Ashley Wagner reveals she was assaulted by John Coughlin

[cholla]

Could there have been junior or novice section of the competition? Most B competitions at that time were not just seniors.

There still is a junior competition at Cup of Nice (I mean, when it's held, which wasn't the case last year) That being said, this guy's behavior is plain repulsive.

 

[jmtfti]

As an interesting tidbit, I don't know if it's been mentioned in here that Giulietti-Schmitt is married to USFSA's former director of communications.

 

[Desperado]

Back to say that as @angi mentioned, these companies don’t to much to curb this type of behaviour, especially in an instance like this where stories go away after a short time and you need to explain a whole context.

We know the whole story, but without proof of the previous video to give the complaint weight, he could just be seen as joking with his happy daughter. (Not sure if it’s a pupil or a family member in the pic).

 

[canbelto]

Instagram is useless. I reported a woman who expressed self-harming thoughts a few years back. They said it didn't violate "terms of service."

 

[VGThuy]

Someone like him should not be teaching children. That said, I'm sure there are many adults in the ISU who probably agree with him.

 

[GarrAargHrumph]

On a side note, Ashley's account sounds oddly like the end of Sixteen Candles when the Geek and Prom Queen are in the car except not skipping to the morning after.

Many people have issues with John Hughes' films for a variety of reasons, this scene as a prime example. Molly Ringwald, for one:

Currently.com - AT&T Yahoo Email, News, Sports & More

Get the latest in news, entertainment, sports, weather and more on Currently.com. Sign up for free email service with AT&T Yahoo Mail.

start.att.net

The films are very much a piece of their time in many ways.

 

[judiz]

Instagram is useless. I reported a woman who expressed self-harming thoughts a few years back. They said it didn't violate "terms of service."

I did the same thing.

 

[Dragonlady]

So..Ashley gets it off her chest when John cannot refute her story. I do not call that brave. By not reporting it....she left John free to go do it to someone else. I find that cowardly and self serving.. Kind of like the big named stars who leftvWeinstein free to prey on others.

Still blaming the victims. Considering how YOU in particular, have gone after every single one of the victims on this board, it's hardly surprising you're still doing it.

Why didn't she come forward before. Because of the way YOU, and all of the others have vilified and revictimized his accusers. Ashley didn't come forward because people like YOU would have attacked her, just like you're doing now. Just like you have treated every single one of John's victims. That's why.

 

[overedge]

Not to sound cynical, although I know I will, if USFS wants a "quick win" to show their commitment to a safe skating environment, they could suspend Skater Alexey's coaching credentials. The post about "me and my latest victim" is reason enough.

 

[jenniferlyon]

@Finsta TBH considering the response from Russian posters (at least Tinami Amori), Russian media, that Russian skater's instagram, that one Russian coach known to date/marry barely (or not) legal skaters, and the general acceptance of sexualizing some young skaters in magazines (sexy clothes) and on ice (Alina's catsuit program anyone?) I worry a lot about the young female skaters in Russia. I debate whether or not Tinami is a very determined troll, but what I have seen is that a lot of Russian fans are seemingly in agreement with her that certain relationships we'd consider predatory in the west are "cute" and then turning around and victim blaming skaters like Wagner. Although the culture in the West is still facing issues, at least it is in the process of changing to one where consent is discussed and predation is reported and punished. It doesn't seem to be that way in Russia yet, which is made all the more disturbing by all the very young superstar skaters they have there.

In Russia, male violence against women (and girls) is tolerated beyond what would be considered acceptable in the mainstream USA. (I used the word "mainstream" because we are talking about the skating world here, which is outside the mainstream. The US is also home to the Christian patriarchy movement, which routinely allows/hides/enables abusive behavior, a la Josh Duggar molesting his four younger sisters.)

 

[mollymgr]

Not to sound cynical, although I know I will, if USFS wants a "quick win" to show their commitment to a safe skating environment, they could suspend Skater Alexey's coaching credentials. The post about "me and my latest victim" is reason enough.

He is based in Russia though. The USFS doesn’t have the power or inclination to do anything in the US on any level of urgency, let alone other countries at this point.

 

[overedge]

He is based in Russia though. The USFS doesn’t have the power or inclination to do anything in the US on any level of urgency, let alone other countries at this point.

My bad, I thought he was based in the US. But the USFS could still report him to the ISU for harassing a USFS member. (I know the ISU will likely not do anything but at least the report would have been made.)

