From Russia with Love [#34]: Autumn 2019

[Sylvia]

Any updates about Savosin‘s WD from his 2nd GP?
Is he injured?

I heard at Skate America that he's been dealing with injury. That's why he didn't attempt a quad in his programs there and only did 3A (fell, was called <; normally a good jump for him) in the SP.

 

[DobrinFan]

Speaking of former successful juniors: Erokhov?! Where is he?

Somewhere in Sambo 70. He is not schedule to compete anywhere yet so probably still injured.

Roman didn't land much of anything at SA. He looked way under-prepared. That 3a wasn't close to happening in practice, singles and doubles.

 

[love_skate2011]

Its looking more like Mishina / Galliamov will be russian No.1 pair this season
T/M mistake again and B/K only 1 point ahead 76+ while M/G scored 75 in+ a B event and their first senior season.

still waiting for Stolbova/ Novoselov debut
but theres a good chance 3 or 4 russian pairs will be in GPF.

My ranking for now

1 Mishina / Gallaimov
2 Tarasova / Morozov , Boikova / Kozlovski
3
4 Pavlyuchenko / Khodykin
5 Stolbova / Novoselov ?
6 Efimova / Korovin

 

[Tinami Amori]

Speaking of former successful juniors: Erokhov?! Where is he?

Somewhere in Sambo 70. He is not schedule to compete anywhere yet so probably still injured.

Alexey Erohov is said to be now an assistant-coach to Dudakov (recent situation), helping him to teach jrs. and novices in the group. Some while back he posted something like "still dealing with transition issues from jr. to sr.". I don't know if it is official, but we'll know in May 2020, when skaters announce the next season's plans.

 

[hanca]

Its looking more like Mishina / Galliamov will be russian No.1 pair this season
T/M mistake again and B/K only 1 point ahead 76+ while M/G scored 75 in+ a B event and their first senior season.

still waiting for Stolbova/ Novoselov debut
but theres a good chance 3 or 4 russian pairs will be in GPF.

My ranking for now

1 Mishina / Gallaimov
2 Tarasova / Morozov , Boikova / Kozlovski
3
4 Pavlyuchenko / Khodykin
5 Stolbova / Novoselov ?
6 Efimova / Korovin

Isn’t it a medical condition (or a symptom of a condition), when someone’s thinking gets attached to an idea and then they struggle to move on?

 

[mjb52]

Maybe I have Stockholm syndrome but I have gotten rather attached to these periodic M/G posts! Wouldn't we all love to have someone this all in for us?

 

[Gris]

Maybe I have Stockholm syndrome but I have gotten rather attached to these periodic M/G posts! Wouldn't we all love to have someone this all in for us?

You know what, I'm thinking about the same. Every skater works so hard and they all deserve an all in uber like love_skate2011.

 

[starrynight]

Any 6 year olds landing quads?

Genuine question here.

If Russia can teach quads and a triple axel to a heap of 11 year old girls, where are the boys?

It's the same technique and element isn't it?

Just genuinely interested as to why there doesn't seem to be the same thing being taught to boys.

I get that the culture of mens vs ladies singles are different universes. You only have to look at the ruthlessness of Sambo 70 vs Nathan Chen who is some college dude who does the sport part time over Skype lol.

 

[rfisher]

Genuine question here.

If Russia can teach a quad and a triple axel to a heap of 11 year old girls, where are the boys?

It's the same technique and element isn't it?

Just genuinely interested as to why there doesn't seem to be the same thing being taught to boys.

I get that the culture of mens vs ladies singles are different universes. You only have to look at Sambo 70 vs Nathan Chen who is some college dude who does the sport part time over Skype lol.

Sambo-70 has several boys who do both.

 

[starrynight]

Sambo-70 has several boys who do both.

Who are they and how old are they? I read the Russia with Love thread everyday but I don't see much discussion of them?

 

[rfisher]

Who are they and how old are they? I read the Russia with Love thread everyday but I don't see much discussion of them?

