. It's not my thing but it is pretty much undeniable that the Battle of the Brians, the Battle of the Carmens, Harding/Kerrigan, Kwan/Lipinski, Medvedeva/Zagitova now in Russia - all that stuff really pushes interest. Chen/Hanyu doesn't seem to quite have the same push and I wonder if that's because of Chen's SP issue making Pyongchang pretty much a foregone conclusion, so that it didn't take off as a pivotal rivalry in the US where people tend more to tune in for the Olympics. And it's sort of one-sided I guess? The Hanyu fans seem really intense about it but I don't get the impression there is this huge Nathan Chen stan community that is obsessed in the same way, maybe he is just so laid-back and chill that it rubs off on his fans! Even the Pasha/Usova/Zhulin stuff brought ice dance a lot of attention. What I don't like is that it takes a toll on the skaters. It brings fans in, but it also brings a lot of negatives. It's a tough balance.
You're exactly right. People love drama and rivalries. There's nothing really of interest right now except with the Russians. Skaters today also just doesn't have the charisma and big personalities too. I remember how Katarina Witt dominated the 80s, people loved her because she was not just beautiful but very mysterious too. G&G was iconic as well and dominated for years.
 

Frau Muller

From Puerto Rico…With Love! Not LatinX!
Messages
22,096
You're exactly right. People love drama and rivalries. There's nothing really of interest right now except with the Russians. Skaters today also just doesn't have the charisma and big personalities too. I remember how Katarina Witt dominated the 80s, people loved her because she was not just beautiful but very mysterious too. G&G was iconic as well and dominated for years.

But then you get a Peggy Fleming who had almost no “personality” marketed...just sheer beauty. (Not that Peggy doesn’t have a great personality. The public finds that out later.)
 

Frau Muller

From Puerto Rico…With Love! Not LatinX!
Messages
22,096
I only know that the one regulation ice rink in DC proper (Ft Dupont) is very out-of-the-way and in the middle of high-crime area. I tried going once by public transport, with a walk up a steep road for the last 15 minutes, and was lucky to be alive at the end!
 

gkelly

Well-Known Member
Messages
16,441

I haven't been aware of that particular program. They seem to be focusing more on inline skating during the YKW.

I do know a little about the Fort Dupont Ice Arena. They offer figure skating programs at recreational levels for a low cost (subsidized by donations), but the programs aren't really designed to prepare skaters for competitive levels.

 

giselle23

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,729
I think casual skating fans want to see what casual fans of any sport want to see -- people who love their sport do great things in it. Look at Elladj Balde -- he's getting millions of views because he's showing how much he loves skating, and how good he is at it.

With judging, I still think it's really not hard for commentators to put some graphics explaining basic elements, and how they are judged. Like "jumps are judged based on how they take off, position in the air, how well it is landed, and the risk factor of the jump.
A skater can fall, but still earn points based on anything that was done well."
I noticed that Russian TV puts the average PCS for each component on the screen when showing the score. See that they are mostly 8s or 9s is more understandable than seeing a total PCS of 33 or whatever.
 

Theatregirl1122

Needs a nap
Messages
30,011
The National Intercollegiate Team Final is usually held each spring (link to goes to the 2019-20 season team competition results; Final was cancelled last year): https://www.usfigureskating.org/skate/skating-opportunities/collegiate-skating

ETA that figure skating is a club, not varsity, level sport at U.S. colleges and depends on interested students to run/organize their respective clubs in order to participate in these intercollegiate competitions.

This IG account was started by USFS in November 2020: https://www.instagram.com/uscollegiateskating/

So one thing that makes it possible for a sport to be varsity is frequent intercollegiate competitions. I don't think competing four times a year will do it. They'd need like weekly competitions between two schools the way gymnastics does. Club sports cannot offer scholarships at all. Right now skating at a college level doesn't seem like it's really formatted in a way that is similar to the way an NCAA sport works.
 

Aussie Willy

Hates both vegemite and peanut butter
Messages
27,871
I have not read the article yet. I plan on reading it in the next 24 hours Max, but as soon as I saw the title, I was surprised.

Why is it seen in a negative light? The US is almost guaranteed a gold in men in worlds and the next Olympics, May be longer. They have a great chance of winning at least one medal in Ice dance at the next world and Olympics.

The US was never strong in pairs. It was very strong in Ladies for decades. The drop off has been in just one discipline- ladies. It is not like they digressed. It is just that Japan and Russia got ahead, way ahead of them. US ladies dominated for decades. Now it could be Russia’s turn In Ladies. Russia/USSR were very strong in pairs, ice dance, and for a decade in men. They have dropped off in men.

These things go in cycles. I see no reason to panic. If they are talking about popularity of the sport, it was always popular among a very small fraction of fans. It will never be like football, Baseball, basketball, or even Tennis.

Now I am curious to read what the article says.
I totally agree. Out of all the discussion points to me this makes the most sense.

I only watch skating because I am involved with it. If I didn't I would just be like every other casual fan who sees it during the Olympics or it came up in my Youtube feed. The same goes for Gymnastics. Again I watch because of the Olympics or Youtube. I really don't go looking for it unless I have to.
 

