Olympic governing body 'knows the truth' behind late figure skater's alleged sexual abuse

[PRlady]

The lawyer needs a defendant and John is dead. I would guess he’s about to sue the rink(s) and/or USFS for contributing to the abuse by not reporting it. It may not be a successful civil case but it’s clear Manley has a strategy going forward.

 

[Prancer]

Yeah @Prancer. I don't know anything so I'm bandying about right along with everyone else on here what's been gossiped about in all of the Coughlin threads on FSU, and what's been mentioned in news articles. Go back and read the articles and previous threads if you wish. Maybe you can make sense out of it.

I obviously read them all, as I have been a participant in them all.

And again, in the previous thread, I read posts stating that it was a third party who came forward on behalf of the two people who were minors when those incidents were supposed to have occurred many years ago.

So link to the posts. Up in the right top corner of every post, there is a number. If you click on that number, you will be given the URL for the post. Copy the URLs, post them here, and let's see the original posts so we can assess these claims for accuracy.

Now obviously, none of this has been confirmed. And that's the problem, particularly with @okokok777 having posted something that conflicts with what posters mentioned in the previous thread.

okokok777 has posted direct quotations from and links to the Kansas City newspaper as support and hasn't said anything I haven't seen officially reported before. Maybe I missed something. What do you consider conflicting here?

 

[Meoima]

The lawyer needs a defendant and John is dead. I would guess he’s about to sue the rink(s) and/or USFS for contributing to the abuse by not reporting it. It may not be a successful civil case but it’s clear Manley has a strategy going forward.

So they have the option to sue USFA or Safesport instead? I didn’t expect.

 

[MsZem]

The lawyer needs a defendant and John is dead. I would guess he’s about to sue the rink(s) and/or USFS for contributing to the abuse by not reporting it. It may not be a successful civil case but it’s clear Manley has a strategy going forward.

If there might be pending litigation, I guess that's all the more reason for the federation to avoid commenting.

 

[Prancer]

So they have the option to sue USFA or Safesport instead? I didn’t expect.

I doubt the accusers intend to sue SafeSport.

 

[Meoima]

Another report brought to us by super objective Christine Brennen. Let the poor man and his family rest in peace.

People are free to not believe Christine Brennen. But the lawyer put his name and his words in there. He certainly is responsible for his statements. And he has his reputation so he can not make up things not told by his clients.
Not saying which side says the truth or lies in this case, once the lawyer says something like this, certainly they are not joking.

 

[PRlady]

If there might be pending litigation, I guess that's all the more reason for the federation to avoid commenting.

Exactly. The USFS’ longtime press person is careful. Lawyers look for big targets and deep pockets, and SafeSport’s statement about patterns of abuse in skating provides a rationale for suing USFS. As soon as I read Manley’s statement about protecting other little girls, with this accused perpetrator dead, I thought there’s a bigger target in mind.

 

[aftershocks]

^I'm a bit confused by your first paragraph. According to the KC article, the first allegation (which involved an adult in her later teens) was made by a third party. The source of the second and third allegations (which involved minors) has not been made public at this time.

Right. And thanks for posting directly from the article in the local Kansas City newspaper. When the first allegation was being discussed, I don't recall any reference to a third party having come forward with that initial allegation. It was the story in the Kansas City newspaper which is the first indication I'm aware of regarding the first allegation having been made by a third party. And then, the allegations involving two minors, as stated in the Kansas City paper: "Family and friends were unclear whether either of the girls or a third party had made the allegation."

So that's where it became more confusing. The family isn't sure who made the allegations regarding two minors from years earlier, but a third party was referenced as a possibility. I didn't recall the family stating that a third party made the first allegation, so I thought you were presenting new information, possibly from a second article. Plus, the thread that discussed the Kansas City article contained a number of posts where people mentioned the article having confirmed rumors they'd heard, including posts by some people who know Coughlin's family and friends. And then other posters chipped in offering their takes and sharing personal stories and suppositions. Emotions ran high, and eventually the thread was closed.

What do you consider conflicting here?

See my above post. okokok777's post did not contain conflicting information, so I stand corrected.

It was the thread about the Kansas City article where a number of posters discussed the family's revelations. Nothing that's been reported or rumored has been officially confirmed.

 

[AxelAnnie]

People are free to not believe Christine Brennen. But the lawyer put his name and his words in there. He certainly is responsible for his statements. And he has his reputation so he can not make up things not told by his clients.
Not saying which side says the truth or lies in this case, once the lawyer says something like this, certainly they are not joking.

