I, Tonya

[Coco]

Fake news!

 

[jenniferlyon]

I'm interested in seeing the film but I don't know the trailer looked kind of trashy. Like it emphasizes the whole white trailer trash park stereotype.

My sister used to live near the trailer park where Eminem's movie 8 Mile was filmed. The residents complained that the filmmakers trashed the place up to make it look worse than it actually did.

 

[Japanfan]

I'm interested in seeing the film but I don't know the trailer looked kind of trashy. Like it emphasizes the whole white trailer trash park stereotype. I don't know if Margot Robbie even watched videos of Tonya because she doesn't sound like her at all, not even close. It's like she's relying on regional accent stereotypes

Has anyone here seen it yet? A few people on a movie forum who saw it say they don't show her as a perpetrator or even aware of any planned attack, and is completely shocked when it happened. Another poster said they saw it as, "a tale of a woman whose career was destroyed by idiot men/abusive assholes in her life. Of course Nancy's life was impacted as well but not nearly to the same permanent degree. They ended up feeling sorry for her"

I'm a little skeptical now after hearing stuff like that

Having not seen the film, I can't comment on it.

But filmmakers are entitled to take a point of view (arguably, it's unavoidable even for ostensibly 'objective' filmmakers).

If the point of view upsets you, you don't can just skip seeing the film.

 

[Japanfan]

You should come! Most of the vineyards were saved because they acted as a natural firebreak. Also, when a tourist area has a natural disaster, the thing that helps it most of all is tourists traveling there.

Now, I wouldn't come today. But next Spring should be plenty of time for the roads to open back up.

I'm so glad to know that - love the area. Maybe next summer!

 

[Jarrett]

*** Tonya Harding's Mother Disputes 'Villain' Portrayal in New Film, Claims Daughter Hates Her :
http://www.insideedition.com/tonya-...ayal-new-film-claims-daughter-hates-her-37681

Haha it looks exactly like her wow, she is deluded.

 

[4rkidz]

I’m excited to see this and it got great reviews at the film festival. It comes to our Landmark theatres Jan 5th.

 

[wouldacoulda]

It looks like her mother is wearing the hairband Tonya had on in one of the photos from her childhood. Now THAT is crazy. Baby Jane Hudson syndrome.

 

[Vagabond]

@Vagabond I think that is one of those Mockumentary scenes where they show "what people think happened" and "what actually happened" in contrast.

Let's hope it isn't "what actually happened."

At the beginning of I, Tonya, we’re informed that what we’re about to see is based on a set of “irony-free, wildly contradictory and totally true” interviews with disgraced figure skater Tonya Harding and ex-husband Jeff Gillooly.

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/sep/09/i-tonya-review-margot-robbie-toronto-film-festival-tiff

The film offers Harding and Gillooly's (internally inconsistent) points of view, but it appears from the trailer that irony crept into the narrative during the production process.

 

[Erin]

*** Tonya Harding's Mother Disputes 'Villain' Portrayal in New Film, Claims Daughter Hates Her :
http://www.insideedition.com/tonya-...ayal-new-film-claims-daughter-hates-her-37681

As with so many things in Tonya's life, it's the small things I have questions about. Like why is her mom called Sandy in that article and not LaVona?

Just like I would like to understand once and for all when she was with Diane Rawlinson as her coach and when she was with Dody Teachman. I know she left Rawlinson for Teachman between 1992 Olympics and Worlds and returned to Rawlinson at some point after that. But I know there were a lot more flip flops and I can't keep track of them all. I tried at one point and just gave up. I think an inaccurate Tonya/Nancy movie confused me for life. I need a timeline!

 

[Vagabond]

As with so many things in Tonya's life, it's the small things I have questions about. Like why is her mom called Sandy in that article and not LaVona?

"Sandy" is her nickname.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt6851974/

For all I know, her middle name might be Sandra.

 

[VGThuy]

As with so many things in Tonya's life, it's the small things I have questions about. Like why is her mom called Sandy in that article and not LaVona?

