The Dance Hall 6: We're All Off Our Rockers 2018-2019

[yurokis40]

I would say a shot. But at the moment likely a P/C, S/K and H/D podium.

P&C yes the other 2 is up in the air , they have very old fashioned programs, 4cc will determine a lot and euros 2.

 

[yurokis40]

Honestly it could be the same podium as last year with P&C, H&D, and W&P, still not convinced sinkats is podium material they had a good GP season but tell that to weapo sometimes its hard to maintain the same level all the way to worlds.

 

[Debbie S]

Honestly it could be the same podium as last year with P&C, H&D, and W&P, still not convinced sinkats is podium material they had a good GP season but tell that to weapo sometimes its hard to maintain the same level all the way to worlds.

But without a CAN or USA judge on the panel (and the group of 13, of which 9 will be drawn, is weighted toward Eastern Euro bloc), I wouldn't expect 2 NA teams on the podium and w/o a GP season, I suspect WeaPo won't be one of them. I would expect the podium to be P/C, SinKats, and H/D, probably in that order, barring major errors or level issues.

 

[Dobre]

I would expect Weaver & Poje could change those expectations during Nationals and 4CCs if W&P skate well.

 

[muffinplus]

I don't think W&P have had enough mileage with that program...I also think SinKats have better skills at this point to be honest (but maybe I'm biased ).

 

[Taso]

But without a CAN or USA judge on the panel (and the group of 13, of which 9 will be drawn, is weighted toward Eastern Euro bloc), I wouldn't expect 2 NA teams on the podium and w/o a GP season, I suspect WeaPo won't be one of them. I would expect the podium to be P/C, SinKats, and H/D, probably in that order, barring major errors or level issues.

On the other political hand, W&P are the only shot the Canadian Fed has for the podium at worlds in any discipline. Russia and the United States could medal in other disciplines (Ladies and Pairs for Russia, Mens for United States).

 

[wickedwitch]

W/P, IMO, are the only medal contenders with two good programs. I don't know how much that will help, but I'm likely to be rotting for them as a result.

 

[starrynight]

Who knows. The whole fabric of space and time can suddenly shift in ice dance.

This time last season Sinitsina/Katsalapov were being thrashed for ‘ruining Russian ice dance’ and now they are being heralded as its saviours.

I was told endlessly that the Shibitanis could never get on a podium because they were too slow and yet....

 

[Dobre]

W&P, H&D, and S&K are all capable of skating fast.

The odds of all three of these teams skating completely clean in the same competition...well, when it happens that will increase the odds significantly from the 0% that it probably is at now.

 

[Bigbird]

W&P, H&D, and S&K are all capable of skating fast.

The odds of all three of these teams skating completely clean in the same competition...well, when it happens that will increase the odds significantly from the 0% that it probably is at now.

I know based on their results S/K should be on the podium but I find their FD utterly uninspiring and flat, they have a well choreographed RD though. I understand that they are fast and elegant and they have decent lines, but OTOH I can't tell you how often I've rewatched the FD from C/B though.

 

[Alilou]

Weapo performed their RD and FD 30 times before sold out crowds on the TYCT. It may not be competition mileage, but it's a LOT of performance mileage.

 

[VGThuy]

So I take it people have given up on Gilles/Poirier.

 

[Taso]

So I take it people have given up on Gilles/Poirier.

I, while I've often enjoyed them, haven't ever thought they'd make the world podium.

 

[PRlady]

So I take it people have given up on Gilles/Poirier.

Never a podium threat, the teck just isn’t there. C/B have a better chance to be spoilers, so do G/F. IMHO.

 

[VGThuy]

Random thought. When Nguyen/Kolesnik get a little older they should do a John Hughes romcom homage program ending with “If You Leave” from Pretty in Pink. They really have the looks for it.

 

[Icetigger]

So I take it people have given up on Gilles/Poirier.

Yep, not a chance. Haven't dealt with the technical issues; haven't improved their standing over the last four years. Plus Worlds is a Russian biased judging panel. If they want to be more competitive, need a coaching change. They are mollycoddled out of making the improvements they need to make to be more competitive. C/B and G/F are the likely spoilers. Followed by W/P and S/B. That makes G/P the eighth placed candidate for a podium place in my opinion. They came sixth at Worlds last year, but they also came sixth way back whenever. A plotting of their trajectory reveals they really don't have one; however much anyone might like them or their programmes.

 

[allezfred]

W/P, IMO, are the only medal contenders with two good programs.

I have a lot of words to describe Weaver/Poje’s programmes this season. “Good” wouldn’t be one of the words I would use though.

 

[MarieM]

I have a lot of words to describe Weaver/Poje’s programmes this season. “Good” wouldn’t be one of the words I would use though.

Their RD was good when they first showed it, not ready, but it was as good as SinKats.
Their FD I can't even remember.

As for C&B, not bad for a return, but the RD needs loads of works. I like the FD more, still something's missing.

 

[nuge]

What if Sinkats make mistakes and Stepanovas skate great ?

 

[lauravvv]

I have a lot of words to describe Weaver/Poje’s programmes this season. “Good” wouldn’t be one of the words I would use though.

What do you have against their RD? The only thing I can imagine is the music choice (Libertango is really, really overused). But that alone can't make a program bad. Not objectively (although perhaps this is the answer ?).

 

[muffinplus]

What do you have against their RD? The only thing I can imagine is the music choice (Libertango is really, really overused). But that alone can't make a program bad. Not objectively (although perhaps this is the answer ?).

