Royalty Thread #10 -Archie Phase 2 - Bold and Bald Still

[canbelto]

Oh FGS I suspect you are one of the very few who thinks that. It is very clear it is a deep respect for the culture and country and I'm pretty sure dialogue has gone back and forth between KP and the Pakistan authorities to determine nothing disrespectful or condescending is occurring. I would check out social media if I were you to see just how pleased and delighted many Pakistani's are with the tour and how the Cambridge's are handling the fine diplomatic line.

People who can't help who they are. William and Kate are very privileged white people. When they put on those costumes it looks like a 19th century world fair. "Oh those exotic dears. How darling!" I mean, seriously, let's be real here. How can Kate who's never had to worry a day in her life aboit anything relate to Pakistani villagers? So the point is to reduce the Marie Antoinette aspect of the tour. I just think when they act like the children are little dolls and wear those "cute" costumes it looks condescending.

 

[Lorac]

People who can't help who they are. William and Kate are very privileged white people. When they put on those costumes it looks like a 19th century world fair. "Oh those exotic dears. How darling!" I mean, seriously, let's be real here. How can Kate who's never had to worry a day in her life aboit anything relate to Pakistani villagers? So the point is to reduce the Marie Antoinette aspect of the tour. I just think when they act like the children are little dolls and wear those "cute" costumes it looks condescending.

You do realise that those are given to them by the elders of those villages as an honoured guest. To refuse to wear them would be seen as an insult!! Privilege has nothing to do with it - it's all about respect for the traditions of the places they are visiting.

 

[Vagabond]

@canbelto You are entitled to your opinions, but must they be such uninformed opinions?

 

[canbelto]

@canbelto You are entitled to your opinions, but must they be such uninformed opinions?

I dont think its uninformed to think that cultural appropriation can offend and look condescending.

 

[Vagabond]

I dont think its uninformed to think that cultural appropriation can offend and look condescending.

But to assume that what was going on was cultural appropriation is to impose your own cultural preconceptions. @Lorac has already explained one of the major weaknesses of your assumptions. You might also do some research on what the Viceroys used to wear on public occasions.

 

[ballettmaus]

A collection of photos of William and Kate in Pakistan:

I love the colors of the first four outfits!

 

[MsZem]

People who can't help who they are. William and Kate are very privileged white people. When they put on those costumes it looks like a 19th century world fair. "Oh those exotic dears. How darling!" I mean, seriously, let's be real here. How can Kate who's never had to worry a day in her life aboit anything relate to Pakistani villagers? So the point is to reduce the Marie Antoinette aspect of the tour. I just think when they act like the children are little dolls and wear those "cute" costumes it looks condescending.

Diplomatic dressing is a thing. It's typically taken as a sign of respect for the local culture.

Kate's experience differs from that of Pakistani villagers, but she is there to learn more about those experiences and to increase the visibility and impact of successful local initiatives. That's vastly more productive than whining about this trip on FSU.

 

[MacMadame]

Also, I’d be surprised if Kate “never had to worry a day in her life.” Being upper class doesn’t protect you from all of life’s problems. Rich people die of cancer, have marital problem, kids get sick, suffer from mental illness, just like the rest of us.

Plus, if it’s true Will cheated on her, then she has a least one problem I’ve never had.

Having privilege doesn’t mean you don’t have problems or worries.

 

[canbelto]

Kate has three beautiful kids, a husband who will be king, a rich family, tons more money herself, wait staff to take care of all her domestic needs, a great figure. I think if anyone had a perfect life it’s her. There’s no way she can have any problems.

 

[MacMadame]

When you say stuff like that, you sound like an immature teenager.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ Right. No one's life is perfect. Walk a mile in someone else's shoes. We all have challenges to face. That's what life is about. The question is not what happens to us, but how we go about managing and dealing with what happens to us. That's where character, upbringing and other factors come into the picture.

Breaking news!! Harry apparently told someone at a charity event that Archie is a ginger!!

"Harry said he definitely is, you can see it in his eyebrows..."

I just told you guys that in my previous post to @Winnipeg.

I'm not surprised. It will still be interesting to see the exact shade of Archie's full head of hair and how it might change over time. @taf2002, we discussed earlier how in some of the SA photos, Archie's hair appeared to be dark brown. But there was also one photo where the light was striking his head and red strands were clearly visible. Here's the photo. Ginger eyebrows and strands of red or ginger hair can be detected:

https://timedotcom.files.wordpress.com/2019/09/baby-archie-south-africa-tour.jpg

And now I'm wondering whether Archie's eyes are dark brown or dark green.

