U.S. Men 2021-22 season news & updates

[nickp]

The US men's field was phenomenal Nathan was on top form

 

[vesperholly]

Correction. Eteri skaters excepted. But Eteri was smart. She petitioned the Russian fed to let Valieva skate with the seniors last year when she wasn’t age eligible. And Russian fed let the world she how she was beating all their amazing senior ladies. So she had an extra push. Malinin has had no such push and showcasing by the USFSA. The USFSA is only catching on now that broadcasting domestic events internationally for free is a great way to get free PR for their skaters. Russia has been playing the game successfully for a while. They also have their very highly visible test skates that give their top skaters high visibility all over the world from the very beginning of the season. It’s so politically smart! Imagine if USFSA had also done test skates with Ilia doing these amazing jumps at the start of the season. It might’ve been a different story today.

USFS already has Nathan to push for this season. Yes, a little short sighted to not also think of future push people. But ... rose colored glasses.

But there decision to leave him of this year could cost him the Olympic gold in 2026. You always take your future

I don't see why. Plenty of skaters win in their first Olympic appearance.

The only logic I can see is wanting to maximize WS points for as many skaters, which is why the USFS during the Olympic season traditionally spreads out the 4CCs, Jr Worlds and Worlds assignments (as well as the Olympics ones). But it's still junky as heck, IMO.

They are still holding that ridiculous Jr Worlds Selection Camp at the end of January for the Men & Women. And, for at least Malinin, Levito, Thorngren & Seo, it's ridiculous to not name them outright since we all know they're the best choices we have for that. About the only question I have is the 2nd spot for the Jr Men (we only have 2 spots).

Liam Kapeikis, hopefully. Kai Kovar and Will Annis were 1-2 in juniors but hella inconsistent, though Will did medal at one of his JGPs.

 

[Karen-W]

Liam Kapeikis, hopefully.

It would be between Liam, Kai Kovar, Will Annis or Lucas Broussard (who had to withdraw from Nats), in my mind. And I'm not sure which one I'd go with.

 

[wickedwitch]

They are still holding that ridiculous Jr Worlds Selection Camp at the end of January for the Men & Women. And, for at least Malinin, Levito, Thorngren & Seo, it's ridiculous to not name them outright since we all know they're the best choices we have for that. About the only question I have is the 2nd spot for the Jr Men (we only have 2 spots).

I am biased, but I wouldn’t be opposed to them just handing that spot to Liam. He was really great this weekend.

 

[vesperholly]

I am biased, but I wouldn’t be opposed to them just handing that spot to Liam. He was really great this weekend.

I have no reason to be biased and he was great! Loved his jumping and style.

 

[Karen-W]

I am biased, but I wouldn’t be opposed to them just handing that spot to Liam. He was really great this weekend.

Well, so am I, but so did Kai! And Liam seems to have definitely moved on to the Senior level. I'm hoping they send him to Challenge Cup to get his senior TES mins.

 

[ross_hy]

I am biased, but I wouldn’t be opposed to them just handing that spot to Liam. He was really great this weekend.

Agreed! I saw a post somewhere that complimented Liam for his old-school style, almost in the mold of Boitano & Scott Davis. I was trying to decide who he reminds me of, and that post summed it up perfectly IMO.

 

[Dobre]

Ooh, ooh! I have a thought.

I'm sure everyone in the U.S. Men's thread could come together if they just have a non-U.S. man to blame:

I give you Semenenko, who could have kept Jason out of qualifying for the GPF by skating two decent programs in either of his events.


I realize the criteria is really way more complex than who qualified for the GPF.

 

[carriecmu0503]

I don't see why. Plenty of skaters win in their first Olympic appearance.

Except that statement is totally untrue for men! Virtually all the male Olympic champions competed in at least one Olympics before they won. Hanyu is very much the exception not the rule, and that Olympics was not at all well skated. You would have to go back to 1948 to find the last time an American man won the Olympics in his first attempt- Dick Button! Nathan Chen just today stated how hard it was to be at the Olympics for the first time, and how important that experience is/ was to him in preparing for this year's Games. USFS is being idiotic for leaving Malinin off the team, and not allowing him to build this experience now. He earned it, and nothing will change my mind that he was robbed due to politics and pomp and circumstance of an ugly federation.

