I, Tonya

I

Inessence

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Japanfan

Japanfan

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alchemy void said:
I get Zayak’s point, but in the grand scheme of things, is Tonya getting a standing ovation in LA really a big deal? No.
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And I'm sure Tonya really appreciated it. It's not as if she gets Standing O's regularly, unless you go back in time to her competitor days. Did Tonya actually ever get a standing O in the rink?
 
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AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)

AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)

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alchemy void said:
I get Zayak’s point, but in the grand scheme of things, is Tonya getting a standing ovation in LA really a big deal? No.

I can’t wait to see this.
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Thats what I thought.

Zayak seemed bitter too. So ONE theatre in LA people stood. And?

Although wasnt 94 the year she returned?

IIRC the podium was Tonya, Kwan, Bobek and then Zayak....

Movie was amazeballs!!!!
 
VGThuy

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If Lizzie Borden had fans after the fact, then Tonya getting a standing ovation from an audience who witnessed a very sympathetic well-made movie that showcased a victimized portrayal of Tonya and hardly shows the victim, Nancy, so she's not humanized at all and who probably didn't know much about all of the facts of the incident and Tonya is understandable.
 
Aussie Willy

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I think Tonya looks good.

Regardless of what you think of Tonya, having your life acted out and put up on a screen is a pretty big deal. Most people outside the sport will probably see things differently to those around the sport and frankly they are not going to care about what happened all those years ago and would have moved on. So what if they give her a standing ovation.
 
BaileyCatts

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I watch the entertainment shows and I kinda agree with Elaine. I don't like the angle that the story is now taking. That poor Tonya is the victim here, lets all embrace her. Nancy is the only victim here. She was physically attacked and probably still lives with visions of that to this day, and then was, and still is, mocked for crying 'why, why' after being struck with a metal baton. A few inches lower he could have shattered her kneecap. But oh poor poor Tonya. She was so persecuted and everyone was against her, look at her awful life, blah blah blah. Lots of people have a bad, horrible, abusive, poverty filled life, and have to fight their way out of that to succeed, and they do (which, by the way, she also did). And now its like, oh Tonya, "we" (the collective 'we' as in society), were so wrong to treat you that way, you did nothing wrong, all those abusive people around you did this and you were just a poor innocent pawn. "We're" so sorry "we" treated you this way. (by the way .... let me finish my comments before you start tearing me apart!) ......

I'm sorry but I believe Tonya was fully involved in the planning of this from the start. In fact, I think it was her idea. I also believe it was her idea to phone in that death threat at Regionals so she wouldn't have to compete. And remember, I was a diehard supporter of Tonya at the time and was convinced she had nothing to do with it as it was all unfolding. Until the facts started coming out. I also believe a lot of the things she said about why she didn't speak up were lies, since something new seemed to pop up every time the story got rehashed. And the way she continues to lie about it even all these years later. Although I believe in her mind, she does believe what she says is the truth and she truly believes she had nothing to do with it.

In both the docu shows they would show a "here's the facts" and then show Tonya saying the complete opposite thing, and the way she said it you could tell she really believed what the was saying. I particularly love the part where they were talking to the Prosecutor about the notes found in the trash at the restaurant. They show Tonya saying "they tested that handwriting and it wasn't mine!". Cue the Prosecutor, "we tested the handwriting and it was Tonya's". For all her claims of "I apologized over and over", no, Tonya, you didn't. Saying "I'm sorry you got hurt; I'm sorry this happened to you" is not apologizing. And she has the nerve to be angry about the way she was portrayed in the media, she's not a villain, she's just as much a victim as Nancy? No, Tonya, you are not. And now its like she's becoming this anti-hero that should be embraced because she was so abused. Do I believe her mother and Jeff were abusive? Yes. Do I believe its as outrageous as Tonya claims? Somewhat, especially the stories about her mother since those were witnessed by other skaters, people at the rinks, etc. Do I believe all the things she said Jeff did to her, like the gun to the head, getting dragged into the woods and beaten, threatened that they would kill her? No. If they killed her or beat her (thus rendering her unable to skate), then there goes the perceived money train they were expecting. . .... (by the way .... let me finish my comments before you start tearing me apart!) .......

