kittysk8ts
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Possibly Gabby Daleman. He has had quite a bit to say about her as well.
The Skating Lesson 2019/2020
- Thread starter MK's Winter
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Ah ok thanks.
Yes, there are a lot of issues there. The discussion I have seen has been about reconciling some of her public activity e.g. posting heavily edited pictures of herself on social media as someone struggling with mental health issues. Suggests she needs more help and why isn't she getting it.
I don't find it personally exploitative because it's commenting on what's been put out there specifically for people to see. There are definitely flags of bigger and more pervading issues there so I, too, hope people close to her are watching her and helping her.
Glad that someone is talking about this vs ignoring or sweeping under the rug.
kittysk8ts
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Sure, but, for me, it’s the approach that is the difference. They tend to have a slight eye roll approach sometimes. But that’s ok. No one forces me to listen. Lol.
CaliSteve
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I have never seen them shade or eyeroll when they discuss the GD situation. They brought up a lot of valid points that merit discussion amongst federations, with regards to a skater's wellness. Is TSL the ones to bring it up and force federations to deal with these situations? I dont know, but someone has too.
CaliSteve
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I watched her latest commentary. I don't know if it was intentional or not but there were a lot of backhanded compliments towards Nathan. She starting to be like those In The Loop ratches.
muffinplus
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Can you give an example?
CaliSteve
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She first defends Nathan against the Twitter haters (ie crazy Fanyus she follows) about his skating. She says he a good skater but needs transitions, which is the reason he can consistently land a quad.....
I think overall she was pretty fair to him. Yes she did say that a lack of transitions may help him with consistency on quads. But she also said he’s already a good performer and a good skater. She added that in his position, why not challenge himself further by adding transitions. Regarding his PCS, she said that while she does think it’s a bit inflated, it’s not nearly as inflated as some people think.
meer
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TSL at least admits they are shady and openly hate some skaters. Fran hides behind her passive aggressive comments and wants to have it both way. Follows crazy Nathan haters and then weakly defends him while suggesting the only reason he can land a quad because he does it the easy way while everyone else can't do what he's doing because they actually challenge themselves. 
And he has added transitions in his FS especially. Idk what people are watching that they don't see them.
And more on topic, there is a new interview with Adam talking about his book up.
And he has added transitions in his FS especially. Idk what people are watching that they don't see them.
And more on topic, there is a new interview with Adam talking about his book up.
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Tinami Amori
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Fran is a joke, she specifically hates some skaters (mostly Eteri's girls). Her attitude is - you're winning and we're not. this can't be - if russians are winning then they must be doing something wrong in secret, because otherwise they can't win from us or not supposed to. It's unwillingness to admit that "those others can simply be better"....
TSL is another story. They lie, spread rumors, ref some "unknown sources" not as an opinion but as facts, make bitchy comments which are not just comments but carry hearsay or insinuations, and worst yet, they often do not know the full story, or some facts..
- Eteri petted a dog in front of the casino. David throws a negative "she did it for publicity". No she did not do it for publicity! she loves dogs and carries dog-treat with her all the time. That was a BS comment.
- Then he hints about Shcherbakova's future. "She may last for a while, don't known how long, but maybe at least her parents will get a government hand-out, an apartment as consolation gift". Well, that's a BS too. Her parents are well off professionals, living very well. They not only have a good residence in the city, but a very nice summer house (datcha) with good chunk of land. It's literally a villa...
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The family has several children (they can afford it) and many pets (which they can afford too.
They travel a lot and stay at nice hotels and resorts, taking not just all the kids but other family members, and participate in costly activities.. Her family traveled the world even before Anna became a top skater...
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Their residence is fancy by Russian standards with artwork and designer furniture..
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Her parents are wealthy, not some pitiful siberian villagers, and not "making Anna skate to help the family finances". David is a jerk to suggest it.
Then he slings mud at Eteri "i heard from another coach that she gave Anna a condition to stay 38 kg or get out". That's a lie! Anna does not weight 38 kg, first of all. Alysa Liu weight is 39 kg by the way.. and she is "larger built". Also how the heck "some coach" could have possibly heard what "Eteri says to Anna"..... Eteri, if there was such conversation hypothetically, would not have had it in public. And Anna would not have talked about it to others. There are no "other coaches" allowed into Khrystalny, and those who are in the rink, would not be talking to foreigners....
