UPDATED: Guilty verdict in Bill Cosby Case (threads merged)

[Twilight1]

Vagabond- what we are exposed to at home can not be crossed along all parts of our life. Unless you saw every single facet of your brothers life... You don't know...

 

[Vagabond]

Are these his words (or yours)? The family next door to us would say that there was no violence in their family, but I spoke to the youngest child in the family a few years ago and he told me that he was raped at five years of age by a neighbour and never told anyone in his family.

Vagabond- what we are exposed to at home can not be crossed along all parts of our life. Unless you saw every single facet of your brothers life... You don't know...

The following post should not come as a surprise to anyone who has been reading my posts closely over the past few months.

My eldest brother (nine years older than I and two years older than my other brother) suffers from psychiatric and physiological problems that appear to have first manifested in childhood. (For various reasons, I would rather not get too specific, but I can remember his having fainting spells when he was about fourteen and he has had such seething rage for the past few years that his wife left him.)

My brother

• severely and repeatedly beat my other brother up for several years when they were in primary and elementary school (if not before), leaving permanent physical injuries (and psychological issues).
• induced my other brother to join him in a pattern of physically and psychologically abusing me when they were 15-16 and 13-14 and I was 6-7 (and possibly even younger).
• "touched" a young girl when he was in his early 30's (and had the police tell him to get out of town rather than arrest him).
• told at least one of his girlfriends that he was sexually obsessed with young girls.
• psychologically abused at least two of the women with whom he was in long-term relationships.
• is currently being prosecuted on felony charges for improper communications with an 11-year-old girl when he was 63.

I feel fairly sure that there is more out there, but I don't know what it might be.

At this point, I don't ever want to communicate with this brother ever again. And, if I did, I probably wouldn't get an honest answer. However, I have had several discussions with my other brother, and he has told me that there were no signs that he was molested at the time -- no warnings from my parents, no sudden change in behavior, no rumors about neighbors not to be trusted. He was spanked for what he did to my other brother (and maybe me -- I don't know), but so were most American children back then.

It is, of course, possible, that something did happen to him, but his health issues strongly suggest that internal problems are the root cause. He didn't ask for them, but I do feel that it is his responsibility to deal with them and to avoid causing harm to others.

Unless you saw every single facet of your brothers life... You don't know...

It's surprising how much I have to say this about my life to people who don't believe that my brother could have been as abusive as he was.

 

[Twilight1]

Every facet can include and is not limited to brain trauma from something as simple as a bad fall off a bike. Seizures from a fever etc.

I would love to say I know almost everything about my psychiatrically unstable sister... but I can't.

Unless a full neuropsych test was done and brain scans... we can't and don't know and may never know

Our lives are built upon our perceptions of things. How we view the world may be in complete opposition of people around us. Our thoughts are our own and how we imbed our experiences are our own. What one might see as overwhelming and traumatic may be just another day for another person.

Just saying...

 

[Vagabond]

I don't think @PeterG was talking about falls off a bike. Still, I can say that my second brother was abusive to me for many years before he had a serious bicycle accident.

Regardless, and as touched on in this very thread, there are many factors that lead to abuse, sexual assault, and other forms of violence against people of all ages. Not every victim of violence becomes violent, and I very much doubt that every person who inflicts violence on others was himself a victim of violence.

 

[Japanfan]

No. Wrong. I want violence to stop. We have to figure out why it continues to happen. I have not taken focus away from victims. I have not spouted bullshit, I have asked questions. Asked questions, not made statements. You quoted my post, which said:

Peter G., I just want to repeat my assertion that men who rape or sexually assault do not always come from a violent background. It's far too common of an act for that.

Rape is a different matter from other violent acts such as assault.

The issue of male entitlement is real. As I pointed out previously, in some parts of the world women do not have the right (legal or social) to say no to sex with their husbands.

When I think of male entitlement, I think of all male athletes who are alleged or proven rapists. Male athletes seem to be over represented among proven/alleged rapists when compared to other groups of males (i.e. philosophy students). I don't fully understand why this is but would think it has something to do with male sports cultures.

Back in the 70s, when I was in my teens, 'date rape' was not a term. Many women were date raped, but they did not have a word for it at the time. And SFAIK rape relief centers were not yet established - without doing any research, I would guess that they emerged in the 70s, concurrent with the women's movement of the time and the publication of the landmark book 'Our Bodies, Ourselves' in 1971 (Rape Relief and Battered Women's Shelter in Vancouver was established in 1973 https://www.rapereliefshelter.bc.ca/about-us/herstory/herstory.)

In so many parts of the world (i.e. refugee camps as mentioned earlier) rape is a daily reality, not a crime.

I remember reading about women in a war-torn African nation who got so sick of being raped that they decided to take up arms themselves. Although I'm extremely anti-war, I couldn't blame them.

