Just call me Harry. (Everything Harry & Meghan)

[canbelto]

It doesn't automatically but a lot of times when it is directed at a Black woman it is code for "not knowing their place" and "their place" is code for "back of the bus."

I do think the UK tabloids lost their collective minds when Harry got engaged to a Black woman, let alone divorced and American. They said blatantly racist shit and they also got fully on board with a lot of racist tropes and microaggressions. Black women being called pushy for perfectly normal behavior is a common one. It's also sexist because it's used against all women just for having autonomy.

A lot of the criticisms of Meghan were strikingly similar to the criticisms of Michelle Obama including yes, the word "pushy" and the awful ape/she's a man memes.

How Michelle Obama expanded the definition of a first lady | Margo Jefferson

The rules imposed on her were constricting. So she expanded them and, in the process, won people over without betraying herself

www.theguardian.com

And many of the comparisons to Melania and Laura Bush were again, Melania and Laura were so "classy" compared to Michelle Obama. So similar to the comparisons to Kate and Diana.

 

[Judy]

Which was a 9-10 year courtship. If Meghan had waited that long she would have been 45-46 and her ovaries definitely would have been dried up.

Lol very true.

 

[Lemonade20]

The same could be said of many 'normal' people, or average people, for a myriad of reasons.

True, I have a friend who got engaged after a month of dating. They're coming up on 25 years together.

 

[Jenny]

A lot of the criticisms of Meghan were strikingly similar to the criticisms of Michelle Obama including yes, the word "pushy" and the awful ape/she's a man memes.

And many of the comparisons to Melania and Laura Bush were again, Melania and Laura were so "classy" compared to Michelle Obama. So similar to the comparisons to Kate and Diana.

For sure Michelle was and is subject to a lot of racism, but she also commands a tremendous amount of respect and public affection for her achievements and her personality. In fact, in 2020 she ranked #1 on a list of most admired women in the world, with several other First Ladies of both parties ranking high, and many women of colour also ranking on the list. (Donald ranked #1, narrowly beating out Barack, so I think we can assume the poll included respondents across party lines).

But I can't recall anyone but her husband and Steve Bannon calling Melania classy, lol. Far from it in many cases - once the whole "free Melania" thing wore off, it was open season on her, and she didn't help matters with things like her infamous "I really don't care" jacket on her way to and from visiting a children's detainment camp on the Texas border.

And really, while Jill Biden is much admired, she is also criticized quite a bit too - a divide that pretty much runs down party lines, as it tends to do with First Ladies.

 

[Japanfan]

Something different about Meghan: unlike other people who married into the BRF she worked most of her life and was an independent earner. Diana ... what was she going to do? Her whole life was spent prepping to be the rich wife of an aristocrat.

So Meghan probably already knew of people at Netflix and Spotify and other media/entertainment channels. This meant she didn't have to stay put when her son was being called a chimp. What is wrong with a woman in 2021 having definite money-earning skills?

In the real world, women are expected to know other skills besides cutting ribbons and looking pretty in a fascinator.

TBH, I think being an independent person and earner is preferable to being prepped to be the rich wife of an aristocrat.

A segment of women and men as well are still being prepped to be aristocrats or the wife of an aristocrat.

 

[puglover]

At least some of the question as to whether Meghan really knew what she was getting herself into come from Meghans comments herself. Comments like "I think the grass is always greener. You have no idea. It's hard to understand what it's like. I know what it should be, but it's a very different thing". "I never thought that this would be easy but I thought it would be fair. And that's the part that's really hard to reconcile".

Would things have been different if the timetable had played out differently? Probably not substantially, love is love, but she may have been better prepared that things were never going to be "fair". Their advantage, perhaps, is that Harry is not Charles, or William or wee George. They had more options and they have opted out. I think it is horribly unfair to place the blame for this choice on Meghan and see it as a positive for the BRF moving forward for those not in direct line to live their own lives. I am fans of theirs and loved Meghan in "Suits". That said, I do not think I need to agree with everything they say or do.

