CAS rules Valieva can compete - reactions/fallout, plus some details from the hearing

[overedge]

Oh, really? It's all over the news whether through TV, the web and published news sources. You'd have to have your head in the sand not to know.

That's what I meant

 

[Tahuu]

Have you checked with them? I'm pretty sure that at least two of them would like to receive the CORRECT medal, judging by the fact that Wakaba Higuchi liked the USOPC statement tweet and Chris Knierim has also tweeted on the subject (but maybe he hasn't communicated with his wife on the topic yet).

Simple logic. Getting your silver and bronze now on site will make not harm to getting your gold or silver later off site, comparing to getting your gold or silver later off site. What if the final ruling were ROC retain their gold and USA and JPN get their silver and bronze? IOC's decision just deprives of the moment of the clean athletes.

 

[Skibean]

I don't think withholding medication from a sick child is something to be proud of.

What's going on isn't fair to any of the skaters, and whatever happens next, I hope it will lead to changes that will be in their best interests.

Alysa’s father is making a good point. When you are the parent of an athlete you are well aware if the banned substances and steer clear of them- even if you Child is ill. Alysa is young, but even she understands banned substances. I’m not sure why he would be vilified for following the rules. I’m sure he gives Alysa meds that aren’t on the list of banned substances. He isn’t the one in the wrong in this situation.

 

[sk9tingfan]

That's what I meant

OK. Sorry. I misread you.

 

[Tesla]

I don't think withholding medication from a sick child is something to be proud of.

I don’t think Arthur is proud of that. The impression I got was that he was afraid to give Alyssa medicine for fear of a doping suspension.

 

[MacMadame]

I don’t think Arthur is proud of that. The impression I got was that he was afraid to give Alyssa medicine for fear of a doping suspension.

And if you have a cold or the flu, no medicine will cure you. It's about relieving symptoms. I'd rather skaters didn't relieve their symptoms and therefore didn't compete than that they dope themselves up so they can grit their teeth and get through their programs. Alternately, they can use natural methods to relieve their symptoms

 

[Mayra]

To be fair, the team medal ceremony, excluding Team ROC, with Team USA getting silver and Team JPN bronze, and women's medal ceremony, excluding Valieva, should be presented and broadcasted to the world.

The CAS decision was made. The IOC has decided not to award the medals. There is no right answer anymore, and there is no fairness left.

Every day that goes by, the powers that be just keep adding insult to injury to all the athletes involved. At this point symbolic medal ceremonies with excluded athletes will just add to the circus show this has become.

I'm sorry for the athletes who have had their Olympic experience completely hijacked.

 

[aka_gerbil]

And if you have a cold or the flu, no medicine will cure you. It's about relieving symptoms. I'd rather skaters didn't relieve their symptoms and therefore didn't compete than that they dope themselves up so they can grit their teeth and get through their programs. Alternately, they can use natural methods to relieve their symptoms

You can take tamiflu if flu is diagnosed early enough, but that’s a prescription antiviral. I’m presuming not on the prohibited list or very easy to get a TUE for.

Advil and Tylenol are fine to take. You can get simply saline to irrigate a stuffy nose (sterile to avoid brain eating amoebas). I’d imagine vicks vaporub is probably fine too.

 

[Winnipeg]

This is so unfair to all the athletes. One cheating athlete wrecks it for everyone else??

Wow, I am not surprised given the accused but still angry. I am sure if it was an athlete from a lesser known place, they would be out.

Everyone has to follow the rules period. It should be black and white and consistently applied without question.

Otherwise, what's the point of having the rules. Alternatively throw out the rules altogether and let 'em go at it and take whatever. At least we would know it was an even playing field albeit a bad one.

I remember one Olympics when the US ladies Gymnastics team was disqualified because the East Germans pointed out that the US alternate was touching a mat near the parallel bars which was not allowed. The girl was nowhere near touching or helping the girl on the bars (which was the context of the rule) but the rule is the rule regardless of the context (in this case) and the US lost the bronze which allowed 4th place EG to advance to the podium.

I recall a very young (minor, yes minor) Romanian gymnast who lost the all around gold medal because she failed a drug test due to a cold medicine. That case was clear cut. No -one complained that she was held accountable and DQ. I can't imagine how she must feel at the inconsistent and seemingly arbitrary application of supposed drug rules by the governing authority.

