From Russia with love [#28]: Autumn to Winter 2017

Yes but what does that really mean? They are a team that if sent to euros can be a 10th place team.
One year they were 4th though, then 10th, then didn't make it this season. So they could rebound next season, right? Provided Mr. Katsalapov isn't injured. What other senior teams do they have? Z/G? P/M? Russian ice dance has truly sunken to the gutters I tell you. :confused::blah:
 
One year they were 4th though, then 10th, then didn't make it this season. So they could rebound next season, right? Provided Mr. Katsalapov isn't injured. What other senior teams do they have? Z/G? P/M? Russian ice dance has truly sunken to the gutters I tell you. :confused::blah:
4th or 10th either one is possible so while upside is good s/k can be worse than z/g or p/m or l/d! I mean what are you going to do? Beg beg beg b/s never to retire? Rush juniors? It’s all disaster. Maybe Bukin can be rehabilitated and get apology from ioc!
 
Lol! Maybe it’s too hopeless! They just believe only one needs talent!
No, not nearly enough nepotism or money or natural thinness working in their favour. Besides isn't Mr. Shibnev in trouble with the law, how would that work out? Their juniors, they need to develop their juniors. Drozd is good though, but I can't say the same about his partner so in essence Russian ice dance is in the pits.
 
No, not nearly enough nepotism or money or natural thinness working in their favour. Besides isn't Mr. Shibnev in trouble with the law, how would that work out? Their juniors, they need to develop their juniors. Drozd is good though, but I can't say the same about his partner so in essence Russian ice dance is in the pits.
Shibnev is according to Tsl! I don’t know what kind of case he has in Hackensack though. So just forget all old skaters! Just do what they did to ladies in 2008. Push them away. Make sotnikovas and tuktamysheva replace anyone over 16!
 
No, not nearly enough nepotism or money or natural thinness working in their favour. Besides isn't Mr. Shibnev in trouble with the law, how would that work out? Their juniors, they need to develop their juniors. Drozd is good though, but I can't say the same about his partner so in essence Russian ice dance is in the pits.
Maybe Ilinykh could get Drozd?
 
So many copycat videos of the kind @Karpenko originated. :p I do not think Maria Sotskova is a star nor a skater worthy of being on the Olympic podium. She's a good jumper and a determined striver. She's not a great performer, nor a great skater. Med and Zagitova deserve the credit for their precocious talents and jumping (rotational) strengths. They are good at what they do, but also lucky to have clout of RusFed & Eteri behind them, which helps with the judging, particularly the high PCS scores. When you are freakin' consistent all the time, and do the difficult tech stuff, the judges go whole hog on the PCS whether deserved or not.

"One nation has risen above the rest. As legends pass into history [shot of Julia Lip in a latter day demise comp], new ones are born to take their place [shots of uber-queens Janny & Alina]. Some have tried to discredit their dominance. But the dirty little games they play will not change the inevitable. Now the world's best figure skaters will claim what belongs to them..." :rofl:

Background music lyrics: "We're ready for war..." Shot of Sotskova :huh: :drama:

Aside from the great production values and editing, I see so much desperation in this hype-driven video. Why all the desperation? It is what it is, with a lot of help from RusFed politicking. And the ladies in question are very talented. They don't have the speed, power and maturity of some other top competitors, but yeah, they are usually more consistent. The need and hunger to promote and flaunt Russian hegemony in ladies by RusFed even surpasses their thirst and conceit to regain traditional Russian dominance in pairs. Meanwhile, they continue to seek viable contenders to rebuild competitiveness in ice dance, forget about dominating in that discipline, for the moment.

Of course Janny Med and Alina Zag are expected to rock Pyeongchang arena with their determined consistency and jumping exploits. I think Alina is a better jumper, as Janny has tech issues on her jumps that are ignored. Neither are great artists on ice, notwithstanding the judges' PCS assessments. Ahem. :COP: Janny has some special aura and ethereal precocity about her, and Zagitova appears to have good technique and wonderful potential artistically (despite not actually being particularly balletic, even with her exaggerated posing in tutus). In any case, ladies that young need to mature in order to fully develop their artistic side. Neither Med nor Zag are as good as Michelle Kwan in Salome and Julia Lipnitskaya in Schindler's List. And even Julia and Michelle were not fully developed skaters artistically when they performed those respective programs.

Another point is that Julia had a hothouse flower, hot minute of a career. Maybe her SL performance in the team event at Sochi Olympics is legendary, but Paul Wylie's exhibition Schindler's List was better and much more profound. The symbolism of the little girl in the red coat that we remember from the Stephen Spielberg movie is what provokes emotions during Julia's memorable SL performance. It was a great vehicle that helped camouflage Julia's weaknesses. Also, real legends do not 'pass into history,' they transcend history.

