Royalty Thread #11: Putting the "Fun" in Dysfunctional

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@becca you're already hoping for a divorce? :rolleyes:
Some of the stuff written about Meghan and Harry is really approaching Tessa/Scott/Jackie Mascarin levels of fanfic except Meghan is apparently ... Jackie Mascarin?
 
I don’t like the optics of her leaving while he works out the deal and I wonder how happy he will be.
I see it in the opposite way. It certainly puts a spoke in the wheels of people saying it's all on her and she's forcing Harry into this. If it was all on her, she'd definitely be in the negotiations making sure she got what she wanted. By leaving it to Harry, it shows that this is his idea and he's the main mover behind it and she's just in the background supporting him.
 
@becca you're already hoping for a divorce? :rolleyes:
Some of the stuff written about Meghan and Harry is really approaching Tessa/Scott/Jackie Mascarin levels of fanfic except Meghan is apparently ... Jackie Mascarin?

no I am not hoping for a divorce. I said multiple times I am not hoping for one.
 
I see it in the opposite way. It certainly puts a spoke in the wheels of people saying it's all on her and she's forcing Harry into this. If it was all on her, she'd definitely be in the negotiations making sure she got what she wanted. By leaving it to Harry, it shows that this is his idea and he's the main mover behind it and she's just in the background supporting him.

My concern is starting an international foundation getting international deals isn’t going to mean no media attention.

I could see Harry leaving but I think it would be to a quiet life in Africa. I don’t think it’s the life Meghan wants. That’s my concern. And I hope I am wrong.

He is leaving and giving up military appointments but not sure it’s for life he would want.

This doesn’t make either of them and people.
 
They didn't lose the titles Duke and Duchess of Sussex, which means they can adjust their branding. It's not like people around the world who are going to buy their branded merchandise are going to forget who his grandmother, parents, and sibling are.
Perhaps people won't forget but I think that not being able to use their HRH status to support their Sussex brand is going to be a lot tougher without the Royal part of it. Their stans will stick with no matter what, but I don't think the general public will. They lost a lot of good will with that website stunt.
 
They didn't lose the titles Duke and Duchess of Sussex, which means they can adjust their branding. It's not like people around the world who are going to buy their branded merchandise are going to forget who his grandmother, parents, and sibling are.

I suspect it will become 'The Sussex Foundation' or something similar as by losing HRH seems to imply they lose the usage of the Royal appendage to Sussex.
 
It's hard to know how important to Harry it is to keep a royal title when he was born a prince and will always be a prince by blood. But I would bet he would find it easy to give up in trade for adequate security. He, Meghan, and Archie are high level attractive targets for nutcases and terrorists. I think he'd give up anything asked to keep his family safe. I notice the announcements didn't address security except to point out it was on an independently determined need basis, so I'm guessing it is or will be determined to be a need. As far as the public goes, the people who hated them or simply resented them will continue to do so, and the public that supports them will continue to do so, regardless of official titles or not. They are a power couple, and charities will continue to value their support and activity. To those who think the lack of being able to use "royal" is going to dampen any enthusiasm for their charities and causes are going to be disappointed.
 
Their stans will stick with no matter what, but I don't think the general public will. They lost a lot of good will with that website stunt.
I'd be surprised if the general public has any idea what was on the website if they even know about it, TBH.

And I agree with SkateSand that I don't think this is going to make a big difference to public support for their charities. After all, lots of famous, not-royal people have charities that do quite well. There's no reason to think H&M will be any different.
 
It's hard to know how important to Harry it is to keep a royal title when he was born a prince and will always be a prince by blood. But I would bet he would find it easy to give up in trade for adequate security. He, Meghan, and Archie are high level attractive targets for nutcases and terrorists. I think he'd give up anything asked to keep his family safe. I notice the announcements didn't address security except to point out it was on an independently determined need basis, so I'm guessing it is or will be determined to be a need. As far as the public goes, the people who hated them or simply resented them will continue to do so, and the public that supports them will continue to do so, regardless of official titles or not. They are a power couple, and charities will continue to value their support and activity. To those who think the lack of being able to use "royal" is going to dampen any enthusiasm for their charities and causes are going to be disappointed.
Since they are no longer working royals, I would suspect they will not be provided with security. They can always hire whatever they want.

