Chinese skating news & social media updates pt. 5, 2023 onwards

[DreamSkates]

Jin doesn't bring results. Why would CFSA want to pay for his expenses in Canada?

Maybe he doesn't have a coach on the rink side but Orser is still listed as his coach in ISU bio and he came to COC.

Maybe they do have some agreements about coaching online?

China doesn’t seem to have any other male Senior skaters ?

 

[Ka3sha]

Another reason could be if Rodin doesn't have the passport to participate internationally for China, but IDK the rules for the GP series there.

ETA: @Ka3sha says this, so whatever the rules of Russian Fed are：

Figure Skating Fed of Russia also updated their requirements for release not so long ago, so skaters stopped running away. Now a skater asking for release should have a citizenship or residence permit of the country he plans to represent. Anyway, the December meeting should be held soon, so we will get more information soon

Yudong won Chinese nationals, happy to see that, it was just plain better than Day (stupid to see the PCS flipped there, but whatever, skating and its scores both make about as much sense as the antivax movement). Zhiming finished 3rd.

I would say that Daiwei's component score should be rightfully ahead of other Chinese skaters, barring some huge disasters of course. He has the very decent basics and nice skating skills. Not Han Yan level yet, but with some work and improvements he can definitely get there.
Anyway, glad that Yudong had a much better result here after his CoC performances.

 

[On My Own]

I would say that Daiwei's component score should be rightfully ahead of other Chinese skaters, barring some huge disasters of course. He has the very decent basics and nice skating skills. Not Han Yan level yet, but with some work and improvements he can definitely get there.

I think his choreography is not very good, and scoring people on potential is never a good idea. Yudong did more interesting stuff in his program for me. I do think Day has better overall skating which I've mentioned before in the thread, but pcs is to be handed out on the day.

I also never thought Yan was all that artistic for much of his career. People are forgetting he had an entire phase between his senior debut and 2018 where he did recycled and boring Lori Nichol choreography, and his performance was non-existent outside his step sequences. If it takes Day the same 5-6 years to get to Yan's La La Land type choreography (which he did for two seasons before eventually settling into the performance), I say, ding him on PCS when required. That SP is especially bad.

ETA: Here, in case people think I'm making that up out of nowhere: https://youtu.be/foWl8KxHLVc?si=cJMU4RpxAAZssqyA&t=160 (and criticism of his spins, if you rewind, which I've noticed and said about Day too before... also haaaaaaaated his arms, just a rather poor dance line in much of that program)

ETA2: https://youtu.be/QbdGcZhJ9Wg?si=p9Ex8OQxdy8YLxfU&t=120

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[Sylvia]

You can find the information here:

Skating Scores: Latest Figure Skating Results, Scores, Rankings & Statistics

The best resource for Figure Skating scores and stats on the web.

skatingscores.com

Thanks @tony! Can't believe I forgot to check SkatingScores.com! Junior Nationals results (Nov. 13-15 in Jilin) are listed further down that page.

 

[farahfan]

Now a skater asking for release should have a citizenship or residence permit of the country he plans to represent. Anyway, the December meeting should be held soon, so we will get more information soon

When did they make that change?

 

[kwanfan1818]

Rule 109 (ISU) has long required citizenship or residency for all singles, but for only one partner on a Pairs or Dance team. That allows the other partner have a visa or passport for where the team trains, but is not required for the country the team represents.

However, Feds get to make up their own release rules in addition to the ISU rules.

 

[On My Own]

What do the Ice Dancies think of Xiao/He? I think they have nice basics, but they're so close in height that I can't help but think there are going to be problems in the future, and he's not 13 or something where one can hope for a growth spurt...

 

[farahfan]

Rule 109 (ISU) has long required citizenship or residency for all singles, but for only one partner on a Pairs or Dance team. That allows the other partner have a visa or passport for where the team trains, but is not required for the country the team represents.

However, Feds get to make up their own release rules in addition to the ISU rules.

Thanks for that info. Yeah I was thinking more about the paired disciplines. Two years is already a long time to wait. Residency usually takes longer…sounds tough on pairs.