What it boils down to obviously is that the Civil War is between Med and Zag. I do not think Sotskova will be a factor. If Sotskova performs well, she'll get good scores, but I can't see her taking the podium. She's not better than a slew of other ladies. It does come down to how everyone performs on the ice, and it seems clear that the judges and rest of skating community await the inevitable battle between Med and Zag for top of podium. If everyone is at their best though, Sotskova won't be climbing on the podium. She's rather bland and average compared to other top contenders. An exciting upset for the top spots would be a fitting end to the figure skating extravaganza in Pyeongchang. But I'm expecting status quo as usual.

Hey, thanks for taking the time to make that whole analysis! I think I should have made it more clear that this is just a fan video, myself being the (CLEARLY BIASED) fan! :wall: I've done really similar Russian Ladies fan videos before, and just wanted to complete the set for the Olympics. They're all supposed to be really tongue-in-cheek, but I'm sorry for coming off as desperate! :slinkaway You have to watch my vids like you do pro wrestling...just know that they are fake, over the top, maybe stupid, but that they are just for fun anyway :p. Good thing I didn't go with the more (potentially) offensive, original version! As for Sotskova's inclusion, I just thought it would be more interesting if the video featured a trio. That's all! LOL! There is something I am actually desperate for, and that's a miracle podium finish for Mirai, but let's not get into that right now lol

Regarding the Karpenko videos, I actually don't know what that's all about. I actually don't frequent this site as often as that other one (which I don't know, can we name?) so I genuinely do not know who Karpenko is. I did not mean to copy this person's work at all, but I am actually very curious to see it now. Maybe you could give me some links so I can watch some of the videos? Anyway, thanks for the great response! You put so much more thought into your analysis than I did in making the video. :rofl: I almost feel bad lol.
 
I hope zhulins career is over and his destructive disgraceful coaching is never seen again!! Bobrova and soloviev were Such a bad team to push. Everyone agreed her bent posture was awful and team ruining! Now Russia may do the same with Stepanova and her lack of talent. No it can’t be a rerun of b/s!! Make a team with equal talent number one! Horrible trash garbage zhulin faded must be over.

Can you do one of these for Chock and Bates and Shpilband?

Pretty Please? :D
 
Oh for sure @alchemy void! It's just a promo vid, and very very well done too, as inspired by @Karpenko's original inspirational fs promo vids. No problema. It is what it is, and it got me to thinking about the nitty-gritty realities.

Of course fans of Russian ladies have a right to love them and to promote them and to cheer for them. The text is a bit OTT. When you great, there really ain't no need to defend and shout it from the mountaintops. :D Sotskova is pretty and a hardworker, bless her heart. She's a consistent jumper, but I do not see her as a world beater. She's been helped quite often in the scoring, especially on PCS, even more-so than Med and Alina.

Enjoy all the rest of the Olympics skating!

Jesus woman, relax. It's a fan video. :lol:
The youtube is full of them. I love Karpenko, he's my friend as well. But he's not the only one doing them. And actually he does a different thing, cause he does that for work also. The objective is different.
These are just fan videos, made for fun and "uber" their favorites. Without been paid or anything. It has more to do with that, the creativity and the production quality of the one who makes them.
 
Jesus woman, relax. It's a fan video. :lol:
The youtube is full of them. I love Karpenko, he's my friend as well. But he's not the only one doing them. And actually he does a different thing, cause he does that for work also. The objective is different.
These are just fan videos, made for fun and "uber" their favorites. Without been paid or anything. It has more to do with that, the creativity and the production quality of the one who makes them.

Relax yourself overly defensive 'Amantide'. Of course @Karpenko is not now the only one doing them, but he was definitely the originator of that style. Of course Youtube is fairly saturated with a number of entertaining fs videos these days. Kudos to all the creativity!

As for Sotskova's inclusion, I just thought it would be more interesting if the video featured a trio

Ah yeah, sure. :p That's an interesting excuse. She's definitely pretty enough to be included. :drama:
 
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Oh please, fan videos have been around since the dawn of Youtube. Creative fans from Russia, Europe, Japan, etc. have been making them forever. This Karpenko person absolutely did not "originate" them. What a silly thing to argue about, although the unhinged lengthy rant about Sotskova is even worse (and I'm not her fan at all, but jesus...maybe get a blog? :rolleyes:).
 
So many excuses for b/s!! Lol it’s absurd!