Just like I would like to understand once and for all when she was with Diane Rawlinson as her coach and when she was with Dody Teachman. I know she left Rawlinson for Teachman between 1992 Olympics and Worlds and returned to Rawlinson at some point after that. But I know there were a lot more flip flops and I can't keep track of them all. I tried at one point and just gave up. I think an inaccurate Tonya/Nancy movie confused me for life. I need a timeline!

From what I remember, Rawlinson had it with an increasingly rebellious and Jeff-influenced Tonya (regular teenage stuff coupled with Tonya latching on to anyone who would show her some love) and recommended one of her former students, Dody Teachman, to be Tonya's coach some time before her 1991 Nationals success. Teachman was Tonya's coach throughout that whole season. Then I think Tonya went back to Rawlinson some time during the 1991-1992 season before the Olympics and then left her again after the Olympics and then was her coach again by the time the 1993-1994 season happened. I do think Jeff was influencing Tonya and telling her she didn't need a real coach and that her natural skating talent was enough to be successful because he didn't want anyone else in Tonya's circle AND he was probably thinking about money and didn't want anyone else having claims to the "millions" he imagined Tonya making. I think he saw Rawlinson as Tonya's surrogate mother who really sacrificed a lot of time and money to coach Tonya and feared she'd want some sort of compensation if Tonya hit it big.

 

[Yazmeen]

What I'm waiting for is either Tonya or her mother to initiate a lawsuit against the filmmakers, Robbie, or anyone else involved. Especially if it's a hit and makes money. Probably using the "this was done without our permission, it was slanderous, ad nauseum" tactic.

And honestly, I'd almost bet on it with one or both if the film takes off. After all, Tonya still bitches that everyone made money off the whack but her...

 

[Jarrett]

What I'm waiting for is either Tonya or her mother to initiate a lawsuit against the filmmakers, Robbie, or anyone else involved. Especially if it's a hit and makes money. Probably using the "this was done without our permission, it was slanderous, ad nauseum" tactic.

And honestly, I'd almost bet on it with one or both if the film takes off. After all, Tonya still bitches that everyone made money off the whack but her...

Why do you think that after Tonya already met with them and appears to not even hold Tonya in an evil light? When was the last time Tonya complained about people making money off her?

 

[binbinwinwin]

I actually don't mind seeing Tonya portrayed as more sympathetic. Until bardtoob said it was a dramatized version of her side of the story I assumed it wasn't taking sides (I haven't read many of the details of it so I was pretty clueless) so I was a bit surprised and taken aback when I read the remarks. Now that I know I'm willing to accept it as is. I still want to see it QUOTE]

I think it's generally enjoyable but I saw earlier in the thread that some people said they would not be happy if that was the case haha

Like I said, the title is a reference to I, Claudius, so think "unreliable narrator" for the movie if that helps.

What I'm waiting for is either Tonya or her mother to initiate a lawsuit against the filmmakers, Robbie, or anyone else involved. Especially if it's a hit and makes money. Probably using the "this was done without our permission, it was slanderous, ad nauseum" tactic.

And honestly, I'd almost bet on it with one or both if the film takes off. After all, Tonya still bitches that everyone made money off the whack but her...

The filmmakers said Tonya was the only one who saw the movie before the premier (other than the cast and crew of course) and she enjoyed it apparently.

 

[skatesindreams]

I can't understand why filmmakers would want to make a movie about someone who (at the very least) conspired to do grievous bodily harm to a fellow competitor?
Why would anyone regard this as material for a "comedy".

That Tonya may have "enjoyed" it, is another matter.

 

[Yazmeen]

I never said Tonya didn't give it her blessing or didn't enjoy it. But I would still almost bet on something happening if that movie is a huge hit. Just my opinion, folks. And Tonya bitterly complained about the money issue for years, including back in 2014 - she has blessedly been out of the spotlight since then. In fact, what minimal respect I have for her would grow if she'd stay out of the limelight with this release. But I don't think that will happen.

I get the point of the movie and the approach, and I even plan to see it. But I also agree with skatesindreams and others who have concerns about this movie glossing over a vicious attack that Tonya was at least somewhat a part of, and of it potentially bringing her very undeserved sympathy and praise. It's a pretty slippery slope. It will be interesting to see how Tonya handles it.