However ........ I do understand that this movie is just a movie. They exaggerated, added, omitted the basic facts of the story to create the screen play. Its not a documentary, its dark comedy, and written to portray exactly that, and showed the story from a "Tonya is a victim" angle. Probably half the people in that theater weren't even born yet when it happened, don't follow skating, or have no clue about what really happened other than what they just saw in that movie. Even Margot had no clue who Tonya Harding was. Hell the people who wrote the screenplay probably don't even know as much about the event as we all do. And really, unless you were a diehard skating fan, you probably did not follow the story the way we all did. It was just something on the news and in the cycle of life at the time. One of those pop culture moments in life that years later you go "oh yeah I remember when that happened". (.....still not done yet!) ......

Will I see the movie? Of course I will! I will probably get the DVD too. Its already getting nominated for a lot of awards and wouldn't it be fantastic if it got Oscar nods? And won Best Picture?! Absolutely! Anything to get skating into the news? Sure, why not. I just don't like how the overall tone in the media is shifting to poor Tonya, the victim, lets celebrate her and embrace her! Dear lord please don't let her end up on Dancing with the Stars so she can be "redeemed"! She was involved in a plot to physically attack her competitor so she could win the Gold (which was never going to happen with or without Nancy there with the way she was skating at the time). She permanently tarnished the sport (even though we did get the explosion of popularity because of it), and you don't get to be redeemed from that.

There ... I'm done. Blast away! Although I probably won't see it until after GPF is over so I don't run into spoilers. :p
 
Yazmeen

Yazmeen

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Before anyone decides to go off on Zayak and claiming she was jealous of the attention on Harding, I can remember reading that she did this for herself because she wanted to be there, not because she had any illusions of winning medals or making the Olympic team. The pewter medal was just icing on a successful comeback cake for her.
 
bardtoob

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Yazmeen said:
Before anyone decides to go off on Zayak and claiming she was jealous of the attention on Harding, I can remember reading that she did this for herself because she wanted to be there, not because she had any illusions of winning medals or making the Olympic team.
Click to expand...

Personally, I concluded that Zayak probably was also scared for herself at 1994 Nationals because nobody knew at that time why Nancy was attacked or if others would also be attacked.
 
AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)

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ks777 said:
lol yes I recognize it also. That choreography is from her SP "people are still having sex"
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I WAS GONNA PUT THAT in my review.. I WAS SO EXCITED..

People r still having sex program /competition is IN THE MOVIE!!!!

OMG How I loved it back then.. I was basically 21ish and going to clubs and I LOVED that song... Other skaters were doing Vivaldi, etc... and she did instrumental version of People r still having sex...

I LOVED the production of that song SO MUCH!!!!!!
 
Jot the Dot Dot

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MacMadame

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BaileyCatts said:
In both the docu shows they would show a "here's the facts" and then show Tonya saying the complete opposite thing, and the way she said it you could tell she really believed what the was saying.
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Really? Because I remember at the time people seeing her say those things and saying "She's lying!" I always thought you could tell when Tonya was lying myself. I just don't think she's very good at it and she had a lot of tells.

As for how the movie treats her story and whether or not it's fair, I'm going to wait until I see the movie to decide. :D
 
bardtoob

bardtoob

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BaileyCatts said:
In both the docu shows they would show a "here's the facts" and then show Tonya saying the complete opposite thing, and the way she said it you could tell she really believed what the was saying.
Click to expand...
MacMadame said:
Really? Because I remember at the time people seeing her say those things and saying "She's lying!" I always thought you could tell when Tonya was lying myself. I just don't think she's very good at it and she had a lot of tells.
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I was told Tonya gave mixed signals and had shifty eyes that made it difficult to tell her intentions. What would have been "tells" for most people were unreliable when it came to Tonya.

My suspicion is that Tonya lied a lot, but not just to hide wrong doing. Tonya probably lied to:

- hide physical abuse
- hide mental abuse
- hide poverty
- hide social faux pas
- hide inconsequential wrong doing
- hide consequential wrong doing

Tonya probably learned to lie at a young age to survive a situation in which she had very little power, and that continued into adulthood, when it was no longer necessary.
 
G

GloriaW

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And the word lies is fully accurate the way you phrase it; I truly 'get' the nuances. It makes me think of the "irony" (?) of all her personae being so committed to a sport in which "creating the fantasy" of the ladies champion is ... fantasy? not truly truth? A lie (nah, harsh) but ... still, you get my slippery slope thinking on this. How Tonya navigated all this is fascinating, whether you admire her or not.
 
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