Here's video of Harry's WellChild speech in which he breaks down while speaking about becoming a father:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6lirNIerI4 Harry's speech starts at 2:14

The below video shows M&H arriving and talking with the children and their parents. The little girl with red hair and her Mom are shown laughing and talking with M&H around 3:11, so that must be when they were discussing Archie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utzwff6Fi-8

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[aftershocks]

The ITV documentary on M&H's South Africa tour is scheduled to air in Britain on October 20. Here's a very brief trailer on the ITV website, showing footage we haven't seen before of Harry holding Archie while Meghan kisses Archie on the forehead, apparently just before they walk over to visit with Archbishop Tutu and his daughter:

https://www.itv.com/presscentre/ep1week43/harry-meghan-african-journey

Tom Bradby is the ITV journalist who developed a close relationship with Harry over the years after working with him on several documentaries chronicling his charity work in Africa in his twenties and early thirties. Bradby and his wife Claudia (a jewelry designer), were guests at M&H's royal wedding. During the ITV coverage Bradby was briefly interviewed and he revealed interesting details about M&H's relationship during the period when public knowledge they were dating first broke:
https://youtu.be/fKPL2P_Yi4s?t=2053

Bradby's comments begin at 36:24 in the above clip:
"Being calm is unusual for Harry. He's a very emotional guy… He's a very kind, very lovely guy at heart. Meghan just calms him down…. After their relationship became public, her dog walker was being chased by the paparazzi. She wasn't used to that and she didn't understand the intensity. Harry was agitated because he really wanted to fix it for her… He asked me to meet with them and counsel Meghan about what to expect. Harry was obviously very in love with her, and he wanted to make sure it would be okay for her... She's really calmed Harry down. I think she's great for him."

 

[Japanfan]

Kate has three beautiful kids, a husband who will be king, a rich family, tons more money herself, wait staff to take care of all her domestic needs, a great figure. I think if anyone had a perfect life it’s her. There’s no way she can have any problems.

Princess Diana would be a case in point. In her case, all the privileges in the world did not compensate for a loveless marriage.

Also, I hardly think of royals having perfect lives. They are constantly under the scrutiny of the media and the public, and often have to follow rigorous schedules. Royals don't get to plead 'jet lag' because they look tired and worn on a certain day.

And in the case of women especially, they have to look a certain way while maintaining the decorum of royalty. Getting dressed and getting your hair done every would take a long time. I think their daily lives are quite rigid, right down to how many calories or carbs they consume.

I wouldn't want that life, regardless of the wealth and privilege I would get in return.

 

[ballettmaus]

Kate has three beautiful kids, a husband who will be king, a rich family, tons more money herself, wait staff to take care of all her domestic needs, a great figure. I think if anyone had a perfect life it’s her. There’s no way she can have any problems.

Are you serious?

 

[canbelto]

Are you serious?

Yeah. When I mean problems I don't mean she couldn't find the right fascinator for her coat dress. I'm talking about real, fundamental problems like no access to basic necessities, no food on the table, being gang raped and kidnapped (like it happened to two Pakistani girls five days ago), being ordered to be raped by the village council. In Pakistan 70-90% of women say they are the victim of domestic violence.

How can Kate relate to that? Seriously?

 

[ballettmaus]

Yeah. When I mean problems I don't mean she couldn't find the right fascinator for her coat dress. I'm talking about real, fundamental problems like no access to basic necessities, no food on the table, being gang raped and kidnapped (like it happened to two Pakistani girls five days ago), being ordered to be raped by the village council. In Pakistan 70-90% of women say they are the victim of domestic violence.

How can Kate relate to that? Seriously?

There are many of us who are privileged enough to not have those problems. That doesn't automatically make our lives perfect or devoid of problems. (And I guarantee you, there are probably an alarming number of women out there who don't have to worry about money but are victims of domestic violence and/or have been raped. Money doesn't protect you from either).

 

[MsZem]

Yeah. When I mean problems I don't mean she couldn't find the right fascinator for her coat dress. I'm talking about real, fundamental problems like no access to basic necessities, no food on the table, being gang raped and kidnapped (like it happened to two Pakistani girls five days ago), being ordered to be raped by the village council. In Pakistan 70-90% of women say they are the victim of domestic violence.

How can Kate relate to that? Seriously?

You can have empathy for others without sharing their lived experience.

Privileged people are not immune to difficulty - they can have medical issues, mental health challenges, unhealthy relationships, grief and more. #Metoo has brought us stories of many otherwise priveleged women who have nonetheless suffered. Kate's brother has been very honest about his struggle with depression, among other things. Privileged people have more resources available to address the challenges they face, but they are not always successful.

If you think the biggest challenge Kate has ever faced involves millinery, you're either being disingenuous or an idiot.

 

[taf2002]

@canbelto, it's not always cultural appropriation to "do as the Romans do". If you went into a Catholic church would you cover your head even if you weren't Catholic? When I went to Mexico City I took a scarf with me because I was planning to tour some of the beautiful churches there. Was I wrong? When people from Pakistan or India come to the US some of them wear Western clothes while here. Are they disrespecting Americans?

