Russian women news & updates, 2021-22 season

[overedge]

Yes Simone speaks out against this because this is what athletes do. Compete with injuries.

I'm not sure what you mean. Simone is speaking out against the idea that athletes should compete no matter how hurt they are, mentally or physically.

 

[layman]

Team Eteri is burning through girls like kleenex.

These fragile girls are breaking like porcelain dolls...and their narcissistic, sociopathic coach keeps going (and going), like a bull in china shop. How many broken, wrecked, career prematurely ended girls will it take before the Russian Fed put a stop to her?

 

[Tobbe]

Team Eteri is burning through girls like kleenex.

These fragile girls are breaking like porcelain dolls...and their narcissistic, sociopathic coach keeps going (and going), like a bull in china shop. How many broken, wrecked, career prematurely ended girls will it take before the Russian Fed put a stop to her?

I think it's the other way around. It's more like the figures skating fans that are the fragile porcelain dolls. The fans keep forgetting that this is a tough sport, and like any tough popular sport it's brutal to kids and teenagers, because it's only the best that survives.

Figure skating is super popular in Russia, so this is exactly what happens there.

In some other countries figure skating might work differently. But that is just because it's more of a hobby for rich kids.

 

[AxelAnnie]

I think it's the other way around. It's more like the figures skating fans that are the fragile porcelain dolls. The fans keep forgetting that this is a tough sport, and like any tough popular sport it's brutal to kids and teenagers, because it's only the best that survives.

Figure skating is super popular in Russia, so this is exactly what happens there.

In some other countries figure skating might work differently. But that is just because it's more of a hobby for rich kids.

Nah! Russia isn't going to reprimand Eteri. .although in my book she has too man injured kids.

She is making WAY too much money for the federation. No one wants to interfere with that freight train.

 

[hanca]

Nah! Russia isn't going to reprimand Eteri. .although in my book she has too man injured kids.

She is making WAY too much money for the federation. No one wants to interfere with that freight train.

Why should they reprimand her? That Usacheva got injured? I got injured while having only single jumps. Should my coach be reprimanded?

Elite sport is not healthy, that’s the bottom line. Injuries happen. Skaters were injured, regardless what country they skate for. It is interesting that when it is a Russian skater, it must be the evil system and the evil coach who made them injured, whereas when it it a Canadian, Japanese, or US skater, it is absolutely ok to be injured. I wonder why….

Sui-Han has been constantly injured. Should their coach be reprimanded? Hanyu is constantly injured. What about reprimanding Orser?

Tinami used to say that the cold war hasn’t ended, it is still very strongly in the mind of people. Whatever happens to a Russian skater will be treated with suspicion and people are attributing the worst intentions, whereas there are not the same patters thinking about skaters from other countries.

 

[Deleted member 80234]

Why should they reprimand her? That Usacheva got injured? I got injured while having only single jumps. Should my coach be reprimanded?

Elite sport is not healthy, that’s the bottom line. Injuries happen. Skaters were injured, regardless what country they skate for. It is interesting that when it is a Russian skater, it must be the evil system and the evil coach who made them injured, whereas when it it a Canadian, Japanese, or US skater, it is absolutely ok to be injured. I wonder why….

Sui-Han has been constantly injured. Should their coach be reprimanded? Hanyu is constantly injured. What about reprimanding Orser?

Tinami used to say that the cold war hasn’t ended, it is still very strongly in the mind of people. Whatever happens to a Russian skater will be treated with suspicion and people are attributing the worst intentions, whereas there are not the same patters thinking about skaters from other countries.

Sui, born 1995, Han born 1992, Hanyu born 1994. They are all adults well into their 20s.
The conversation about anorexia and how to change technical values so that the sport doesn’t inadvertently hurt girls is a valid one. And it doesn’t apply just to figure skating or just to Eteri, it’s pervasive in women’s athletics. Nike’s athletic program for teenage female runners came under criticism a couple years ago.

Opinion | I Was the Fastest Girl in America, Until I Joined Nike (Published 2019)

Mary Cain’s male coaches were convinced she had to get “thinner, and thinner, and thinner.” Then her body started breaking down.

www.nytimes.com

Bottom line, many coaches, including prominent male running coaches in the US, have encouraged anorexia in girls.
Girls should be able to aspire to lifelong health. Live to 105 and still be able to run then, like master’s runner Julia Hawkins. Don’t develop holes in your spine and lose height from collapsing vertebrae in your 20s.