Samsonov, Danielian---pretty much all the Russians in the JGPF. Most of the discussion on juniors are in the JGPF or Russian cup threads and not this one.

 

[starrynight]

Samsonov, Danielian---pretty much all the Russians in the JGPF. Most of the discussion on juniors are in the JGPF or Russian cup threads and not this one.

Difference with the girls must be that the junior girls were discussed almost more than the seniors in these threads for a couple of years.

I just looked up Daniil Samsonov - is he really 14 and only 140cm tall? woah. Shoma Uno will be pleased when Samsonov turns senior and relieves him from the title of the short skater.

 

[rfisher]

Difference with the girls must be that the junior girls were discussed almost more than the seniors in these threads for a couple of years.

I just looked up Daniil Samsonov - is he really 14 and only 140cm tall? woah. Shoma Uno will be pleased when Samsonov turns senior and relieves him from the title of the short skater.

There are some talented Russian junior men this season.

 

[starrynight]

There are some talented Russian junior men this season.

I wonder why people don't talk about them in the main Russian threads? Or is it only the girls people like?

 

[Gris]

Difference with the girls must be that the junior girls were discussed almost more than the seniors in these threads for a couple of years.

I just looked up Daniil Samsonov - is he really 14 and only 140cm tall? woah. Shoma Uno will be pleased when Samsonov turns senior and relieves him from the title of the short skater.

ISU Figure Skating on Twitter

“🔢 Junior Grand Prix 2019 - Riga Junior Men Final Standings: 🥇 Andrei Mozalev 🇷🇺 🥈 Sihyeong Lee 🇰🇷 🥉 Daniil Samsonov 🇷🇺 Full results: 🔗 https://t.co/H8glIlmU0Q #⃣ #JGPFigure #FigureSkating”

twitter.com

Yes Daniil is really small. Sihyeong Lee, who is 185cm tall looked like a GIANT there.

 

[starrynight]

ISU Figure Skating on Twitter

“🔢 Junior Grand Prix 2019 - Riga Junior Men Final Standings: 🥇 Andrei Mozalev 🇷🇺 🥈 Sihyeong Lee 🇰🇷 🥉 Daniil Samsonov 🇷🇺 Full results: 🔗 https://t.co/H8glIlmU0Q #⃣ #JGPFigure #FigureSkating”

twitter.com

Yes Daniil is really small. Sihyeong Lee, who is 185cm tall looked like a GIANT there.

Gosh. Worth noting that the Sambo-70 selection criteria of choosing very small children applies to both boys and girls.

 

[rfisher]

I wonder why people don't talk about them in the main Russian threads? Or is it only the girls people like?

I can't answer that except maybe because the girls/women have been do dominant and the Russian men have most certainly not. But, if the current crop of boys mature and go on to senior success, that will change.

 

[Sylvia]

I wonder why people don't talk about them in the main Russian threads?

There's been a bit of discussion about Daniil Samsonov in the JGP threads in Kiss & Cry (87.33 in SP, 163.18 in FS, 250.51 total in winning the JGP in Gdansk POL and qualifying for the JGP Final in his first season of eligibility):

Daniil Samsonov (RUS) | Men Short Program | Gdansk 2019

Visit https://isu.org/JuniorGrandPrix for more information on the ISU Junior Grand Prix of Figure Skating. MEN SHORT PROGRAM START ORDER 18:40:00 - 18:46:00 ...

www.youtube.com

Daniil Samsonov (RUS) | Men Free Skating | Gdansk 2019

Visit https://isu.org/JuniorGrandPrix for more information on the ISU Junior Grand Prix of Figure Skating. MEN FREE SKATE ORDER 11:00:00 - 11:06:00 Warm-Up G...

www.youtube.com

 

[starrynight]

I can't answer that except maybe because the girls/women have been do dominant and the Russian men have most certainly not. But, if the current crop of boys mature and go on to senior success, that will change.