 

[MacMadame]

But I can't recall anyone but her husband and Steve Bannon calling Melania classy, lol.

OMG, social media was full of Trumpsters saying things like "we finally have a classy lady back in the WH" after Trump's win. These were often accompanied by heavily Photoshopped images where Michelle was made to look as bad as possible. For those people clearly classy = white. Especially since they would not normally call a woman who made soft-core porn or posed nude classy.

 

[overedge]

I think it is horribly unfair to place the blame for this choice on Meghan and see it as a positive for the BRF moving forward for those not in direct line to live their own lives.

I think there is already some precedent for that with e.g. Zara and Peter Phillips, and Princess Margaret's children. They have their own lives and careers, while still being part of the family. But of course they all live in the UK, and haven't been subject to the intense kind of attention that H&M have received. Also, since they are older than Harry, they grew up during a time when social media wasn't a thing.

 

[Karen-W]

At least some of the question as to whether Meghan really knew what she was getting herself into come from Meghans comments herself. Comments like "I think the grass is always greener. You have no idea. It's hard to understand what it's like. I know what it should be, but it's a very different thing". "I never thought that this would be easy but I thought it would be fair. And that's the part that's really hard to reconcile".

Would things have been different if the timetable had played out differently? Probably not substantially, love is love, but she may have been better prepared that things were never going to be "fair". Their advantage, perhaps, is that Harry is not Charles, or William or wee George. They had more options and they have opted out. I think it is horribly unfair to place the blame for this choice on Meghan and see it as a positive for the BRF moving forward for those not in direct line to live their own lives. I am fans of theirs and loved Meghan in "Suits". That said, I do not think I need to agree with everything they say or do.

I also don't believe it is either right or fair to lay any and all blame for the decision to opt out of the BRF on Meghan. Harry has made it clear, for at least 10-13 years that he wanted out. I think he found a strong woman who was willing to back him up on how/what he/they wanted for their roles within the BRF, and a woman smart enough to help figure a way out if the BRF proved immovable.

But, a lot of the things they say they want or have driven their decision to opt out are not consistent with their subsequent actions - and that, as far as I am concerned, is open for criticism and discussion.

 

[canbelto]

OMG, social media was full of Trumpsters saying things like "we finally have a classy lady back in the WH" after Trump's win. These were often accompanied by heavily Photoshopped images where Michelle was made to look as bad as possible. For those people clearly classy = white. Especially since they would not normally call a woman who made soft-core porn or posed nude classy.

Like this meme. Or this one.

I'll never understand the British tabs' horror at women working. Carole Middleton still gets a lot of bitchery (like that Tatler article that Kate sued about) for (horrors!) running her own company. There was a lot of pearl-clutching at first that Sophie had also worked before marrying Edward. But this horror went through the roof before, during, and after Meghan's brief time as a royal. Like what the hell is wrong with her earning a paycheck? Are all women supposed to be like Diana, who had her uncle vouching for her virginity and lack of any life experience?

My GUESS (and it;s only a guess) that Meghan and Harry inking those Netflix and Spotify deals are responses to the fact that Harry essentially has no job skills. He was never taught to have any, and so he doesn't. Some of the British tabloids' articles about Meghan made me check whether it was 2019 or 1619.

 

[Karen-W]

Like this meme. Or this one.

I'll never understand the British tabs' horror at women working. Carole Middleton still gets a lot of bitchery (like that Tatler article that Kate sued about) for (horrors!) running her own company. There was a lot of pearl-clutching at first that Sophie had also worked before marrying Edward. But this horror went through the roof before, during, and after Meghan's brief time as a royal. Like what the hell is wrong with her earning a paycheck? Are all women supposed to be like Diana, who had her uncle vouching for her virginity and lack of any life experience?

My GUESS (and it;s only a guess) that Meghan and Harry inking those Netflix and Spotify deals are responses to the fact that Harry essentially has no job skills. He was never taught to have any, and so he doesn't. Some of the British tabloids' articles about Meghan made me check whether it was 2019 or 1619.