 

[AxelAnnie]

What you say is accurate.
I was responding to post 1052.

 

[ЭPiKUilyam]

Sui-Han has been constantly injured. Should their coach be reprimanded? Hanyu is constantly injured. What about reprimanding Orser?

I totally agree. Team Orser made a point in the press that he was "carefully" monitoring a young Nam Nguyen when he was attempting quads at 13, as opposed to the evil Russians who couldn't care less about the safety/health of their top athletes. Right. Nam Nguyen left Orser injured and broken. And then Stephen Gogolev, who was attempting quads at 12? Oh yes, we are not like the Russians, we watch these youngsters and their quads... a few years later Gogolev leaves Orser injured/broken. Not a word from the NoAm press about the abuse of young skaters there, but a reminder that Eteri girls have occasional injuries...

Bradie Tennell has been out of competition all season and might miss the entire season because of injury. Her coach? An American who has a history of students with major injuries.

Rika is injured the whole season. I don't think her coach is Russian, and it certainly isn't Eteri.

Leave Eteri alone, please. Figure skating is a tough sport. People get injured. Don't blame the coach.

 

[Cachoo]

For me it is more about trends. To see Nathan as a teenager with quads and now as a man feels like two different people. Of course I prefer the experience and maturity. My question is if we will ever have the same situation with ladies. They seem to be younger and younger and it shows. Ideally I’d like to see Trusovsa four years from now with her quads as her artistry matures.

 

[love_skate2011]

Update after NHK, Now its down to a 5 woman race, not that Usacheva really had a chance but still it was unfortunate what happened to her, they know next Olympics is not a guarantee they will still be around.

Ranking

Valieva > Tuk > Shcherbakova > Kromykh > Kostornaia - Trusova ?

If Shcherbakova wins next GP convincingly, she will be in the 2nd running
Kostornaia is she scores a decent 78-79 SP and 145+ FS Will already be a big win for her reputation.

 

[Scott512]

I am sooo tired of Dave L and his sensational scandal "journalism".

It detracts from his knowledge of figure skating when he does all this BS stuff and drama stuff.

Scandal journalism is what it is.

 

[Scott512]

Chances are more likely that a 15 year old do what she wants and don't tell her coaches that she was in pain.

My nephew used to play football at quite a high level. Once, when he was 15, he had an important game. He had the flu, lied about it, took some Paracetamol, and went to play the match anyway. Because he knew that if he wasn't there he was out of the team...

This is the reality in all elite sports.

Interesting story and I think it's been that way for decades in sports in many countries. I'm sure. Dasha thought she could get on the podium at NHK even at less than 100%. But the worst case scenario happened to her. It's important that she heals properly come back strong next season and she doesn't even need an ultra jump to compete with the to make podiums. All the girls with the ultra jumps are struggling physically or struggling to retain their ultra jumps except for KV and even she is struggling with her triple axel this season. I did not expect that.

 

[Scott512]

So I listened to the video that Dave posted, and I have to say that it is almost unlistenable because he does this faux Russian accent through out the video. That being said, in this case Dave is reading news articles from sports.ru which includes this article with quotes from Averbukh that Ushaeva was injured before arriving in Japan. This isn't the first time that we've seen this & it seems to be a thing that sports.ru likes to do. They quote Dave quoting their articles - it's a toxic cycle between sports.ru & The Skating Lesson.

Илья Авербух: «Было понятно, что Усачева едет на Гран-при Японии травмированной»

Хореограф Илья Авербух прокомментировал травму российской фигуристки Дарьи Усачевой на Гран-при Японии .

www.sports.ru

You know it is a toxic cycle between Dave and sports.ru. it's a crazy website to go to but they have a lot of information and a lot of articles on figure skating especially Russian figure skating.

 

[trouble77]

Whenever a coach talks about the prospects for a team or a player during the upcoming season, the discussion always starts with two words:
"If healthy..."
Nothing can derail a season and demoralize a player more than an injury, and usually, injuries happen during the heat of competition.
A basketball player lands on a guy's foot and twists his ankle. A baseball player gets hit with a pitch and breaks his hand. A football or hockey player gets laid out and gets a concussion.

It's possible that Daria injured herself before the competition and tried to pull a Katia Gordeeva's stunt. Or maybe, the injury happened there and then during the warm-up. However, the EVIL Etery blah, and blah blah blah! Give it a break you, trolls!