 

[kwanfan1818]

There are countries, at least through periods, that give out citizenship like candy to elite athletes, regardless of ancestral ties. Presumably they will be where Pairs and Dance partner or teams continue to land.

 

[Karen-W]

So, I guess Sui's comeback is official...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1864980309281779844

 

[On My Own]

"Fresh noodles for Milan".

 

[On My Own]

Yihan did well!

 

[ginsengtea]

So, I guess Sui's comeback is official...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1864980309281779844

Do we think Hongbo Zhao would come out of retirement to coach them?

 

[On My Own]

Do we think Hongbo Zhao would come out of retirement to coach them?

Wenjing has already won everything, so there's no fear of missing out for her. If she wants to compete, let her compete. If she's not afraid of failure and is really only doing it for the joy of competing, well more power to her.

 

[farahfan]

Zhang/Huang just threw down 176 at the Junior GPF. Would China send them to the Asian Winter Games? I think they'd have a legit shot at bronze.

 

[Karen-W]

Zhang/Huang just threw down 176 at the Junior GPF. Would China send them to the Asian Winter Games? I think they'd have a legit shot at bronze.

They aren't senior age-eligible until next season.

 

[On My Own]

Well done to Zhang/Huang!

 

[hanca]

Do we think Hongbo Zhao would come out of retirement to coach them?

He may come out of retirement and skate with her, if Zeen Li doesn’t work out…

 

[On My Own]

Skating Scores: Latest Figure Skating Results, Scores, Rankings & Statistics

The best resource for Figure Skating scores and stats on the web.

skatingscores.com

Where/from whom does skating scores get its Chinese nationals results and protocols, does anyone know? Some strange names in here, like Song Nan being written as "nanningxia song" (or "gongmingsichuansheng cheng" not even sure who that is). Pretty clear bad machine translation.

 

[Sylvia]

^^^ SkatingScores.com provides a great (free) service to fans. I asked and got this reply back:
"Yes, thank you! Looks like some issues there. I will fix!! Bug reports are always welcome!!"

 

[On My Own]

Well, it provides a free service. Databasing should be done with accuracy. Are they sure the rest of the Asian names have been translated with accuracy?

 

[tony]

Well, it provides a free service. Databasing should be done with accuracy. Are they sure the rest of the Asian names have been translated with accuracy?

Why don’t you write to him on another form of social media and ask? The amount of work he puts in as a hobby— not an official ISU source— is unbelievably valuable for those who like statistics, and here we are with someone complaining about translations being pulled over incorrectly.

Oh, and not to mention, it’s a great source of showing judging anomalies and biases, too. As @Sylvia noted above, he’s more than receptive of bug reports and improvement ideas.

 

[On My Own]

and here we are with someone complaining about translations being pulled over incorrectly.

And here I am wondering why someone who databases stats couldn't see that nobody called "nanningxia song" exists in skating.

And here I am wondering what other mistakes this person might have made, not just when it comes to names, if he couldn't do such a basic review.

And here I am wondering why I shouldn't be caring about Asian names being written up improperly.

Question to you and the ones who liked your post, not that I will bother reading the answer, because your posts really make me want to cry out of boredom: how do you expect stats to exist when, as an example "nanningxia song" has all of one competition?

Not stats I tend to care about usually anyway.

 

[kwanfan1818]

I used to collect the high-level results from the isu results grids, not the protocols, in Excel, and it was hard enough to aggregate skaters' results from the transliterated official Roman-character names. I eventually gave up because of this.

It's a whole other level when the results are in another character set and not transliterated by the machine.

 

[tony]

And here I am wondering why someone who databases stats couldn't see that nobody called "nanningxia song" exists in skating.

Because a lot of it is probably auto-pulled and he doesn’t check every last sheet?

And here I am wondering what other mistakes this person might have made, not just when it comes to names, if he couldn't do such a basic review.

A basic review of a massive database? Maybe you can volunteer your time to check every last page for him instead of whining here about it?

And here I am wondering why I shouldn't be caring about Asian names being written up improperly.

No one said you shouldn’t care. It’s been suggested to write to him with mistakes you find, and it’s been relayed to you that he welcomes corrections. You’d rather make it much more dramatic here, like usual.