 

[Vagabond]

Not to sound cynical, although I know I will, if USFS wants a "quick win" to show their commitment to a safe skating environment, they could suspend Skater Alexey's coaching credentials. The post about "me and my latest victim" is reason enough.

Does he even have a USFS coaching credential? as far as I can tell, he's based in Omsk.

 

[Lacey]

So, just curious, was this @Vagabond's and others' question above, if this "he" Alexey (edited in later: thanks @Kasey), see below--his last name is Motorin, came to the US with a student for a skating competition, could he be prevented from attending by USFS or SafeSport?

Is either entity reading this here, would they be listing him, are coaches screened at every competition, would/should we be reporting him, or is it hearsay?

The man has got to be stopped, if only in the US, at least that would be a start.

 

[Kasey]

So, just curious, if this "he" Alexey (do we have his whole name?)

Alexey Motorin

 

[misskarne]

Does he even have a USFS coaching credential? as far as I can tell, he's based in Omsk.

Is there a Russian coaches' association, like the PSA, that he could be reported to?

 

[Artistic Skaters]

... Was John Coughlin the coach or some official that was overseeing Ashley Wagner?

If yes, then it is a USFSA, Safe Sport, USOC matter.
If no, then it is a police matter.

Safe Sport already said they will no longer be handling cases involving Coughlin due to his death. However, under circumstances when both parties are living, there is no limitation that would have required Coughlin to be a coach or some official overseeing Ashley Wagner, because member to member complaints can also be made. Reporting to police is an additional track for members to consider, but it would not normally be an either/or situation in most cases.

 

[Japanfan]

Still blaming the victims. Considering how YOU in particular, have gone after every single one of the victims on this board, it's hardly surprising you're still doing it.

Why didn't she come forward before. Because of the way YOU, and all of the others have vilified and revictimized his accusers. Ashley didn't come forward because people like YOU would have attacked her, just like you're doing now. Just like you have treated every single one of John's victims. That's why.

Related to this is Ashley's concern that if she came forward, she would be seen as a 'a girl who makes trouble', which might do her a disservice with the judges. And that perception may have caused her to feel ashamed.

Children need to learn what assault and sexual assault are, that it is never their fault, and that they should never be afraid of coming forward. Of course that requires a certain set of conditions to be in place, which unfortunately is often not the case. But, society at large and systems/institutions/organizations within it should be working towards creating those conditions.

 

[canbelto]

You know, not for nothing, here and elsewhere Ashley Wagner was often criticized for being outspoken and brash and not the "typical" ice princess. That and the comments that were made about Simone Biles and Aly Raisman when they came out as being abused by Nassar should drive home the point once and for all that there is no "typical" victim. Victims can come off as strong, confident and assertive. You can't tell how someone is by watching them for a few minutes on TV.

 

[Japanfan]

You know, not for nothing, here and elsewhere Ashley Wagner was often criticized for being outspoken and brash and not the "typical" ice princess.

Whereas others will commend her. I was very, very impressed - and moved - when she was willing to speak out against Putin's anti-gay stance in the run-up to the 2014 Olympics. SFAIK she was the only one to do so. And skaters are not encouraged to discuss politics, again SFAIK. I don't know whether skaters are explicitly told that they should stay away from politics, or it's just an implicit rule or understanding.

And I can understand that it might be best for athletes to stay away from politics, as it could distract their focus away from training and competition.

But OTOH, skaters and other athletes, especially those who are high profile, can bring awareness fo various issues and injustices.

Ashley Wagner has skills and interests that would qualify her for some sort of advocacy work or a career in the political arena. I hope she can put those skills and interests to use (just as Kwan did with her skills and interests).

 

[aftershocks]

Children need to learn what assault and sexual assault are, that it is never their fault, and that they should never be afraid of coming forward. Of course that requires a certain set of conditions to be in place, which unfortunately is often not the case. But, society at large and systems/institutions/ organizations within it should be working towards creating those conditions.

ITA. Realistically, at the time of the incident, and under the circumstances of that time, I have serious doubts Ashley would have been listened to. Her revelation would have surely been seen as a non-incident since there was no hard evidence of actual physical harm. Sadly, the psychological and emotional trauma Ashley experienced would have been passed off as some kind of imaginary fantasy of her own making, most likely. Her career would have been over for good, before it even started. And as we know, as it turned out, she was the one who grew enough in character and experience to jumpstart her waning career post-2010 U.S. Nationals, and take it to the next level, completely by virtue of her own gumption and desire!

