U.S. Men 2020-21 season news & updates

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Jammers said:
This is just total nonsense with these new rules. If Nathan and Jason combined finish less then 13 the US should be given 3 spots for the Olympics just like in the past simple as that none of this bullshit of having to qualify for the 3rd spot at Nebelhorn.
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Uhhuh... And how were you feeling in 2017 about the US pairs losing out on a 2nd Olympics spot because so many other countries earned multiple spots and by the time we got to the top US placement, there was only 1 spot left?
 
Vincent reported being so nervous, like he had stomach butterflies all over his body going out for the short program. Hindsight is always 20/20, but I wish he would have watered down his content to maybe Rippon triple lutz/toe and triple flip. He does those jumps perfectly. He probably would have qualified for the LP with that content.

He said he feels like he let down himself, his team and his country 😢
 
Jammers said:
This is just total nonsense with these new rules. If Nathan and Jason combined finish less then 13 the US should be given 3 spots for the Olympics just like in the past simple as that none of this bullshit of having to qualify for the 3rd spot at Nebelhorn.
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Yeah, I don’t get this post at all.

Many countries have one good skater and a second skater that wouldn’t make it out of qualifying at Worlds. Many countries have 2 good skaters and maybe a third that isn’t as good.

So, because the US should qualify 3 men on a good day but did not, they should just hand them that spot? Did you like when Aiza Mambekova or Abzal Rakimgaliev (twice) got into the Olympics over someone who placed higher at Worlds because of what their teammate did?

Would you like if Donovan Carrillo, who beat Zhou here, finished 24th and the ISU went back to their old rules of ‘well we are giving the US a spot, sorry, all skaters down to 23rd have an Olympic spot but Donovan you don’t even though you made the LP. Try again later.’

The US didn’t deliver yesterday. Doesn’t matter what they’d do on any other day.
 
clairecloutier said:
Vincent posted on Instagram that he has an ankle injury.

He thought he could skate through the pain and still compete.

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Meh.. after the Rachael Flatt fallout I think he would've been best to just say he had a bad day honestly.
 
clairecloutier said:
Vincent posted on Instagram that he has an ankle injury.

He thought he could skate through the pain and still compete.

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tony said:
Meh.. after the Rachael Flatt fallout I think he would've been best to just say he had a bad day honestly.
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What in the ever-loving F is the USFS doing to monitor these skaters who are based in their own backyard?! Like, seriously, I realize it's the week of but the US should have pulled him and replaced him with the 1st alternate. I don't blame Vincent for this, I blame the USFS. After the Rachael Flatt incident, they absolutely should have known their skaters' physical state and pulled him out. Tomoki would have done just fine and deserved a shot at this.
 
So how does US figure skating do this monitor you want? Do they x-ray each skater in great detail?

They are not going to know that the skater isn’t landing jumps because he’s hurt his ankle I mean skaters don’t land jumps all the time. Or are you telling me that every man who fell in the event was injured - I don’t think so.

Now, this is where the problem is - if the skater knew they were injured especially before they left and decided to hide it because “I want to go to worlds” then yes there should be a penalty. I don’t know what the solution is but I don’t think you can assume USFS knows and is just ignoring facts. they did not know about Rachel , that’s a given, and they probably didn’t know about Vincent.
 
Unless the USFS hires their own National doctor and have camps in the style of USAG, the only way they can know if a skater is hiding a easily concealable injury is if either the skater discloses it themselves or the private doctors break HIPAA laws.

Sometimes the skaters themselves don’t know the extent of their injury and were skating more or less normally during practices. They may experience a bit more pain but skaters often skate through pain.
 
I'm sorry, but no, stop giving the USFS the benefit of the doubt here. Both Flatt and Zhou train/ed in Colorado Springs, where the USFS headquarters is located. There is ZERO reason they should have been unaware of either skaters' injuries. Vincent freakin' flew out of state to see a doctor? Yeah, someone at HQ should have heard about that and some conversations should have been had with both Vincent's team and Tomoki's team. They're all right there in Colorado Springs for goodness' sake.
 
Skaters are required to report injuries to USFS. I assume if Vincent is posting about it, then he reported as required. From what he describes, it seems the doctor gave him the OK to compete. At that point, USFS had only that to go on. If he was practicing normally, there wouldn't have been any indication that it would be a problem.

Also, given that it was the week of, and given the extra rules due to YKW (I know before Nats, USFS advised skaters to minimize contact with others plus get at least 1 test), there may just not have been time to have another skater at the ready.
 
