The Dance Hall 13: When You Dance on the Ice and Your Feet Twizzle Twice, That's Amore

[her grace]

23 years ago, you couldn’t get a Lithuanian team on the podium who deserved it. Now you can’t get them off the podium when they don’t deserve it.

 

[peibeck]

I 100% agree with you there. R/A should NOT be getting 9s or even 8s for skating skills.

The judges were obviously still high off their "I'm too Sexy" camp classic RD. Even if their skills are modest, that dance is a triumph of "so bad it's good" and the only memorable RD I've seen so far this season.

 

[escaflowne9282]

Does anyone have eyes on Vanessa Gusmeroli?

Thank you for this wonderful throwback to one of the few truly interesting and original ladies programs of that era.

 

[Karen-W]

As I was finishing up laundry a thought occurred to me. I was wondering if the Shibs looked at these results today and were like, "Oh s**t..." or if they delusionally thinking "See! The judges are loving comeback skaters!"

Since most skaters seem to live in delululand, I'm pretty sure they're thinking the latter. It'll be interesting to see what happens at NHK - that's not an IAM-heavy field - just FabAyer, FearGib and YoMori. I don't think GuigFab have a prayer in hell at overtaking FearGib there, but I'm curious what will happen with the Shibs. Propping them up to beat FearGib puts them in a better position to go help knock FBCiz and IAM down at Finlandia a couple weeks later (in tandem with GilPoir and the Maurizio teams there) - it'll be interesting to see who the Finnish fed taps to fill out the panel there.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Charlene decided to call out the judges on social media, not sure this will end well for Guignard/Fabbri.

Interesting and all those judges that are circled are teams that placed above them, so maybe those judges had special interests.

 

[jmtfti]

Random fun fact mostly to reiterate how.....interconnected the ice dance world is beyond any one school: new British judge Sundeep Pandya used to be involved with the Lithuanian fed from the late 1990s through early/mid 2000s.

 

[peibeck]

...it'll be interesting to see who the Finnish fed taps to fill out the panel there.

Do the feds tap the tech and judging panels? I thought all that was done in Switzerland by the ISU.

 

[litenkyckling]

Since most skaters seem to live in delululand, I'm pretty sure they're thinking the latter. It'll be interesting to see what happens at NHK - that's not an IAM-heavy field - just FabAyer, FearGib and YoMori. I don't think GuigFab have a prayer in hell at overtaking FearGib there, but I'm curious what will happen with the Shibs. Propping them up to beat FearGib puts them in a better position to go help knock FBCiz and IAM down at Finlandia a couple weeks later (in tandem with GilPoir and the Maurizio teams there) - it'll be interesting to see who the Finnish fed taps to fill out the panel there.

very interested to see what the US judges do going forward...

 

[Karen-W]

Do the feds tap the tech and judging panels? I thought all that was done in Switzerland by the ISU.

Just checked the GP General Announcement -

ISU appoints the Referees, Tech Panels and Data/Replay Operators. Organizing fed invites the judges "based on a procedure agreed with ISU". Presumably the 7 countries with teams in the dance event there - CAN, CZE, ESP, FIN, FRA, GEO & USA - will each have a judge and then the Finnish fed will invite two more from other countries. And the US teams there are the Browns, Shibs & ZingKol, so I'm not sure IAM can count on that judge being in their bucket, especially if the Shibs finish 1st or 2nd at NHK.

 

[litenkyckling]

Just checked the GP General Announcement -

ISU appoints the Referees, Tech Panels and Data/Replay Operators. Organizing fed invites the judges "based on a procedure agreed with ISU". Presumably the 7 countries with teams in the dance event there - CAN, CZE, ESP, FIN, FRA, GEO & USA - will each have a judge and then the Finnish fed will invite two more from other countries. And the US teams there are the Browns, Shibs & ZingKol, so I'm not sure IAM can count on that judge being in their bucket, especially if the Shibs finish 1st or 2nd at NHK.

Surely it's in the US best interest to actually push GP at Finlandia? I guess we won't know until we see how the Shibs look at NHK but their main goal will be to make FBC look like less of a threat? (Assuming this is how everything will be judged, given the fact that what is on the ice seems a bit irrelevant)

 

[Karen-W]

Surely it's in the US best interest to actually push GP at Finlandia? I guess we won't know until we see how the Shibs look at NHK but their main goal will be to make FBC look like less of a threat? (Assuming this is how everything will be judged, given the fact that what is on the ice seems a bit irrelevant)

That's my thought process as well. It is in the US and Canada's best interests to push each other's top team coming into Finlandia. Whether that's the Shibs or ZingKol remains to be seen - next week will sort that out to some extent with ZingKol, GreenP, SmaDie and LopBri battling for silver & bronze.

Next week's panel is probably going to be IAM heavy since there are only 5 countries in total there - CHN, ESP, FRA, KOR & USA - which leaves the CFSA free to appoint judges from other IAM-adjacent countries like AUS, JPN & AZE (Ritter/Brykalov are at IAM-O).

 

[Andrea82]

Random fun fact mostly to reiterate how.....interconnected the ice dance world is beyond any one school: new British judge Sundeep Pandya used to be involved with the Lithuanian fed from the late 1990s through early/mid 2000s.

