IAAF and Russian Athletics Anti-Doping Corruption Review

[poths]

FFS doping and corruption is blatantly just as prevelant in the USA as it is in Russia

 

[Coquelicot14]

To be met with 'fans' who are so oblivious to the state of the sport and disgusted by anyone who highlights the bloody obvious, is utterly frustrating. Year upon year, skaters are favoured and "chosen" deals are made and results are fixed.

I am eagerly awaiting for you court sanctioned documentation, videos, police investigation, proof over your claim of Sotnikova's "bought" medal, as you so callously claim. You have stated that as a "fact". Ok, let's see if you have proof of this statement.
I am not interested in your delirious opinion, only that you have the proof of the statement.
if you do not have such, the comments regarding libel and slander are very relevant indeed.

 

[poths]

: Evidence thus far

 

[Coquelicot14]

Ah, ok. You are a teenager....
But that's just my opinion
(No offense to all mature teenagers here)

 

[overedge]

Also, I have to laugh at anyone who can be so ignorant as to think there's no PEDS in skating,

No one is saying there are no PEDs in skating. But I still haven't seen anything showing how PEDs would actually improve a skater's performance. If they did, more skaters would be using them. And if there is widespread PED abuse in skating, surely more evidence would have emerged by now.

The last leaked report of failed drug tests (sorry, I can't find a link to it) in all Olympic sports showed very few, if any, failed tests in figure skating - the skating-related ones were in short-track and long-track speedskating.

 

[Xela M]

Russian girls increase in PCS in 2013-14 season was unprecendented.

China replaced East Germany as the biggest doping country in the world especially in swimming. All you have to do is look at Chinese female swimmers in the 1990's and see how they improved. You would have to be naive to believe it was all kosher. And of course the age thing with the female Chinese gymnastic team is always a question mark of just how they actually are.

Gimme a break. The US has been a dominate swimming country since the days of Johnny Weissmuller back in the 1920's. And at least our female swimmers never looked like men like the East German female swimmers did. It's amazing how obvious it was to anyone with a brain that they were doping but no one did anything about it for years.
Individual athletes cheat in the US but the old Soviet Union and East German's were state run from the very top.

So every nation is doping except the US? Haha is all I have to say to that. US swimmers will be caught out soon enough and they will suddenly completely coincidentally lose their dominance just like the Germans.

I know this is a contriversial view point, but I actually personally have nothing against doping in endurance sports or weight lifting because I just accept that everyone does it and it's not humanly possible to achieve those results without. I still respect the athletes just as much and I don't think it diminishes their achievements because even if an ordinary person was to inject himself with a lion's share of doping it still wouldn't make him into an Olympic champion without the amazing talent and the painful back-breaking work they put into it all their lives.

 

[Perky Shae Lynn]

poths - simple question... How did what you posted (the links you provided) supported the statement that Adelina's gold medal was bought? Why did you single her out? Why not speculate about Davis & White's win for example?

Corruption is a huge issue in skating. I have no doubt that bribes and deals are common. I have little doubt Russia has led this parade for decades. Doesn't mean we should throw baseless accusations at individual skaters. Re-watched Sochi tapes. Ladies competition was certainly controversial. Made more controversial by who the players were. An awkward girl that came out of nowhere vs. a legendary skater. But man, Adelina gave an amazing performance. The most problematic thing were not the scores. It was the appalling behavior of Russian skating 'fans' - they sucked the energy out of every non-Russian performance in ladies & pairs. I have forgotten how bad it was. So when people say Sotnikova only won because the competition was held in Russia, they are probably right. Whether her medal was 'bought' or not, we will only know after the investigation produces evidence.

 

[Coco]

I'm not sure why there is such an uproar over this anyway. Nothing was said that hasn't been said here before, many times over by many people.

Really?

Lord knows there was a lot said about fairness of the marks, but I don't think anyone has ever explicitly alleged on this board that the callers, referees, judges, plus whomever had control over which judges were selected, and for which phase, were paid cash to put Sotnikova ahead of Kim.