Then he was making "negativity assumptions" what would happen to Anna if she did not win, making all sorts of stereotypical "Russian Gulag style" suggestions, how Anna's life would be over, and Eteri would send her home alone, and not give her the time of day. Well, for one thing, Anna's father was with her, and they traveled home together, as planned, win or no win.
Second, Anna currently is Eteri's and Gleikh's longest student, she was there since early years, and they love her.. back when she was just another Novice.... They would never ditch her because she did not win.
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This is another example of the attitude - nobody can win so much without doing something evil, or if i don't like someone it's not right for them to win so much so lets dig up dirt.
David's partner, Jonathan, is walking a fine line with sexual remarks about his sexual attractions towards skaters.
He thinks it is ok and cute to "express desire when he sees a butt in tight pants". Well, if he said that about a female skater, how he sees "her butt in those tight pants and i am just ohhhhhh xxxxx", he'd be called a sexist and would get a lot of slack...... But somehow people ignore it.... why? because he says it about a man? These are all skaters, and yet Jonathan talks about some of them as "objects of his sexual desire".
There is no difference if it is "man about man" or "man about woman"... it's not right! And it is a double standard to think it's ok when it is same sex but not when it is opposite sex.
Their comments and behavior need to be looked at from several legal perspectives.. they may not be within the laws.
CaliSteve
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I have a different take on Dave's comments from the last TSL episode. I think he really likes Eteri. He really does think she's the real star, and I agree that she is. The comments made were just a snarky joke and really meant to be a homage to her, and I think Eteri would get that type of humor.
BTW- IMHO, Eteri is the type of woman that gay men gravitate towards.
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Tinami Amori
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I think he thinks she is a "Diva" and Dave likes "divas" in general, but he either feeds to the "popular opinion" of his mostly North. Am. audience and "dishes on her", or uses her persona as a cheap trick to appear "snarky" and to have "insiders' info".... He often looks stupid, because he does not know even the info that's been out in public, and sells it as "news"..
Humor is good. Humor that is degrading to a person is not good. Joking about her facial procedures is questionable. Commenting on her physical features, if he was "straight white man", would have created an outrage.
Making assumptions about her "selfish intentions" when she petted a dog is an insult, especially when Eteri is a well known animal lover.
Animal lover is positive. Why is he making it "negative" and picking the most negative scenario? Because he is an a..s.
Yes, given my experience, given 60+% of my male friends are gay, they like their female friends to be "divas", "colorful", "fashionable" and "edgy". And! when these guys make "bitchy" comments, such comments lean towards "praise" and not negativity.
Dave must have missed that point in gay-men culture. Or his ego was not stroked by her, and she is not playing his fag hag..
aftershocks
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Uh well, did you happen to see the frightened glance Scherba gave Eteri in the kiss 'n cry after she received her FS marks. "Did that satisfy you Mommy-monster? Did I do good? Am I out of the doghouse?"
But yep, DL's wink-wink insights and often cruel, contradictory put-downs vs kissing-up stances should never be taken at face value.
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Dave can multitask. He can declare himself an Eunsoo Lim uber and point out that her bullying allegations against Mariah Bell amounted to nothing. He can root for Hubbell/Donahue and criticise their programs without mercy. He can admire the force of Eteri's personality, which he obviously credits as the driving force of her school's success, and acknowledge some of the things her students say are alarming. It's a relief from all of the fans who pick a side (a favorite skater, a coaching team, a country) and then fight endless online battles on their behalf with the single-mindedness of paid trolls.
The funny thing is that I found his Aunt Joyce blog repellent, but the Overton window on skating fandom behavior has shifted so far that Dave seems like a reasonable moderate to me now. Now there are these aggressive, super emotional, super irrational fans on Skating Twitter screaming racism or imperialism at every score they disagree with. Or cursing at the skaters on their social media accounts. Or doing mind-boggling things like flipping out when the official GPF Twitter used a wings metaphor for Shoma Uno (which apparently is deeply insulting to Hanyu!?). Compared to all this, TSL recaps are a sane, pleasant way to consume skating discussion.
muffinplus
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What doghouse ? Eteri doesn't make Anna do anything.. Anna is skating for herself.
aftershocks
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Does she now!?