It will be interesting to see how they do without HRH. Everything has it's price.
 
Oh dear, H&M need to talk to their “friends.” This kind of article is, IMHO, another unforced error especially when read after the warm, supportive, message from the Queen. They have what they want and I truly hope they will be happy. This airing of dirty laundry is unnecessary.

 
Oh dear, H&M need to talk to their “friends.” This kind of article is, IMHO, another unforced error especially when read after the warm, supportive, message from the Queen. They have what they want and I truly hope they will be happy. This airing of dirty laundry is unnecessary.

Boy, those two are hard learners. And I cannot imagine that they have not spoken to their friends, nor that their friends are acting without the approval of M&H
 
Oh dear, H&M need to talk to their “friends.” This kind of article is, IMHO, another unforced error especially when read after the warm, supportive, message from the Queen. They have what they want and I truly hope they will be happy. This airing of dirty laundry is unnecessary.


Really? That article is nearly a week old and doesn't seem to say anything new.
 
Oh dear, H&M need to talk to their “friends.” This kind of article is, IMHO, another unforced error especially when read after the warm, supportive, message from the Queen. They have what they want and I truly hope they will be happy. This airing of dirty laundry is unnecessary.


To be honest with you this happens too many times so I have to wonder how much of a say H&M are having in these articles and their 'friends' commenting like this. The Queen is trying to give them as much as she can yet these 'friends' keep sniping and being downright nasty.
 
@becca why even mention divorce if that's not what you want? You realize they have an infant together right?

And the agreement is flexible because they're family and in general family don't shut the doors and throw away the keys on other family members.
 
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To be honest with you this happens too many times so I have to wonder how much of a say H&M are having in these articles and their 'friends' commenting like this. The Queen is trying to give them as much as she can yet these 'friends' keep sniping and being downright nasty.

I doubt these “friends” are actually speaking on behalf of H&M anymore. Maybe before, but not now. The thing is it doesn't matter. It still sounds petty.

I think if there was any way the Queen could have made a half in half out work, she would have. As a family this has to be so tough.
 
@becca why even mention divorce if that's not what you want? You realize they have an infant together right?
Three of the queen's children ended up getting divorced, as did her sister. The queen likely recognizes that some of the next generation's marriages might not last, but there's no reason to expect Harry and Meghan specifically to get divorced at some point down the line.
 
@becca why even mention divorce if that's not what you want? You realize they have an infant together right?

And the agreement is flexible because they're family and in general family don't shut the doors and throw away the keys on other family members.

Saying things look unstable doesnt mean I want them to be. But I don’t expect anything.

I don’t know them but I am not so sure moving will solve problems. I could be wrong and I hope I am. And I don’t expect anything.

look I am a kid of divorce. The last thing I would want is to see Archie go through that. Or for them to do so. So I hope I am wrong. And I wouldn’t wish it on anyone.

I did qualify I don’t want them to get divorced. I truly don’t the last thing I would do is wish that on anyone.
 
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Apparently Meghan is interested in a house in Kits. This is a highbrow area in Vancouver near where Chip Wilson (Lululemon) lives. It is not without controversy. Roads and access were changed so the houses no longer have a through street going past. Traffic was rerouted onto a smaller, previously quieter street, with much protest. It seemed it was very much a wealth buys you a quiet neighborhood even though the street and traffic patterns were well known before people started putting up 40 million dollar mansions.

I have no idea how accurate this report is. It is a lovely waterfront area and probably, other than West Van, would give them the privacy and neighbours they are looking for.
 
This article says that Frogmore Cottage is being shuttered, and its staff reassigned elsewhere within the Royal Family's households:

Yes. But supposedly they can use it while in the UK. However they are to reimburse the Crown for the cost of the renovations they had done.
 