 

[once_upon]

Wait - rogaine is on the list of banned substances?

You learn something new every day.

 

[Coquelicot14]

Really?

Lord knows there was a lot said about fairness of the marks, but I don't think anyone has ever explicitly alleged on this board that the callers, referees, judges, plus whomever had control over which judges were selected, and for which phase, were paid cash to put Sotnikova ahead of Kim.

A delusional fan's fantasy... Stated as a fact, no less. You saw his/her proof in emoticons just a few posts above.

 

[Coquelicot14]

Wait - rogaine is on the list of banned substances?

You learn something new every day.

I was surprised as well.
I guess a skater would have to wait until the end of competitive career! No fair!

 

[once_upon]

Too bad, my dermatologist tells me there is a small window of time for rogaine to be effective. Too much baldness for too long - rogaine may not be effective. As it is it is a crap shoot anyway. I'm just thankful that it is resolving my female alopecia symptoms

 

[alchemy void]

It was the appalling behavior of Russian skating 'fans' - they sucked the energy out of every non-Russian performance in ladies & pairs. I have forgotten how bad it was.

This. I remembered the crowds were bad but upon rewatching it was even worse than I remember. Embarrassing, really.

 

[overedge]

Too bad, my dermatologist tells me there is a small window of time for rogaine to be effective. Too much baldness for too long - rogaine may not be effective. As it is it is a crap shoot anyway. I'm just thankful that it is resolving my female alopecia symptoms

My bad - the banned substance is finasteride, which is one of the ingredients in Propecia and Proscar. Rogaine, however, contains minoxidil, which is not banned.

Here's a story about a skeleton luger that got caught for taking Propecia and Proscar, to regrow his hair...
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/19/fashion/thursdaystyles/19skin2.html?_r=0

I am pretty sure there was a male pairs skater that got caught for the same reason, but I can't find any online stories about it.

 

[Willin]

I know in NCAA sports athletes are encouraged to tell their coaches about EVERY medicine or cream or supplement they take. At least one player's been suspended this year for taking medicine that's allowed, but was not reported to the school before drug testing leading to a positive test and a suspension.

The NCAA does have a lot more control over their athletes than, say, the ISU; but I think every country's organization should encourage this. Sure, it's invasive, but maintaining proof of medications prescribed or by doctors that contain banned substances can save them a ton of grief later. Athletes are also encouraged to ask about over-the-counter medications before buying them because some over-the-counter stuff can have banned chemicals in them or provide false positives.
Now, because this is invasive I don't think it should be required, but I think a policy like this would be useful for Olympic/World caliber athletes in case they need to take a banned substance for a medically necessary reason or if they take something medically necessary that may trigger a false positive.

 

[Deleted member 40371]

This. I remembered the crowds were bad but upon rewatching it was even worse than I remember. Embarrassing, really.

Nothing gets to SLC level embarrassment where it was either with us (US) or them attitude. That was piss poor, I don't think any games have reached to SLC or Atlanta level embarrassment. In Atlanta, there was too much cheering for home performance that many athletes on the floor could not hear the music .

 

[overedge]

Now, because this is invasive I don't think it should be required, but I think a policy like this would be useful for Olympic/World caliber athletes in case they need to take a banned substance for a medically necessary reason or if they take something medically necessary that may trigger a false positive.

I think most federations for Olympic sports are very clear that their athletes have to report every medication they take, even if it's over-the-counter and/or not on the list, in case an athlete gets an unexpected positive test. Canadian rower Silken Laumann failed a drug test because she was told by the team doctor to take Benadryl for a cold, and she mistakenly bought extra-strength Benadryl which contains a banned substance.
http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/laumann-fails-drug-test/

AFAIK if an athlete needs to take a banned substance for a medical reason, they have to get a clearance from their federation to do so.

