From Russia with love [#28]: Autumn to Winter 2017

barbarafan said:
I was thinking of Pluschenko as well but he is not proven yet as a coach but Urmanov did a great job of repairing Julia's jump technique.
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Look at Samoylov and Sima's progress! And check it the academy's succes in last weekend on several competitions. I collected on Plushy's fan page. I know he is not a top trainer now but he has everything, knowledge, very good trainers ( 8 trainers are working with him )probably the most complete training center for fs in Moscow everything is on one place. One very important thing is missing his icerink is not standard.They usually train in Novogorsk , too. He is negotiating about an area, he will build a new rink in that area.
 
Tinami Amori said:
Russia has "valley girls"!...:cheer2:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81IZDhXeJBk
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so the valley girls are Californian..and they have accent, right? I hardly understand them..
Sorry, my multiple posts.
I wanted to ask what happened with this forum? Look at this thread usually this was the most visited thread on this forum..and 1233 viewers over 6 weeks?
And the other's have less visitors, posters :rolleyes:

edit: I criticised the Russian girls' taste some days ago ...well Masha was really stunning https://www.instagram.com/p/Ba04MwbjKGs/?taken-by=m_a_r_i_y_
and Radio is fabulous
https://s8.hostingkartinok.com/uploads/images/2017/10/8b9d7b8ecf571ac4c13702c0faab3830.jpg
 
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barbarafan said:
I was thinking of Pluschenko as well but he is not proven yet as a coach but Urmanov did a great job of repairing Julia's jump technique.
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Urmanov may be a great technician, but I think now Pogorilaya needs people around her who love her. Her family, her friends and lots of love, to get over what happened. Unfortunately, Urmanov is in Sochi and Pogorilaya would spend there a lot of time alone, feeling lonely. At this stage she needs her head fixed probably more than she needs her technique fixed. I think making such a huge change in her life at this moment may not be a good idea.
 
hanca said:
Urmanov may be a great technician, but I think now Pogorilaya needs people around her who love her. Her family, her friends and lots of love, to get over what happened. Unfortunately, Urmanov is in Sochi and Pogorilaya would spend there a lot of time alone, feeling lonely. At this stage she needs her head fixed probably more than she needs her technique fixed. I think making such a huge change in her life at this moment may not be a good idea.
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I think Pogo and her coach know each other very well for a long time. Probably Pogo likes her but they have debates. That is not so tragic for Pogo as we assume.
 
Am not sure there was anything Tsareva could say in the K&C that would sound allright. Or that sitting silently with a bitch face would be better. Am also not sure saying something like `oh, don't worry, darling, you did splendidly, it's that evil ice to blame' would be right.
Seemed like Pogorilaya had a Leonova TEB 2015 moment there....
 
TAHbKA said:
Am not sure there was anything Tsareva could say in the K&C that would sound allright. Or that sitting silently with a bitch face would be better. Am also not sure saying something like `oh, don't worry, darling, you did splendidly, it's that evil ice to blame' would be right.
Seemed like Pogorilaya had a Leonova TEB 2015 moment there....
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Maybe something like, 'Are you hurt?' or putting an arm around her could have worked....
 
lala said:
Look at Samoylov and Sima's progress! And check it the academy's succes in last weekend on several competitions. I collected on Plushy's fan page. I know he is not a top trainer now but he has everything, knowledge, very good trainers ( 8 trainers are working with him )probably the most complete training center for fs in Moscow everything is on one place. One very important thing is missing his icerink is not standard.They usually train in Novogorsk , too. He is negotiating about an area, he will build a new rink in that area.
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That is terrific news. I feel there will be great results from his school. He is obviously looking after every aspect of their skating but he also seems very human and kind but knows the hard work has to be there to be successful.
 
TAHbKA said:
Um.. there are people who don't like being touched. Obviously no idea whether it's Pogorilaya's/Tsareva's case
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Not only that, sometimes people comforting you makes you more emotional in the moment. I am all for keeping emotions at bay in kiss and cry after a bad skate.