As late as 2017...the panel for Masters of France 2017 was:

 

[Andrea82]

That's my thought process as well. It is in the US and Canada's best interests to push each other's top team coming into Finlandia. Whether that's the Shibs or ZingKol remains to be seen - next week will sort that out to some extent with ZingKol, GreenP, SmaDie and LopBri battling for silver & bronze.

Next week's panel is probably going to be IAM heavy since there are only 5 countries in total there - CHN, ESP, FRA, KOR & USA - which leaves the CFSA free to appoint judges from other IAM-adjacent countries like AUS, JPN & AZE (Ritter/Brykalov are at IAM-O).

There is an Australian judge at Cup of China who has double qualification (both ID and Single/Pairs). You can see it from the ISA google drive with their assignments.

Just checked the GP General Announcement -

ISU appoints the Referees, Tech Panels and Data/Replay Operators. Organizing fed invites the judges "based on a procedure agreed with ISU". Presumably the 7 countries with teams in the dance event there - CAN, CZE, ESP, FIN, FRA, GEO & USA - will each have a judge and then the Finnish fed will invite two more from other countries. And the US teams there are the Browns, Shibs & ZingKol, so I'm not sure IAM can count on that judge being in their bucket, especially if the Shibs finish 1st or 2nd at NHK.

I bet on the Norwegian judge being invited.

 

[Marta24]

The ISU issued the judges draw for Euros, 4CC, Jr. Worlds and Worlds in Communication 2744.

Euros: CYP, CZE, ESP, FIN, FRA, GEO, GER, ITA, NED, POL, SVK, TUR, UKR
Worlds: AUS, CAN, CYP, CZE, ESP, FRA, GBR, GEO, KOR, LTU, SVK, TUR, USA

F/G and R/A are without judges at Euros, while G/F won't have a judge at Worlds, but I would also be surprised if we see G/F again competing after Milan.

 

[marbri]

I do agree with you for a lot of this, but G/F just got a lower skating skills mark then R/A. That's not explicable via anything but IAM politics, surely.

Was it IAM politics that RUDELY dumped LaLa last Worlds or was it a handful of nations trying to get their team in the top ten and they all decided that LaLa were expendable. Because I really don't see any of the head coaches at IAM intentionally plotting against LaLa. But what just happened to G/F here happened to them at Worlds and they actually had good programs.

I personally think a lot of people conflate IAM politics with the reality that most teams that move to Montreal greatly improve their skating skills and choreography and that gets rewarded by the judges. But I can see why coaches like Babs and Carol Lane want to focus on IAM politics and not themselves. One might say they have been engaging in their own politics the last few years.

Now where I think having a stable of nations represented at your club does come in handy is when you want to give C/B the nudge over G/P. And that is a tale as old as time because for years we correctly guess an outcome based on what judges make any given panel.

None of that changes the fact that G/F were already on the way down last year and decided to double down on that and enter this season with programs. Harry Connick Jr 2.0

 

[SidelineSkater]

Chock & Bates fell in the standings, they kept their mouth shut, made changes and won gold medals. I wish other teams grasped pettiness, vindictiveness and trash talking doesn't work and hasn't worked to get medals.

To be fair, Chock/Bates started winning gold again internationally when the dance field cleared out wide open after the ‘22 Olympics.

They fell in the standings along with Weaver/Poje and Capellini/Lanotte leading into the 18 games.

Between ‘18-22 they were top 3-4. They had a span of 6 years between world podiums of 16 and 22.

Agreed that trash talking isn’t the way to the top, but let’s not pretend Chock/Bates worked hard and over the course of a season started winning gold.

As has been repeated. The Italians programs this season and last are doing them no favors.

 

[marbri]

On a funnier note Charlene reshared some instagram that claims for figure skating fans what happened at the Louvre was only the second biggest robbery in France today. Now I don't think she was laughing when she shared it but if gave me a little

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

On a funnier note Charlene reshared some instagram that claims for figure skating fans what happened at the Louvre was only the second biggest robbery in France today. Now I don't think she was laughing when she shared it but if gave me a little

Lol she has the ANL sarcasm, her and I can hang out at the bar for Cockeys!!

They are totally capable of getting a world medal every single year, but I question the material. Last year robots, and now this year that free program is bland music that did not capture me emotionally.

 

[Debbie S]

To be fair, Chock/Bates started winning gold again internationally when the dance field cleared out wide open after the ‘22 Olympics.

To be fair, C/B climbed back to where they had been within 2 seasons of going to IAM. And in their first season there, they missed the GP when Madi was recovering from surgery. In 2019, they won 4CC (admittedly due to H/D mistake) and the following season were 2nd at GPF, won Nats and 4CC, and were on their way to a World medal when Covid hit and caused Worlds to be canceled. In 2021, they said afterward that Evan was dealing with an injury.

Not that this is relevant to this discussion, I just wanted to point that out.

When B/K dropped in the standings, they ultimately made changes. At this point in their careers, I don't see G/F making a coaching change. They can make changes to their programs but I feel like the writing was on the wall last season and I don't think there was much they could have done over the summer to change that.

I do hope that Italy wins the bronze in the TE so they can win a medal that way.

 

[~tapdancer~]

Well here we go with the new season. I personally don't give a crap about the politics of skating anymore. After all these years I just go with how I feel. I have to say I was absolutely blown away by FB/Ciz, wow that was some incredible skating. I didn't appreciate him back in the day, but he is really perfection. With Laurence it's just a whole different feeling I get, they were made to skate together.

I don't care that G/F got dumped, it's about time.