 

[Parsley Sage]

Many of Kate's clothes on this trip are by Pakistani designers. Months of preparation go into tours like this. Her clothes would have been sourced and approved ages ago.

As for Kate not having problems, she attended therapy sessions with her brother James when he was struggling with depression.

Kate and Pippa Middleton Joined Their Brother James's Therapy When He Was Struggling With Depression

James Middleton revealed that all of his family members had joined him for a session or two—even the royal one.

www.townandcountrymag.com

 

[ballettmaus]

As for Kate not having problems, she attended therapy sessions with her brother James when he was struggling with depression.

Kate and Pippa Middleton Joined Their Brother James's Therapy When He Was Struggling With Depression

James Middleton revealed that all of his family members had joined him for a session or two—even the royal one.

www.townandcountrymag.com

Apparently, that's not a real problems since she still had food on her table and wasn't beaten or raped.

 

[Japanfan]

There are many of us who are privileged enough to not have those problems. That doesn't automatically make our lives perfect or devoid of problems. (And I guarantee you, there are probably an alarming number of women out there who don't have to worry about money but are victims of domestic violence and/or have been raped. Money doesn't protect you from either).

And rich women can be at a particular disadvantage when they are victims of domestic violence or rape. They may live in relative isolation, alone with their families on large properties, with little recourse to turn to. In contrast, poor women are victims of domestic violence or rape may have the support of their communities, with fathers and brothers eager to wreak retribution.

In may countries in the world, it is not seen as possible for man to rape or harm his wife, given that a wife is a man's property. Those countries that do see marital rape or harm to a wife as a crime (which are very difficult to prove) did not always do so. Sadly, rape was and continues to be a common lived experience for women, not an exceptional experience.

 

[MLIS]

Sure, wealth and privilege can remove a lot of problems, or make it easier to deal with the problems you have. I've never worried about putting dinner on the table, either. But I can empathize with those who do, even without sharing the specific experience. And mothers are mothers the world over -- our concerns and fears for our children may be individually different, but the experience is universal, no matter how much money we have. We have more in common than we have differences. We can relate to each other. One thing I will say about Kate (and this is true of most members of the royal family) is she always looks completely engaged when she is talking to people and listening to their stories (and I have read reports that she is always running behind on engagements because she gets so caught up in talking to people). She seems genuinely interested in the people she meets, and I'm sure many of their stories stay with her and shape how she interacts with the world going forward.

 

[Vagabond]

Yeah. When I mean problems I don't mean she couldn't find the right fascinator for her coat dress. I'm talking about real, fundamental problems like no access to basic necessities, no food on the table, being gang raped and kidnapped (like it happened to two Pakistani girls five days ago), being ordered to be raped by the village council. In Pakistan 70-90% of women say they are the victim of domestic violence.

How can Kate relate to that? Seriously?

Can you?

 

[Winnipeg]

I don't think any kind-hearted, civilized person can relate to the raping of women. How is Kate any different? I am sure she would be equally appalled at what ever station in life she was in.

 

[mag]

This must have been a bit scary!

Prince William and Duchess Kate's Plane Forced to Abort Landing Twice

Prince William and Duchess Kate's plane was forced to abort landing twice due to an electrical storm in Pakistan on Thursday, October 17 — details

www.usmagazine.com

And some photos of Kate playing cricket.

Prince William and Kate bowl over royal fans on Pakistan tour

The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge take to the crease on the fourth day of their visit to the country.

www.bbc.com

 

[mag]

Yep, Kate wore clothes, must be a tribute to Diana

Kate Middleton, The Princess of Wales Latest News | HELLO! Magazine

Explore the latest news, photos, and fashion stories of The Princess of Wales, Kate Middleton. Dive deep into her royal journey with Prince William and their three children with our exclusive insights.

ca.hellomagazine.com

 

[AxelAnnie]

Princess Diana would be a case in point. In her case, all the privileges in the world did not compensate for a loveless marriage.

Also, I hardly think of royals having perfect lives. They are constantly under the scrutiny of the media and the public, and often have to follow rigorous schedules. Royals don't get to plead 'jet lag' because they look tired and worn on a certain day.

And in the case of women especially, they have to look a certain way while maintaining the decorum of royalty. Getting dressed and getting your hair done every. I their their daily lives are quite rigid, right down to how many calories or carbs they consume.

I wouldn't want that life, regardless of the wealth and privilege I would get in return.

Lb
Oh...but all those tiaras. WORTH IT!

 

[mag]

Kate Middleton Will Give a Rare Interview on CNN as Part of Her Tour of Pakistan

This is very exciting.

www.harpersbazaar.com

 

[Winnipeg]

Sounds like their tour of Pakistan is going well!

Now Harry and Megan will have to find something to beat it.

 

[mag]

I would so wear Kate’s black coat!

Duchess Kate Wore Two Black & White Looks on Her Last Day in Pakistan

She highlighted Pakistani and British brands.

www.harpersbazaar.com