I don't find what Tsareva said horrible, just annoyed with the fact that she said this in public. People excel under various conditions. Some need soft touch, others tough love.
 
hanca said:
At this stage she needs her head fixed probably more than she needs her technique fixed.
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More than anything right now, I think she needs her back fixed. I wonder what exactly is wrong with it. Whatever it is, I hope it can be taken care of without surgery.
 
17 Ladies have qualified to Nationals:
via GP events: Medvedeva, Radionova, Sotskova, Pogorilaya, Zagitova, Tuktamysheva, Tsurskaya, Leonova, Mikhailova
via JGPF: Trusova, Kostornaya, Samodurova, Tarakanova, Panenkova
via Russian Cup events: Gulyakova, Gubanova and Konstantinova

Sakhanovich VS Fedichkina for the last, 18th, spot :wuzrobbed
 
TAHbKA said:
Um.. there are people who don't like being touched. Obviously no idea whether it's Pogorilaya's/Tsareva's case
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Forget about the arm around her, but words of love, care, compassion can go a long way when it comes to healing, particularly mental.
 
TAHbKA said:
Am not sure there was anything Tsareva could say in the K&C that would sound allright. Or that sitting silently with a bitch face would be better. Am also not sure saying something like `oh, don't worry, darling, you did splendidly, it's that evil ice to blame' would be right.
Seemed like Pogorilaya had a Leonova TEB 2015 moment there....
Click to expand...

Having seen the video and heard the interaction in Russian, there was really nothing over the top about it. People are making it sound a lot worse than it was. The interaction wasn't worse than you would have expected from a top level coach after their athlete totally bombed (including falling on a spin!)
 
Ka3sha said:
Sakhanovich VS Fedichkina for the last, 18th, spot :wuzrobbed
Click to expand...

Do you think there's any hope that one of the Jr girls will withdraw and do only Jr nationals? Oh... why oh why of all the 10000000 Russian ladies skaters I pick the inconsistent ones??? :duh:
 
lala said:
so the valley girls are Californian..and they have accent, right? I hardly understand them..
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:D There is an "accent" issue, but it is secondary to the "presentation" and "sentence structure" (or lack of it). In that video above, 2 girls show contrast between "regular" and "valley girl" talk.
The girl in glasses uses structurally correct sentences, stating the "issue" without any extra words in between; the "valley girls" adds a lot of exclamations, sounds, unnecessary words, uses incomplete sentences, etc. I'll just translate 3 examples:
Nerdy Girl: "Hallo" (Хэлло)
Valley Girl: "He-aya guys, ee... like haaay-yaaa". (Hey guys! like hi!) (Эй-.хей.. ребятки! ну вроде, как бы приветик там вам всем...)
Nerdy Girl: "How are you today" (Как Вы поживаете или Как дела).
Valley Girl: "So... like..... how are you today.... eeehh.... i have not heard from you in a while..eee" (Ну.....вроде.... как, это самое, дела там у вас?...эээ... давно необщались...)
Nerdy Girl: "Do you have plans for tonight?" (у тебя есть планы на вечер?)
Valley Girl: "Are you, like doing anything later.....? ... like, you know, later tonight? are you?..... 'cause like i really want to do something... do you wannaaa do something? (ты там, ну как-бы, чем-то вечером занята? .... ну как-бы, понятно да? позже вечером? ты занята?.... да па-та-муш-та ну мне хочется чего-то там поделать..... а ты хочешь чего-то там поделать?)

;) ... so, like, you get it now, right? it it's like wow!....... totally narly... ;)

ice crystal said:
Maybe something like, 'Are you hurt?' or putting an arm around her could have worked....
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You are absolutely right. Tzareva knows how to behave properly in public and how to be supportive.... @ Helsinki Worlds all went well in K-n-K (@ 7:10) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9N2x9Y1VzE

Aside from "compassion" issue, Tzareva's behavior in K-n-K @ SC was not productive. Pogo was not ready to discuss and address the technical problems right there and then. But the "negative impact" of the conversation will remain in her mind.
 