FYI: Fran is just a skating fan with opinions, like everyone posting on FSU. The difference is that Fran wishes to share her opinions on Youtube in living color giving face to name. I doubt Fran thinks she's the be-all and end-all voice of FS knowledge, unlike some obsessive fs fanatics, eh.
Fran is having fun enjoying and sharing her passion for fs. All of our opinions are what they are, and none of us are perfect. I don't get the impression that Fran (as a young fan still living at home and working) is sharing her opinions with any kind of agenda in mind, unlike some fs podcasts...
aftershocks
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Scherba, just like any other impressionable teenager/athlete wants to please her coach and mentor just as much as she wants to win herself. It is well known and factual that Eteri runs a tight ship and that she uses some questionable mind-game tactics to get her impressionable young charges to be more scared of her than they are of the judges or the audience, or of failing. It is what it is.
MK's Winter
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Adam Rippon Interview:
youtu.be
Adam Rippon: Beautiful on the Outside (A TSL Interview)
Adam Rippon's life has been a whirlwind since becoming America's Sweetheart at the 2018 Winter Olympic Games. I recently had the chance to catch up with Adam...
youtu.be
Tinami Amori
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Eteri does not uses "questionable tactics and mind games" and has no intent to make students "scared of her". That's an invention, a myth that someone came up with, and it got spread, and accepted as truth, and keeps getting repeated.
Eteri is a) very clear about her methods and expectations, upfront, b) takes actions and makes decisions according to what she has clearly stated. It's not "mind games", it's "actions".
- If a skater, in her opinion, is not working hard enough, she gives him/her less time, and if nothing is fixed, moves him/her to the lower ranking practice group.
- She does not believe in "cuddling a skater" after mistakes, to give him/her time to process the mistakes and to feel unsatisfied enough to want to do better.
- All of her students have PARENTS and Eteri insists that one of them is present during each practice, to watch the process.
She said this many times in the interviews, many of her students repeated this, and those who accept this method come to her and stay with her; those who do not, they leave.
Very honest and straight forward.
aftershocks
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^^ I'm sure that Eteri is very up-front and straightforward about some of her methods. As you have spelled out, she 'takes actions...' You may not want to call it mind-games, but that's what it amounts to, no matter what her methods are called. I'm sure Eteri's motives and methods are justified in her mind because she wants her skaters to believe they can do the impossible. That's why it's likely easier to work with young skaters and mold them.
Eteri has succeeded with her methods, and so she's respected for her results. That doesn't mean her methods are perfect or harmless physically, emotionally and psychologically for her skaters in the long term.
There is simply no mistaking Scherba's anxious, worried, or fearful (take your pick of how to describe it) glance toward Eteri in the kiss 'n cry. Sure, Scherba and her training mates may wish to please Eteri because they want to win, and thus they don't want to lose Eteri's favor since they must believe they need her attention and her favor in order to achieve their goals.
Eteri has succeeded with her methods, and so she's respected for her results. That doesn't mean her methods are perfect or harmless physically, emotionally and psychologically for her skaters in the long term.
There is simply no mistaking Scherba's anxious, worried, or fearful (take your pick of how to describe it) glance toward Eteri in the kiss 'n cry. Sure, Scherba and her training mates may wish to please Eteri because they want to win, and thus they don't want to lose Eteri's favor since they must believe they need her attention and her favor in order to achieve their goals.
skateboy
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I had a Soviet trained violin teacher (I am a violinist by trade) who, while being a brilliant teacher, yelled at me constantly and scared the hell out of me at practically every lesson. He would not accept anything less than correct. If I made mistakes I risked being thrown out of his studio. I worked with him for five years. For me, it was what I needed and it "toughened me up" to the point where any audition or performance was a relief... far less stressful than the lessons. It worked for me and I'm grateful to have had that kind of "severe" training. But that approach does not work for everyone.
muffinplus
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Maybe you should stop stating things that you think are there are as facts. She looks disappointed, I didn't see anxious, worried or fearful.