Wow, I sure don’t read Vincent’s post the same way many of you do. Did all of you read what he said? Yes, he mentions he had an ankle injury but felt like he could skate through it and consulted a doctor the week he flew out. He took responsibility for his performance and did not blame it on that injury. He admits it may have eroded his confidence to some degree. But said he was skating clean LPs in practices. I also think what probably played on his mind as much or more was that he was on the podium last time he was at Worlds...and being out of international competition for two years with Olympic spots looming. Heck, probably the majority of skaters in the event have some sort of injury.
 
olympic said:
^Quite frankly, they should trash the 13 rule altogether. There are better ways to get more qualified skaters to Worlds

Use the ranking system
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But we're not talking about Worlds. We're talking about the Olympics, for which there a limited number of spots available.
 
Vagabond said:
If Keegan Messing were still skating for the United States, we'd still have an excellent shot at three entries in the Men's event at the Olympics.

:blocjudge
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That's assuming, of course, that Keegan would have made the US team for worlds. I do enjoy Keegan's skating - just wondering.
 
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mtnskater said:
Wow, I sure don’t read Vincent’s post the same way many of you do. Did all of you read what he said? Yes, he mentions he had an ankle injury but felt like he could skate through it and consulted a doctor the week he flew out. He took responsibility for his performance and did not blame it on that injury. He admits it may have eroded his confidence to some degree. But said he was skating clean LPs in practices. I also think what probably played on his mind as much or more was that he was on the podium last time he was at Worlds...and being out of international competition for two years with Olympic spots looming. Heck, probably the majority of skaters in the event have some sort of injury.
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You know, I feel very sorry for Vincent, but in reading his post, it sounds like he didn’t take responsibility beforehand, at the time when it really mattered. Sadly, he seems to be driven by a lot of internal demons.
 
He did say he was landing multiple quads at practices and getting through the pain. Every skater at his level skates through pain so at times it takes longer for them to realize this isn’t “run-of-the-mill” pain. He also didn’t think it was a big problem till the week of. By that point it would have been too late to call in the substitute with COVID and everything else. He also doesn’t really blame the injury but his own self for his SP skate. I don’t think he did anything irresponsible. Had his doctor told him he couldn’t skate, but he skated anyway, then yeah, he didn’t take responsibility. He also explicitly said he failed. That he didn’t skate up to his preparation and training. He said he let himself, his team, and his country down. I don’t know how much more responsibility he can take for his bad skate. We know Vincent is a self-reflecting young man. I don’t think he has “demons”. He’s just...”poetic”. He likes to write poetry and these sorts of posts.
 
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Re-posting this discussion here ;):
olympic said:
I actually think selecting a US man [for Nebelhorn Trophy] is dicier. Zhou spooks everyone right now, but if he's PROVEN healthy, then maybe him. Otherwise, who? A lot of the US journeymen retired after 2018 - Rippon, Miner, Aaron, Hochstein. The newcomers flash brilliance but are all over the place.
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VGThuy said:
I think it would be right for Vincent to earn it. Plus, he’ll be hungry and have a lot to prove. This a man who is planning five quads in his LP, including the hardest ones. He needs to do it.
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It will be interesting to see if USFS will have a selection process for which man goes to Nebelhorn Trophy or if Vincent will be the automatic first choice.

P.S. Nathan was AMAZING today :kickass: and Jason was compelling to watch as usual (stood up on his opening 4S<).
 
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BTW, not to minimize Nathan's extraordinary achievement, but was his shirt really out of Shae-Lynn's closet of old costumes or was that a joke? :unsure:
 
Honestly, I don’t think Vincent’s injury that has suddenly appeared was why he didn’t skate well. Reports were that he was doing well in practice and warm-up.


I think once he hit the ice on that first jump it was over. Whether at that point he decided it hurt or he just gave up, which is kind of what it looked like, it was over. His goal was not to make the cut, his goal was to challenge Nathan and Hanyu for a medal . He knew when he landed on the ice on that first jump the goal was probably out of reach

Generally at this point in the season, there’s not a skater out there who probably doesn’t have some kind a body part that hurts.
 
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Carolla5501 said:
Did you bother to read the article before editorializing on it
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Yes, dear, I did. In an article about Nathan’s win, there was no need for him to diss Jason for “failing once again to land a fully rotated quad for the first time in his career.” His long-standing negativity towards Jason and quads is tiresome, and it was especially tacky here, in view of the quotes that Jason so generously gave him.
 
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