Do you really believe that? Lawyers twist words for a living.

 

[Prancer]

Perhaps people don't understand this, but when I say don't post speculation, I mean don't post speculation about anyone.

 

[Meoima]

Do you really believe that? Lawyers twist words for a living.

They could not say A if their clients say B. Their clients pay the money. "Our clients want to continue this case" that means their clients want to. Whether or not you believe their clients is another story.

 

[okokok777]

Right. And thanks for posting directly from the article in the local Kansas City newspaper. When the first allegation was being discussed, I don't recall any reference to a third party having come forward with that initial allegation. It was the story in the Kansas City newspaper which is the first indication I'm aware of regarding the first allegation having been made by a third party. And then, the allegations involving two minors, as stated in the Kansas City paper: "Family and friends were unclear whether either of the girls or a third party had made the allegation."

So that's where it became more confusing. The family isn't sure who made the allegations regarding two minors from years earlier, but a third party was referenced as a possibility. I didn't recall the family stating that a third party made the first allegation, so I thought you were presenting new information, possibly from a second article. Plus, the thread that discussed the Kansas City article contained a number of posts where people mentioned the article having confirmed rumors they'd heard, including posts by some people who know Coughlin's family and friends. And then other posters chipped in offering their takes and sharing personal stories and suppositions. Emotions ran high, and eventually the thread was closed.



See my above post. okokok777's post did not contain conflicting information, so I stand corrected.

It was the thread about the Kansas City article where a number of posters discussed the family's revelations. Nothing that's been reported or rumored has been officially confirmed.

@aftershocks I was about to ask the same question as @Prancer but you already responded LOL

Thank you for explaining where your confusion came from. There has been a lot of discussion regarding these incidents floating around social media. It is for that reason that I always make sure to double-check and cite sources, such as news outlets and official statements from SafeSport, before commenting.

Based on the publicly-available information (from Christine Brennan/USA Today, Dan Hill and SafeSport, JC's family and friends and Attorney John Manly), I really hope that SafeSport launches an investigation into any complicit parties (coaches, rinks, USFS) who may have contributed to ongoing abuse.

P.S. In the future, I suggest being a bit more careful before claiming that a post is offering "conflicting" reports. As you said before, there are a number of posts (both here and on other social media platforms) discussing the allegations - we must be extra careful not to conflate information coming from news outlets/NGBs with information coming from fans.

 

[skatfan]

Christine Brennan is not a reliable reporter. She has various agendas and reports only what supports her latest cause. Lately, it is sexual abuse. With the gymnastics scandal concluded with Nasser’s conviction, she is looking for other scandals to report on. Yes, sexual abuse is serious, but that doesn’t necessarily make it prevalent. Unnamed ( and not credible—the accusers’ lawyer, really?—sources are just a step above gossip. Until Christine finds someone willing to go on the record, her reporting is worthless.

Brennan is a veteran reporter for a national newspaper with a more than 30-year career. To my knowledge she hasn’t been sued. She has editors who make sure she doesn’t report false things and get confirmation for sensitive matters.

In this case, the fact that the victims are represented by Manly is important. He has represented victims related to the catholic church (successfully sued) and the Nassar victims (suits and claims with USA gymnastics underway for settlement in bankruptcy court). He is only going to take credible cases. He can say things and based on his track record, people will believe him. He is not just any lawyer. That is well above “gossip.”

US Figure Skating Better have a plan to respond to the Coughlin allegations - this is a shot across the bow.

 

[giselle23]

Brennan is a veteran reporter for a national newspaper with a more than 30-year career. To my knowledge she hasn’t been sued. She has editors who make sure she doesn’t report false things and get confirmation for sensitive matters.

In this case, the fact that the victims are represented by Manly is important. He has represented victims related to the catholic church (successfully sued) and the Nassar victims (suits and claims with USA gymnastics underway for settlement in bankruptcy court). He is only going to take credible cases. He can say things and based on his track record, people will believe him. He is not just any lawyer. That is well above “gossip.”

US Figure Skating Better have a plan to respond to the Coughlin allegations - this is a shot across the bow.

The issue isn’t false reporting or defamation. It is her agenda. A lawyer’s job is to advocate for his client. What he says is, at best, put in the best possible light for his case. It is not evidence or proof of anything. And his association with the Nasser case is irrelevant—mentioned only to suggest this case is similar, which it is not. I understand that the accusers may not want to step forward but unless they do, all we have is hearsay and speculation. That is not news.