Ladies Short Program | Skate America 2019 | #GPFigure
Where to watch in your territory - bit.ly/2pvzo07For more information visit https://isu.org/ISU Grand Prix of Figure SkatingSkate America / Las Vegas, USA / ...
youtu.be
aftershocks
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I had a horseback riding instructor at a local stables during my college days who made all of us newbie riders more scared of him than we were of the horses. 
I understood that underneath our instructor's gruff exterior and seemingly harsh demands and loud admonishments, he deeply cared about us and the horses, and not just about himself and furthering his own reputation and business prospects. I learned to love and to trust horses, and to jump fences, etc. I had a blast. I miss those days.I still say that while I can understand the purpose and motivation behind Eteri's methods, there is a fine line between taking 'methods and actions' too far. I've had some really great teachers, and some not so great teachers...
aftershocks
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Maybe you should stop stating things that you think are there are as facts. She looks disappointed, I didn't see anxious, worried or fearful.
Ladies Short Program | Skate America 2019 | #GPFigure
Where to watch in your territory - bit.ly/2pvzo07For more information visit https://isu.org/ISU Grand Prix of Figure SkatingSkate America / Las Vegas, USA / ...
I'm talking about a brief glance I witnessed by Scherbakova toward Eteri in the kiss 'n cry after Scherba's very successful free program performance. And that's the only thing I was referencing because I noticed it, and I have expressed how I interpreted the way Scherba looked at Eteri in that specific moment.
SkateFanBerlin
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I had the same reaction as Jonathan. But, you're right. That kind of locker room talk has no place here. Must be creepy for the receiver of such attention. Thanks for pointing it out.
CaliSteve
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Enjoyed the Adam interview.
Tinami Amori
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Shcherbakova often has that "guilty kitten who spilled the milk" look.... even when she wins or plays but often when she concentrates ...
When i first noted her, i thought she is about to cry, but was explained it's the way she holds her face and her eyebrows.
Buy the way..... when Sasha Trusova laughs hard, she looks like she is crying hysterically, if sideways...
I'm no expert on Russian system but I'm Eastern Euro -- I know how my people roll.
The idea of managing someone's self esteem along the way is a very western and even North American approach.
Over there it's simple. If you're doing it as a hobby, don't attempt to waste the time of elite trainers and centers. If you're serious about it then you are expected to work like a horse, be disciplined and be perfect. It's the destination that matters (being perfect/best) not the journey. You will be criticized and driven. If you can't handle the training and mental stress, get out and go somewhere and do it for fun.
They laugh at us for giving hugs and telling everyone they are special bc they know that's rarely the formula to be #1. And that's all that matters to them. And you need to be hard to get there, not soft.
I'm sure that mentality bleeds into a lot of the elite training centers in any sport or profession.
Totally agree, not for everyone but it IS for anyone who wants to truly be the best and sacrifice to get there.
Adam Rippon Interview:
Adam Rippon: Beautiful on the Outside (A TSL Interview)
Adam Rippon's life has been a whirlwind since becoming America's Sweetheart at the 2018 Winter Olympic Games. I recently had the chance to catch up with Adam...
This was an excellent interview. I never disliked Adam but at the same time I was never a big fan.
I did respect how after 2014 he found a way to take his skating to the next level.
My mind is changed. Really like the guy.
What I loved about his interview was how transparent he was about so many things without trying to be provocative. He knew where his skating stood among the field and his limitation.
He also made a number of comments that support what Dave has said in the past (and I have experienced myself) and that is when you talk to a lot of fairly elite skaters, they are very direct, honest and even harsh sounding about their own skating and the skating of others. You have to not only accept but crave criticism as your path to relentlessly getting better. And this includes your fitness, weight, everything - and you have to fix that if needed and do it properly.
This kind of commentary is the norm in any of my experiences talking to coaches, judges and athletes. There's very little sugar coating involved and it's said with athletes interests to succeed in mind. Very very different from what is tolerated in forums like this with a more generalized audience like this. All a very normal and widely accepted part of the journey to achieve.
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