The Dance Hall 6: We're All Off Our Rockers 2018-2019

[starrynight]

So one judge gives Parsons/Parsons +4 for their curve lift and another +1.

Another question- did anyone get the rocker key point? (I need some lessons on reading the new protocols)

 

[believed]

I haven’t been impressed with anyone’s SD yet, but I’m hoping some of the top teams will nail that pattern (or at least make it interesting).

 

[Dobre]

Another question- did anyone get the rocker key point? (I need some lessons on reading the new protocols)

https://www.isu.org/inside-single-p...ications-fs/16863-isu-communication-2148/file

I really have no idea what is what yet in the pattern based on my own observations, but based on page 6 in the link above, I believe the rocker is part of the 3rd & 4th keypoint on the first section of the pattern. If that is correct, the answer is yes. The Parsons got both the 3rd & 4th keypoint. Three other teams had ladies who earned the 3rd keypoint but the man didn't earn it for the 4th. (If I'm reading this wrong, please correct me).

 

[starrynight]

Wasn't the rocker meant to be so hard they weren't even originally going to include it as a key point? I recall everyone saying that no dance team did it correctly at the 2010 Olympics.

It's certainly interesting then if the Parsons got it at a Challenger event in August. Maybe no one really concentrated on it much back in 2010?

 

[VGThuy]

Fabian Bourzat and Barbara Fusar-Poli at the seminar seemed to want the rocker in while Margaglio and the Tech committee said they spoke to other coaches who spoke about how difficult it was to get all key points with the rocker as well. Igor was just chilling not saying a word and smiling. I think some FSUers think Margaglio spoke to Zueva.

 

[Dobre]

Wasn't the rocker meant to be so hard they weren't even originally going to include it as a key point? I recall everyone saying that no dance team did it correctly at the 2010 Olympics.

It's certainly interesting then if the Parsons got it at a Challenger event in August. Maybe no one really concentrated on it much back in 2010?

We'll see.

I'm sure the teams are focusing more on the keypoints now that these particular steps are keypoints. Despite all the no's & timing calls on these patterns, though, the caller here is not generally one of the tougher ones. (She did several of the highest scoring dance events over the past three seasons).

And Novak & Kiliakov are no slouches when it comes to teaching the pattern. Lorraine & Quinn had one of only two level 4s on the rhumba at 4CCs last year. The other being Muramoto & Reed. And the Greens had high pattern scores relative to the rest of the junior field all last season.

It is interesting that after all the discussion about the rocker, all the teams at the Asian Open so effectively bombed the second half of the pattern here. Though really--except for the Parsons' first half--everyone effectively bombed the pattern. Period.

My personal theory is that we'll likely find that the tough callers won't give teams the rocker and the lenient ones will, but that's only a theory. We'll see.

 

[sap5]

Is there a clip somewhere showing the rocker done correctly?

 

[Dobre]

And the protocols from the FD.
http://www.fsatresults.com/ISUchallenger/Scores/CSTHA2018_IceDance_FD_Scores.pdf

I was looking to see what the judges did with Rachel's twizzles & realized we now get the levels for each skater written separately on the twizzles, the lady's mark written first and the guy's mark written second. I knew they were going to be scored separately but I missed spotting how it was shown when I looked at the RD protocol earlier. (In this case, Rachel had no level at all--I assume due to her hand down on the first transition between her sets, while Michael has a 4).

Also we're getting separate marks for the lady and the man on the one-foot step sequences? I hadn't realized this was happening. So we will know who specifically mucks up on that element now. (Ouch).

Any other thoughts?

 

[VGThuy]

I think each partner getting their own twizzles calls is actually going to help a team when they boff the twizzles, so as long as one partner completes their twizzles, then it won't be as devastating a result as they may still get about 3 points for the element rather than a 0 like before. It should help some teams.

 

[Dobre]

I think each partner getting their own twizzles calls is actually going to help a team when they boff the twizzles, so as long as one partner completes their twizzles, then it won't be as devastating a result as they may still get about 3 points for the element rather than a 0 like before. It should help some teams.

Agreed. Though with this system, you could loose more GOE on the twizzles relative to your competition than you would have with the previous code so I'm not sure whether the separate scoring will save teams that would have lost spots previously.

 

[VGThuy]

Very true. I think it’ll help differentiate between all the clean twizzle sequences we will see.

 

[Dobre]

Trends:

After watching all the dance programs in Lake Placid, I just wanted to share thoughts on some of the trends I noticed overall. Since these were mostly young North American teams it's hard to know if the same trends will be true everywhere; but they are definitely things I saw from multiple teams and more than one country.

For the good.
-We seem to be getting a lot more teams shooting for different variations on the twizzles. (Lots of Guignard & Fabbri leg positions, teams going back and forth, changing arms positions, other leg-feature positions, etc. Essentially, lots of teams shooting for GOE, which results in a wider variety of unique and/or difficult twizzle sequences. Nice to see.

-We're also getting some very low difficult-looking and interesting combination spin positions. Not from as many teams as the ones experimenting with the twizzles, but at least 4 or 5 teams bringing that difficulty to the table. And--again--reaching for that extra GOE. I hope they get the credit for them because I think we could really use an infusion of more creativity in the dance spins.

-I do like seeing some of the lift entrances coming out of twizzles or difficult footwork.

On the negative side.
-The lift exits are driving me nuts. Everyone seems to need to hop up for one or two or three more mini lifts or flips after the main lift is done, and I feel like these "exit features" are spoiling the impact of what is often a more spectacular central position. (Note: My mother thinks I'm wrong and that all the hoppy exits are coming at the end of dance spins so it's possible we might be in for a plethora of those too).

