CAS rules Valieva can compete - reactions/fallout, plus some details from the hearing

[manhn]

So that’s a valid excuse not to hold the medals ceremony?

 

[Sylvia]

Bach talks about offering to meet with Japan and US starting at 11:50 into the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFUIIlpxWsQ
Per Bach: unlike previously reported the Olympic torches were not supposed to be a "replacement" for the medal ceremony. They were a thank you for meeting with them and offering constructive advice on what changes needed to be made going forward.

Japan declined the meeting on behalf of the athletes but I really wish they would have had the same opportunity as the US skaters too. Maybe they could have gotten torches too and, last but not least, had an opportunity to say what they would like to see happen in the future of figure skating.

Thanks.

AP article After skating debacle, Bach takes rare shots at Russians by Graham Dunbar:

After skating debacle, Bach takes rare shots at Russians

A worldwide wave of sympathy has flowed to Kamila Valieva for the ordeal she endured at the Beijing Olympics.

apnews.com

Minutes after Bach’s comments about Valieva’s team, a journalist wearing a Russian Olympic Committee team jacket questioned the IOC.
Did Bach, he asked, feel partly responsible for “media chaos” around Valieva that included “hate speeches ... bullying of a 15-year-old ... political propaganda?”
An untypically confrontational Bach replied with “the ones who have administered this drug in her body, these are the ones who are guilty.”
Bach generally withholds comments from ongoing investigations. On Friday, he directly contradicted Valieva’s lawyers’ arguments that the sample was accidentally contaminated by her grandfather’s heart medication.
Russian anti-doping officials are responsible for the doping case, but IOC and World Anti-Doping Agency officials have said they will also investigate. Whatever the findings, expect appeals and counter investigations that stretch out for months.

 

[MacMadame]

Zhulin just wrote an open letter to Bach on his instagram, slating him and telling him essentially to mind his own business, that Eteri who has trained multiple Olympic champions doesn't need his advice and the IOC ruined the girl etc etc...That they are targeting the Russians because they use Meldonium (which wasn't previously banned) and that it can stay in your system for years, then goes on to site Bobrova's case

Do they think it's mercury or something?

Just as classy as the Russian skier Veronika Stepanova writing on her social media today that the Swedish journalist (who accused her of cheating) should look inside her knickers - complete with a pic of herself in underwear

What does that even mean?

 

[Xela M]

Do they think it's mercury or something?


What does that even mean?

She said if he should look inside her knickers to check if she has a secret motor

 

[Sylvia]

Madison Hubbell and Zachary Donohue: 'We have our own empty medal box waiting in our room,' say US ice dancers left in limbo by Kamila Valieva case | CNN

Team USA ice dancers Madison Hubbell and Zachary Donohue say they have their "empty medal box waiting in our room," as they wait to receive their figure skating team event medal which has been postponed without a date in light of Kamila Valieva's ongoing doping case.

www.cnn.com

"We were really looking forward to sharing that Olympic moment together. It's an incredibly difficult situation for everyone involved, but certainly I don't think that it's fair to any of the athletes who medal that we have to forego that Olympic moment ... it's hard to go home empty-handed," Hubbell said.
Donohue added that he hopes the situation would be solved "as quickly as possible," both for the athletes and for the integrity of sport.
"We have a whole team of athletes that have finished competing and are staring looking at an empty box and the unknown of the future and missing out on that Olympics moment," Donohue said.

The two ice dancers were among the US skaters that met with International Olympic Committee (IOC) President Thomas Bach on Wednesday, which Bach described on Friday as "very fruitful."
Both Hubbell and Donohue said they appreciated meeting Bach to share their perspectives on the Valieva issue.
"We didn't leave the meeting feeling, I don't think any better about this situation, but at least you know, we had our chance to kind of say what it feels like to be an athlete in our shoes," Hubbell said.
Donohue confirmed that they have received Olympic torches from the IOC, which Bach earlier clarified was a "token of appreciation" for an honest meeting, not a consolation for a medal.

 

[Skibean]

Had Kamila medaled, would a medal ceremony even had mattered? It would have been a Russian sweep. The girls could have their own Ceremony in Russia.

That said, this was such a disturbing Olympics to watch. Makes me question what goes on with these young girls.