Vash01

Fan of Yuzuru, T&M, P&C
Messages
55,380
I finally read the whole article and was unimpressed (sorry Claire, I still appreciate you posting this).

I have so many disagreements that it is hard to lit’s them in one post.

The first disagreement is about the judging system. The writer laments the loss of the 6.0 system, which she claims was easy to understand. She doesn’t like numbers. Didn’t we hear for years that the convoluted 6.0 system was difficult to understand for casual fans and they understand numbers? Like 90.5 is greater than 88.5 ?
I personally have no problem with either system but I don’t believe in blaming the IJS for US skaters not winning gold. Actually Davis &White did win the OGM and Nathan Chen is likely to win, because he can land quads - something that the writer hates.

I suspect the article focuses too much on US ladies not winning gold. I know there are other issues mentioned and I will address those in a separate post.

I am going to stop here and continue after sometime to talk more about the article.
 

olympic

Well-Known Member
Messages
10,892
I find the hairdos for lady figure skaters to have a fascinating history. After all, it is a sport and hair can get in the way, but ladies are supposed to be glamorous or historically look ladylike. I like the Aquanet look of the 64 and 68 Olympic podiums :lol: and did anyone notice that the entire 72 podium was pixie cuts? What was that all about? Julie Holmes probably missed the podium because she refused to part with the Aquanet look :lol: . And the 76 podium was also all short, sensible haircuts. The 80s podiums were more high-hair as a part of an overall more garish, glamorous look: Witt's hair accessories, braids, and buns, US lady perms. Honorable mention to Jill Trenary for THAT. She needs to sit w/ TSL And they need to ask her about her hair choices :lol: . Brief interlude of more athletic ponytails but w/ a permed pine cone or bear claw front in the early 90s (Yamaguchi, Ito, Harding). Oksana Baiul held on to an egregiously outdated perm, bolstering a stereotype in the West of Eastern European fashion sensibilities at the time. Nancy Kerrigan began to show us the sophistication of the bun, followed by Kwan later in the 90s
 

Frau Muller

From Puerto Rico…With Love! Not LatinX!
Messages
22,096
AQUANET - LOL!!! I’m guilty...esp the ‘80s version, like Jill Trenary’s. Even coach Christa Fassi sported it. Believe me, not even a hurricane could move one hair out of place!!! 💨 Those bangs & puffs were like steel sculpture.
 

Lemonade20

If I agreed with you, we’d both be wrong.
Messages
2,379
Was there ever a 10.0 system or was that only at world professional competitions?
 

tony

Throwing the (rule)book at them
Messages
17,677
Was there ever a 10.0 system or was that only at world professional competitions?
6.0 is based on the six tracings in compulsory figures, and was around for over 100 years prior to it going away in 2004.

10.0 was just an easier system for fans to understand, even if the majority of the pro competitions using that scale didn't really have much in the way of rules.
 

Doggygirl

Banned Member
Messages
11,107
Take for latest example, NBC universal gave me copyright strikes (that could lead to a complete channel delete) because of videos from 2014 US Championships (I could understand since it is their event) but ALSO deleted videos (not blocking) from Worlds 2017... wtf?? why??? it's an ISU event so why not blocking in their territory and let the casual fans from all over the world watch vintage stuff that belongs to the ISU and that the ISU seems to not care if it's shared

It's absolutely crazy the lengths these organizations are all going to to PREVENT people from watching this sport. And then they wonder why popularity diminishes. The time and resources they are expending would be better spent figuring out how to create even more value for advertisers in the "after market" when videos are shared. And then promote video sharing for the benefit of the sport AND the advertisers.
 

Simone411

To Boldly Explore Figure Skating Around The World
Messages
19,207
Take for latest example, NBC universal gave me copyright strikes (that could lead to a complete channel delete) because of videos from 2014 US Championships (I could understand since it is their event) but ALSO deleted videos (not blocking) from Worlds 2017... wtf?? why??? it's an ISU event so why not blocking in their territory and let the casual fans from all over the world watch vintage stuff that belongs to the ISU and that the ISU seems to not care if it's shared
It wasn't much longer after you received your copyright strikes when I finally received a copyright strike for an interview with Todd, Elvis, Michelle and Tara before the 1998 Olympics. All I was doing was sharing skating videos of various events from mainly the 1990's and early 2000's like the 1995 Vail Figure Skating show which included various skaters that competed at the 1994 Olympics.

I had included shows like the Fox Rock N Roll competitions, Improv-Ice, Great Skate Debate, etc. I remember when I signed into my channel, I was blocked at first with a notification regarding the copyright strike. It stated that I had to attend "Copyright School" before I could even access my channel. I was then threatened with my channel being deleted if I received one more copyright strike.

I immediately thought about what happened with you, and now they were giving copyright strikes for skating events, shows and competitions from the 1990's. I didn't wait around for them to delete my channel. I deleted it because I decided it wasn't worth having to worry about what was the next skating event or show from the past that would receive a copyright strike.

It was very hard for me to delete my channel, and I even cried because all I had wanted to do was share all the competitions and events that I had the pleasure of seeing through the years with others that might not have had the opportunity to see it.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top
Do Not Sell My Personal Information