 

[Artistic Skaters]

I also question Manly's characterization of Coughlin taking his own life as "despicable... a mixture of denial, ignorance and in some instances, malice." What kind of statement is that??? It's horrible for anyone to get to the point where they would take their own life, but calling the act 'despicable' is not Mr. Manly's area of professional authority. And what is meant by "some instances"? There is only one instance in which Coughlin took his own life. I also do not get the references to 'ignorance' and 'malice.' I don't see the connection between suicide and malice. Unless Mr. Manly is a psychiatrist with expertise in suicide and depression, he needs to take several steps back and pursue professional consultation and extensive research.

It doesn't sound like we have read the same news article. Here is the actual statement:

“His family can create any narrative they want to create,” Manly said, “but U.S. Figure Skating knows the truth, and for them to allow a story to circulate that a false accusation led to Mr. Coughlin’s decision to take his own life is despicable. It’s a mixture of denial, ignorance and in some instances, malice.”

The lawyer is clearly discussing the handling of the situation by USFS as the "despicable" act, and referring to USFS when he describes what they are doing as denial, ignorance and in some instances, malice.

Whatever you (or anyone else) think of Christine Brennan, she is reporting on this story as it develops, not sensationalizing anything.

There are now tabloid articles out there ghoulishly detailing every sensational detail regarding the method of suicide from the medical examiner's report. This information is totally inappropriate and unnecessary, and it is only being
shared to attract the gawkers.

Christine Brennan has not included anything like this in her reports and has remained focused on the abuse of athletes and SafeSport. She began reporting on these topics a long time before the cases of either Coughlin or Nassar, and her coverage in this area goes back many years to when USFSA was still handling their own grievances prior to SafeSport.

 

[okokok777]

The issue isn’t false reporting or defamation. It is her agenda. A lawyer’s job is to advocate for his client. What he says is, at best, put in the best possible light for his case. It is not evidence or proof of anything. And his association with the Nasser case is irrelevant—mentioned only to suggest this case is similar, which it is not. I understand that the accusers may not want to step forward but unless they do, all we have is hearsay and speculation. That is not news.

@giselle23 I have to disagree. Regardless of your opinions on Brennan's agenda, I believe the article is newsworthy. It indicates that three women are accusing JC of sexually abusing them as minors AND that these women have retained legal counsel (Source).

This information is especially important as JC's family is arguing that:

1. "SafeSport was used as a weapon" against him (Kansas City Star)
2. “The subject is an Olympic figure skater who was currently trying to get a commentator position with the U.S. Olympic Committee,” Hawkins wrote. “He was competing for the position with another person. This person made false allegations, which resulted in the subject getting suspended from all correspondence and activities.” (USA Today)
3. "Family and friends said Coughlin categorically denied that any of the relationships SafeSport was investigating involved sexual misconduct. Each, they said, was a “peer-to-peer” relationship from his earlier skating days, none from when he was a coach." (Kansas City Star)

The second point is especially interesting, as his family and friends stated that they only knew that the first allegation came from a third party. The source of the second and third allegation has not been made publicly available (Kansas City Star).

TLDR Brennan's new article is important because it complicates the JC family's assertion that the sexual misconduct allegations were falsely created by a third party. It also provides concrete evidence that the alleged victims themselves are accusing JC of misconduct - not just third parties.

 

[LeafOnTheWind]

How much is USFSA responsible for not protecting victims names and other acts that can be considered retaliatory? Yes, figure skating is a small community but how much was done to protect information from gossips and how many felt completely comfortable spreading it around? That alone could indicate a culture of protecting abusers rather than the abused.

I also have questions around disciplinary actions. Certain USFSA members made very public statements that can be construed as attacks on the accusers. Is that also coming into play? Did USFSA take disciplinary action against them and if they did, should it have been made public? Is a private disciplinary action enough from a public relations standpoint as well as changing the mindset of a community? Would someone need to be the example set?

Can Manly use any of this to establish a culture of abuse?

ETA: sorry if any of this isn't clear. The cold medicines are fogging my brain.

 

[chantilly]

All I can say from my perspective is that who cares if Christine Brennan has an agenda. And I’m not saying she does. But even if she does, I have zero problems with it as long as she continues to report the facts. If her continued reporting exposes a federation or coaching group or anyone who abused or covered up abuse of minor female athletes I say more power to her.

The Spotlight reporters definitely had an agenda and thankfully they did.

 

[Erin]

I also think it’s funny that people are accusing Brennan of having an agenda when she also wrote the article with the pretty inflammatory accusations from Coughlin’s family. If she really had an agenda and only wanted to show one side, she wouldn’t have put that article out.