 

[muffinplus]

Russian vs US take on Valieva scandal:

https://youtu.be/SX_cxwu_GFA

 

[YukiNieve]

Russian vs US take on Valieva scandal:

https://youtu.be/SX_cxwu_GFA

I find this video quite interesting. She was born and grew up in Russia, was an athlete herself (rhythmic gymnastics), and explains the differences in the value systems and perspectives between non-Russian and Russian people about the expectations for the athletes or people in general - she explains well why Eteri's attitude for her students is not well-regarded outside Russia but is praised in Russia.

I'd also like to know how posters here with Russian background think about this video.
Listning to views from multiple perspectives is always helpful.

 

[TAHbKA]

The video makes some very valid points, however:
1. by the age of that woman she must be more or less my age, i.e. her experience is from the 80-90s and probably partly in the USSR.
2. Russia is big. As in hugely big. Things that are correct for Moscow are not correct for Arkhangelsk.

So all she says is probably true for the coaches and the journalists ( who are in their 40s and grew up in the USSR with exactly the values she is mentioning), however, it is probably not so true for the skaters, who were born in a different country (Russia, not USSR) 20-25 years later. So while the coaches and the journalists do mention all that `fighting for our country's respect' when talking about figure skating I frankly can't recall many skaters saying that.

 

[maatTheViking]

So now that the olympics are over, what happens next?

Is Valieva's case concluded with this finding, (she was temporary suspended for a day, but is allowed to compete?) or is there an additional investigation which will result in a ruling?

As discussed in the other doping thread, even accidental or non-intended doping tend to result in 12-24 months of suspension, so would that not be the case with Valieva?

what is the timeline of further investigation? and who will undertake it? RUSDA, since this was a sample from a Russian competition or WADA as she is an international athlete?

 

[TAHbKA]

If Valieva is disqualified it makes Scherbakova a world, european and Olympic champion. Hendrixks a European bronze medalist.
And dear god, Roman Sadovski an Olympic bronze medalist

 

[Trillian]

So now that the olympics are over, what happens next?

Is Valieva's case concluded with this finding, (she was temporary suspended for a day, but is allowed to compete?) or is there an additional investigation which will result in a ruling?

There will still be investigation and a final ruling that will likely determine the final outcome of her European and Olympics results, plus any other events she does in the meantime. Basically an asterisk on every result from 12/25 until a final ruling is made.

As discussed in the other doping thread, even accidental or non-intended doping tend to result in 12-24 months of suspension, so would that not be the case with Valieva?

Who knows. Generally an athlete is suspended while an investigation is pending and she wasn’t. The fact that Laura Barquero will likely not be able to compete at Worlds this year (at least) and Valieva likely will is… really something.

 

[screech]

Was the CAS ruling just specific to the Olympics? Can the ISU refuse her participation in Worlds?

 

[Mayra]

So now that the olympics are over, what happens next?

Is Valieva's case concluded with this finding, (she was temporary suspended for a day, but is allowed to compete?) or is there an additional investigation which will result in a ruling?

As discussed in the other doping thread, even accidental or non-intended doping tend to result in 12-24 months of suspension, so would that not be the case with Valieva?

The investigation continues. If Kamila's lawyers can establish no significant fault or negligence, WADA Code says...

10.6.1 Reduction of Sanctions in Particular Circumstances for Violations of Article 2.1, 2.2 or 2.6.

10.6.1.3 Protected Persons or Recreational Athletes
Where the anti-doping rule violation not involving a Substance of Abuse is committed by a Protected Person or Recreational Athlete, and the Protected Person or Recreational Athlete can establish No Significant Fault or Negligence, then the period of Ineligibility shall be, at a minimum, a reprimand and no period of Ineligibility, and at a maximum, two (2) years Ineligibility, depending on the Protected Person or Recreational Athlete’s degree of Fault.

what is the timeline of further investigation? and who will undertake it? RUSDA, since this was a sample from a Russian competition or WADA as she is an international athlete?

It's my understanding RUSADA will be handling this case. WADA and the ISU have the right to appeal to CAS if they disagree with how they applied WADA code and/or the suspension length.

No clue on the timeline on this, but I have to assume lawyers have been hashing this out? The question of sample B still remains unanswered as well.

My question is, if Kamila is allowed to skate at worlds, will there again be no medal ceremony if Kamila medals?