 

[Karen-W]

Ooh, ooh! I have a thought.

I'm sure everyone in the U.S. Men's thread could come together if they just have a non-U.S. man to blame:

I give you Semenenko, who could have kept Jason out of qualifying for the GPF by skating two decent programs in either of his events.


I realize the criteria is really way more complex than who qualified for the GPF.

And I'm sure that the RusFed would have appreciated it too. Not that they care about justifying any of their Euros selections to the world. cough*Semenenko*cough*over*cough*Mozalev*cough

 

[Baby Yoda On Skates]

Well now both get to go since Kolyada pulled out. I admit I wasn't heartbroken by his withdrawal since Mozalev needed another chance to prove himself and not blow the SP.

 

[Karen-W]

Well now both get to go since Kolyada pulled out. I admit I wasn't heartbroken by his withdrawal since Mozalev needed another chance to prove himself and not blow the SP.

Is it wrong to hope that Mozalev beats Semenenko and that Kondratiuk beats them both again?

 

[dinakt]

False. Vincent made his first Olympics in his debut senior season, and he didn't win Nationals.

You are right.
I guess JW cancelation last year really hurt Malinin’s chances.
I wish Jason to have at least the same impact at Olympics as Adam did, and I wish Ilia both health and World minimums.

 

[Baby Yoda On Skates]

Is it wrong to hope that Mozalev beats Semenenko and that Kondratiuk beats them both again?

Yes it is wrong. Kondratiuk does absolutely nothing for me. I'd rather watch Columbus and the Devil fail his costume change.

 

[Vagabond]

Is it wrong to hope that Mozalev beats Semenenko and that Kondratiuk beats them both again?

Not at all. It's de rigueur.

 

[Karen-W]

So, Ilia just posted this clip on his IG in the last hour... https://www.instagram.com/tv/CYiO02LKepQ/?utm_medium=copy_link

Which one will we see ratified first in competition? Yuzuru's 4A or Ilia's 4T-4T?

 

[skateboy]

So, Ilia just posted this clip on his IG in the last hour... https://www.instagram.com/tv/CYiO02LKepQ/?utm_medium=copy_link

Which one will we see ratified first in competition? Yuzuru's 4A or Ilia's 4T-4T?

The latter.

 

[bladesofgorey]

So, Ilia just posted this clip on his IG in the last hour... https://www.instagram.com/tv/CYiO02LKepQ/?utm_medium=copy_link

Which one will we see ratified first in competition? Yuzuru's 4A or Ilia's 4T-4T?

Dimitriev's 4a

 

[Karen-W]

Seriously, can't believe he went from falling on the 2nd 4T on Dec 1 to that smooth as buttah 4T-4T 5 weeks later.

Raf has to be salivating at working even more closely with Ilia once this season is over. Wouldn't surprise me to see Ilia move out there to train full time.

 

[canbelto]

So I fell down the rabbit hole of watching Tatiana Malinina videos tonight. Holy shit she had gorgeous jumps and flow.

Tatiana Malinina UZB - 1999 World Championships LP

QB : 2nd, SP : 5th, LP : 3rd, 4th placeMarch 20th-28th, Helsinki FIN

www.youtube.com

 

[livetoskate]

So I fell down the rabbit hole of watching Tatiana Malinina videos tonight. Holy shit she had gorgeous jumps and flow.

Tatiana Malinina UZB - 1999 World Championships LP

QB : 2nd, SP : 5th, LP : 3rd, 4th placeMarch 20th-28th, Helsinki FIN

www.youtube.com

Who can forget her perfect 3z technique & those Aladdin moves? I used to have some of her performances on vhs. Do I feel old now.

 

[canbelto]

Who can forget her perfect 3z technique & those Aladdin moves? I used to have some of her performances on vhs. Do I feel old now.

Compared to the other ladies of her era she was also a fast, strong spinner. That Aladdin LP is seriously cute.

 

[livetoskate]

Compared to the other ladies of her era she was also a fast, strong spinner. That Aladdin LP is seriously cute.

I remember a comment someone made online, "Da*n, girl! Eat a cheeseburger!" Maybe it was here on FSU or the old rec.skating group. That comment still comes to mind 26 years later whenever I think of Tatiana.