For me it's the FD music choice I really don't like...

 

[starrynight]

I have a lot of words to describe Weaver/Poje’s programmes this season. “Good” wouldn’t be one of the words I would use though.

I need to figure out where Weaver/Poje fall in your Uber Matrix lol

They usually tend to get caught up by virtue of being Canadian due to Virtue/Moir association and also playing spoiler occasionally to some favoured USA and European teams. Although they did beat P/C a couple of times back in the beginning of last quad so perhaps a long term Uber Matrix?

 

[millyskate]

I liked C/B's RD, it suits them. But the FD I didn't connect with. I was disappointed as I do like their style a lot normally, but this seemed to lack their usual passion and personality.

 

[kittysk8ts]

So I take it people have given up on Gilles/Poirier.

Not me!

 

[Dobre]

So I take it people have given up on Gilles/Poirier.

I personally have never anticipated their making the World podium. But I perennially underestimate where Gilles & Poirier will finish.

They came sixth at Worlds last year, but they also came sixth way back whenever.

2015.

-Both years there was a Canadian technical specialist.

-By using the same measuring stick--only the 2015 & 2018 Worlds and exempting all teams that have retired/split/are skipping this season/didn't qualify for either of those Worlds--none of the current contenders improved their standing except Hubbell & Donohue.

-When comparing the previous span of the same amount of time, 2012 & 2015, Hubbell & Donohue finished 10th at both Worlds. So I'd guess that's proof that one's inability to move up over the course of a particular three years does not mean one cannot move up in the rankings during the following three seasons.

 

[kittysk8ts]

I personally have never anticipated their making the World podium. But I perennially underestimate where Gilles & Poirier will finish.

I haven't given up on them, however, they will likely need to beat WeaPo at Canadians to even have a chance. I guess we shall soon see if that is going to happen.

 

[allezfred]

I need to figure out where Weaver/Poje fall in your Uber Matrix lol

They usually tend to get caught up by virtue of being Canadian due to Virtue/Moir association and also playing spoiler occasionally to some favoured USA and European teams. Although they did beat P/C a couple of times back in the beginning of last quad so perhaps a long term Uber Matrix?

They fall under my “Gilles/Poirier have significantly superior programmes this season” Uber matrix.

 

[starrynight]

They fall under my “Gilles/Poirier have significantly superior programmes this season” Uber matrix.

Good to know

Look at us ice dance fans all learning about ourselves and coming to realise why we have those feelings that urge us to use to use the emoji

Here's another good example of the uber matrix.

The most common Uber Matrix Weaver/Poje have got negatively caught up in is the Virtue/Moir one. This is one is where Virtue/Moir are at the top of the matrix and then they don't like W/P for stepping on V/M's territory in Canadian ice dance while they were absent. Hence they back G/P simply so they can beat W/P as retribution. This of course being an abrupt about turn from when the V/M uber matrix seriously disliked G/P because they would beat Paul/Islam who were considered to be disciples of the V/M style. When G/P would beat P/I that was an extension of the judges scoring Davis/White higher than V/M despite V/M's style being 'inherently superior' *breathe*. Back in this time, I don't think W/P factored into that uber matrix because they had not come anywhere near to stepping on V/M's toes.

I just really enjoy tracking these patterns and adding in where teams fall in the overall structure.

Because ice dance is so inherently political and subjective, all of us fans have our own politics. Any ice dance fan who claims to be objective about the sport either isn't a close fan of the discipline or is lying lol.

Of course, everyone can have different teams at the top of their matrixes and then the patterns and flow down of emotions about different teams can have very different motivations. There's not just P/C or V/M uber matrixes.

A lot of it sounds ridiculous when you write it out, but it’s all an accurate reflection of the way people feel.

 

[VGThuy]

The most common Uber Matrix Weaver/Poje have got negatively caught up in is the Virtue/Moir one. This is one is where Virtue/Moir are at the top of the matrix and then they don't like W/P for stepping on V/M's territory in Canadian ice dance while they were absent. Hence they back G/P simply so they can beat W/P as retribution. This of course being an abrupt about turn from when the V/M uber matrix seriously disliked G/P because they would beat Paul/Islam who were considered to be disciples of the V/M style. When G/P would beat P/I that was an extension of the judges scoring Davis/White higher than V/M despite V/M's style being 'inherently superior' *breathe*. Back in this time, I don't think W/P factored into that uber matrix because they had not come anywhere near to stepping on V/M's toes.

Is that really a common uber matrix for W/P? I didn't know V/M fans liked P/I because they saw them as spiritual successors and I didn't think V/M fans paid W/P any mind unless they were fans of theirs (I don't think there are big anti-W/Pers out there) since V/M were never in any real danger of losing to W/P. I also don't know how many equate G/P beating P/I with D/W beating V/M. I think G/P have their own thing going on as to why people like them or dislike them (Gilles mainly) outside of the the actual skating skills and merit.

 

[starrynight]

@VIETgrlTerifa Depends on who you ask. Those Uber Matrixes I mentioned are not an FSU common ones.

But common enough on Twitter, Tumblr and blogs

Thise Uber matrixes came to mind as they are a good example of the complicated web that ice dance weaves. Of course everyone has their own perception.

All the mediums - forums, Twitter, tumblr, Instagram tend to have different feelings. Most ubering doesn’t happen on forums. The real crazy certainly doesn’t. There are Tumblr blogs and Instagram accounts with huge amounts of followers that get I think a lot more participation than the forums do on certain topics.