 

[Vagabond]

Nothing gets to SLC level embarrassment where it was either with us (US) or them attitude. That was piss poor, I don't think any games have reached to SLC or Atlanta level embarrassment. In Atlanta, there was too much cheering for home performance that many athletes on the floor could not hear the music .

I know that it's difficult for people who haven't lived in North America to understand this, but Americans and Canadians don't tend to root for each other's athletes all that much, and certainly not just because they are fellow North Americans.

 

[Deleted member 40371]

I know that it's difficult for people who haven't lived in North America to understand this, but Americans and Canadians don't tend to root for each other's athletes all that much, and certainly not just because they are fellow North Americans.

Salt Lake City and Atlanta are both in the USA, I certainly don't think Canadians and USAns cheer each other unless they don't have their own athletes to cheer for. I did not claim that in my post either.

 

[aftershocks]

Bad sportsmanship by fans and arena staffers is embarrassing and petty wherever and whenever it occurs. Comparing worst instances is rather useless.

 

[Vagabond]

Salt Lake City and Atlanta are both in the USA, I certainly don't think Canadians and USAns cheer each other unless they don't have their own athletes to cheer for. I did not claim that in my post either.

What you did say was:

Nothing gets to SLC level embarrassment where it was either with us (US) or them attitude.

And, given your subsequent post, it appears that you do believe that Americans will cheer Canadians (like Salé & Pelletier) when they don't have their own team to cheer for and, what's more, they actually did so. This really isn't the case. In fact, there's a fair amount of cheering against each other's teams and athletes, particularly in ice hockey.

Of course Americans cheer for Americans. Just as Russians cheer for Russians and Portuguese cheer for Portuguese. That's just how it goes. But to suppose that American spectators have an "us versus them" attitude does a disservice to Americans.

Have you ever been to the United States? If not, spending some time here and meeting people might be an eye opener for you.

 

[allezfred]

Ah, ok. You are a teenager....
But that's just my opinion
(No offense to all mature teenagers here)

For what it's worth, I thought Sotnikova deserved gold in Sochi.

 

[MarieM]

: Evidence thus far

Ah I love you you made me laugh again

 

[DimaToe]

Of course Sotnikova's OGM was bought, same for Kim's OSM and Kostner's OBM, as far as I know medals aren't made for free,just ask the ISU. Although with all the you'd think they'd be able to scrap up enough money to stop giving out those microscopic medals at worlds.

 

[Carolla5501]

I think this thread probably is more "trash can" then anything else

 

[GarrAargHrumph]

No one is saying there are no PEDs in skating. But I still haven't seen anything showing how PEDs would actually improve a skater's performance. If they did, more skaters would be using them. And if there is widespread PED abuse in skating, surely more evidence would have emerged by now.

The last leaked report of failed drug tests (sorry, I can't find a link to it) in all Olympic sports showed very few, if any, failed tests in figure skating - the skating-related ones were in short-track and long-track speedskating.

I think that current PEDs would do very little for any figure skater during the event itself. It'd be more about recovery from injury or similar; long term stuff. And even there, some say that PEDs don't actually help with recovery, not that athletes don't take them for that purpose.

 

[allezfred]

There is a press conference by the report's authors happening right now.

Live blog

 

[allezfred]

Short and sweet is that WADA are recommending that Russia be suspended from IAAF. They also found that the Russian government is involved in manipulating doping tests for Russian athletes, including at the Sochi Olympics.

While its report largely focuses on doping in Russian athletics, it adds “there is no reason to believe that athletics is the only sport in Russia to have been affected.”

Link to the full report

 

[Buzz]

Have an entire country be suspended from Athletic competition before?! Are things with doping in Russia that bad?!
http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/34765444

 

[skipaway]

It also said the International Olympic Committee should not accept any entries from the Russian federation until the body has been declared complaint with the code and the suspension has been lifted. Such a decision could keep Russian athletes out of next year’s Olympics in Rio de Janeiro

Doping Scandal