U.S. Ice Dance 2017/18 season news & updates

[blancanieves]

I think the closest H/B and H/D had been to being a real rivalry was in 2014-2015 when Hawayek/Baker were fresh from their Junior Worlds win and had a great, fresh FD (better than any of the top three FDs in terms of choreography) and seemed to have a bright, exciting future ahead. This was before H/D moved to Montreal and seemed to have stagnated artistically and technically with Camerlengo/Krylova who failed to tap into their technical potential the way Dubrieul/Lauzon have.

And H/D weren't training 100% due to Madison's post labrum surgery rehab. It's an important, often ignored detail.

 

[VGThuy]

And H/D weren't training 100% due to Madison's post labrum surgery rehab. It's an important, often ignored detail.

I wasn't ignoring it on purpose, I just forgot.

 

[Stephanie]

The Parsons are confirmed for Skate America http://www.isu.org/docman-documents...series-files-10/entries/7514-gp-icedance/file

 

[Penniless Rostrum]

I wonder why the world standings page hasn't been updated yet for salt lake or lombardia , I'm not sure I like the new ISU site either !! Loving H&D SD & FS very good

 

[chapis]

The Parsons are confirmed for Skate America http://www.isu.org/docman-documents...series-files-10/entries/7514-gp-icedance/file

so, there are almost 0 probabilities for a second assignment for M/C?

 

[Dobre]

so, there are almost 0 probabilities for a second assignment for M/C?

We'll see.

I would guess that a withdrawal from NHK would be the best chance. Japan has a history of inviting top-level dance teams from around the world and high on the replacement list. Plus NHK currently only has one U.S. team signed up--though they've had three the last two years--and Fournier-Beaudry & Sorenson, who are the only team higher than McNamara & Carpenter on the list, are already invited there. But there aren't usually very many openings filled in dance, even fewer from the top of the list. And Coomes & Buckland will almost certainly be added to it after Nebelhorn.

 

[semogal]

Fabulous start for the Parsons today!! They are in second place at Ondrej Nepela Trophy
67.48 (36.72 + 30.76) 7.85 7.50 7.75 7.70 7.65

 

[Jun Y]

Fabulous start for the Parsons today!! They are in second place at Ondrej Nepela Trophy
67.48 (36.72 + 30.76) 7.85 7.50 7.75 7.70 7.65

I find it a bit strange and perhaps amusing that the Parsonses were 6.5 points higher than Popova/Mozgov in the technical score, but their SS is only 0.15 higher, and TR is only 0.3 higher. If one team is able to do so much better technically than another team, and considering that the short dance is by definition filled with technical elements reflecting skating skills (no jumps, no spins, only 1 lift), how do we then get to the conclusion that their skating skills are almost the same? The only explanation is that the technical panel and the judges disagree with each other by a lot.

Can't say I'm surprised though, especially in ice dancing.

 

[gkelly]

I find it a bit strange and perhaps amusing that the Parsonses were 6.5 points higher than Popova/Mozgov in the technical score, but their SS is only 0.15 higher, and TR is only 0.3 higher. If one team is able to do so much better technically than another team, and considering that the short dance is by definition filled with technical elements reflecting skating skills (no jumps, no spins, only 1 lift), how do we then get to the conclusion that their skating skills are almost the same? The only explanation is that the technical panel and the judges disagree with each other by a lot.

The biggest difference was between level 2 vs. level 4 step sequence.

In some cases all it would take is a poorly designed sequence and/or a single tiny mistake or unclear edge to result in a lower level call. If the judges are looking at the big picture they might not see a tiny problem or consider it significant enough to make a 0.25 difference in the score.

In other cases a team might intentionally plan a sequence at a lower level to showcase GOEs and components instead.

 

[semogal]

McNamara & Carpenter also had a good start to their first senior season, placing 4th in a very tough field at the Autumn Classic:
62.00 (32.56 + 29.44) 7.45 7.15 7. 30, 7.50, 7.40
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f71DTdxbfK4

 

[semogal]

Really a good day yesterday for US Ice Dance as Christina Carreira and Anthony Ponomarenko punched their ticket to the Junior GPF with another gold medal, finishing first in both segments in Minsk with a total score of 150.05:
SD: 63.77 (33.25 + 30.52) 7.54 7.33 7.71 7.75 7.83 0.00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRT6BhLG27M