 

[Primorskaya]

Dave Lease is very knowledgeable, puts in the hours to produce his content, and passionate about skating, but he's also passionate about hearing the sound of his own voice. I do check TSL regularly because he's had some fab guests and sometimes gets scoops and good insights, but I think at heart he's a tabloid writer, he just loves scandals and it gets in the way of what could be excellent FS reporting. I like sarcastic humour and the odd gossip too, but I remember some lines from his old blog which were real howlers, and I always wonder if some of his prestigious guests are aware of some of the stuff he came up with back in the day...

 

[love_skate2011]

I dont like the fake accent, its not even an accurate satire.

 

[ЭPiKUilyam]

I didn't see Kamila's exhibition at SkCan and wow am I impressed. She is a world class dancer and performer. She is amazing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3X-iq-LdGQ

 

[soogar]

Dave Lease is very knowledgeable, puts in the hours to produce his content, and passionate about skating, but he's also passionate about hearing the sound of his own voice. I do check TSL regularly because he's had some fab guests and sometimes gets scoops and good insights, but I think at heart he's a tabloid writer, he just loves scandals and it gets in the way of what could be excellent FS reporting. I like sarcastic humour and the odd gossip too, but I remember some lines from his old blog which were real howlers, and I always wonder if some of his prestigious guests are aware of some of the stuff he came up with back in the day...

I like Dave's content and I find the faux Russian accent to be annoying, however he also receives a lot of positive feedback for the Russian soap opera stories and his faux accent. He wants an audience and it seems those vids do well. Instead of criticizing Dave, I think it's more appropriate to criticize the Russians' behavior. I remember back in the day, the USFSA didn't really appreciate Tonya's lack of class. They wanted her to behave a certain way. Now all you see and hear are Russian coaches openly airing grievances, even Evgeny's non-sportsmanlike behavior towards Evan and there's no real pushback from the ISU. It's a like a circus out there and Dave is just mirroring what they are putting out there. It's not his fault that Eteri's group has all this friction.

 

[Primorskaya]

I like Dave's content and I find the faux Russian accent to be annoying, however he also receives a lot of positive feedback for the Russian soap opera stories and his faux accent. He wants an audience and it seems those vids do well. Instead of criticizing Dave, I think it's more appropriate to criticize the Russians' behavior. I remember back in the day, the USFSA didn't really appreciate Tonya's lack of class. They wanted her to behave a certain way. Now all you see and hear are Russian coaches openly airing grievances, even Evgeny's non-sportsmanlike behavior towards Evan and there's no real pushback from the ISU. It's a like a circus out there and Dave is just mirroring what they are putting out there. It's not his fault that Eteri's group has all this friction.

Please. He's an adult and responsible for his choices. If other people choose to jump off a cliff, you don't have to follow them... I also wasn't referring specifically to his coverage of Eteri's group, but to his coverage of events in general. But oh, those Russians! It's all their fault

 

[Deleted member 80234]

I totally agree. Team Orser made a point in the press that he was "carefully" monitoring a young Nam Nguyen when he was attempting quads at 13, as opposed to the evil Russians who couldn't care less about the safety/health of their top athletes. Right. Nam Nguyen left Orser injured and broken. And then Stephen Gogolev, who was attempting quads at 12? Oh yes, we are not like the Russians, we watch these youngsters and their quads... a few years later Gogolev leaves Orser injured/broken. Not a word from the NoAm press about the abuse of young skaters there, but a reminder that Eteri girls have occasional injuries...

Bradie Tennell has been out of competition all season and might miss the entire season because of injury. Her coach? An American who has a history of students with major injuries.

Rika is injured the whole season. I don't think her coach is Russian, and it certainly isn't Eteri.

Leave Eteri alone, please. Figure skating is a tough sport. People get injured. Don't blame the coach.

Orser himself was jumping a triple axel in a pro competition when he was about 40, I think. And aren’t there a lot of female skaters who performed up to middle age? Shizuka is approaching 40 and performing in ice shows. All that changed is the point value of quads, right? If they’re that valuable then everyone will want to do them. And as you pointed out, even little kids can do them, so rewarding them with very high point values relative to other things that take longer to learn doesn’t necessarily make sense either from a sport or art perspective. But many people even today don’t know about the anorexia/osteoporosis connection and quads haven’t been around long enough for injury differences between them and triples to even be quantified yet. So instead of blaming anyone, leave it open to research and discourse. Like with diving, when is a high dive too high?