And I do have to make one comment about the trailer. The ending scene with Tonya breaking the 4th wall and saying "Who would do that to a "friend"? I immediately pictured both Nancy Kerrigan and Kristi Yamaguchi collapsing on the floor, laughing themselves sick over that remark...

 

[gkelly]

I can't understand why filmmakers would want to make a movie about someone who (at the very least) conspired to do grievous bodily harm to a fellow competitor?
Why would anyone regard this as material for a "comedy".

There are many many movies about people who harm or attempt to harm other people.

Some of them are based on real incidents.

Some of them are comedies.

I'm sure there is some overlap between those two subsets.

Chicago comes to mind

 

[skatesindreams]

I also agree with skatesindreams and others who have concerns about this movie glossing over a vicious attack that Tonya was at least somewhat a part of, and of it potentially bringing her very undeserved sympathy and praise.

Thanks for understanding.
I don't think that she should receive any attention at all.

This subject should have been handled with all the seriousness it deserved.
I doubt that 2017's audience knows enough about what actually happened, to appreciate that.

 

[Vagabond]

What I'm waiting for is either Tonya or her mother to initiate a lawsuit against the filmmakers, Robbie, or anyone else involved. Especially if it's a hit and makes money. Probably using the "this was done without our permission, it was slanderous, ad nauseum" tactic.

And honestly, I'd almost bet on it with one or both if the film takes off. After all, Tonya still bitches that everyone made money off the whack but her...

It's my understanding that I, Tonya is based on The Tonya Tapes, a book by Lynda D. Prouse based on interviews with Harding. I would be astonished if Harding did not receive some sort of compensation for the interviews and expect that she received some sort of compensation from the sale of the movie rights, possibly including royalties.

According to the screen title at the start of the movie, it is also based on interviews with Jeff (Gillooly) Stone. He probably has some sort of deal similar to his ex-wife's.

Finally, it is extremely difficult for a public figure, such as Harding, to win a suit for defamation or invasion of privacy because the plaintiff must prove that the defendant was reckless in gathering the information and did not check it before publishing it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_Publishing_Co._v._Butts

This principle applies even to "limited purpose public figures" who "thrust themselves to the forefront of particular public controversies in order to influence the resolution of the issues involved."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_figure

LaVona Golden, who did several interviews back in 1994, would fall under this description.

A person can become an 'involuntary public figure' as the result of publicity, even though that person did not want or invite the public attention. For example, people accused of high profile crimes may be unable to pursue actions for defamation even after their innocence is established....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_figure#Overview

That covers both Stone and Shawn Eckhardt, for example.

 

[Yazmeen]

Vagabond: I understand and agree. But that doesn't necessarily stop anyone from trying.

 

[Vagabond]

You can always sue. The question is: can you win?

ETA: Since it's likely that any suit any of the people Yazmeen mentioned would be dismissed at the outset, they wouldn't have much leverage in attempting to negotiate a settlement.

 

[aussieSKATES]

Below is the link to Tonya Harding's short program from the 1993 US Championships.

It is clear within the first few seconds of her program that the neck clasp holding her dress together popped open by itself.

https://youtu.be/zbJvKhEPe9E

 

[BittyBug]

Reality break - the slo mo of the lutz from the movie clip in the Inside Edition piece shows a marked flutz. A small detail but it's a shame the film makers got that wrong.

 

[MacMadame]

And then there's this.

Tonya Harding, as portrayed by Margot Robbie, may be a bad actress, but Margot Robbie herself is not.

When I saw that, I realized the movie was going to be awesome. Robbie nails how Tonya comes across as lying when she talks about the event. So on the surface, she's saying the right thing, but if you are paying attention at all you are thinking "OMG, she totally was in on it!"

Haha it looks exactly like her wow, she is deluded.

I didn't think Janney looked much like my memories of Tonya's mother but in the E! clip when they show Tonya and her mom at the boards waiting to take the ice, I thought for a second that it was a scene from the movie.

Speaking of that E! clip, I just want to set the record straight. Tonya Harding is not the only US woman to land a 3X in competition. Kimmie Meissner did it at Nationals one year and Mirai Nagasu did it this year.