 

[Tesla]

I am sure if it was an athlete from a lesser known place, they would be out.

An athlete from any other country would be out.

 

[Winnipeg]

An athlete from any other country would be out.

ITA!!!

 

[sk9tingfan]

This is so unfair to all the athletes. One cheating athlete wrecks it for everyone else??

Wow, I am not surprised given the accused but still angry. I am sure if it was an athlete from a lesser known place, they would be out.

Everyone has to follow the rules period. It should be black and white and consistently applied without question.

Otherwise, what's the point of having the rules. Alternatively throw out the rules altogether and let 'em go at it and take whatever. At least we would know it was an even playing field albeit a bad one.

I remember one Olympics when the US ladies Gymnastics team was disqualified because the East Germans pointed out that the US alternate was touching a mat near the parallel bars which was not allowed. The girl was nowhere near touching or helping the girl on the bars (which was the context of the rule) but the rule is the rule regardless of the context (in this case) and the US lost the bronze which allowed 4th place EG to advance to the podium.

I recall a very young (minor, yes minor) Romanian gymnast who lost the all around gold medal because she failed a drug test due to a cold medicine. That case was clear cut. No -one complained that she was held accountable and DQ. I can't imagine how she must feel at the inconsistent and seemingly arbitrary application of supposed drug rules by the governing authority.

More recently, Sha'Carri Richardson who smoked pot after losing her biologic mother before the summer Olympics was bumped from competition. she owned up to it very publicly as an error in judgment and took her suspension without further comment.

Sha’Carri Richardson, who missed the Tokyo Games, asks why a Russian skater can compete after failing a doping test. (Published 2022)

Richardson, the sprinter who lost her spot on the U.S. team after testing positive for marijuana, asked for a “solid answer” on the difference between her case and Kamila Valieva’s.

t.co

 

[Vagabond]

One cheating athlete wrecks it for everyone else??

It isn't clear that there is a cheating athlete. It seems far more likely that one or more people close to Valieva cheated and that Valieva was either wholly unaware or misled. And if they were in her "entourage," to use the vogue term, then they have wrecked it for their own as well for everyone else.

And, oh, how I love Eteri Tutberidze's being reduced to being "someone in Valieva's entourage"!

 

[Karen-W]

It isn't clear that there is a cheating athlete. It seems far more likely that one or more people close to Valieva cheated and that Valieva was either wholly unaware or misled. And if they were in her "entourage," to use the vogue term, then they have wrecked it for their own as well for everyone else.

And, oh, how I love Eteri Tutberidze's being reduced to being "someone in Valieva's entourage"!

Vagabond - it doesn't matter how the drug got into her system. Once it is there, she has a doping violation. Athletes are absolutely accountable for what goes into their bodies. There isn't really any grey area and I fail to understand why anyone is trying to excuse her.

 

[antmanb]

Do we think there might be booing during the SP? I mean it all officials and athletes but you have to reckon a lot of athletes are pissed at this decision.

 

[coppertop1]

I understand why Richardson is aggrieved, but she's an adult and Valieva isn't.

Has there been an equivalent case with an athlete who is a protected person at this level of competition?

If fifteen is old enough to compete at the Olympics, it's old enough to play by the same rules. If it isn't then fifteen year olds shouldn't be at the Olympics. It can't be both ways.

 

[skategal]

Do we think there might be booing during the SP? I mean it all officials and athletes but you have to reckon a lot of athletes are pissed at this decision.

I wondered that too.

Also I was thinking if this was an ordinary Olympics with fan spectators, I bet you would get a few banners with some choice slogans on them.

 

[Wyliefan]

Do we think there might be booing during the SP? I mean it all officials and athletes but you have to reckon a lot of athletes are pissed at this decision.

I've been wondering that too. This could get extremely awkward.

 

[altai_rose]

I recall a very young (minor, yes minor) Romanian gymnast who lost the all around gold medal because she failed a drug test due to a cold medicine. That case was clear cut. No -one complained that she was held accountable and DQ. I can't imagine how she must feel at the inconsistent and seemingly arbitrary application of supposed drug rules by the governing authority.