Amy L said:
Do you think there's any hope that one of the Jr girls will withdraw and do only Jr nationals? Oh... why oh why of all the 10000000 Russian ladies skaters I pick the inconsistent ones??? :duh:
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Anything is possible. Someone may be injured, or one of the juniors may prefer to skip senior nationals and concentrate more on junior nationals, because junior nationals are qualifying competition for junior worlds.
 
Just please no Morozov for Anna!

How about a grandmother type? I also really don’t like Swan Lake for her... I still think she’d Make the perfect Lara Antipova from Doctor Zhivago!
 
Xela M said:
Having seen the video and heard the interaction in Russian, there was really nothing over the top about it. People are making it sound a lot worse than it was. The interaction wasn't worse than you would have expected from a top level coach after their athlete totally bombed (including falling on a spin!)
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I am jiawen2016 at GS, and I posted there some details about my observation about their interaction. I would like to post a summary here. I was sitting next to where Tsareva was standing during the trainings, and I could hear their conversations. Unfortunately, I do not understand Russian, but there was definitely some tension between them. No other skater jumped as much as Anna, who did like 10 3Lz3T attempts in one training session, and obviously, no one fell as hard as she did, and she was always the last one to leave the ice, so I definitely would not buy that Anna is lazy and does not train hard. I really want to question Tsareva's coaching strategies there for demanding Anna to jump that much when she looked apparently injured with a visible back brace. In contrast, Ashley did not jump at all during the morning training session and left the trainings like 15min after it started before FS. So shouldn't Tsareva be blamed for not asking Anna to do more run throughs of her program and practicing more spins (she really did not practice spins that much, maybe due to her back injury) and others things?

When Anna fell on that spin right in front of me (I was at the second row opposite to where the judges sat near the K&C), I literally heard her scream, and it hurt like hell and the audience really felt for it. I think what Tsareva said after the FS was simply mean, definitely not what Anna needed when she was already in both physical and psychological pain.

After the free skate, I waited at the bus stop. Tsareva came out first by herself, and Anna came out like 15min later with her suitcase and backpack, covered in her hoodie, sobbing and inhaling some kind of painkiller I guess. Maybe Anna preferred to be alone, but Tsareva really looked unconcerned to me. I also saw other girls who were apparently upset after FS, Alaine Chartrand, Rika Hongo and Marin Honda, but all their coaches were with them and seemed to be more supportive at that moment. So yeah, I don't think what happened between them was normal to my naked eye.
 
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Xela M said:
Having seen the video and heard the interaction in Russian, there was really nothing over the top about it. People are making it sound a lot worse than it was. The interaction wasn't worse than you would have expected from a top level coach after their athlete totally bombed (including falling on a spin!)
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Could this be a cultural difference between Russia and North America? What appears cruel and heartless to us, may appear normal to a Russian?
 
Vash01 said:
Could this be a cultural difference between Russia and North America? What appears cruel and heartless to us, may appear normal to a Russian?
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No. It's a matter of people mishearing/misunderstanding what she said and the tone she said it in.
 
Vash01 said:
Could this be a cultural difference between Russia and North America? What appears cruel and heartless to us, may appear normal to a Russian?
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I am the first person to claim cultural differences, and to defend tough Russian trainers and authorities, and accuse cry-babies athletes. Not this time.. :lol:

Tzareva was acting inappropriately under the circumstances, on 3 counts: they were out in public all eyes on them; Pogo was hurt physically and the primary conversation should have been about her condition, and not 1 word was said or asked; Tzareva was verbally "biting/pinching" Pogo and picking on her over elements and matters which at that time/situation could not have been fixed or even properly processed.

As to how to interpret their "dialogue", the Russian press (from the original "culture") called it "conflict" and "confrontation"...
Russian skater had a scandal with her trainer... (google translatable)
http://ren.tv/novosti/2017-10-29/ro...laya-poskandalila-s-trenerom-posle-provalnogo

Pogorilaya had a fall and a fight with her trainer. .. (google translatable)
http://www.eurosport.ru/figure-skating/skate-canada/2017-2018/story_sto6385976.shtml
 
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