To be quite honest, I believe Meghan and Harry were isolated, particularly by the Cambridges/Carole Middleton and palace courtiers via leaks to the press and some unfairness behind-the-scenes. I think the Queen and Prince Charles were fair and accepting initially, but that when the vicious leaks began to occur after the major success of the Sussexes' South Pacific tour, a number of entities within the royal family became concerned about M&H's popularity. But why so concerned? William & Kate will be King and Queen so what's the problem? Charles will be inheriting the throne when the Queen passes, so what's the problem? Why not embrace M&H and the popularity that they brought to the firm in recent years (and that Harry has always brought)?

Charles and the Cambridges are already busy copying many of the Sussexes' initiatives, ideas, and ways of interacting with the public. Charles recently became patron of a 'women's empowerment' group. That is a direct result of Meghan's influence and passion surrounding that cause. The Cambridges have been attempting to emulate the Sussexes' example all along, from the way M&H craft their Instagram to their interaction with communities around Britain in a unique, hands-on way that highlighted community projects and local businesses. It was Meghan's idea for her and Harry to visit communities around Britain in advance of their wedding, in order to learn as much as she could about her new country. Those visits were popular, well-received and very successful. There are many iconic moments from those visits, along with the invaluable way Meghan's sartorial choices helped a local business (Huit Denim) and other British manufacturers. This is down to how hands-on Meghan always is in her advance research and preparation. And now with the Cambridges' recent visit to Bradford, they are clearly continuing to follow the example set by Meghan and Harry in many regards.

We learned that Meghan writes her own speeches in addition to helping Harry with his, and also being able to speak very effectively off-the-cuff. Months later in the aftermath of the faux reports of 'rifts' between Meghan and Kate, there were reports in the American press picked up from British tabloids that Kate suddenly is now 'writing her own speeches.' I mean, fine well and good, but if so, it's clearly a reaction to the fact that Meghan is so capable in that regard. It's not a competition and that's not how M&H have carried themselves. It is totally down to the Cambridges' feelings of insecurity and anxiousness regarding a popular spotlight being on the Sussexes, particularly whenever the Sussexes went on tour. Again, such a competitive, insecure reaction makes no sense to me. There's plenty more examples including the fact that Harry previously spoke up for both Camilla and Kate when they were criticized in the media. But did anyone in the royal family do the same for Harry's wife, when she was being unfairly dragged and smeared during her pregnancy? NO!

One of the royal reporters even wrote a story recently stating that Harry & Meghan need to 'dim' their light! :rolleyes: How is that supposed to happen? M&H have done nothing but be themselves, work hard, genuinely engage with people, serve good causes, love each other, exist and breathe. But somehow the royals, palace staffers, and royal reporters couldn't wrap their heads around the existence of this couple on the royal scene. They wanted to both use and abuse M&H, but could not abide M&H objecting to vile treatment. There has been a huge campaign afoot to target and blame the Sussexes for objecting to mistreatment by speaking out and standing up for themselves. Leaks from KP are what led to the Sussexes' decision to launch their website and make their announcement in order to stay in control of the narrative. Don't mistake that bitter hardball has been played behind-the-scenes, chiefly against M&H as a result of their decision to not be maligned (even though they will be maligned anyway). The little bit of leverage M&H have attempted to use ultimately can't win out against the combined power of the monarchy and the media. That is the exact reason why Harry said to the public in his statement released last September that, "It may not look like it, but we need your support."

William has been so used to Harry the spare and the cut-up always taking the fall and being the third wheel. Behind-the-scenes, it has actually been William causing the Queen and Prince Charles the most trouble. But they both decided to let William do as he pleased, and they also decided not to speak out in support of Meghan against the media attacks. They expected her to take it and to just be grateful she married into the family, and to be happy with the perks and with the early small gestures from them. Neither the Queen nor Prince Charles have had the foresight or gumption to hold William accountable, because William is second in line to the throne, and as such, he represents the future of the monarchy. Thereby Harry and his wife are expendable. And with Meghan being 'different' she will eternally receive the bulk of the blame for the decisions the Sussexes made together. In fact, Harry has chafed under the yoke of being royal for a long time. Still, he was willing to stay and to serve out of love and loyalty to his grandmother and to his father. But they have both failed him.