The reason Ashley is coming forward now, is chiefly to help others. That is amazingly courageous and commendable, because it certainly cannot be easy to recall what happened, to respond to questions challenging her character and veracity, and to face nasty, heedless backlash.

 

[DimaToe]

I agree with some of what has been said, if Ashley had no name recognition her story would be just tossed aside. That can’t be done now though, she’s the most successful U.S. singles skater of her generation, and even then she is getting a lot of hate (at least what we can see on social media, who knows what is happening within the insiders of skating) could you imagine what the situation would be if she was a middle of the pack skater?

 

[Frau Muller]

As an interesting tidbit, I don't know if it's been mentioned in here that Giulietti-Schmitt is married to USFSA's former director of communications.

Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding!

 

[aftershocks]

if Ashley had no name recognition her story would be just tossed aside.

But even at that time, just over 10 years ago, whether or not Ashley had 'name recognition,' wouldn't have mattered much within the figure skating environment, nor within the larger cultural environment. Some of Weinstein's victims had 'name recogniton,' back then and were reluctant to speak out for fear of being vilified and/or having their career opportunities dashed. Or in some cases, the few people the victims confided in either refused to help, or couldn't make a difference due to indifference and the forces mounted against them (which included Weinstein's power and influence).

 

[mackiecat]

I feel that Ashley coming forward will help Bridgette ( the first girl who went public). She was vilified after she came forward. Ashley adds strength to her claims. Privately it should also help the two unnamed minors who reported also.

 

[aftershocks]

... the two unnamed minors who reported also.

I believe at least two of the victims who initially reported incidents (or who had someone come forward on their behalf), similar to Ashley, were minors at the time of the alleged abuses, but are not minors now.

 

[once_upon]

He was still coaching, those victims could still be minors. I think they are minors

 

[PDilemma]

Many churches are now using curriculum which teaches kids about boundaries, what kinds of relationships and interactions with adults should be questioned, and what should be reported and how to report.

Most Catholic dioceses require it to be taught and many other faith groups have begun to implement it. My husband and I teach confirmation class to 7th and 8th graders and have to teach lessons on these matters each year. From a very young age, kids who attend are encouraged every year to think about who the trusted adults are in their lives that they can go to if something inappropriate happens. They are encouraged to have one in mind who is not a parent or step-parent as well (recognizing without saying directly to them that parents are unfortunately not a trusted adult in every child's life).

Each year they are reminded to "PLAAN" in case someone puts them at risk or violates their boundaries. It's an acronym for "Protect" as in protecting themselves, "Listen" as in listen to yourself--if you feel like something is wrong, it probably is; "Ask" for ask themselves if this is violating their boundaries, hurting them or seems wrong, "Act"--with 7th and 8th graders we talk about taking precautions to protect themselves--don't be alone with people they don't trust, don't give out their personal information online or to people they don't know and trust; if a situation seems risky or becomes risky, get themselves out of it (we talk about how it is usually better to make your parents mad if they have to pick you up from somewhere you aren't supposed to be than it is to do things like get in a car with a drunk driver, hide that you have been hurt or violated--notice that Ashley didn't tell her parents because she didn't want them to be mad she was at a party; or stay in any situation that has become a risk to them) and finally, "Notify"--tell that trusted adult if something happens so they can report it and get you help.

Since I've been teaching it, I have thought that it should be routine in public schools and parents should have access to these kinds of materials. Our church version has faith elements. But they are not integral to the message and can easily be left out. There is no reason that U.S. Figure Skating cannot make this kind of education available and mandatory on the club and national level.

 

[VGThuy]

That sounds nice, but it's not totally comprehensive. Most sexual assault happens when the perpetrator is someone the victim knows and trusts. Usually they are in a situation that does not seem dangerous or risky. Often times, by the time they realize it has become risky, there's not a viable way out. But it is good to teach people what to look out for and to not be ashamed of reporting it, which is a huge problem.

 

[Barbara Manatee]

Is that the entirety of the curriculum? I do hope there is equal time put into teaching children to understand and respect boundaries and not become abusers themselves. Too many boys grow up believing that verbal and physical aggression are just part of being a man and are a-okay as long as they don't go as far as "rape rape." I would not be shocked if John Coughlin thought he was a good guy because he stopped when Ashley said no.