I never said Tonya didn't give it her blessing or didn't enjoy it. But I would still almost bet on something happening if that movie is a huge hit.

Too bad there's not a bet in the Sportsbook about it. I'd totally take you up on that bet. I think you are way off-base on this one. Since she had a kid, Tonya has not sought out the spotlight. (Notice that she isn't lined up for a bunch of interviews about the movie.) This doesn't even get into any compensation she got from the producers already.

 

[vesperholly]

Below is the link to Tonya Harding's short program from the 1993 US Championships.

It is clear within the first few seconds of her program that the neck clasp holding her dress together popped open by itself.

https://youtu.be/zbJvKhEPe9E

Not available in the US Copyright claim by Muyap?!

 

[Vagabond]

Speaking of that E! clip, I just want to set the record straight. Tonya Harding is not the only US woman to land a 3X in competition. Kimmie Meissner did it at Nationals one year and Mirai Nagasu did it this year.

I was until I went back and listened to the clip again. The announcer uses the word "nail" rather than "land." It's a matter of opinion, but Meisner's only triple axel landed in competition doesn't look fully rotated to me, and, IINM, Nagasu has never received neutral or positive GOE for any of her triple axels.

 

[casken]

Not available in the US Copyright claim by Muyap?!

Change "youtube" to "youpak" in the url and you should be able to watch it.

 

[Erin]

It's my understanding that I, Tonya is based on The Tonya Tapes, a book by Lynda D. Prouse based on interviews with Harding.

Is it wrong that I kind of want to read this book while I'm waiting for the movie to come out?

 

[meggonzo]

As with so many things in Tonya's life, it's the small things I have questions about. Like why is her mom called Sandy in that article and not LaVona?

Just like I would like to understand once and for all when she was with Diane Rawlinson as her coach and when she was with Dody Teachman. I know she left Rawlinson for Teachman between 1992 Olympics and Worlds and returned to Rawlinson at some point after that. But I know there were a lot more flip flops and I can't keep track of them all. I tried at one point and just gave up. I think an inaccurate Tonya/Nancy movie confused me for life. I need a timeline!

From what I remember, Rawlinson had it with an increasingly rebellious and Jeff-influenced Tonya (regular teenage stuff coupled with Tonya latching on to anyone who would show her some love) and recommended one of her former students, Dody Teachman, to be Tonya's coach some time before her 1991 Nationals success. Teachman was Tonya's coach throughout that whole season. Then I think Tonya went back to Rawlinson some time during the 1991-1992 season before the Olympics and then left her again after the Olympics and then was her coach again by the time the 1993-1994 season happened. I do think Jeff was influencing Tonya and telling her she didn't need a real coach and that her natural skating talent was enough to be successful because he didn't want anyone else in Tonya's circle AND he was probably thinking about money and didn't want anyone else having claims to the "millions" he imagined Tonya making. I think he saw Rawlinson as Tonya's surrogate mother who really sacrificed a lot of time and money to coach Tonya and feared she'd want some sort of compensation if Tonya hit it big.

Tonya was with Dody at 91 SKAM, 92 Nats, 92 Olys, and then with Diane at 92 Worlds. However, I think there was a firing/re-hiring of Dody between SKAM and Nats. I remember some fluff piece about it and Tonya referring to Dody as "her employee". Which doesn't bother me that much reading about some of the control other coaches have over their skaters. I think she was with Diane from 92 Worlds on through 94 Olys?? But I could be forgetting another flip flip in between that time.

 

[Erin]

Tonya was with Dody at 91 SKAM, 92 Nats, 92 Olys, and then with Diane at 92 Worlds. However, I think there was a firing/re-hiring of Dody between SKAM and Nats. I remember some fluff piece about it and Tonya referring to Dody as "her employee". Which doesn't bother me that much reading about some of the control other coaches have over their skaters. I think she was with Diane from 92 Worlds on through 94 Olys?? But I could be forgetting another flip flip in between that time.

Ah, thanks, I clearly got the Dody/Diane switch in 92 flipped. I just remember her getting new programs for 92 Worlds, which I thought was absolute madness. This fluff piece confirms that it was Dody to Diane in 92:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1WMW6ZQWnQ&t=211s