All short dance fault
All missing three worlds fault
All soloviev injury fault

Nonsense. Like they honestly didn't realize how fugly that SD was? They honestly thought that FD could hold a candle to I/K's Black Swan from Sochi? Behind closed doors, they're crapping bullets because they don't collectively have the resolve to do what is necessary to transform Russian ice dance. Period.
 
4th or 10th either one is possible so while upside is good s/k can be worse than z/g or p/m or l/d! I mean what are you going to do? Beg beg beg b/s never to retire? Rush juniors? It’s all disaster. Maybe Bukin can be rehabilitated and get apology from ioc!

I don't think they need to rush the Juniors. If I was Russia, I'd go all in behind Stepanova/Bukin going forward. Heck, being "not invited" may even make them a sympathetic figure with the judges. Sinitsina/Katsalapov, Zagorski/Guerrero, and Popova/Mozgov can either improve or hold the fort until the juniors age into Seniors.
 
Nonsense. Like they honestly didn't realize how fugly that SD was? They honestly thought that FD could hold a candle to I/K's Black Swan from Sochi? Behind closed doors, they're crapping bullets because they don't collectively have the resolve to do what is necessary to transform Russian ice dance. Period.
Agreed! Resolve is so important. When they “fired” anyone having anything to do with ladies pre 2007 in 2008 that was a big moment.

I don't think they need to rush the Juniors. If I was Russia, I'd go all in behind Stepanova/Bukin going forward. Heck, being "not invited" may even make them a sympathetic figure with the judges. Sinitsina/Katsalapov, Zagorski/Guerrero, and Popova/Mozgov can either improve or hold the fort until the juniors age into Seniors.

But her weaknesses are like bobrova’s. If they rise there will be more criticism and belbin for example will be relentless in attacking her knees like bobrovas back if they become the hyped Russia number one. Then judges will scrutinize more too. And then it’s 5th in Beijing at best if Bukin is allowed in Beijin and If Bukin ever stops being angry and disillusioned! He skipped a Competition in Russia.
 
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Oh my goodness that was quite a fall straight on the knee out of that 4T, the kind of fall that makes you draw breath. An older athlete would probably be in a bit of trouble with that and there'd be a serious knee injury, but I guess when you're 13 (the tiny kind of 13 Trusova is) you just bounce. But ouch.
 
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Aleksandra Trusova's LP at the Russian Cup Final
4S, 4T< , 3lz-3Lo, 3F-1Lo-3S, 3F-3T
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-2M7gR9pPM

Child is ready for Junior Worlds :saint:
Tutberidze is clearly getting ready for the change of rules. If having all jumps in the second half doesn’t bring the extra points due to new limitations on the number of jumps in the second half, Tutberidze’s skaters will get the points through having several quads. I wonder what those who wanted the rule changed will say next. Ban quads in junior ladies?
 
I guess the test will be to see if she can get the girls to keep the quad jumps into seniors.
Well, considering how many of the juniors she has, she needs at least one or two to be able to keep them. They don’t all have to keep them. So the numbers are on her side. (It is not as if she had one promising junior. This season she had four successful at JGP and fifth one (with skills comparable to those four) injured. As long as at least two survive, Tutberidze will achieve it. (Horrible, but that’s life.)

My prediction is that by next Olympics Tsurskaya will be either gone or underperforming (like Tuktamysheva currently). Zagitova and Medvedeva - the one who will win Olympics will be retired, enjoying the benefits of being Olympic champion, the one who doesn’t win Olympics will probably stay and keep trying but may be pushed down in ranking, and the next Olympics it will be one of those up coming juniors (and it could even be one who is still unknow. After all, who heard of Zagitova four years ago?)
 
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Oh my goodness that was quite a fall straight on the knee out of that 4T, the kind of fall that makes you draw breath. An older athlete would probably be in a bit of trouble with that and there'd be a serious knee injury, but I guess when you're 13 (the tiny kind of 13 Trusova is) you just bounce. But ouch.
Touch of pogosplat there
 
Well, considering how many of the juniors she has, she needs at least one or two to be able to keep them. They don’t all have to keep them. So the numbers are on her side. (It is not as if she had one promising junior. This season she had four successful at JGP and fifth one (with skills comparable to those four) injured. As long as at least two survive, Tutberidze will achieve it. (Horrible, but that’s life.)

I'll be interested to see how she goes with the quads. Based on the way Eteri operates at the moment, I can imagine perhaps a skater just 15 years old whose puberty has been held back landing the quad for a season.

What kind of physicality would a lady need to maintain quads in the long term? It's interesting to be that all the ladies who have done triple axels into adulthood are all of muscular build (Tuktamysheva, Midori Ito, Tonya Harding, Nagasu etc). Would a lady need to be like that for a quad?
 