 

[Lanie]

I don't think there is systemic sexual abuse in the sense of a Larry Nassar here, but USFS sweeping this sort of thing under the rug is ridiculous. We've talked enough over the years about weird relationships (Morozov anyone?), coaches, not just sexual things but also weigh-ins, bullying by coaches, partners being abusive, all sorts of things that have permeated this sport's culture and people in the federations just turn a blind eye. Hell, at my rinks growing up I saw parents turning a blind eye. That's got to stop. Maybe with this out in the open USFS can make those steps, but it doesn't seem like they care enough to do so.

Brennan is reporting facts. I knew John--not well, but I talked about it in the other thread. I always thought he was a good guy. Who knows anymore. I was shocked by the accusations, I hurt for the victims and I think they deserve justice no matter what happened, and I am also sorry and sad John felt like he was in such a place that he killed himself. I hurt for his family as well. But Christine Brennan also loves the sport and I think welp, at least someone's trying to hold USFS to account.

 

[overedge]

that hasn't kept too many people from speculating, guess-tulating, pontificating...making judgement calls....

"Pontificating" and "making judgement calls"? You mean like labeling a reporter biased and sensationalistic for reporting facts that don't fit your version of the story?

 

[canbelto]

My heart really goes out to any figure skater who is a victim of abuse right now. To see this kind of response and some of the biggest names in the sport on a full-on "blame the victims and shoot the messengers" campaign ... How will they have the strength to report the abuse? To even admit to trusted people that they are being abused? It's really awful.

 

[mag]

What I don’t understand is why people are talking about an agenda like it is a bad thing. Everyone has an agenda, but it seems to me it is only brought up when someone disagrees with someone else’s agenda. There is no neutral. Neutral is simply another name for not acknowledging an agenda you agree with.

 

[caseyedwards]

This is crazy! It’s like avenatti’s and Gloria Allred’s dont exist and all lawyers are good people who tell the truth

 

[Aerobicidal]

This is crazy! It’s like avenatti’s and Gloria Allred’s dont exist and all lawyers are good people who tell the truth

While the only response this post deserves is [sic], I was curious and googled John Manly.

Aside from his website and lots of coverage of the Nassar case, I did find a page attempting to smear him on a site called The Media Report. Anyone want to guess what that site's agenda (apparently the word of the week) is? Criticizing people who accuse the Catholic Church for being a hotbed of sexual abuse.

Now, that agenda seems somewhat problematic, IMO. I'd argue that it's more problematic than any agenda associated with John Manly, or lawyers in general.

I really don't understand what's at stake for people who are determined to repeat claims about how survivors of sexual abuse are either delusional or should immediately come out publicly with their stories. That demonstrates an astonishing lack of empathy, among other things.

On the other hand, listening to the testimony from the survivors who did have the courage to speak publicly in the Michael Jackson and R. Kelly documentaries (and, although I haven't seen as much of it, in Larry Nassar's trial) is a million times more powerful and important than reading this stupid post I will end now.

 

[lala]

I don't want to read this whole thread..so are there facts, evidences on Caughlin's sin?Did anyone or any organization clear what happened, what did Caughlin do with the victim, when, who were the victim ( without names, of course), etc?

 

[BittyBug]

I don't want to read this whole thread...

Seriously @lala? I like you but if you're truly interested you could do a quick search on the internet as well as read the past threads on FSU. It's a complicated matter.

 

[MsZem]

I don't want to read this whole thread..so are there facts, evidences on Caughlin's sin?Did anyone or any organization clear what happened, what did Caughlin do with the victim, when, who were the victim ( without names, of course), etc?

It would be difficult to provide this kind of detailed evidence in a way that wouldn't identify the victims. You can read the article linked in the first post in this thread for a statement from their lawyer. The same article also has a link to an earlier one that covers the most recent statements from the Coughlin family.

Anything else would be gossip and speculation.

 

[UGG]

I don't want to read this whole thread..so are there facts, evidences on Caughlin's sin?Did anyone or any organization clear what happened, what did Caughlin do with the victim, when, who were the victim ( without names, of course), etc?

The lawyer who represented victims of Larry Nassar has come forward and stated he is representing 3 victims of John Coughlin. He stated the victims were minors at the time of the incidents.

 

[CaliSteve]

Another report brought to us by super objective Christine Brennen. Let the poor man and his family rest in peace.

The article was about the narrative that JC family and friends put out about an alleged motive.