FD: 86.28 (39.13 + 47.15) 7.71 7.54 8.00 8.00 8.04 0.00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOeWK1O08Ik

Interview with Ted Barton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyoGEIuWm14

 

[semogal]

Avonley NGUYEN / Vadym KOLESNIK made their Junior GP debut yesterday finishing in 5th place with a total score of 114.89:
5th SD: 50.37 (27.00+ 23.37) 5.88 5.63 5.92 5.96 5.83 0.00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Q_JSRkFn5s

6th FD: 64.52 (28.42 + 37.10) 6.25 6.00 6.08 6.42 6.17 1.00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IU9H6lj3AXg

Avonley really sells the programs. Does anyone else see a Madison Chock mini-me?

 

[Dobre]

Avonley really sells the programs. Does anyone else see a Madison Chock mini-me?

Not at all. The first time I saw Avonley, I saw a mini-Maia. Now I see a skater with her own special light. But ALWAYS I see a dancer. She is in the right discipline, that's for sure.

 

[VGThuy]

Not at all. The first time I saw Avonley, I saw a mini-Maia. Now I see a skater with her own special light. But ALWAYS I see a dancer. She is in the right discipline, that's for sure.

I can see that. Mini-Maia was a bit more...exuberant than present-Maia who brings her own distinct sort of far away quality (which some like and some don't.)

 

[Lara111]

Not at all. The first time I saw Avonley, I saw a mini-Maia. Now I see a skater with her own special light. But ALWAYS I see a dancer. She is in the right discipline, that's for sure.[/QUOTE]

Well, they are both Asian that about it when you try to find similarities in them.

 

[Dobre]

Well, they are both Asian that about it when you try to find similarities in them.

Avonley was not at Shpilband's the first time I saw her so she did not have that particular style of choreography. She did have tough twizzles, musicality, and the kind of personality that hit the audience right off the bat. Also itty bitty even among the young dancers. Maia also was not at Shpilband's & Marina's the first time I saw her. They are both the kind of ice dancers that I notice right away.

That happens very rarely with novices/intermediates. The only other young dance ladies I remember that strongly from a first sighting were Emily Samuelson, Eliana Gropman, and Sarah Feng.

 

[Twizzler]

I find it a bit strange and perhaps amusing that the Parsonses were 6.5 points higher than Popova/Mozgov in the technical score, but their SS is only 0.15 higher, and TR is only 0.3 higher. If one team is able to do so much better technically than another team, and considering that the short dance is by definition filled with technical elements reflecting skating skills (no jumps, no spins, only 1 lift), how do we then get to the conclusion that their skating skills are almost the same? The only explanation is that the technical panel and the judges disagree with each other by a lot.

Can't say I'm surprised though, especially in ice dancing.

By definition, the Skating Skills is about the overall execution of the entire program- not just the required elements:

“Skating Skills Definition: Over all skating quality: edge control and flow over the ice surface demonstrated by a command of the skating vocabulary (edges, steps, turns, etc), the clarity of technique, and the use of effortless power to accelerate and vary speed.”

A team can have all level 4 lifts, a level 4 spin, and level 4 twizzles with positive GOEs and be overall scratchy and slow with poor skating skills. With the exception of footwork, technical score on a specific element/set of elements really has little to do with the ability to flow freely and effortlessly across the ice.

 

[Jun Y]

I fully understand the argument that the SS component reflects overall skating skills in an entire program, while TES reflects the quality of specific elements that may not be related to skating skills. That's why my questioning of the scores is specifically applicable to short dance, but less applicable to free dance and not at all to singles and pairs skating.

 

[Lara111]

Avonley was not at Shpilband's the first time I saw her so she did not have that particular style of choreography. She did have tough twizzles, musicality, and the kind of personality that hit the audience right off the bat. Also itty bitty even among the young dancers. Maia also was not at Shpilband's & Marina's the first time I saw her. They are both the kind of ice dancers that I notice right away.

That happens very rarely with novices/intermediates. The only other young dance ladies I remember that strongly from a first sighting were Emily Samuelson, Eliana Gropman, and Sarah Feng.

I noticed Avonley in Intermediates as well. I liked her emotions at that time. As far as Maia - she has zero emotions - or at least how it looks to me. As far as Avonley now - not so sure yet.

 

[Dobre]

As far as Maia - she has zero emotions - or at least how it looks to me.

Your impression is the opposite of mine.