Didn't Raducan get to keep her Olympic team and event final medals?

ETA - per Wikipedia, Raducan's positive drug result during the all-around was known prior to the event finals, yet she was still allowed to compete in the event finals. That's actually more lenient than the situation with Valieva...

Speculations around the all around gold arose and Andreea was informed that there was a possibility that she could be stripped of her all around gold medal. This affected her mentally and she went to the floor final fazed by the situation. She fell on her third tumbling pass, and received a score of 9.275. Without that error, she would have scored a 9.775, which was enough for the bronze medal.

 

[jeffisjeff]

Do we think there might be booing during the SP? I mean it all officials and athletes but you have to reckon a lot of athletes are pissed at this decision.

If people in the arena want to protest, perhaps if she ends up first after the SP, and thus skates last in the LP, they could just leave after the 2nd to last skater? Seems like the best way to protest with minimal impact on other skaters. Booing could be upsetting to whoever skates after her.

 

[Vagabond]

Vagabond - it doesn't matter how the drug got into her system. Once it is there, she has a doping violation. Athletes are absolutely accountable for what goes into their bodies. There isn't really any grey area and I fail to understand why anyone is trying to excuse her.

It's a doping violation alright, and my personal opinion is that Valieva's results at Russian Nationals, Europeans, and the Winter Olympic Games should all be annulled. (Welcome to the podium, Adelia Petrosian!)

Winnipeg, however, said, "One cheating athlete wrecks it for everyone else??" From what little we know for sure, it is unfair to call Valieva a "cheating athlete."

This is conjecture on my part, but I anticipate that we will eventually learn Valieva was conditioned by her entourage to believe that they had her best interests at heart and not to question what they were doing. It's a common technique on the part of cults, abusers, and the like.

ETA:

 

[overedge]

I predict a mass bathroom break when she skates. I don't know if there's concession stands in the arena, but if there are, people might suddenly get very hungry.....

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Do we think there might be booing during the SP? I mean it all officials and athletes but you have to reckon a lot of athletes are pissed at this decision.

There’s not much of an audience though

 

[Karen-W]

There’s not much of an audience though

No, there isn't but most of the audience are other figure skaters and athletes. I think something like that would be very noticeable and felt, especially by the athlete.

 

[Xela M]

It isn't clear that there is a cheating athlete. It seems far more likely that one or more people close to Valieva cheated and that Valieva was either wholly unaware or misled. And if they were in her "entourage," to use the vogue term, then they have wrecked it for their own as well for everyone else.

And, oh, how I love Eteri Tutberidze's being reduced to being "someone in Valieva's entourage"!

She's 15 (almost 16) - not 5/6! Of course she knows she's doping

 

[quartz]

I’ve just looked at the short program schedule and I will need to be doing my hair and makeup for work right when the Russian women will be skating and finishing just as Kaori takes the ice. So, that’s how I’m dealing with it.

 

[Karen-W]

I’ve just looked at the short program schedule and I will need to be doing my hair and makeup for work right when the Russian women will be skating and finishing just as Kaori takes the ice. So, that’s how I’m dealing with it.

Lol. That works! I'll be in the bathroom when Kamila is on the ice and in the kitchen when Anna & Sasha skate.

 

[bladesofgorey]

She's 15 (almost 16) - not 5/6! Of course she knows she's doping

These kids at Sambo 70 have so much of their lives regimented and controlled by the coaching team and are so used to doing as they are told in order to be on top that I really don't think it's far-fetched to believe that they are given supplements and "vitamins" from their trainers to take all the time. I don't think it feels unusual to them and I don't think these young skaters think they are being doped, rather that they are being given helpful, healthy vitamins and recovery aids for their training.

Edited to add: this training group is like a cult imo, and methods are not questioned just obeyed. If the coach says to do something it's the correct way to do something. If the coach or doctor says to take a vitamin it's the correct vitamin to take. etc.

 

[her grace]

Shabotova’s statement indicates that the young teens know doping is going on. I’m unconvinced that Valieva was completely in the dark.

 

[miffy]

I don’t think skaters will boo, I expect silence - no cheering or clapping - which won’t have much effect as Team Russia will still cheer.

If there were fans I think there would be a lot of booing.