I'll be interested to see how she goes with the quads. Based on the way Eteri operates at the moment, I can imagine perhaps a skater just 15 years old whose puberty has been held back landing the quad for a season.

What kind of physicality would a lady need to maintain quads in the long term? It's interesting to be that all the ladies who have done triple axels into adulthood are all of muscular build (Tuktamysheva, Midori Ito, Tonya Harding, Nagasu etc). Would a lady need to be like that for a quad?
Not all. Asada did not have the same bodyshape as Harding, Ito and Tuktamysheva. And I think Asada kept her triple axel much longer than the ladies you mentioned.
 
Subbed recent Medvedeva/Zagitova documentary (aired 2018; recorded events 2016-2017 season). Medvedeva has a great personality and attitude that will carry her far in life, no matter what happens in Pyeongchang.
Not sure if this has been posted, but here is a new documentary about Alina and Evgenia (english subtitles)
The original YT link (posted on Feb. 10) no longer works -- I assume this was the video? (Russian version is linked at the bottom) https://rtd.rt.com/films/ice-princess/

Hersh's SP recap - Rink mates Zagitova, Medvedeva battling for gold: http://web.icenetwork.com/news/2018/02/21/266839424
 
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These two were exceptional!!!!:kickass::kickass::kickass:

It made for one of the closest nail-biting competitions ever, but I admit my pick for the gold was Zagitova by a half point. ;) Her jumps were spectacular, especially putting them in the second half, smart move. And Medvedeva gave a great performance as well; she didn't give up without a fight. They both should be proud!

BRAVA, BRAVA, BRAVA!:encore::respec::respec::hat1:
 
I suppose the artist always loses to the jumping bean :(

Poor Evgenia. To decimate the competition for over two seasons (half a quad!) and then to loose on the very last hurdle. I really thought being the 2x world champion would negate it but her absence from the GPF really killed her. Judges dumped her and jumped on the Alina wagon without second thought :fragile:

She should be proud after fighting back after injury, so close to the Olympics, but it likely won't make it hurt any less :(
 
I don't think Zagitova is a jumping bean, but my heart breaks for Medvedeva (and just the season where I started really liking her!). I had a feeling this would happen after last year's Russian nationals. This will be debated forever, but once the hate for Zagitova dissipates, she should be remembered as objectively one of the strongest Olympics champions: the most difficult program and combinations, excellent jump quality, better spins than any other ladies champ, good footwork, lots of transitions, solid basics, very memorable and beautiful programs.

And I said this in her thread, but I really wish the IOC would reinstate the anthem and flag for her. She was only 11 in Sochi and had nothing to do with any scandal. She actually had to pass more rigorous testing than skaters from other countries to be here, so she's no doper. She deserves the full experience.
 
I'll be interested to see how she goes with the quads. Based on the way Eteri operates at the moment, I can imagine perhaps a skater just 15 years old whose puberty has been held back landing the quad for a season.

What kind of physicality would a lady need to maintain quads in the long term? It's interesting to be that all the ladies who have done triple axels into adulthood are all of muscular build (Tuktamysheva, Midori Ito, Tonya Harding, Nagasu etc). Would a lady need to be like that for a quad?

Mao Asada was not muscular, and yet she was able to land the triple axel. Early in her career Sasha Cohen was landing quad salchows in practices, though she never tried one in a competition. Trusova is 13 and is landing quads. Hard to tell how puberty would affect that ability of hers.
 
I just came from IN and was touched to see the pic of Zagitova hugging & comforting her teammate Medvedeva. Now this is sportmanship at its very finest!:40beers: A far cry from the days of Yagudin versus Plushenko, et al. So many can learn from this imho.

ps: if it was up to me I would've given the top 3 an individual Olympic Gold Medal. All three were outstanding!!!!:hat1:
 
I just came from IN and was touched to see the pic of Zagitova hugging & comforting her teammate Medvedeva. Now this is sportmanship at its very finest!:40beers: A far cry from the days of Yagudin versus Plushenko, et al. So many can learn from this imho.

ps: if it was up to me I would've given the top 3 an individual Olympic Gold Medal. All three were outstanding!!!!:hat1:

That is BS. It was Med who went to Zag to congratulate her. THAT is sportsmanship. It is not like Zag went up to Med to comfort her. Med came across as the leader to me. It is easy to be nice to others when you are winning. Real class is seen in adversity. Zhenya, Michelle belong in that group. We don't know much about Zag. It is easy for her to be nice since she won. However, I suspect she would have been nice and polite to Med, had she lost.
 
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