Heck, you could probably include Kate in that group regarding work. She wound up working at her parents company (and getting that ridiculous nickname) in part because the media hounded her relentlessly when she did work for Jigsaw in London, at an entry level position. She was "lucky" in the sense that her parents were in a position to be able to hire her to work for Party Pieces but most royal GFs don't have that luxury.

Sophie owned her own company and the intent was for her to keep working after their marriage, which happened for a couple years, but then their was the fake sheikh scandal and that was the end of her working outside The Firm - so, is it completely the press' fault or did she help contribute to not being able to work?

 

[clairecloutier]

All the recent stuff in this thread has made me realize more than ever that I'd be a republican (small r) if I lived in Britain or a Commonwealth country.

The monarchy is picturesque and traditional and has provided a lot of pageantry and gossip (and some good TV series) over the years. I'm not sure its usefulness goes any further than that.

I think Meghan and Harry interest me in part because I believe the whole royal family may eventually be doing what they're doing--i.e., trying to figure out what life is like after being an active royal.

 

[MacMadame]

My GUESS (and it;s only a guess) that Meghan and Harry inking those Netflix and Spotify deals are responses to the fact that Harry essentially has no job skills. He was never taught to have any, and so he doesn't.

Harry had a successful career in the military where he was highly regarded. It is generally accepted that being in the military gives you life and work skills.

 

[AxelAnnie]

That’s up to CBS.

No, it is not. One word from either of them to hold the airing would put it on hold.

 

[AxelAnnie]

They mentioned it on the news, but I don't remember which one

He was hospitalized for an infection. He was then moved to a different hospital to deal with an ongoing heart issue. The two are not necessarily combined conditions. Although neither thing can be great at 97.

 

[AxelAnnie]

All the recent stuff in this thread has made me realize more than ever that I'd be a republican (small r) if I lived in Britain or a Commonwealth country.

The monarchy is picturesque and traditional and has provided a lot of pageantry and gossip (and some good TV series) over the years. I'm not sure its usefulness goes any further than that.

The Monarchy brings in bazillion of tourist dollars every year.

Sunday Post

The royals, in fact, brought in £430 million more than they cost us last year, leaving other royals such as the Spanish or Belgian ones lagging far behind.

 

[Judy]

A lot of the criticisms of Meghan were strikingly similar to the criticisms of Michelle Obama including yes, the word "pushy" and the awful ape/she's a man memes.

How Michelle Obama expanded the definition of a first lady | Margo Jefferson

The rules imposed on her were constricting. So she expanded them and, in the process, won people over without betraying herself

www.theguardian.com

And many of the comparisons to Melania and Laura Bush were again, Melania and Laura were so "classy" compared to Michelle Obama. So similar to the comparisons to Kate and Diana.

Well I remember reading that about Michelle. Someone had posted it on their facebook and I think? the woman was over the moon about Melania (). It was a disgusting comment. Michelle Obama was an awesome first lady.

 

[overedge]

No, it is not. One word from either of them to hold the airing would put it on hold.

No, it would not. If they've signed a release, which they would likely have to do as a condition of doing the interview, CBS owns the rights to the interview and can air it whenever it wants. H&M can request that it be delayed, but CBS isn't under any obligation at all to honor that request.

 

[AxelAnnie]

True, I have a friend who got engaged after a month of dating. They're coming up on 25 years together.

My aunt and uncle got married after 6 months of courtship. They lived one state away, and my uncle rode up to see his love on his motorcycle on weekends.

They were as much in love on their 69th anniversary as their first.

That was a different time. People actually made a commitment and stuck to it. All the more important to spend time actually getting to know the other person.

I betcha if divorce were made illegal, or required years to complete, we would see people waiting a lot longer to get married.
One of my daughter's friends got pregnant in college. The father wanted to marry her..........she did not want to make that kind of commitment. HUH? I always wondered what kind of commitment she thought having a baby was.

 

[Judy]

No, it is not. One word from either of them to hold the airing would put it on hold.