 

[Frau Muller]

Bill Cosby booted out of the Kennedy Center Honors Circle (medal rescinded)!

https://www.nbcnews.com/pop-culture...scinds-top-prizes-bestowed-bill-cosby-n872221

 

[Vagabond]

Bill Cosby Sentencing: Live Updates

 

[ilovepaydays]

Sentence - 3 to 10 years plus will have to register as a “sexually violent predator” for the rest of his life.

I didn’t know Cosby was legally blind now.....not that it really matters.

 

[attyfan]

Found to be a sexually violent predator under state law, with 3 to 10 years in prison. At his age, it is probably a life sentence

https://www.cnn.com/

 

[AxelAnnie]

You know, I know he did it............but he also did so much good for Blacks and Whites in understanding each other. Sending a blind 80 year old man to prison for sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again) just seems silly and sad.

 

[Andora]

You know, I know he did it............but he also did so much good for Blacks and Whites in understanding each other. Sending a blind 80 year old man to prison for sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again) just seems silly and sad.

Then I guess it's too bad that he got away with it for DECADES and is left to only pay the price now.

 

[ballettmaus]

You know, I know he did it............but he also did so much good for Blacks and Whites in understanding each other. Sending a blind 80 year old man to prison for sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again) just seems silly and sad.

On the one hand, I agree and think the judge might have wanted to make an example out of him. On the other hand, if he had gotten house arrest or whatever due to his old age then once again the message would have been that a man can sexually assault a woman and still get sympathy and leniency (while the woman will have to live with it for the rest of her life).
As sad as it is, I think it needed to be done. And, if you think about it, he only has himself to blame.

 

[Vash01]

You know, I know he did it............but he also did so much good for Blacks and Whites in understanding each other. Sending a blind 80 year old man to prison for sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again) just seems silly and sad.

As the judge said, no one is above the law. It is ok to feel compassion for an 80 year old blind man, but he has to pay for his actions, as the law states.

 

[AxelAnnie]

As the judge said, no one is above the law. It is ok to feel compassion for an 80 year old blind man, but he has to pay for his actions, as the law states.

Then I guess it's too bad that he got away with it for DECADES and is left to only pay the price now.

I did not say that.

There is nothing right about any of it.

 

[Andora]

I did not say that.

There is nothing right about any of it.

I'm sorry, what are we supposed to infer by calling it silly and sad? It's sad that it took this long for justice. Not sad to send him to jail.

It's sad what his actions have done to the legacy of a fairly important show, culturally. But again, that's on Bill.

 

[Tinami Amori]

Sending a blind 80 year old man to prison for sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again) just seems silly and sad.

As the judge said, no one is above the law. It is ok to feel compassion for an 80 year old blind man, but he has to pay for his actions, as the law states.

This is a tough one for me to decide what is the right punishment in this case, given his age and the crimes. Personally, if i was in the place of one of these women who were given drugs, and woke up in bed with a celebrity which i liked, admired but did not plan to sleep with, yet physically unharmed and my life/state of mind was not ruined (like in some Wein's cases), 20/30+ years later i would want lots of MONEY, and a 10 year house arrest. At parties women get drunk all the time and are taken home by guys they did not intend to sleep with, and they wake, take shower, feel yakkie for a while, but then few days later life goes on and one does not even think about it.... especially 20/30 years later. (imo).

 

[Peaches LaTour]

It is not enough but at least there is some justice for the victims & Cosby's name & reputation is forever stained as a "Convicted Sex Offender".

Wonder what his former co-star of The Cosby Show thinks now. She was quick to defend him, initially.

 

[AxelAnnie]

This is a tough one for me to decide what is the right punishment in this case, given his age and the crimes. Personally, if i was in the place of one of these women who were given drugs, and woke up in bed with a celebrity which i liked, admired but did not plan to sleep with, yet physically unharmed and my life/state of mind was not ruined (like in some Wein's cases), 20/30+ years later i would want lots of MONEY, and a 10 year house arrest. At parties women get drunk all the time and are taken home by guys they did not intend to sleep with, and they wake, take shower, feel yakkie for a while, but then few days later life goes on and one does not even think about it.... especially 20/30 years later. (imo).

You said that much better than I.

 

[PeterG]

You know, I know he did it............but he also did so much good for Blacks and Whites in understanding each other. Sending a blind 80 year old man to prison for sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again) just seems silly and sad.

One step forward for racial equality...two steps back for women being able to feel 100% safe and happy while they are still alive.

Would you feel the same way about a person who raised money for a children's hospital, but robbed a whole slew of seniors of their retirement funds?

By the way, an older male who might not be able to have an erection...can STILL sexually assault people.

Plus, I keep wondering if somewhere below your statement, it's implied, "...if I can just hide all of the rapes I've done until I'm a little ole man...then there's folks out there who will want to cut me some slack". I don't care if the guy is blind and quadriplegic and has cancer...throw the freaking BOOK at him. The fact that he might serve three years - or less for "good behaviour" (he did all his best routines for the other inmates on a regular basis!) is freaking infuriating!