What's obvious is: the Windsors will protect and preserve the British monarchy by any means necessary. Remember how George V refused to help his lookalike cousin, Tsar Nicholas of Russia during WWI! The Windsors feared that helping their Russian cousins escape from Russia might lead to a similar overthrow of the monarchy in Britain. We know the grave result of that choice by George V.

It remains to be seen whether Charles and William will be strong monarchs once the Queen passes. Even now, I don't think the Queen was ever completely in charge. She's always been a figure head, and an admirable one, but still a figure head. She's adhered to duty and tradition, to government decisions, and to the advice of courtiers and to a lesser degree her husband's advice. She never ever liked becoming deeply involved in family squabbles. Prince Philip always handled family matters, but he's no longer able to do so in his old age. Both QE-II and Pip are in their nineties. Pip is almost 100 years old and he could die any day. Despite the obvious fact that neither can live forever, I'm willing to bet that it will be M&H who are blamed should either Pip or QE-II die in the next year or two. And Meghan will always be blamed for 'stealing Prince Harry,' and also for weakening the monarchy, when in fact family squabbles and courtier-jockeying for position during this transitional period have been going on for a number of years. Those are the realities that have been weakening the monarchy. Plus the fact that once the Queen passes, it is uncertain how strong a monarch Charles and especially William, will be. Certainly, they will both be bolstered by self-interested courtiers, royal reporters, and the fantasy romanticism and royal sentimentality exhibited among certain segments of the British public.

An enormous amount of goodwill and increased interest around the world was visited upon the British monarchy as a result of Meghan marrying into the royal family. But vindictive palace courtiers, malicious tabloid media, and jealous/ weak members of the royal family have simply blown that goodwill. People who never liked nor ever accepted Meghan will be happy with this result. I believe that M&H had reached the point where they knew it was possible they would be stripped of everything to do with being royal, and that huge criticism would be thrown at them. But still, they forged ahead to gain freedom over their own lives. Their decision took a huge amount of courage. If anyone was blindsided, it was Prince Harry who had to be wounded by the leaks and media attacks against Meghan, and by the royal family's refusal and ultimately by the refusal of some members of the British public to fully accept his wife. It seems that the royals are now attempting to ostracize Prince Harry further, possibly in the hope that it will hurt his relationship with Meghan in the long term.

Invictus and Sentebale are Harry's brainchilds and so he should be able to maintain overseeing those brilliant and successful charitable enterprises.
 
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Bill Maher makes a lot of sense with his take. He often does, though I don't always agree with him. He does tickle the funny bone with his scintillating wit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Y3K6v4o7hk Annoucement from BP

The fact the Sussexes are said to have to 'pay back' renovation costs for Frogmore Cottage is ridiculous. I wonder whether it is just being reported that way to appease the public, but not actually expected of them in reality. That property was already being renovated as part of ongoing upgrades of Crown Estate properties. The FC renovation was already ongoing and had nothing to do with M&H until the Queen decided to allow them to move there since KP Apartment 1 renovations would take too long and were going to be extensive and even more expensive.

The money that was used for the FC upgrade was not from taxpayers' money. The fact is that the monarchy does not want to be too transparent about how much wealth the Queen and her family hold in the first place. Money from the Duchy of Lancaster is placed in the Sovereign Grant, some of which is then given to Parliament for the British people, and some portions are earmarked for upkeep of Crown Estate properties and other royal expenses, including staff salaries. Meghan and Harry also paid for the amount of renovations over the budgeted cost, in addition to paying for their furnishings, so this news (whether actually true or not) is put out as another petty slap in their faces, i.e. 'the punishment' courtiers initially blared about in the press.

As far as losing 'HRH' titles, I don't think M&H care about that at all. Witness how they refused to give their son a royal title. I guess they will continue to be known as the Duke and Duchess of Sussex, without the HRH attached.

Furthermore, apparently it is being conveniently forgotten how much money the royal wedding of Meghan and Harry brought to the British economy: estimates were between a billion pounds to 1.8 billion pounds. As well, Meghan's style and her sartorial impact helped a lot of British and Canadian brands. M&H owe the British public nothing.
 
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