 

[Vash01]

Nah! Russia isn't going to reprimand Eteri. .although in my book she has too man injured kids.

She is making WAY too much money for the federation. No one wants to interfere with that freight train.

Injuries are a part of sports. All sports. Athletes compete with injuries until they cannot. This is normal.

Show me a coach whose students never had injuries. That includes young students who work on difficult jumps. This Eteri bashing is getting out of control. Rika, Bradie have pulled out of their GPs due to injuries. Is anyone blaming their coaches? Eteri has a lot of talented students and she has helped many of them to be successful. These attacks on her are ridiculous. I think the problem is that she is Russian and successful. Some seem to have a problem with that.

 

[Cachoo]

I didn't see Kamila's exhibition at SkCan and wow am I impressed. She is a world class dancer and performer. She is amazing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3X-iq-LdGQ

I don’t see it. And that is not snark—it simply doesn’t seem special to me.

 

[Vash01]

I didn't see Kamila's exhibition at SkCan and wow am I impressed. She is a world class dancer and performer. She is amazing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3X-iq-LdGQ

Kamila was an incredibly talented nine year old when I first saw her video. Now she is an incredibly talented 15 year old. She still needs development artistically. I see a lot of 'Look I am flexible' in this as well as in her Bolero LP. I don't see the Dancer in her, but she is a beautiful skater.

IMO the most mature, dancer, artist who was just 15 was Oksana Baiul. Kamila has more athletic talent and she is going to be great.

 

[Karen-W]

Rika, Bradie have pulled out of their GPs due to injuries. Is anyone blaming their coaches?

Can't say that I've seen any blame directed at Rika's coaches, in part, I think, because she only recently relocated to The Cricket Club and, from what I've read about her injury, it predated the move to Toronto.

As far as Bradie is concerned, yes, there has been plenty of comments about Tom Z and his history in this regard (folks in the US women's thread especially like to bring up how he let Rachael Flatt conceal her injury and compete at Worlds in 2010). I don't know if I think it's been to the same degree as the Eteri criticism right now but when you have as MANY high-level skaters as she does, there are bound to be more instances of major injury that receive attention.

Eteri has, what, 6 of the 9 Russian women who received GP assignments and, so far, 3 of those 6 have been/currently are injured in the past 3 months, plus you have Med's injury back in 2017-18 that derailed her entire fall season and allowed momentum to swing Zagitova's way. It's hard not to notice a pattern and question the coaching choices when 4 out of 8 of her skaters from the current and last Olympic cycles all were severely injured during the Olympic season. It's hard not to wonder which of the other three will injure herself in the next 3 months and possibly lose out on a chance for Olympic glory.

 

[Frau Muller]

I like Dave's content and I find the faux Russian accent to be annoying, however he also receives a lot of positive feedback for the Russian soap opera stories and his faux accent. He wants an audience and it seems those vids do well. Instead of criticizing Dave, I think it's more appropriate to criticize the Russians' behavior. I remember back in the day, the USFSA didn't really appreciate Tonya's lack of class. They wanted her to behave a certain way. Now all you see and hear are Russian coaches openly airing grievances, even Evgeny's non-sportsmanlike behavior towards Evan and there's no real pushback from the ISU. It's a like a circus out there and Dave is just mirroring what they are putting out there. It's not his fault that Eteri's group has all this friction.

Dave has termed this his “Galina voice” after his beloved coach, Galina Zmievskaya...coach and mother of Petrenko brothers & Oksana Baiul. She occasionally offers pointers. Love it!

“David Spletnikov” translates to “David the Gossip Guy” LOL!

 

[Cachoo]

Kamila was an incredibly talented nine year old when I first saw her video. Now she is incredibly talented 15 year old. She still needs development artistically. I see a lot of 'Look I am flexible' in this as well as in her Bolero LP. I don't see the Dancer in her, but she is a beautiful skater.

IMO the most mature, dancer, artist who was just 15 was Oksana Baiul. Kamila has more athletic talent and she is going to be great.

Agree. I’m really pulling for Alena because I do think she has that “it” factor artistically. But it doesn’t look rosy for her at all. And I am not wild about her programs. My hope is that she doesn’t disappear.