 

[Wyliefan]

So, Ilia just posted this clip on his IG in the last hour... https://www.instagram.com/tv/CYiO02LKepQ/?utm_medium=copy_link

Which one will we see ratified first in competition? Yuzuru's 4A or Ilia's 4T-4T?

A good response, kid. Let your skating do the talking.

 

[missing]

I guess people really didn’t pay attention the selection criteria that had been around since before the season started.

I paid attention to the selection criteria that had been around since before the season started and I thought it sucked.

 

[SDoesNotKnow]

So I fell down the rabbit hole of watching Tatiana Malinina videos tonight. Holy shit she had gorgeous jumps and flow.

Tatiana Malinina UZB - 1999 World Championships LP

QB : 2nd, SP : 5th, LP : 3rd, 4th placeMarch 20th-28th, Helsinki FIN

www.youtube.com

Right now, I’d prefer Tatiana Malinina on the women’s Olympic team than Ilia Malinin on the Mens.

 

[missing]

I would rather be in a car with someone I know, without a mask, than in a plane with multiple people and who knows if someone takes theirs off or has a mask that doesn’t fit well or has a mask with only one or 2 layers. That air gets recirculated.

Jason and Tracy got to do both.

 

[Willin]

There is not enough laughter for that. Ilia was TWENTY points ahead of Brown here, even with far lower PCS and GOE!

Okay I said I wasn't going to reply any more, but I had to reply to this. Ilia got inflated PCS and GOE he wouldn't have gotten internationally.

International Senior judges gave Ilia ~7.0 average PCS (7.5 average for Junior judges). International Senior Judges give Jason 9-9.5 PCS. Rounding down for Jason, that still gives him a 28 point advantage internationally. The difference in BV between them is 24.1 here in favor of Ilia. That still leaves Jason with a 3.9 point lead on PCS vs. BV.

Now, for PCS I'll go with Ilia's best showing (JGP) and Jason's worst scoring skate (GP Canada). Ilia gained 8.15 SP +5.81 FS GOE for 13.96 total GOE gain across the two programs. Jason gained 9.38 SP +8.8 FS GOE for a total of 18.18 points GOE gain. That's another 4.22 points of advantage for Jason internationally even if Ilia has a good skate and Jason a bad one. (With two clean skates he usually gets 20+ points GOE gain across two programs)

So, across two programs, Ilia has a 24.1 point BV advantage, but Jason's ~28 point PCS advantage and 4+ point GOE advantage make it not that ridiculous to think that Jason could beat Ilia under an international panel this season. Now once international judges start giving Ilia the same benefit of the doubt on GOE and PCS that the other men do Jason can't beat him. But until then...

 

[becca]

Okay I said I wasn't going to reply any more, but I had to reply to this. Ilia got inflated PCS and GOE he wouldn't have gotten internationally.

International Senior judges gave Ilia ~7.0 average PCS (7.5 average for Junior judges). International Senior Judges give Jason 9-9.5 PCS. Rounding down for Jason, that still gives him a 28 point advantage internationally. The difference in BV between them is 24.1 here in favor of Ilia. That still leaves Jason with a 3.9 point lead on PCS vs. BV.

Now, for PCS I'll go with Ilia's best showing (JGP) and Jason's worst scoring skate (GP Canada). Ilia gained 8.15 SP +5.81 FS GOE for 13.96 total GOE gain across the two programs. Jason gained 9.38 SP +8.8 FS GOE for a total of 18.18 points GOE gain. That's another 4.22 points of advantage for Jason internationally even if Ilia has a good skate and Jason a bad one. (With two clean skates he usually gets 20+ points GOE gain across two programs)

So, across two programs, Ilia has a 24.1 point BV advantage, but Jason's ~28 point PCS advantage and 4+ point GOE advantage make it not that ridiculous to think that Jason could beat Ilia under an international panel this season. Now once international judges start giving Ilia the same benefit of the doubt on GOE and PCS that the other men do Jason can't beat him. But until then...

Juniors PCs all go up once they hit seniors.

 

[VGThuy]

Juniors PCs all go up once they hit seniors.

Most of them don’t go up that dramatically in the same season.