Yes and I also think that men in figure skating has a totally different vibe to it as compared to the culture of being fans of the young girls. Boys and girls are viewed completely differently in skating, I think.

A lot of the teen female followers of the sport love the Sambo 70 girls because they want to be like them and then for others there's something about them being young and cute and well behaved that captures the imagination. The idea of a submissive disciplined male being scared of Eteri isn't as appealing to many people I think. I don't know if the whole mysticism of Sambo-70 works as well for the boys in respect of achieving massive public interest.

And also with the men, there's no real new ground the junior boys can break - the seniors are already doing it.

And being a young boy doesn't give you the advantage a young girl has. Young men get stronger and better as they age (rather than the other way round).

As for Daniil Samsonov - I just watched him and he's still very much a child. He has got a lot of growing up to do before he can challenge Yuzuru or Chen etc. That's what makes mens and ladies different. But I'm glad that he will be left alone to develop as a junior before his time in seniors comes.

And also the men are too well established for the fans of mens singles to be too interested in rapidly dethroning them one after the other. Fans of Hanyu, Chen, Uno for example aren't going to be rushing at Russian junior men. It's a bit of a different equation to the culture of ladies where it's well established that there is a new champ every season.

 

[mjb52]

I am not sure it has so much to do with gender as that Trusova and maybe Shcherbakova (can't remember when her quad lutz kicked in - it was last season right?) were doing things that the ladies at the senior level weren't doing and in some cases that no lady at the senior level had ever done. So when you have junior skaters who could be beating the top seniors in the world if they were age-eligible, of course people will talk about them. With Samsonov and the others, they are great, but they aren't out-performing Chen or Hanyu or Zhou so it isn't the same phenomenon. If we saw one of them land a quad axel or something, something the senior men can't do, I think you'd see the conversation about them ratchet up very dramatically.

 

[Tinami Amori]

If Russia can teach quads and a triple axel to a heap of 11 year old girls, where are the boys?

Who are they and how old are they? I read the Russia with Love thread everyday but I don't see much discussion of them?

If would have watched this season's Junior GP events, and several Russian local competitions (all listed in Kiss'n Cry section), you would not have to ask this question, if Russian jr. men do quads. Many Russian jr. men do or train quads, from different clubs, in different cities in Russia. It's a "must" now in all top coaches' groups.

All Russian Junior Boys who made the JGPF are jumping several quads in their progammes. Samsonov, Gumennik, and the alternatives Danielian and Yablokov..

There are also those young men who did not make the JGPF or the alternative list, but are also jumping/training quads: Rukhin, Lutfullin, Vetlugin, Kunitza, others that i can't think of now.

All top coaches, Tutberidze, Mishin, Boyanova, Davydov, few others, expect their junior boys to do/learn quads. That's a general expectation to get into and to stay in the elite training groups, and some of them start to practice them in novice.

I just looked up Daniil Samsonov - is he really 14 and only 140cm tall? woah. Shoma Uno will be pleased when Samsonov turns senior and relieves him from the title of the short skater.

Well, i guess to compare properly Samsonov (14) and Uno (21), we would need to wait till Samsonov turns 21... Because at 16 Shoma was the tiniest boy on the block...

http://www.insideskating.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/IMG_9126-copy.jpg

Gosh. Worth noting that the Sambo-70 selection criteria of choosing very small children applies to both boys and girls.

Don't start stirring trouble "something odd and evil at Sambo"..... because you do this sh..t constantly.

There are plenty of boys Samsonov's size and height at local Russian competitions. You just don't bother to follow these events (although they are practically ALL posted in kiss and cry with links to live feeds and videos).

Samsonov is on the right. And Khromykh is the tallest girl in 2nd row.

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Most top girls in Junior ranks in Russia are about the same size and height. Fr Panova's, Davydov's, and Tutberidze's group:

imgur.com

Discover the magic of the internet at Imgur, a community powered entertainment destination. Lift your spirits with funny jokes, trending memes, entertaining gifs, inspiring stories, viral videos, and so much more from users.