 

[Scott512]

Whenever a coach talks about the prospects for a team or a player during the upcoming season, the discussion always starts with two words:
"If healthy..."
Nothing can derail a season and demoralize a player more than an injury, and usually, injuries happen during the heat of competition.
A basketball player lands on a guy's foot and twists his ankle. A baseball player gets hit with a pitch and breaks his hand. A football or hockey player gets laid out and gets a concussion.

It's possible that Daria injured herself before the competition and tried to pull a Katia Gordeeva's stunt. Or maybe, the injury happened there and then during the warm-up. However, the EVIL Etery blah, and blah blah blah! Give it a break you, trolls!

No question if healthy are the 2 key words in sports.

There are injuries all around the figure skating world and I only wish the fans and media cared about those injured skaters just as much as they do about skaters at Sambo 70. But that probably wont happen because there is a craze about EG even though she stays out of the spotlight.

Hasn't Rika been injured for much of the last year after trying to incorporate quads in her free skate? I hope she is healthy soon. But figure skaters have to live with injuries. It's part of their lives.

I also think the pandemic has taken a big toll on figure skaters not being able to train as they normally would not be able to travel for competitions as they normally would have played a role in some injuries although there's no way to prove that.

The Olympic season is gonna be a real battle for these great athletes and I wish them all good health.

 

[Scott512]

I totally agree. Team Orser made a point in the press that he was "carefully" monitoring a young Nam Nguyen when he was attempting quads at 13, as opposed to the evil Russians who couldn't care less about the safety/health of their top athletes. Right. Nam Nguyen left Orser injured and broken. And then Stephen Gogolev, who was attempting quads at 12? Oh yes, we are not like the Russians, we watch these youngsters and their quads... a few years later Gogolev leaves Orser injured/broken. Not a word from the NoAm press about the abuse of young skaters there, but a reminder that Eteri girls have occasional injuries...

Bradie Tennell has been out of competition all season and might miss the entire season because of injury. Her coach? An American who has a history of students with major injuries.

Rika is injured the whole season. I don't think her coach is Russian, and it certainly isn't Eteri.

Leave Eteri alone, please. Figure skating is a tough sport. People get injured. Don't blame the coach.

Wowwwwwwwww!

Orser had boys doing quads at 12 and 13? I literally did not know that.

I feel for Bradie Rika and all injured skaters.

I don't know how many women are gonna do ultra jumps in the future because I shank a lot of them can score around 230 points without them and those that do the ultra jumps almost always fall at least once during a free skate. Is it worth the risk?

Anna worlds without landing a quad.

Where is Mariah?

 

[Scott512]

Can't say that I've seen any blame directed at Rika's coaches, in part, I think, because she only recently relocated to The Cricket Club and, from what I've read about her injury, it predated the move to Toronto.

As far as Bradie is concerned, yes, there has been plenty of comments about Tom Z and his history in this regard (folks in the US women's thread especially like to bring up how he let Rachael Flatt conceal her injury and compete at Worlds in 2010). I don't know if I think it's been to the same degree as the Eteri criticism right now but when you have as MANY high-level skaters as she does, there are bound to be more instances of major injury that receive attention.

Eteri has, what, 6 of the 9 Russian women who received GP assignments and, so far, 3 of those 6 have been/currently are injured in the past 3 months, plus you have Med's injury back in 2017-18 that derailed her entire fall season and allowed momentum to swing Zagitova's way. It's hard not to notice a pattern and question the coaching choices when 4 out of 8 of her skaters from the current and last Olympic cycles all were severely injured during the Olympic season. It's hard not to wonder which of the other three will injure herself in the next 3 months and possibly lose out on a chance for Olympic glory.

Skaters from everywhere always skate injured unless the injury is too severe. They are going to skate at less than 100% especially in an Olympic season. It's just the way it is. It doesn't make it right but it's just the way it is.

On these underage skaters I do wonder how much influence the parents have or if they're just completely pushed to the side and let their child do what they want. My guess is it's the latter.

 

[pointbleu]

But there are ligaments that attach to muscles at both the distal and proximal ends of the femur and it is at those ends that the growth plates areas are. so i think what they just mean is it's likely a ligament tear at one or the other end. Based on her fall i'm guessing the distal end, but who knows at this point.

Thanks, but I do know my anatomy. I was just saying that if they don’t know, they should not say anything. That report meant nothing.

BTW, get a coxofemoral injury and try to see if you can weightbear... and see if you feel like bending the hip/knee.