Question to you and the ones who liked your post, not that I will bother reading the answer, because your posts really make me want to cry out of boredom:

Thank you.

Not stats I tend to care about usually anyway.

And there we are, another person perpetually mad about things they don’t ‘tend to care about’.

 

[On My Own]

I don't know if @Axel Rittberger visits here these days but I just wanted to post a BIG THANK YOU 7 years later for all you've done with your invaluable database that so many of us fans (and even journalists

) use on a regular basis!

Well I hope to see the journalists reporting on this legend-level Chinese skater Nanningxia Song who only ever appeared at one senior nationals and beat all the others and then disappeared off the face of earth.

I don't know why we care about whether or not Dai "Daiwei" is the next Yan Han. I want to know who the next Nanningxia Song is.

 

[Private Citizen]

And here I am wondering why someone who databases stats couldn't see that nobody called "nanningxia song" exists in skating.

Automated pull / feed, I'm sure.

Question to you and the ones who liked your post, not that I will bother reading the answer, because your posts really make me want to cry out of boredom: how do you expect stats to exist when, as an example "nanningxia song" has all of one competition?

Question to you: have you ever managed a big database or spent any time cleaning data? These issues happen all the time: literally every day in my world. It's a whack-a-mole game of keeping the data clean. Automated checks can do only so much. Expecting 100% clean data in a database of this size is unrealistic. Submit a bug report. This is the way it works in the real world, even with large professional data teams. Analysts find mistakes, they submit a ticket, engineers fix them. Done. Until the next time.

 

[On My Own]

These issues happen all the time: literally every day in my world.

Right. And therefore, it makes sense to point it out somewhere, and question if it's a translation error, and if there are more like it around on a website that claims to do databasing and producing stats out of said database.

Neither of my initial two posts was meant to be shady, and I wasn't pointing out the possibility of its being a translation error for no reason. If they took it otherwise, well that's their problem. Not mine, really.

If you noticed, after "Nanningxia Song" was fixed, Nan Song's entry now contains his results from 2009 Nationals and the elements he performed there. Thereby making the database more accurate and the stats more complete.

Here's more BTW:

And here I am wondering what other mistakes this person might have made, not just when it comes to names, if he couldn't do such a basic review.

Skating Scores: Latest Figure Skating Results, Scores, Rankings & Statistics

The best resource for Figure Skating scores and stats on the web.

skatingscores.com

Misha Ge of China, who competed only in 2009 Chinese Nationals.

Expecting 100% clean data in a database of this size is unrealistic.

Good thing I wasn't, then, until someone told me I was "complaining about translations being pulled over incorrectly". Would say someone who's pointing out that it's a "valuable resource" should understand why translation errors - or whatever the bug was here - are important to be pointed out somewhere, as is the question about whether it's affected more than just this particular nationals' entry.

Automated pull / feed, I'm sure.

I don't really agree here, BTW. Not that I care enough to argue on this website, but at least for us, when we do a project, we make sure that the entries/results/whatever make sense. Eyeballing something so simple - the names, and Misha Ge from China - shouldn't be considered out of the ordinary.

 

[tony]

Neither of my initial two posts was meant to be shady, and I wasn't pointing out the possibility of its being a translation error for no reason. If they took it otherwise, well that's their problem. Not mine, really.

Here's more BTW:

Skating Scores: Latest Figure Skating Results, Scores, Rankings & Statistics

The best resource for Figure Skating scores and stats on the web.

skatingscores.com

Misha Ge of China, who competed only in 2009 Chinese Nationals.

Because he did compete in China that season and then switched to Uzbekistan. So all of his (result)s for that one country are listed correctly there. It sounds like you're trying to provide another error when this one is, in fact, not.

I don't really agree here, BTW. Not that I care enough to argue on this website, but at least for us, when we do a project, we make sure that the entries/results/whatever make sense. Eyeballing something so simple - the names, and Misha Ge from China - shouldn't be considered out of the ordinary.

See above. And yes, "we" as in a group of people working on something in your case. Write to him and tell him you'll volunteer your free time to help "him" - as in one person - with this database.

 

[On My Own]

It's always fun to read the posts of someone who claims six decades worth of skating knowledge yet can't figure out that Kagiyama has a Flutz.