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and compared to foreign skaters ..... who are often even smaller..

imgur.com

Discover the magic of the internet at Imgur, a community powered entertainment destination. Lift your spirits with funny jokes, trending memes, entertaining gifs, inspiring stories, viral videos, and so much more from users.

imgur.com

What are you trying to do? find a comforting "discovery" that yes, something sinister is taking place in "Sambo group", because it just can't be happening without something evil..."? Well there is something going on.... the secret it.... hard blimey work.

Just learn to handle the fact that Sambo is the top training centre, Tutberidze is currently the most successful coach, and her students produce en-mass the best results. Everything that happens there is under the supervision of skaters' parents, all is legal, and there is not a darn thing jealous foreigners across the ocean can do about it.... except train your own kids well and by the right method....

Gee this reminds me of an old prejudice "why are you jews so successful.... you must be cheating and manipulating and conducting a Judeo-Masonic conspiracy to control the world"....

 

[starrynight]

^^ @Tinami Amori I must say, I think you're on a one person mission to successfully freak people out about Sambo 70 and you're doing a really good job at it. I literally had no opinion about the place or Tutberidze at all until I started reading your posts - particularly the ones demonising Medvedeva and Lipnitskaya. But I guess that's the idea?

 

[Polaris]

You only have to look at the ruthlessness of Sambo 70 vs Nathan Chen who is some college dude who does the sport part time over Skype lol.

You kind of have to marvel at the difference of approach.

 

[starrynight]

You kind of have to marvel at the difference of approach.

That Rocket Man program needs to be accessorised with sunglasses, a skate board and a bong. lol

Also interesting reading: https://fs-gossips.com/kiira-korpi-...u-find-out-how-everything-is-arranged-inside/

 

[zebraswan]

You know what, I'm thinking about the same. Every skater works so hard and they all deserve an all in uber like love_skate2011.

There's a fine line between "zealous fan" and Annie Wilkes in Misery...just saying.

 

[starrynight]

Also how stunning was that throw jump from Aleksandra Boikova and Dmitrii Kozlovskii in their short program at Skate Canada? Beautiful entrance with a big smile from her as she went into it - looked effortless and like she didn't even need to concentrate (although I'm sure she was) and then a beautiful glide out.

You can see it here: https://twitter.com/ISU_Figure/status/1187891184481361921?s=20

A beautiful throw like that has to be my favourite skating element.

 

[love_skate2011]

Also how stunning was that throw jump from Aleksandra Boikova and Dmitrii Kozlovskii in their short program at Skate Canada? Beautiful entrance with a big smile from her as she went into it - looked effortless and like she didn't even need to concentrate (although I'm sure she was) and then a beautiful glide out.

You can see it here: https://twitter.com/ISU_Figure/status/1187891184481361921?s=20

A beautiful throw like that has to be my favourite skating element.

they look like they are copying M/G and T/M Throw
the exit on that reminds me of Mishina's technique

 

[Mad for Skating]

Maybe I have Stockholm syndrome but I have gotten rather attached to these periodic M/G posts! Wouldn't we all love to have someone this all in for us?

I’m super obsessive about my faves so I won’t judge, but I just wish the user could gush over them without tearing down the other pairs.

 

[TAHbKA]

Just genuinely interested as to why there doesn't seem to be the same thing being taught to boys.

Tutberidze said several times in her interviews working with the boys is harder - while there are plenty of girls and the competition is high the boys tended to feel sorry for themselves and demand much more love and attention. I think she was talking back then specifically about Pitkeev, so perhaps the younger boys take after the girls in her group rather than being drama queens.

 

[ChiquitaBanana]

Tutberidze said several times in her interviews working with the boys is harder - while there are plenty of girls and the competition is high the boys tended to feel sorry for themselves and demand much more love and attention. I think she was talking back then specifically about Pitkeev, so perhaps the younger boys take after the girls in her group rather than being drama queens.

Back then you had Mishin saying he prefered coaching boys as it was much easier...