Which is fine. There are many athletes who leave very different impressions on different people.

 

[vireo]

Avonley NGUYEN / Vadym KOLESNIK made their Junior GP debut yesterday finishing in 5th place with a total score of 114.89:...

Avonley really sells the programs. Does anyone else see a Madison Chock mini-me?

Yes, Avonley reminds me a great deal of Madison. Her energy, vivacity and performance ability bring Madison to mind, as well as her very supple spine. Madison and Avonley are both flexible in their upper back, which is rather rare.

I look forward to watching Avonley and Vadym develop. I hope for the best for them.

 

[chameleonster]

Nguyen/Kolesnik are now listed on the ISU entries for JGP Poland. While nothing's final until published on the USFS assignments page, as it's next week we can probably assume that this recent change is final. They were very charming, I'm glad they're getting the chance to develop.

 

[Sylvia]

Dance (2nd) assignments are confirmed on USFS' website:
JGP #6 Poland: Green/Green, Gunter/Wein
JGP #7 Italy: Lewis/Bye, Nguyen/Kolesnik

USFS' video uploaded on Sept. 13, 2017:

23 Questions with Madi and Zach.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1FhL2n8FOQ

From H/D's fan thread:

Madison Hubbell's latest blog entry [Sept. 28, 2017] is all about her showcasing Manta/Johnson because she believes they deserve some attention. I really love her for doing that.

for Madi! ...I knew immediately that I needed to shine some well-deserved light onto a team I respect for their athleticism, passion, and dedication. In U.S. ice dance, there is not enough press to go around. We have so many talented, successful teams, and some deserving athletes don’t seem to make it into the limelight. It is not fair, but it is reality. And I know, trust me, that my tiny blog is not considered “press.” But when I finished watching the programs of Karina Manta and Joseph Johnson, I thought it would be fun to praise them a bit in my blog!
Link to her interview: http://www.hubbell-donohue.com/

ETA: Karina Manta/Joe Johnson are 12th of 18 teams after the Nebelhorn Trophy SD (51.91): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKi1wz9lWFE

 

[Dobre]

Congratulations to the Greens for winning their second bronze on the JGP!

 

[Jammers]

Congratulations to the Greens for winning their second bronze on the JGP!

I see gold in the future for this team. Two Bronze medals in their first year on the JGP despite being the youngest team is fantastic these teams that are beating them now better enjoy it because they won't be beating them in a year or two.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Congratulations to the Greens for winning their second bronze on the JGP!

I agree! was this their first season?

So are C&B and the Shibs not doing anything before the GP starts????

 

[Sylvia]

I agree! was this their first season?

Yes, Caroline Green only turned 14 last week so this was the first year she's eligible for ISU junior internationals - here's their FD in Gdansk yesterday: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmA68oXgMlE
Gordon was very excited when their score came up.

So are C&B and the Shibs not doing anything before the GP starts????

No - by choice.

 

[Dobre]

So are C&B and the Shibs not doing anything before the GP starts????

Working.

 

[jiejie]

Watching the Parsons and McNamara/Carpenter progress with interest, this being their first senior season. AFAIK, they are also the first seniors that their coaches Novak/Kiliakov have taken into international competition--up until now they have been powerhouses bringing junior and lower-level skaters up, but not seniors. I have mused that N/K being the "outsiders" among the Pantheon of big name dance coaches (i.e. Zueva, Shpilband, Dubreuil, et al) might put their skaters at a political disadvantage with international judges, especially when the GOE/PCS is handed out. But right now it's too early to draw any conclusions, just not enough data points. And most first-year senior dance teams still have an element of "paying their dues" even if they shone as juniors.

 

[Twizzler]

Watching the Parsons and McNamara/Carpenter progress with interest, this being their first senior season. AFAIK, they are also the first seniors that their coaches Novak/Kiliakov have taken into international competition--up until now they have been powerhouses bringing junior and lower-level skaters up, but not seniors. I have mused that N/K being the "outsiders" among the Pantheon of big name dance coaches (i.e. Zueva, Shpilband, Dubreuil, et al) might put their skaters at a political disadvantage with international judges, especially when the GOE/PCS is handed out. But right now it's too early to draw any conclusions, just not enough data points. And most first-year senior dance teams still have an element of "paying their dues" even if they shone as juniors.

It is my understanding that N/K have enlisted the help of Linichuk for these teams as they transition to Senior.