He might be doing ok too. Just the 99 years old freaks me out.

 

[AxelAnnie]

He might be doing ok too. Just the 99 years old freaks me out.

No kidding! That is a lot of years.

 

[taf2002]

Posts here are full of examples of other royals who thru the years have had to put up with as much as Meghan. My response to that is why haven't the BRF done something about it? No one should have to suffer in silence. I think the Queen could make a difference if she wanted to. And I think the tabloid people are scum bottom-feeders. JMO And anyone who buys their magazines or clicks on their pages are just as bad & are putting in their pockets.

 

[taf2002]

No, it is not. One word from either of them to hold the airing would put it on hold.

You know this how?

 

[Judy]

My aunt and uncle got married after 6 months of courtship. They lived one state away, and my uncle rode up to see his love on his motorcycle on weekends.

They were as much in love on their 69th anniversary as their first.

That was a different time. People actually made a commitment and stuck to it. All the more important to spend time actually getting to know the other person.

I betcha if divorce were made illegal, or required years to accomplish, we would see people waiting a lot longer to get married.

Well a lot I suspect is that so many women now aren’t

At least some of the question as to whether Meghan really knew what she was getting herself into come from Meghans comments herself. Comments like "I think the grass is always greener. You have no idea. It's hard to understand what it's like. I know what it should be, but it's a very different thing". "I never thought that this would be easy but I thought it would be fair. And that's the part that's really hard to reconcile".

Would things have been different if the timetable had played out differently? Probably not substantially, love is love, but she may have been better prepared that things were never going to be "fair". Their advantage, perhaps, is that Harry is not Charles, or William or wee George. They had more options and they have opted out. I think it is horribly unfair to place the blame for this choice on Meghan and see it as a positive for the BRF moving forward for those not in direct line to live their own lives. I am fans of theirs and loved Meghan in "Suits". That said, I do not think I need to agree with everything they say or do.

I don’t think anyone - aside from Kate - could survive living and just being attacked constantly. Toxic is an understatement I couldn’t do it nor would I want to.

 

[canbelto]

Well I remember reading that about Michelle. Someone had posted it on their facebook and I think? the woman was over the moon about Melania (). It was a disgusting comment. Michelle Obama was an awesome first lady.

I reported a bunch of "Michelle is an ape" memes on FB and was told each time that it didn't violate "community standards."

The thing is, Kate DOESN'T put up with it. She sued Tatler magazine for that article about her that had a bunch of bitchy comments about Carole Middleton. She also sued for the topless shots.

 

[MacMadame]

Like this meme. Or this one.

The second one was more what I was seeing. Where you could believe it was Michelle if you wanted to.

 

[Judy]

I reported a bunch of "Michelle is an ape" memes on FB and was told each time that it didn't violate "community standards."

The thing is, Kate DOESN'T put up with it. She sued Tatler magazine for that article about her that had a bunch of bitchy comments about Carole Middleton. She also sued for the topless shots.

Social media is just plain toxic and potentially dangerous. Certainly not everyone but there are just too many problems with it.

if you are interested read Nobody’s Victim by Carrie Goldberg. A friend recommended it to me and it is .

I find social media toxic so I don’t use a lot of it.

 

[canbelto]

The second one was more what I was seeing. Where you could believe it was Michelle if you wanted to.

I remember this one making the rounds. And this one.

 

[puglover]

I think we can all agree that an alarming amount of social media/comments are toxic and dangerous. I am not claiming equivalency here. Recently during my many hours at home I have started watching home renovation/improvement shows. One I quite enjoy features a talented couple, husband and wife, fixing up their home town one house at a time. I am fairly new to the story but I understand that after a prolonged time of trying they got pregnant and happily announced the birth of a beautiful daughter. Apparently, their baby has been targeted with horrible comments online calling her "ugly" and words to that affect. I have noticed they now show her with them but from behind.

 

[overedge]

@puglover If this is the show I'm thinking of, the couple are white Christians. I bet the online abuse would be different, i.e. worse, if they were neither white nor Christian.