-Some of the spins seems to go on forever. More positions, without any of them being gorgeous or unique or intriguingly difficult, is not so fun.

So that's what I see thus far. Probably more good than bad. It's always fun to see teams experimenting.

 

[starrynight]

Trends:

On the negative side.
-The lift exits are driving me nuts. Everyone seems to need to hop up for one or two or three more mini lifts or flips after the main lift is done, and I feel like these "exit features" are spoiling the impact of what is often a more spectacular central position. (Note: My mother thinks I'm wrong and that all the hoppy exits are coming at the end of dance spins so it's possible we might be in for a plethora of those too).

Are these lifts on trend at the moment or is it just the easiest way to satisfy the 'difficult exit' bullet point for levels on the lifts?

They've become quite popular in the last few years.

 

[Dobre]

I assume both.

I believe exit features of any kind became more popular in 2017-18 when it became necessary to include an unexpected-or-something-else entry or exit feature in order to get a level four.

They've become quite popular in the last few years.

If you would describe their use as "popular" last season, then perhaps the correct term for their use at this competition this season might be "voracious."

I assume the answer for why they appeared to be in a good 90-95% of the junior & senior dance programs in this competition lies in the updated rules for lift levels and/or features for this season. But darned if I can find anything. I remember reading a comment about the pairs needing to have both an entry & exit feature now so that might be the scenario but I didn't find anything saying this in the three different ice dance handbook/communication pages I checked before coming back to answer your question.

One thing I can say is that there was nothing "unexpected" about these hoppy lift exits at Lake Placid. You expected them to come, and they did.

 

[aftershocks]

Has it been confirmed that Igor and Pasquale teamed up permanently? I know I saw a recent IG post from Kaitlyn Weaver showing her and Andrew working with both Pasquale and Igor before going back to Morosov, but I didn't know it was totally confirmed already.

Igor discusses teaming up with Pasquale in one of the recent TSL interviews.

 

[cgirl8]

Kana Muramoto and Chris Reed have split. They are both looking for new partners.
https://twitter.com/AxelQuadruple/status/1027409482429546496
Article with more information: https://www.sponichi.co.jp/sports/news/2018/08/09/kiji/20180809s00079000096000c.html

 

[Dobre]

Kana Muramoto and Chris Reed have split. They are both looking for new partners.
https://twitter.com/AxelQuadruple/status/1027409482429546496

Sheesh, would someone please tell the ice dancers that the off season is over already!

 

[Sylvia]

I'm sad to hear about the split but glad I got to see their lovely 'Sakura' free dance (music by Ryuichi Sakamoto) in person last season.

Muramoto/Reed were assigned to NHK Trophy and Rosetelcom Cup back-to-back (original list dated June 29): https://isu.org/docman-documents-li...s-2/17411-ice-dance-2018-19-all-6-events/file

 

[chameleonster]

Post Olympic season splits are extremely common, but I feel like there are an unusual amount of late splits this year. I generally expect things to settle down by June or so, but we're still seeing splits from teams who had GP assignments and decent prospects for the season.

 

[Dobre]

Muramoto & Reed were a bit of a question mark because he has competed so long. (Chris has been to three Olympics). I had thought he might be considering retirement, though I'd hoped not because the new partnership was so successful it seemed likely they could develop further. Find it pretty startling to read that he is looking for another partner though.

 

[mysticchic]

And Chris's long time girlfriend announced her retirement yesterday.

 

[lauravvv]

Muramoto & Reed were a bit of a question mark because he has competed so long. (Chris has been to three Olympics). I had thought he might be considering retirement, though I'd hoped not because the new partnership was so successful it seemed likely they could develop further. Find it pretty startling to read that he is looking for another partner though.

I too hoped they wouldn't retire as there was a pretty good possibility of them climbing ranks at least as far as to become a solid world top 10 team, and I was looking forward to their new programs and rivalry with other teams of similar level. But I didn't really consider that they might split and look for other partners as it seemed to be going so well for them. Could it be that they did not get along very well? If so, it was not visible from outside at all. But their results could not have been at fault. Although perhaps there are other reasons that we don't know about - probably they will explain the split in more detail later.

 

[aftershocks]

Surprising. I thought that Chris and Kana supposedly got along well.

 

[lauravvv]

Surprising. I thought that Chris and Kana supposedly got along well.

It seemed so to me as well. As I wrote, probably there is another reason that we don't know about. Anyway, I edited/reworded that part in my post, as I don't find it very believable that the reason for the split were personal differences.

 

[barbarafan]

Kana Muramoto and Chris Reed have split. They are both looking for new partners.
https://twitter.com/AxelQuadruple/status/1027409482429546496
Article with more information: https://www.sponichi.co.jp/sports/news/2018/08/09/kiji/20180809s00079000096000c.html

OMG

 

[VGThuy]

At first after reading @mysticchic's news, I thought it was less Kana and Chris not getting along and more Chris deciding to move on with his life but then I reread the first post and missed that they both were looking for new partners. I wonder what happened.

 

[Sylvia]

Chris Reed's IG post: https://www.instagram.com/p/BmQZyV-g1Ii/?hl=en&taken-by=chrisreed77

 

[VGThuy]

Chris Reed's IG post: https://www.instagram.com/p/BmQZyV-g1Ii/?hl=en&taken-by=chrisreed77

That does not sound amicable.

 

[Bigbird]

That does not sound amicable.

It sounded like he was very disappointed that they parted but ultimately he was respectful. Kudos to him. I hope they are both able to continue their careers.

 

[firstflight]

That does not sound amicable.

She was just so recently bringing out a birthday cake for him and leading the happy birthday song. This makes me sad.