 

[Vagabond]

sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again)

There was evidence that

is possible that he has already met someone who could be a future victim

The final decision by Judge O’Neill upheld the board’s finding. He said the state had met “a clear and convincing standard.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/25/arts/television/bill-cosby-sentencing.html

 

[Lacey]

This is a tough one for me to decide what is the right punishment in this case, given his age and the crimes. Personally, if i was in the place of one of these women who were given drugs, and woke up in bed with a celebrity which i liked, admired but did not plan to sleep with, yet physically unharmed and my life/state of mind was not ruined (like in some Wein's cases), 20/30+ years later i would want lots of MONEY, and a 10 year house arrest. At parties women get drunk all the time and are taken home by guys they did not intend to sleep with, and they wake, take shower, feel yakkie for a while, but then few days later life goes on and one does not even think about it.... especially 20/30 years later. (imo).

Pardon me, please see the portions of your statement I have bolded, and I will ask, in what world are you living?

I live in Philly, and we Americans believe in the trial by Jury with Judge Overseeing System.

We have been listening to 100% very fair coverage of this subject for years and years, no matter the local network. Ditto for the newspapers. Not one newsperson has ever ever ever put forth such a statement or two as you have here.

Today, the system won. Bill Cosby was found guilty. If one does the crime, one must do the time. One cannot seek pity for having lost perfect vision, as I have, to glaucoma &/or old/age. One cannot seek a different sentence for previous good acting that told a unique story. This here is a far bigger story, and he will be remembered for his illegal behavior rather than for his tv show.

My body shook today and I cried for the many women who, after this verdict, might have the courage to come forth.

 

[Aussie Willy]

You know, I know he did it............but he also did so much good for Blacks and Whites in understanding each other. Sending a blind 80 year old man to prison for sexual assault (which clearly is not going to happen again) just seems silly and sad.

It might have taken years, but what he did has eventually come back to bite him on the butt.

Years ago I was on a jury where the man was in his 70s. He had molested a couple of young boys back in the 70s and 80s when he was a teacher at school. We found him guilty and he went to jail for 18 months. After we found him guilty it was revealed he had been convicted back in the 50s of a similar crime.

It is also the case with many of the priests and those in the church are now being held to account for things that happened years, if not decades ago. If not to punish them, to at least make an example and show that these behaviours, not matter how socially accepted they were back then are not accepted now.

 

[ballettmaus]

Plus, I keep wondering if somewhere below your statement, it's implied, "...if I can just hide all of the rapes I've done until I'm a little ole man...then there's folks out there who will want to cut me some slack".

That crossed my mind, too, when I was writing my reply earlier, I just didn't know how to put it. But I definitely think if the judge had been lenient it would send that message.

Also, what about old(er) guys who rape women?



Has anyone else heard that they will have to make adjustment in the prison he'll go to because he's legally blind? My parents said they heard something along those lines on the radio.

Also, what's this 3-10 years deal? I thought this was his sentencing. Shouldn't there be a definite jail time?

 

[PeterG]

Also, what's this 3-10 years deal? I thought this was his sentencing. Shouldn't there be a definite jail time?

Hoping it's a typo and it should have read "...sentenced to 310 years."

 

[attyfan]

It isn't uncommon to have a "range", where the lower figure is the time that must be served before he is eligible for any kind of early release.

 

[Vagabond]

Has anyone else heard that they will have to make adjustment in the prison he'll go to because he's legally blind?

If he's lucky, he might be given a white cane.

ETA: "Legally blind" means his sight is 20-200 or worse. He most likely already has eyeglasses that will be allowed to bring with him to prison.

 

[BaileyCatts]

.....Has anyone else heard that they will have to make adjustment in the prison he'll go to because he's legally blind? My parents said they heard something along those lines on the radio.

In some article I read today it said something about there being a new $$$ prison medical facility that was designed for elderly prisoners that he was going to be sent too? I can't find the right article now, but I know I was looking at MSN.com headlines.

ETA: oh wait, here is the article I read that in. Its near the bottom. Doesn't say he "will" go there, but the way I interpret it, he will since he is over 80 and has medical issues.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/celebr...or-more-than-3-years-for-2004-rape/ar-AAADPxZ

 

[Peaches LaTour]

And now his attorney is screaming, in part, this verdict is about racism.

I wondered, if he was convicted, how long it would take the Cosby team to play that card.

 

[ballettmaus]

And now his attorney is screaming, in part, this verdict is about racism.

And sexism. Are they freaking serious? He's on trial for sex crimes and they're trying to make it about sexism? You have to be all kinds of stupid to think it's a good idea to use that as a defense for the man convicted of sex crimes.

 

[Tinami Amori]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/celebr...or-more-than-3-years-for-2004-rape/ar-AAADPxZ

Well, in that case it is another story, and he should serve his time, given the facility is for older, disabled, non-violent offenders.

Also, what's this 3-10 years deal? I thought this was his sentencing. Shouldn't there be a definite jail time?

I was also wondering at first what a strange way to pass a sentence, and it was explained to me that a) he has to serve minimum of 3 years before his lawyer can submit an request for parole/early release, and b) but the maximum he can serve is 10 years.