 

[Trillian]

It's my understanding RUSADA will be handling this case.

Ooh, very suspenseful, I wonder what they’ll decide.

WADA and the ISU have the right to appeal to CAS if they disagree with how they applied WADA code and/or the suspension length.

…And that’s the part that might take a while.

My question is, if Kamila is allowed to skate at worlds, will there again be no medal ceremony if Kamila medals?

There’s also the issue of prize money for many ISU events. It’s really a logistical nightmare.

 

[allezfred]

If a protected person can get away with a reprimand and no period of ineligibility for testing positive for a banned substance, then there is absolutely no real consequence for drugging up under age athletes.

 

[skategal]

I would think at least she will lose her Russian National title considering she tested positive from the sample taken during Russian Nationals, right?

 

[Karen-W]

I would think at least she will lose her Russian National title considering she tested positive from the sample taken during Russian Nationals, right?

Not if the punishment is merely a reprimand.

 

[Trillian]

I would think at least she will lose her Russian National title considering she tested positive from the sample taken during Russian Nationals, right?

Not if the punishment is merely a reprimand.

Yeah, Russia’s gonna Russia. Even if their ruling is eventually appealed and overturned, would that necessarily apply to a domestic event? I’m not assuming she’ll be stripped of that title regardless of what else happens.

 

[screech]

I would think at least she will lose her Russian National title considering she tested positive from the sample taken during Russian Nationals, right?

And Trusova would finally have a gold at an important senior level event

 

[Vagabond]

If Valieva is disqualified it makes.... Hendrixks a European bronze medalist.
And dear god, Roman Sadovski an Olympic bronze medalist

Every dark cloud has its bronze lining.

 

[MacMadame]

I can't believe CAS didn't limit the suspension of her suspension to just the period covered by the Olympics. There will be no "irreparable harm" from missing Worlds. It's not an every-four-year event.

 

[skatingguy]

If a protected person can get away with a reprimand and no period of ineligibility for testing positive for a banned substance, then there is absolutely no real consequence for drugging up under age athletes.

And then athletes can be doped up as much as they want prior to their 16th birthday as long as they don't test positive afterwords.

 

[Mayra]

I would think at least she will lose her Russian National title considering she tested positive from the sample taken during Russian Nationals, right?

I think RUSADA is going to try to appease the ISU/WADA by having the suspension include Russian Nationals and Euros(at maximum).

The Ministry of Defence of Russia is tweeting out amazing propaganda videos of a little girl being chased by skating's version of Dementors aka the West. I really don't see RUSADA extending any suspension to include the OGM the team won. It just wouldn't fit the narrative.

https://twitter.com/mod_russia/status/1494304905686835202?s=20&t=sxZ2Yl2myHUltE-YuA2q6g

 

[skategal]

Not if the punishment is merely a reprimand.

I’m assuming they might sacrifice Valieva’s Russian title to prove they have given her a punishment and to appease the other Russian skaters.

 

[barbk]

Banning her for a year seems reasonable and proportionate.

 

[screech]

I'd say even if she's banned for 6 months from the date of the sample. Meaning she would be able to compete in the GP series in the fall. It would negate her nationals, Euros and Oly's results, and keep her form Worlds, allowing her to start the new season with a 'blank slate' once she's of age to no longer be a protected person.

 

[Xela M]

On a slight side note, but if anyone has watched "Cheer" on Netflix- isn't the coach Monica just the American version of Eteri?! The vibe is so similar. It's just in competitive cheerleading rather than in skating

 

[myhoneyhoney]

On a slight side note, but if anyone has watched "Cheer" on Netflix- isn't the coach Monica just the American version of Eteri?! The vibe is so similar. It's just in competitive cheerleading rather than in skating

Not surprised since competitive cheer is cut throat. Girls have been murdered for cheer spots.

ETA: I think the one murder I was thinking of was NOT because she got a spot, she just happened to be a cheerleader in Florida. I do recall one Mom in Texas hired someone to kill a cheerleader because her daughter didn’t get the spot. Totally insane.

 

[On My Own]

https://twitter.com/mod_russia/status/1494304905686835202?s=20&t=sxZ2Yl2myHUltE-YuA2q6g

Not worse than Daniil's programs.